Natural Resources Committee on April 30th, 2019

[Richard Cannings, NDP, South Okanagan—West Kootenay, BC]

It's okay now.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

All right. All systems are working now.

[Christyne Tremblay]

I am happy to answer your question about natural disasters, Mr. Cannings. My department is actually going to receive $88 million to ensure that communities are resilient to natural disasters. A large part of that amount will be used in fighting forest fires. As you know, British Columbia saw major forest fires last year. The money will also be used to increase our forecasting and mapping abilities. The goal is for us to be more proactive and better prepared, so that we are able to see the disasters coming.

[Kent Hehr, Liberal, Calgary Centre, AB]

Thank you for that answer.

We heard some questioning by Mr. Schmale around our new incentive program to encourage people to look at electric vehicles. I'm hoping that you can tell me a bit more about that program.

As well, Hannah Wilson from my office stated that about 80% of cars in that marketplace would be available for that price point. Are there cars available at the $45,000 cap? Would those be available? How does the program work?

[Christyne Tremblay]

Thank you for the question.

Increasing sales of zero-emission vehicles is a major objective for the government. As you mentioned, a new incentive program is designed to encourage consumers to choose those vehicles. Transport Canada, not Natural Resources Canada, is responsible for the program. However, we have to make sure that the cars can be driven and recharged. So we have to make sure that the infrastructures are in place.

We are already working to establish a network of more than 1,000 charging stations across Canada. In some cases, these will be electric charging stations and in others the stations will work on hydrogen or natural gas. In the most recent budget, we received funds to add 20,000 charging stations. This time, they will be installed near where Canadians live. In other words, stations will be in their homes, and near where they work and play, even in the parking lots they use. For us, therefore, this is a major investment.

In addition, we are continuing to work very hard for the stations to be more effective. If I may, I will give the floor to Frank Des Rosiers, our assistant deputy minister responsible for everything related to clean technologies in our department. He works specifically with certain technologies in order to ensure that Canadians who own vehicles of that kind are able to drive them.

[Frank Des Rosiers, Assistant Deputy Minister, Innovation and Energy Technology Sector, Department of Natural Resources]

Exactly.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Perhaps to add to the deputy's remark, this is actually one of those areas that is important for Canada. We've seen all those cars on the road. They account for roughly a quarter of our GHG emissions in the country. Making a dent in this actually matters a great deal.

We have not only an opportunity to deploy existing technology, but also to develop new ones. We have a number of innovators in the country. I'm thinking about AddÉnergie, for instance, based in Shawinigan, Quebec. They are in the process of developing, thanks to our support and the support of the provincial government as well, new infrastructure, for instance, to have a solution for those residing in condos and multi-residential units. Right now there aren't a lot of solutions being offered in the marketplace, and we're looking for those kinds of solutions.

Another angle that we've been exploring is what the impact is of having thousands, tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of vehicles on the grid. Picture if you are running a utility and a sizable electrical grid, and you suddenly have this large amount of demand out there. How do you manage this? What's the cybersecurity consideration around having such a large amount of new demand in the marketplace?

These are the kinds of solutions and issues we've been striving to resolve.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

Thank you.

Mr. Falk.

[Ted Falk, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you to department officials for attending.

I have a whole bunch of questions. I'll try to fire through them and we'll see how it goes. I don't care who answers.

We've bought a pipeline. Have we paid for it? That is the question. Have we paid for the pipeline?

[Christyne Tremblay]

Mr. Labonté will answer.

[Jeff Labonté, Assistant Deputy Minister, Major Projects Management Office, Department of Natural Resources]

Have we paid for the pipeline, meaning has the transaction been closed?

[Ted Falk, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

Correct.

[Jeff Labonté]

I believe the transaction has been closed, but I think the Minister of Finance is responsible for the execution through CDIC, the Crown agency that's responsible for delivering and operating the pipeline.

[Ted Falk, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

Okay.

Would the Crown agency also incur all the costs associated with it now in order to proceed towards the expansion, or would that be a departmental cost?

[Jeff Labonté]

The Crown agency is run through its own separate board of directors, but I'm getting to the margins of my knowledge base here, given that it's the Minister of Finance's officials and whatnot. It's run through, as I understand it, a separate board of directors. It has its own, if you will, financial regime under which it operates.

Of course at this point there's no certificate for an expansion to occur, so it's operating the pipeline that exists today and waiting for the decision that will come—should it come—related to the project decision on the expansion part.

[Ted Falk, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

Okay. Very good.

The carbon tax was implemented in my province recently. I saw just over a 4.5¢ per litre increase on the price of gas, and just over 5¢ per litre on the price of diesel fuel. Do you have projected revenues on what that will bring in?

[Christyne Tremblay]

That is a question for Environment and Climate Change Canada.

[Ted Falk, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

So your department hasn't been tasked at all with calculating the amount of fuel that's going to be burned. You have not been involved in that at all.

[Christyne Tremblay]

There has certainly been collaboration between the departments, but the question should go to another department.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

There's your answer.

[Ted Falk, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

Okay. Can you give me the volumes, then, of fuel that you expect to be taxed with this carbon tax, either gasoline or diesel? Have you done that calculation?

[Christyne Tremblay]

As I have already said, the question should be addressed to Environment and Climate Change Canada, which is responsible for the carbon tax, or to the Department of Finance Canada, which is responsible for calculating the revenue from that tax.

[Ted Falk, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

Mr. Chair, I'm not looking anymore for the dollar amounts; I can do the math myself. I'm looking for volume. That, I think, would be something that would fall under this department's jurisdiction.

[The Chair, Liberal, James Maloney]

I understood the question, and I think they did too, but the answer's the answer, Mr. Falk.

[Ted Falk, Conservative, Provencher, MB]

Okay.

Getting back to my colleague's question on the Canadian fuel standard, have there been any calculations done by the department on the effect of that?

[Christyne Tremblay]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

The Department of Natural Resources is collaborating with the industry on the work being done on the clean fuel standard. A consultation is under way. Our department is working with various companies, the industry, as well as Environment and Climate Change Canada to analyze the effects of the scenarios that come up and that are of concern to the industry and to companies on an individual basis. When the regulations are published, the stakeholders will provide cost estimates, as always.