Public Accounts Committee on Nov. 19th, 2020

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

That answer actually suffices quite well, Ms. Thomas.

In the event that the Liberals or the Conservatives try to privatize delivery services, including the COVID vaccination, is it still fair to say that it would be cheaper for the Department of National Defence to be delivering its own materiel rather than using commercial services?

[Jody Thomas]

General Cadieu is responsible for transportation, so I'll ask him to respond.

[MGen T. J. Cadieu]

We move materiel based on the operational necessity, so there will be times—if, for example, we need to get equipment parts, food or additional resources to deployed troops—where we might have to rely on commercial means if that's going to be quicker than what we refer to as the “national freight run” or the green trucks to move our equipment.

We assess the criticality of the operational requirement and the imperative to get it into the hands of the men and women who are serving on behalf of the nation as we make these determinations.

[Matthew Green, NDP, Hamilton Centre, ON]

How are you able to budget for the cost overruns for the use of commercial delivery services and what pool of money do you have to pull from to cover your delivery overrun costs?

[MGen T. J. Cadieu]

Madam Chair, in all of the operations we conduct, we plan in great detail, including for the financial resources that are required and including for the use of commercial transport if and when we need to use it to push materiel out to our deployed troops.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly Block]

Thank you very much, General Cadieu.

Members, that takes us to the end of our third round.

Before we move into the next portion of our meeting, I do have a question that was prepared by the analyst from the Library of Parliament regarding recommendation 3.57.

That recommendation states:

National Defence should communicate the costs of all available transportation methods and provide clear guidance on how to select the mode of transportation to ensure that decisions are founded on a full understanding of costs.

What progress has been made with respect to defining the problem and determining the best methodology to query the existing data? I'll pose that to Ms. Thomas.

[Jody Thomas]

This is part of the holistic review that is being done of the entire process to look at our end-to-end delivery. We need to be completely transparent on costs. We need to make cost-effective decisions. We need to be able to manage the inventory and the movement of goods around the country in a way that is cost-effective, and we will be publishing results of studies as they become available.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly Block]

Thank you very much for that answer.

Because we are so close to 12:45, and that's the time that we designated for committee business, I want to thank our witnesses for joining us today. It's been a tremendous time here with you, hearing the very good questions of our members and the answers that we've received.

I will thank you and let you know that you are free to leave this meeting at this time.

We will then go into committee business.

Seeing that the witnesses have all left, we have two orders of business in front of us for the next 15 minutes.

The first is the budgets, and I believe they were all circulated to you. I think what we will do, if the committee members agree, is to just go through each one asking for whether or not it is the will of the committee to adopt the budgets as presented. We then have a service contract that the clerk has sent to all members.

Are there any questions before we begin?

Go ahead, Mr. Longfield.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

I just wanted to say thank you to the clerk. The estimates are a lot lower than they normally come in at when you don't have travel. I wonder whether we're able to approve them in one shot rather than do each one individually.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly Block]

Absolutely, we could take care of this in one motion if it is unanimous to just adopt the budgets as presented.

[Lloyd Longfield, Liberal, Guelph, ON]

In that case, I would so move that we adopt all the budgets.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly Block]

Are there any questions around that?

Go ahead, Mr. Blanchette-Joncas.

[Maxime Blanchette-Joncas, Bloc, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'll ask a simple question.

I've noticed that several of our colleagues are participating in this meeting virtually. Project budget requests always include an “other expenses” category for working meals. We could save money if we were to bring our own meals. I understand that this money might not be spent. That said, even if the money is included in the budget, it constitutes allocated amounts that we could save. Since the start of this parliamentary session, most of my colleagues have been attending meetings virtually. Meals can be prepared. However, if people aren't here to eat them, money will be wasted.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly Block]

Madame Clerk, would you like to speak to that issue? I know that there is a process for determining what is needed to be ordered.

[The Clerk of the Committee, Ms. Angela Crandall]

Certainly, thank you, Chair.

I've included meals in the budget, one for each meeting that we normally would have on the study. We don't necessarily spend that money or have to spend it. If we don't, it goes directly back into the budget for committees. It's a question of being able to order meals if members indicate that they're going to be present. Even if we had half the members here, it probably wouldn't cost the full amount, but it's a question of having the money available so we don't have to go back and ask for more in a budget.

It's the same with the headsets. The number may be a little bit higher than what we may actually spend. We may not have the actual number of headsets for witnesses, but it's a question of being prepared so that we don't have to come back to you and say we need a budget for $75 to pay for something.

As I said, the money goes back into the general committee budget, the directorate, if it's not spent. That's usually fairly quickly after the end of a study.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly Block]

Does that answer your question, Mr. Blanchette-Joncas?

[Maxime Blanchette-Joncas, Bloc, Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC]

Yes.

Thank you, Madam Chair and Madam Clerk.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly Block]

All in favour of adopting the budgets as presented?

(Motion agreed to)

The next item on our agenda is the calendar.

After the last meeting and pursuant to the motion adopted by the committee, the clerk, analysts and myself had a discussion and I would like to propose the following changes to the calendar. I do believe that it was circulated to you ahead of time. I hope you have had the opportunity to look at it.

The first change would be that the committee invite the appropriate witnesses to appear on Thursday, December 3, in relation to “Report 3—Taxation of E-Commerce” of the 2019 spring reports of the Auditor General of Canada. That directly relates to a motion that was adopted at the last meeting.

Number two is that the committee study any available draft reports on Tuesday, December 8.

Is it the will of the committee to adopt the amended calendar as presented?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly Block]

Seeing that everyone has agreed to that, we will adopt this calendar.

I believe that takes care of our business for this period during our meeting.

I would remind you that our next meeting will be on Tuesday, November 24, with Mr. Longfield chairing it. I think you're in for a treat with Mr. Longfield chairing.

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

Madam Chair, I just have one question.

Is there any update on the training that was scheduled?

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly Block]

Yes, that is on the calendar, I believe. It is scheduled for Thursday, the 26th. I believe it was scheduled on that day, so that didn't change from the original calendar.

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly Block]

You're welcome.

If there are no other questions, I will adjourn the meeting.

Thank you so much.