Justice Committee on Feb. 16th, 2017

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

Yes.

[Ron McKinnon, Liberal, Coquitlam—Port Coquitlam, BC]

That would not seem to be—

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

No, that does not seem to be covered in this bill.

[Ron McKinnon, Liberal, Coquitlam—Port Coquitlam, BC]

Is that something that you think should be incorporated in this bill?

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

It can be considered, yes.

[Ron McKinnon, Liberal, Coquitlam—Port Coquitlam, BC]

Okay.

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

Basically, what I'm trying to say is that the bill will act as an agent that will allow you to expand, strengthen, and achieve the main objectives.

[Ron McKinnon, Liberal, Coquitlam—Port Coquitlam, BC]

One of the questions provided by our great analysts suggests that graffiti painted on a park bench in a public playground would be subject to this act, but the same thing done to a private playground or a private residence would not, so there would be disparate treatment between those two cases.

Do you think that's appropriate?

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

I agree with that, because there are still, as I was mentioning, hate crimes like those that happened in Ottawa. We saw graffiti against a private home and against a place of worship. These two are treated separately, although the end effect is the same. The end effect was that the communities felt unsafe.

Yes, that is an issue.

[Ron McKinnon, Liberal, Coquitlam—Port Coquitlam, BC]

I have a final question. You mentioned seniors' residences. I agree with Mr. Nicholson that it seems to be logical to include them within the range of other public buildings. What about youth centres and so forth?

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

At the end of the day, my objective is not to limit it. I want it to be as open and as wide as possible. Any amendments will be good.

[Ron McKinnon, Liberal, Coquitlam—Port Coquitlam, BC]

You would be happy if this provision applied to any building anywhere?

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

For public buildings and community buildings, yes.

[Ron McKinnon, Liberal, Coquitlam—Port Coquitlam, BC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Anthony Housefather]

Thank you, Mr. McKinnon.

Mr. MacGregor.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Arya, I'd like to congratulate you for your success in the House in getting your bill passed on to us unanimously. Welcome to the committee.

It's already been raised—and you reported this already to this committee—that the failure to include “gender expression” was an oversight.

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

Yes.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

I think your bill has laudable goals, but my concern overall is that we seem to be fixing individual trees and losing sight of the forest.

If you look at Bill C-16 and the Criminal Code, you will see that there are also provisions there for prohibiting discrimination based on sex. Your bill also forgets to include that particular part. Is that something that you were made aware of, or is that another oversight?

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

In fact, after I presented the bill, several of these things came up. As I said, I'm always open to all friendly amendments. I should say that I had to rush through it at the last moment.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

Yes, and I ask because the thing that comes to mind for me in my riding of Cowichan–Malahat–Langford is that I have a society there, the Cowichan Women Against Violence Society, which is there, obviously, to help women who are affected by violence. They help them seek shelter and get out of abusive relationships. What if someone were to take issue with the work they do and spray-paint graffiti on their place of work?

I wasn't sure that we're casting a wide enough net, so that's good to hear.

I've read your bill, and you've included these specific areas where hate-based mischief can happen. I was wondering what your rationale was for deciding to list these additional types of property, beyond houses of worship, instead of treating all hate-based mischief offences the same, regardless of where they take place. What was your rationale for taking that approach?

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

I looked at that criminal subsection. It was very specific to religious properties.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

Yes.

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

My thinking was that it would be good to deal very specifically with the places where the community gathers and where the community will be affected by these hate-based crimes. That was the rationale behind what I defined or included in the list of properties.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

Okay. In that same vein, the way the bill is drafted, it seems that if someone were to spray-paint racist insults on a park bench in a playground, that theoretically could be considered worse than if they did so on someone's private home, for example.

Can you explain to the committee why those types of mischief should be treated differently? If they knew where a person's private home was, and if that person were transgendered or followed a certain religion, and the perpetrator decided to create mischief at that personal home, they would get a lighter sentence than if they did it at a public place.

[Chandra Arya, Liberal, Nepean, ON]

I understand, but the effect is the same. In terms of the impact on the communities—number one, on the family and their friends and relatives, but also on the entire community—the effect is the same.