Official Languages Committee on May 30th, 2017

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

Mr. Jutras, unfortunately, that's all the time I have. I could talk to you for hours, since I'm really passionate about the issue. We could have talked about conditions that are essential and not essential to amending the Constitution, but I do not have the time right now.

So I am going to move my motion. I already gave notice on Friday, May 26, 2017. It reads as follows:

That the Committee, before presenting its report to the House on the nomination of Madeleine Meilleur, invite the following people to appear in order to gain a better understanding of the appointment process for the position of Commissioner of Official Languages: 1. The President of the FCFA; 2. Michel Doucet; 3. The Boyden representative responsible for the selection process; 4. The Deputy Minister of Canadian Heritage; 5. Mathieu Bouchard; 6. Gerry Butts; 7. Rémi Leger; 8. The Deputy Minister of Justice; 9. The Chief Human Resources Officer of the Treasury Board of Canada Secretariat; 10. The Deputy Secretary to the Cabinet of the Privy Council Office (PCO).

The reason for this motion is that, as you know, the Standing Committee on Official Languages must make a decision on the appointment of Madeleine Meilleur as the future Commissioner of Official Languages, as proposed by the government. So our decision must be made after careful consideration and with utmost transparency, and we must ensure that we are not going to make a very serious mistake in supporting the appointment of Madeleine Meilleur as Commissioner of Official Languages.

Madeleine Meilleur appeared before us at our last meeting, and we asked her a few questions. The answers we received are very concerning to us, because there seem to be contradictions in what she said. For example, she said that she had no longer been a Liberal member for some time. The last response she sent us was in April 2017. It’s recent as a date, it’s like it was yesterday. We may even wonder since when in April 2017, she stopped being a member.

[A voice]

April 7.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

Okay, it was on April 7. There you go.

There is something else. We talked about the last time she met with the Prime Minister. Her answer was also quite nebulous; we did not know exactly what to think about it. We had an answer on that. I understood that she had met with the Prime Minister during the election campaign. I may have misunderstood. That's why we wondered whether it was at a fundraiser. When she gave us her answer, she said it was at an event that took place in 2014, if memory serves. So I have some serious questions about the appearance of Madeleine Meilleur.

As you know, the controversy is ongoing right now. With each passing day, something new comes up, a new group adds its voice to those who have qualms about the appointment of Madeleine Meilleur. Recently, the FCFA met with all its members who asked what was happening with this appointment. The FCFA members were unable to unanimously agree on the choice of Madeleine Meilleur. So opinions are divided about the process, which is raising a lot of questions.

Recently, the Quebec Community Groups Network, or QCGN, also sent a letter stating that it was very concerned about the appointment process. Will Ms. Meilleur be far enough removed from the Prime Minister, far enough removed from the government, to be able to make impartial and fair decisions? I have major doubts about that.

All this is without mentioning the report about Michel Doucet in the media. I think you've all seen this out in the media and you all fell off your chairs, just like me.

After going through the entire process, Mr. Doucet was told that, if you are not close enough to the Liberal government, you stand no chance of being appointed Commissioner of Official Languages. That's beyond outrageous. It is absolutely incredible to hear that.

We are talking about a position of the utmost importance within the government and at the highest levels of government. We have learned that you have to be part of the Prime Minister’s inner circle to hope to get there. You have to meet with Gerald Butts and Katie Telford to get the position of Commissioner of Official Languages. There is a breach of trust in the process. This process is being questioned not only by the opposition parties—they are not the only ones questioning the process—but also—

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Mr. Choquette—

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

Yes? I am not quite finished presenting my arguments.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

I'm listening, but I have some questions for you.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

Yes, Mr. Chair.

You want to ask me questions. I'm listening to you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

I have some questions about the admissibility of your motion. Let me explain.

You state: “... in order to gain a better understanding of the appointment process for the position of Commissioner of Official Languages”.

