Evidence of meeting #15 for Official Languages in the 43rd Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was interpreters.
A video is available from Parliament.
4:15 p.m.
Conservative
Steven Blaney Conservative Bellechasse—Les Etchemins—Lévis, QC
It's a process that won't end with our meeting today.
I'd like to give what little time I have left to my colleague Mr. Dalton.
4:15 p.m.
Liberal
4:15 p.m.
Conservative
Marc Dalton Conservative Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge, BC
That's great.
Thank you for your presentation, Mr. Stoll. On a personal note, I was born in Baden-Soellingen, the Canadian Forces base just next to Heidelberg, and I have a brother and sister who were born in Heidelberg. It's beautiful country.
Concerning Canada, you were talking about the platform so much, and you were mentioning Internet connections. That's a major problem when you go up north or when you're in the rural areas. The platforms that you mentioned, would they make a difference? Does rural connectivity, Internet connectivity, play a big part? That would be one question.
The second question would be on the aspect of the visuals. Here, obviously, we're focusing on interpreters. Are these other platforms you recommend good visually? That's a really important part for us as MPs in being able to get our message across in the House and elsewhere.
4:15 p.m.
Senior Lecturer and Research Fellow, Conference Interpreting Programme, University of Heidelberg, As an Individual
There are all kinds of systems. The main thing about the dedicated systems where the parameters can be set manually by technicians is that you can set priorities. For instance, when you say that there are conference interpreters involved, you can set audio as a priority, and lip synchronicity, for instance, and you can set them to not be quite as precise when it comes to the rendering of the background. I'm not a sound engineer or an IT person, but I know that they have all sorts of settings available.
You're always as good as the connection is. There are limits, of course, to what these systems can do. When you're sitting in a hut in the middle of nowhere, obviously your connection won't be as high performance as others.
I'm sorry if I went over the time.
4:15 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Emmanuel Dubourg
Thank you, Mr. Stoll.
Mr. Arseneault and Ms. Martinez Ferrada will share the next five minutes.
Go ahead, Mr. Arseneault.
February 4th, 2021 / 4:15 p.m.
Liberal
René Arseneault Liberal Madawaska—Restigouche, NB
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Don't hesitate to interrupt me after two and a half minutes. I have a tendency to talk too much.
Mr. Stoll, thanks for coming and welcome virtually to Canada. We're happy to have you with us tonight.
I think I'm more lost than I've been, on the technical part of this discussion.
We have to realize that in Europe and in North America we're using this Zoom platform more often, so it makes me think about it and conclude that all interpreters in the western countries are suffering because of the poor quality of the system that is used. It's across all the western countries. Am I correct when I say that about speaking on a Zoom platform or the equivalent of a Zoom platform?
4:15 p.m.
Senior Lecturer and Research Fellow, Conference Interpreting Programme, University of Heidelberg, As an Individual
Yes. The Internet-based platforms with automatic adjustment of parameters by algorithms are a huge problem for conference interpreters as a category of software.
4:15 p.m.
Liberal
René Arseneault Liberal Madawaska—Restigouche, NB
Okay. It's not only in Canada. It's in European countries as well. Am I correct?
4:15 p.m.
Senior Lecturer and Research Fellow, Conference Interpreting Programme, University of Heidelberg, As an Individual
It depends to some extent on the connection quality. When you have a very fast broadband connection, it's of course less dangerous to your hearing than it is with bad connections.
4:15 p.m.
Liberal
René Arseneault Liberal Madawaska—Restigouche, NB
I understand that.
I'm quick because I only have two and a half minutes, and I don't want to see the whip of the chair.
Let's say that we're in a pandemic, a situation that nobody on this planet controls. It's not the last day that we're going to have discussions like this about this platform and other kinds of platforms. If we have a headset like you're suggesting, if we have a good high-speed connection directly connected to our device, our computer, and if people start to talk slowly like me—usually I do—is this something that at first sight can start to meet the minimum criteria with the Zoom platform?
4:20 p.m.
Senior Lecturer and Research Fellow, Conference Interpreting Programme, University of Heidelberg, As an Individual
The engineers have given us a very clear answer. They measured a completely wired set-up, and even Zoom “advanced”, which is specified to reach 15 kilohertz, which is the absolute minimum we need, did not meet that threshold.
I'm afraid, then, the answer is no. It will help, of course; everything we do will help. The interpreters will just have to suffer through it, I'm afraid, and live with the hearing damage that is inflicted during COVID on this generation of interpreters, to some extent.
The less loud we have to turn the original, the more it helps us, of course. We have to find a way of dealing with this as best we can.
4:20 p.m.
