Justice Committee on June 3rd, 2021

[Carole Morency]

I would say that for sure a big part of our recent efforts since 2016 though Justice Canada has been support through the FILUs, the family information liaison units, with regard to murdered and missing indigenous women. In addition to that, we do continue to work and to look at, for example, working with individual communities for even more lessons learned about some of these different issues that have been identified as ways to improve responses on a go-forward basis. Of course, we work with the provinces and territories, who directly engage and provide support to individuals and work with organizations and communities in their jurisdiction as well.

I don't know if my colleague has anything else to add.

[Randall Garrison, NDP, Esquimalt—Saanich—Sooke, BC]

Not hearing anything, maybe I'll ask very specifically about the residential school survivors from St. Anne's. They are in a kind of David and Goliath court struggle. Is legal assistance funding being provided to the residential school survivors from St. Anne's in their fight with the federal government in court?

[Carole Morency]

I'm not aware; I'm not in a position to respond to that. It could be that it's outside of the victims strategy. We're not in a position to comment or to answer the question.

[Randall Garrison, NDP, Esquimalt—Saanich—Sooke, BC]

Thank you very much.

Thank you, Madam Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Iqra Khalid]

Thank you very much, Mr. Garrison.

We'll now go to our second round of questions, starting with Madam Findlay, for five minutes.

[Kerry-Lynne Findlay, Conservative, South Surrey—White Rock, BC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you to the witnesses for being with us today. This is an important topic.

I'd like to begin by noting that section 2.1 of Bill C-32, the victims bill of rights act, called for a parliamentary review to be conducted five years after the bill coming into force. As we all know, July 2015 was six years ago. That comprehensive review needs to take place separate from our study. [Technical difficulty—Editor] victims and their families is something we should all care deeply about. I believe we do, so I'm glad we are at least taking the time to study it here.

This is for the Department of Justice officials, for Ms. Morency or Ms. Bouchard. Under subsection 515(13) of the Criminal Code, added through Bill C-32 with respect to bail hearings, justices are now required to include in the record a statement that the justice “considered the safety and security of every victim of the offence”.

Could you speak to the impact this new requirement has had on the safety of victims over the past six years?

That's for either one of you.

[Stéphanie Bouchard]

As you will know, the CVBR is the overarching bill, and when it was passed, a number of Criminal Code amendments were provided. There have been many changes to the Criminal Code to provide for different measures, including testimonial aids and publication bans.

Accompanying all those legislative measures aiming to provide more security for the victims, there have been investments. Through the federal victims fund, money was provided to PTs to purchase more testimonial aids, and they were able to adapt different rooms for victims to wait in. Some have improved some of the rooms in this pandemic to make them bigger and to be able to have the victim support and still maintain the social distancing.

[Kerry-Lynne Findlay, Conservative, South Surrey—White Rock, BC]

Thank you.

Clause 29 of the bill now requires the court to consider making a restitution order in all cases, not just fraud, and if it's not granted, to include reasons in the record. This is section 737.1 of the Criminal Code.

Has this requirement led to more restitution orders since its enactment? Do we have any data on this?

[Stéphanie Bouchard]

We are currently monitoring the case law to see if, in effect, the amendments to the Criminal Code are having the impact that was envisioned when they were implemented to ensure the victim is not forgotten, and that there's real attention paid to restitution.

We're still analyzing the data. We're working with criminal justice at StatsCan. It's difficult. I'm sure the committee is aware of the data difficulties based on the different PT systems of collecting data. We're still in the process of assessing and looking at whether or not they impact. The civil remedy and enforcement measures are under the PT administration of justice.

Funding also was made available through the victims fund to help support them to implement restitution programs in order to facilitate the collection and enforcement of the orders that have been made by judges, for them to be reimbursed for some of the readily ascertainable losses they might have gotten.

[Kerry-Lynne Findlay, Conservative, South Surrey—White Rock, BC]

Thank you.

