Public Safety Committee on March 20th, 2007

[The Chair, Conservative, Garry Breitkreuz]

I would like to call this meeting to order. This is the 34th meeting of the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National Security. The first part of the meeting is in public, and we are dealing with a motion from the government side, from Mr. Dave MacKenzie, regarding Bill C-286.

Mr. MacKenzie, would you like to refresh our memory, or can we deal with that right now?

[Dave MacKenzie, Conservative, Oxford, ON]

I'd be happy to, Mr. Chair.

What we're asking is that the standing committee extend by 30 days the study on Bill C-286. Just for a little bit of background, I'd be pleased to share with the committee a press release that went out. It perhaps will explain some of why we've had this delay. It's not what we wanted, but it's what has developed.

This was a press release of March 16:

The Honourable Monte Solberg, Minister of Human Resources and Social Development and the Honourable Stockwell Day, Minister of Public Safety Canada, today announced the beginning of consultations for a proposed new service for victims of abuse.

The consultations will focus on how to effectively integrate programs from a number of federal departments to form a service delivery network for victims at risk. Service Canada will engage in discussions with federal government departments, provincial and territorial partners and stakeholder and advocacy groups in the development of this comprehensive approach to assist victims at risk of serious injury or death in changing their identities while respecting jurisdictional authorities.

In the proposed new service, Service Canada will be responsible for coordinating access to all required federal government services and will work with provincial and territorial government partners. The proposed new service is being developed in consultation with Public Safety Canada.

“Support for this most vulnerable group requires a coordinated response from all levels of government. My department will work with provincial and territorial counterparts so that the process is seamless and secure for victims of abuse,” said Minister Solberg.

What we're trying to do is take this away from the victim witness program operated by the RCMP to give domestic victims of abuse the protection of providing them with new identities. It's a service that's been there for a good number of years, but we're trying to make it more available and more accessible for those victims so that there's not the huge cost, and there's also not the need for victims then to essentially lose all their contact with family and friends back home. It just simply will give them the opportunity to assume new identities in some other community of their choice. That proposal is satisfactory to the proposer, and once it's done I think it will satisfy everybody. Then the bill need not pass in the House.

[The Chair, Conservative, Garry Breitkreuz]

And we have to deal with this today because I have to report it to the House before Thursday.

[Dave MacKenzie, Conservative, Oxford, ON]

That's right.

[The Chair, Conservative, Garry Breitkreuz]

Ms. Barnes.

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

The only concern on this side is the fact that just because we do the motion here, it's still deemed a passed bill by Thursday. So the only way we'd support this is with the assurance that if this is not passed...to get an extension in the House, we have to deal with it before Thursday, and that's a problem.

[The Chair, Conservative, Garry Breitkreuz]

Let me refer that to the procedural experts here, but I believe if we deal with this today and refer it to the House and I report it before Thursday, the House doesn't have to vote on the acceptance of our motion at that point. The vote can take place at a later time, I believe.

Is that correct?

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

My information is that according to the Standing Orders of the House, it's deemed passed by this committee within 60 days. Our 60 days are up Thursday. So unless the House gives us an extension, this is deemed passed by Thursday. That's my concern, and that's not what I think we had planned to do here.

This is something that I made you aware of before the break period.

[The Chair, Conservative, Garry Breitkreuz]

I know we have to report it back by Thursday, but in asking for the extension, I don't think it has to be voted on before Thursday.

[The Clerk of the Committee, Ms. Louise Hayes]

If the request for an extension is presented in the House before the deadline for the private member's bill, that is okay for meeting the requirement for the deadline. Then, of course, the report would have to be concurred in for the extension to take effect, but that could happen after the deadline if the report has been presented to the House by the committee. That is my understanding.

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

What would happen if they say no in the House? Does that mean we've passed the bill at committee?

[The Chair, Conservative, Garry Breitkreuz]

No, that's one of those--

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

I believe it's deemed to be passed. That's why, if we're not going to get an extension, I would like us to have a meeting tomorrow so we can deal with this.

I think Mr. MacKenzie is saying this is not the appropriate vehicle; there is another appropriate vehicle. What logically should happen is that this gets turned down at committee.

Once the House has sent the bill here, I don't believe there's a rule that allows the presenter of the bill to withdraw his own bill. He needs the consent of the House to do that.

[The Chair, Conservative, Garry Breitkreuz]

But I don't see how this can happen before tomorrow.

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

I don't want this bill going back to the House as deemed to be approved. That's the same concern that I--

[The Chair, Conservative, Garry Breitkreuz]

We will make that request for an extension. According to the clerk, once we make that request, as long as it's before the 60 days, we have met the requirements. If it's accepted, then the House can deal with the report from this committee. If it's not accepted, I don't know what we can do. We'll have to come back and deal with it.

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

On Thursday.

[The Chair, Conservative, Garry Breitkreuz]

Well, I'll report it before Thursday, but I don't think the House will have made a decision before Thursday.

According to this, as long as we report it back, we have met the requirements.

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

But we haven't reported it back. All we're going to report back is a motion to ask for an extension.

[The Chair, Conservative, Garry Breitkreuz]

We could try to get concurrence tomorrow, if there's all-party support for the motion.

[Sue Barnes, Liberal, London West, ON]

Yes. Why don't you try to get concurrence, and if not, put it on your agenda for Thursday. I think there would be some change in how people would deal with this on Thursday if you don't get this.

[The Chair, Conservative, Garry Breitkreuz]

Okay. We have all parties represented here. Can everybody on this committee talk to their whips, House leaders, and make sure that nobody throws sand in the gears tomorrow when I report on this to the House?

Yes, Mr. Comartin.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

I don't have the bill number in front of me.

[The Chair, Conservative, Garry Breitkreuz]

It's Bill C-286.

[Joe Comartin, NDP, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

I'm a bit concerned about the timing. Is the deemed acceptance date on Thursday?