Liberal
René Arseneault Liberal Madawaska—Restigouche, NB
I'm trying to understand. With a sound system engineer's suggested platform—one that met all the criteria—if we don't have a good connection, we're still in the same place. Am I correct in my interpretation?
4:20 p.m.
Senior Lecturer and Research Fellow, Conference Interpreting Programme, University of Heidelberg, As an Individual
I'm sorry; I would contradict that.
4:20 p.m.
Senior Lecturer and Research Fellow, Conference Interpreting Programme, University of Heidelberg, As an Individual
A good sound engineer, or a sound technician even, with a bad connection can set the parameters in a way that is less damaging to our health than an algorithm that is optimized for a different thing can do.
Getting professionals in from sound engineering to advise on the type of connection that is set up would definitely help, absolutely. I think you can make the most out of what you have with those connections.
4:20 p.m.
Liberal
René Arseneault Liberal Madawaska—Restigouche, NB
Thank you very much, Dr. Stoll.
I think my time is up, Mr. Chair.
4:20 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Emmanuel Dubourg
Yes, but there's a minute left for Ms. Martinez Ferrada.
You have the floor, Ms. Martinez Ferrada.
4:20 p.m.
Liberal
Soraya Martinez Ferrada Liberal Hochelaga, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Dr. Stoll, for being with us today.
I'll be brief because time is running out. Today, one of your recommendations is to limit the daily working hours of the interpreters, which raises the issue of numbers.
Last Tuesday, witnesses mentioned that our interpreting industry is world class. But for at least the last 10 or 12 years, there has been a lack of recruitment and training and limited funding.
How can we make sure we invest in the interpreter industry?
What do you see in Europe in terms of hiring and training?
You can give us your answer in writing.
4:20 p.m.
Senior Lecturer and Research Fellow, Conference Interpreting Programme, University of Heidelberg, As an Individual
I'll be happy to do that. In Europe, there are plenty of interpreters, as there are many more training institutes, also for English and French—in Paris, for instance, at the ISIT and ESIT.
We'll be happy to assist in any course optimization or setting up of training, of course. I'm authorized to offer our help in anything you might need, for the University of Heidelberg.
4:20 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Emmanuel Dubourg
Yes. Thank you for your kindness.
Mr. Beaulieu, you have two and a half minutes.
4:20 p.m.
Bloc
Mario Beaulieu Bloc La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC
Dr. Stoll, if I understood correctly, the sound management on the Zoom platform is done by algorithms. However, if it were done by sound engineers, it would be better. Is that right?
I didn't hear your answer, but I saw you nodding your head in agreement.
We could ask Zoom to adjust using sound engineers instead of algorithms, which would improve things.
As some of my colleagues have raised, and as you mentioned in your conclusion, interpreters should be exposed to toxic sounds as little as possible. There are two solutions to this: to have many more interpreters, which seems difficult to achieve since there is a shortage of interpreters, or to reduce the number of interventions to be translated. In fact, the Translation Bureau is currently moving in a direction that is not compatible with these orientations.
Do you think it's realistic to consider increasing the number of interpreters? You probably can't answer this question, because Europe may not have the same shortage.
The other thing is not to talk too fast. Maybe we should lengthen the time allocated to each intervention. We often speak quickly because we only have 35 seconds, for example, to ask our questions. Extending the speaking time and providing the text of our intervention could be part of the solution.
According to statistics, 70% of interpreters report having suffered injuries. Do you think this justifies changes to the current way of doing things, either by reducing the amount of time interpreters work, increasing the amount of intervention time allocated to each participant, or making technical improvements?
4:25 p.m.
Senior Lecturer and Research Fellow, Conference Interpreting Programme, University of Heidelberg, As an Individual
I believe some solution will have to be found, because if we're stuck for another year with COVID....
I'm no medical doctor, but I've followed this very closely, as much as I can, and part of my Ph.D. thesis was psychoacoustics and neurophysiology. What we haven't talked about is the brain damage, which is quite possible if the metabolism on the cortical...on the brain surface is overtaxed, because we tend to activate very large parts of our brain surface in simultaneous interpreting.
There are quite a number of health concerns that medical studies have to investigate. I feel nervous about the situation at the moment. I have no panacea or silver bullet, but there are plenty of interpreters in the U.S., for instance, in Washington and other locations. You might want to set up interpreting hubs to rope them in, or probably the Translation Bureau has solutions ready. I haven't talked to them.
4:25 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Emmanuel Dubourg
Thank you, Mr. Stoll. That's all the time we have.
The last questioner will be Mr. Boulerice, for two and a half minutes, please.
Go ahead.