Official Languages Committee on May 9th, 2022

[Patricia Lattanzio, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

Okay, there would be room for nine more appointed individuals, if there is need. That is what you're telling us. I understand it's a private corporation, but it's up to 20.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

That's what their articles allow for, but it's up to them to decide the size of it. It's a minimum of seven, a maximum of 20, but right now they've chosen to have 11.

[Patricia Lattanzio, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

Okay. Let's shift gears now and speak a little bit about the language commissioner.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Sorry, I've been corrected: it's up to 21. I apologize.

[Patricia Lattanzio, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

It's 21, so there's one more spot on that board. Thank you.

Let's shift gears now. Let's go on to speak a little bit about the official languages commissioner. Are you aware if the commissioner has previously investigated CN for compliance with the act?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Yes, I actually looked into this before appearing at this committee and found that the Commissioner of Official Languages has received five complaints against CN. All of these were received in 2019-20 in relation to part V of the Official Languages Act, dealing with the language of work.

[Patricia Lattanzio, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

I'm sorry, Minister, but are you saying five were received since 2019 or only in 2019?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Over the past five years, they received only five complaints, in the year 2019-20, that is, between 2019 and 2020.

[Patricia Lattanzio, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

Okay, they've received five on part V of the law.

What were the circumstances and conclusions of those complaints?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

They were under part V, dealing with the language of work. Those are internal matters. Typically the commissioner does not make the findings public in order to protect the privacy of the complainant, ensuring thereby that the complainant's issues remain private. I don't know the outcome because the commissioner never releases these investigations.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Minister and Ms. Lattanzio.

Mr. Beaulieu, you have the floor for two and a half minutes.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

I'd like to go back to francophone board appointments.

The Teamsters Union of Canada has filed a lot of complaints that reveal various problems and involve safety issues. There's a risk of accident if a controller gives important instructions to someone but can't speak to him in his language.

Do you have some sort of authority to intervene in safety matters?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

I agree on the importance of the ability of workers to work in their language of choice, and it has a safety ramification. CN, if we're talking here about CN, has an obligation to ensure that all of its workers are able to work in their language of choice, and if it is not upholding that responsibility, the official languages commissioner is able to investigate and hold them accountable for potential failure.

To your point, I want to reiterate that safety is at stake, and not only rights. Safety is at stake and CN must fulfill its obligation.

[Mario Beaulieu, Bloc, La Pointe-de-l'Île, QC]

CN is subject to the Official Languages Act, unlike other federally regulated private businesses such as Air Canada. As you said earlier, these are former crown corporations that made amendments with respect to official languages when they were privatized, but we can see that isn't working.

The Official Languages Act is based on institutional bilingualism. That means that individuals may use the language of their choice. However, what happens if one person wants to work in English and another in French? That principle doesn't work. There has to be a common language. That's why the purpose of Bill 101 is to make French the common language.

The Official Languages Act hasn't worked in the past 50 years. Why do we keep saying it will work better? The very principle of the Official Languages Act doesn't work. Why not let Quebec, for example, apply Bill 101 to federally regulated businesses?

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. That's all the time you had. Two and a half minutes go by very quickly.

The next speaker for two and a half…

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

I would love to respond to this, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

You may do so if someone asks you a question on the subject. I have to give everyone a chance to speak.

The next questions are from Ms. Ashton, for two minutes and 30 seconds.

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

We've heard today about how both Air Canada and CN—now privatized—are not living up to their obligations when it comes to respecting the rights of francophones, that is, their responsibilities when it comes to services in French.

I'm very concerned by the government's most recent proposal, seeking private proposals to cover service for Via Rail's high-frequency corridor. Unifor, which represents more than 2,000 workers at Via, was clear in its opposition, saying, “Public-private partnerships cost more, don't work, and the facts speak for themselves. Privatization in transport means higher costs, broken promises, worse service and route closures”—and perhaps we could add that it will impact service in French.