You talk about the appointment process. If I refer to Standing Order 111(2), it says: “The committee, if it should call an appointee or nominee to appear pursuant to section (1) of this Standing Order, shall examine the qualifications and competence of the appointee or nominee to perform the duties of the post to which he or she has been appointed or nominated.”

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

You're right, Mr. Chair, but—

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Let me finish my explanation.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

Yes, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

In light of that Standing Order and the wording of your motion, I am concerned about the admissibility of the motion. That is why I want to know what all my colleagues here think.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

I understand, Mr. Chair.

May I just say a few words about admissibility, Mr. Chair?

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Yes, I'm listening.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

On the issue of admissibility, I agree that we can change the wording if that's the problematic aspect of the appointment. I'm talking about the wording you mentioned, what you read about the candidate, and the situation before us. That's basically what I was saying, that the question is whether, precisely, the candidate Madeleine Meilleur is not too close to the high-ranking officials and the Liberals' inner circle to have the distance required to make fair, impartial and transparent decisions.

I was saying that I and other Canadian citizens filed a complaint against the Prime Minister—can you imagine—because he did not comply with the Official Languages Act. The Privy Council Office, through the Prime Minister, did not comply with the Official Languages Act. It was the interim commissioner who tabled a report on that issue.

When a Canada-wide consultation was held in Ontario, he did not want to answer in French to Franco-Ontarians. In the Sherbrooke area—

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

I'm ready to listen to what you have to say about admissibility. You asked me to comment on the admissibility, Mr. Choquette. I'm ready to listen to you, because I have to decide, first of all, whether or not your motion is in order.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

Yes, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

That's why I'm asking you, as a first step, you and the colleagues here, to indicate why this would be acceptable and why it would not.

[François Choquette, NDP, Drummond, QC]

That's what I was saying. With respect to Madeleine Meilleur's competence and impartiality, we have all indicated that she has all the required qualifications, except necessary ones like impartiality and independence from the government

We also learned today that she left the Liberal Party on April 7, 2017. That was yesterday, Mr. Chair, which is why I believe this motion is in order, so that we can study and better understand how Madeleine Meilleur is too close to the Liberal Party. So we have to look at that.

That's why it would be relevant to meet with everyone listed in my motion.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

You have the floor to talk about receivability, Mrs. Boucher.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

With all due respect, Mr. Chair, I think this motion is transparent and receivable. We've always said that the nominations would be made transparently. The more we learn about this nomination, the less transparent it seems. How is it that some candidates had access to Gerald Butts?

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

Mrs. Boucher, you're talking about the process. I'll refer you once again to Standing Order 111(2), which states that a committee shall examine the qualifications and competence of the appointee or nominee to perform the duties of the post to which he or she has been appointed or nominated.

[Sylvie Boucher, Conservative, Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC]

Exactly.

Ms. Meilleur may have the competence, but she doesn't have everything she needs to be impartial. Impartiality will be lacking. When she appears before this committee, or when she produces fine reports, every member of the opposition will ask who she is speaking for, the Liberal Party or herself? She has been attached to the Liberal Party for a long time. Let's stop fooling ourselves. She was a minister in the Ontario Liberal government, gave money to the federal Liberal Party and to the leadership organizers of the Prime Minister, the Right Honourable Justin Trudeau. Are we going to be led to believe that she would be impartial to a post that is supposed to be apolitical?

With all due respect, Mr. Chair, we need to debate this motion here. Our committee is the one responsible for official languages and their management. If the Liberals on the other side of the table are at least concerned about defending their language, as we have done from the beginning, they will agree. This is one of the finest committees the House of Commons has. These people have been fighting for real issues from the beginning, but on their own behalf, not on behalf of the Liberal government.

[The Chair, Liberal, Denis Paradis]

We'll now move on to Ms. Lapointe.

[Linda Lapointe, Liberal, Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC]

I ask that the debate be adjourned.