Again, for you or the Parole Board officials, section 15 of the Victims Bill of Rights sets out that “Every victim has the right to present a victim impact statement to the appropriate authorities”. Clause 49 provides that victims may present that at conditional release hearings. Impact statements help with decision-making, but also are important to victims in coping.

I heard in October of a victim's family being told that because of the pandemic they wouldn't be allowed to give their impact statement in person. Without reference to any specific case, do you see this as a violation of victims' rights? Was this happening in every province during the pandemic?

[Ian Broom]

If I can respond to the question—

[Kerry-Lynne Findlay, Conservative, South Surrey—White Rock, BC]

Yes, thank you, quickly.

[Ian Broom]

—I would say that throughout the pandemic the Parole Board of Canada has ensured that we've respected the legislative rights of our victims. In terms of participation, victims have been able to submit statements and to have the statements considered by board members.

In respect of hearings where a victim statement was to be read, initially in the pandemic, in the early days, it was a challenging time technologically, I think for us and for others. What we ended up doing is putting in place a stable and secure teleconference system, and then we shifted to a video conferencing solution, which was piloted towards the end of 2020 and launched nationally in 2021.

Since that time, the board has facilitated the participation of over 500 victims at over 300 hearings, so actually 12% more than the year before, and specifically in terms of presentations—

[The Chair, Liberal, Iqra Khalid]

I'll stop you there, Mr. Broom. My apologies, but we're a minute over.

[Kerry-Lynne Findlay, Conservative, South Surrey—White Rock, BC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Iqra Khalid]

We'll go next to Mr. Maloney.

Please go ahead for five minutes.

[James Maloney, Liberal, Etobicoke—Lakeshore, ON]

Thanks, Madam Chair.

Thank you to all our witnesses.

I'll say what many of you have said. This is an important discussion. Victims' rights are paramount.

This occurred to me when we were getting ready to have this discussion today, and some of the comments made today reinforced this notion. Mr. Cooper was talking about the transparency of the parole process. Ms. Findlay was just alluding to it. Correct me if I'm wrong, but children of the criminals themselves, I would argue, are victims of crime, too, and I don't believe they are considered under this legislation. Is that true? Does anybody want to answer? It's a yes-or-no question.

[The Chair, Liberal, Iqra Khalid]

Is that for anyone specifically, Mr. Maloney?

[James Maloney, Liberal, Etobicoke—Lakeshore, ON]

It's for anybody who can answer the question.

The children of people who have committed crimes do not benefit under this legislation as it currently stands. Is that fair?

[Stéphanie Bouchard]

The definition of victim is provided in the CVBR and in the Criminal Code. It depends on the correlation, if the children of the offender were offended against themselves by the offender who has been....

[James Maloney, Liberal, Etobicoke—Lakeshore, ON]

I looked at the definition, and I don't see that a child of somebody who is in prison, who has committed a crime, would fall under the definition of victim. However, if you're talking about things like parole hearings and the benefits available and access to information, there are situations where children have parents who have committed crimes of whatever nature and who are now suffering through no fault of their own.

Anybody can answer this question. Would you think it's a good idea that they be incorporated into the definition of victim somehow?

[Julie Thompson]

If I could, I will attempt to offer some information in response to this question. While I can't offer an opinion on whether or not the definition should be adjusted to include children, I did want to offer that there are some information publications available to children who have parents who are being incarcerated. Not to put my colleague from Correctional Services on the spot, I've forgotten the name of the organization that provides that service. I'd be happy to provide it, but I'm wondering if Correctional Services might....

[James Maloney, Liberal, Etobicoke—Lakeshore, ON]

You might be referring to KIP Canada, Kids with Incarcerated Parents. That's one organization I know of.

I see Ms. Wallace-Capretta is shaking her head.

[Kirstan Gagnon]

It's the Canadian Families and Corrections Network, whom we work with closely.

[James Maloney, Liberal, Etobicoke—Lakeshore, ON]

Are there structures in place that do work with the children of perpetrators? Is that along the same lines as might be considered under the Victims Bill of Rights?