Nevertheless, this is a strategy that your government is using time and again. We've seen this with the Infrastructure Bank. We are trying to fix that through my bill, Bill C-245, investing in indigenous and northern communities in light of the climate crisis.

Why is your government continuing to rely on bad economic policies that privilege the ultra-wealthy, push privatization and, ultimately, impact negatively on service and service delivery in French?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Mr. Chair, and Ms. Ashton, while we are talking today about some of the shortcomings of some former Crown corporations or areas of improvement for our Official Languages Act, I think it's really important as well to take stock of the fact that Canada and Canadians have been working really hard together to protect French and to ensure that our cultural identity remains as diverse and as rich as we're accustomed to. I think it's really important to identify what else we can do to improve our Official Languages Act, but we should also recognize that we've done a lot of good. We will continue to do more to ensure that we protect people's rights.

As far as high-frequency rail is concerned, this is a great project for rail workers and travellers. We're going to deliver the largest project in Canada's history, which offers to revolutionize the corridor. I'm looking forward to your support in ensuring that we do it right and deliver it on behalf of Canadians.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, René Arseneault]

Thank you.

Ms. Ashton, you have only three seconds left.

We will hear two more speakers, Mr. Généreux and Ms. Kayabaga.

I'll have to take back one minute from both of you to stay on schedule. So you will have four minutes each.

Go ahead, Mr. Généreux.

[Bernard Généreux, Conservative, Montmagny—L'Islet—Kamouraska—Rivière-du-Loup, QC]

Finally, some speaking time, Mr. Chair. Thank you.

Good afternoon, Minister. Thank you for being here.

I'm honestly disappointed today because you don't have any solutions for us apart from Bill C‑13, which our committee will soon begin considering.

The bill would provide for fines of up to $25,000 that the Commissioner of Official Languages could impose. Given CN's revenues, which run into the billions of dollars, I'm not sure a $25,000 fine would change much.

The bill would also give the Commissioner authority to order businesses subject to the Official Languages Act to take certain types of action. I would like to hear what you think of that. Are you in favour of that possibility?

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

Mr. Chair, and Mr. Généreux, CN already has legal obligation. It is obligated by law. What Bill C-13 proposes are additional tools to enforce the law.

[Bernard Généreux, Conservative, Montmagny—L'Islet—Kamouraska—Rivière-du-Loup, QC]

If CN already has that obligation under the act, why isn't it meeting it?

Actually, to be fair to CN, I have to say it appointed Jean Charest, but he unfortunately resigned so he can do something else now. I have at least 100 experienced Quebec candidates that I could suggest to CN. They include Lawrence Cannon, former Minister of Transport, Infrastructure and Communities and former Canadian ambassador to Paris. He would definitely be ready to take on that role in a business like this, just as you will be, Minister, once you've left politics, since you'll have the necessary experience.

So there are hundreds of perfectly bilingual candidates in Quebec who could definitely play a role like that at CN.

My impression is that no one has made the effort. The fact of the matter is that the Canadian government can't really do anything except make suggestions and then be disappointed when they aren't considered.

[Omar Alghabra, Liberal, Mississauga Centre, ON]

We should make a distinction between CN's obligation under the law and the makeup of the board. You have heard me here today speak very clearly in opposition to how CN appointed its board members from a leadership standpoint, but the law is silent on this issue. Having said that, we are here today learning from that shortcoming and there is an ongoing discussion about CN's responsibility. CN has acknowledged that this should not have happened.

I'm looking forward to the committee's study and report on this, but again, I'm not going to shy away from doing everything I can to defend the interests and the rights of Quebeckers to speak and work and receive service in the language of their choice.

I will encourage CN not only to uphold the law—its obligation under the law—but also to go beyond that to ensure that they are promoting and protecting the rights of French and those who work at CN.

[Bernard Généreux, Conservative, Montmagny—L'Islet—Kamouraska—Rivière-du-Loup, QC]

I have other names I could give you…