Public Safety Committee on Nov. 29th, 2018

Evidence of meeting #141 for Public Safety and National Security in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was chair.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

Bill C-83

Supplementary Estimates (A), 2018-19: Votes 1a and 5a under Canada Border Services Agency, Vote 1a under Canadian Security Intelligence Service, Vote 1a under Civilian Review and Complaints Commission for the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, Vote 1a under Correctional Service of Canada, Votes 1a and 5a under Department of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness, Vote 1a under Office of the Correctional Investigator of Canada, Vote 1a under Parole Board of Canada, Votes 1a, 5a and 10a under Royal

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Angela Connidis Director General, Crime Prevention, Corrections and Criminal Justice Directorate, Department of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness

Ruby Sahota Brampton North, Lib.

Luc Bisson Director, Strategic Policy, Correctional Service of Canada

Jim Eglinski Yellowhead, CPC

Juline Fresco Counsel, Legal Services, Department of Justice

Clerk of the Committee Mr. Olivier Champagne

3:45 p.m.

Green

Elizabeth May Green Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

We're still in the same clause, dealing with the same question.

The proposed section that I seek to amend now states:in consultation with the offender, in order to ensure that they receive the most effective programs at the appropriate time during their confinement in the unit and to prepare them for reintegration into the mainstream inmate population.

My amendment adds “as soon as possible”. This stems from the United Nations Committee Against Torture. It's called on Canada to “limit the use of solitary confinement [to] a measure of last resort for as short a time as possible”.

This will require that the updates of the prisoner's correctional plan be tied to this objective of release back into the general population as quickly as possible. I hope you'll find it acceptable.

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

3:45 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal John McKay

This is the ASAP amendment.

Go ahead, Ms. Dabrusin.

3:45 p.m.

Liberal

Julie Dabrusin Liberal Toronto—Danforth, ON

This is just to say thank you to Ms. May for bringing it. I think it's a helpful addition and I support it.

3:45 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal John McKay

Go ahead, Mr. Motz.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Glen Motz Conservative Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner, AB

There's a gentleman by the name of Glen Brown, a retired warden and deputy warden, and I've had a conversation with him about his experience.

Officials can correct me if I'm wrong or if his assessment is wrong, but he urges that sometimes the rapid reintegration of inmates, as this entails, is not in their best interests. The current practice of preparing them for transition, as the wording said, should not be rushed. That's from a conversation with him, as someone who is in the business and has been in the business for many years.

I certainly would throw that out there. If this is all about the best interests and the rehabilitation of an inmate, then that's something we need to consider.

3:45 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal John McKay

Is there further debate?

(Amendment agreed to [See Minutes of Proceedings])

On PV-4, go ahead, Ms. May.

3:45 p.m.

Green

Elizabeth May Green Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to members for passing that last amendment. It's much appreciated.

Again, this is dealing with the whole question of making decisions and updating plans. This was a suggestion from Senator Pate. As we know, she has had an extraordinary career and a commitment to the Elizabeth Fry Society in advocating for women in incarceration.

The suggestion is to add the following to the bill:(2.2) The offender under subsection (2.1) whose correctional plan is to be updated shall be given an opportunity to make written representations to the institutional head before any decisions on program selection are made.

Again, this was to be in consultation with the offender, but other than being asked to sign that they've received the documentation, there is no meaningful involvement unless we add this amendment.

I would really appreciate consideration for Green Party amendment 4.

3:45 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal John McKay

Thank you, Ms. May.

Is there debate?

Go ahead, Mr. Paul-Hus.

3:45 p.m.

Conservative

Pierre Paul-Hus Conservative Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles, QC

Is this already common practice among inmates? Are they able to correspond with authorities when their programs are discussed?

3:50 p.m.

Director, Strategic Policy, Correctional Service of Canada

Luc Bisson

This is already part of our practices and policies. We work with inmates to develop their plans, and we monitor their progress. That's already the case.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Pierre Paul-Hus Conservative Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles, QC

All right. Thank you.

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal John McKay

Is there any further debate?

(Amendment negatived)

(Clause 3 as amended agreed to)

(Clause 4 agreed to on division)

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Pierre Paul-Hus Conservative Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles, QC

On division.

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal John McKay

I see you're training these folks well, Mr. Paul-Hus.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Pierre Paul-Hus Conservative Charlesbourg—Haute-Saint-Charles, QC

I'll put my lens on now.

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal John McKay

You can actually see your amendments.

3:50 p.m.

Conservative

Glen Motz Conservative Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner, AB

You will see when we get to amendment CPC-2 that I have to do it because he couldn't read it. It's his new glasses. He's getting used to them.

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal John McKay

I'm pleased to hear that the Conservatives can now see where they are going.

We're on clause 5 and amendment PV-5.

Go ahead, Ms. May.

3:50 p.m.

Green

Elizabeth May Green Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

This one would apply when a registered health professional believes that a prisoner's death was due to natural causes and the natural cause is a chronic illness.

The amendment I'm proposing would require that health care professional to consider lifestyle changes or habits that could have managed that illness, in, for example, an illness like diabetes, and the extent to which lifestyle changes were restricted as a result of being confined in the unit. Again this comes from a recommendation from Senator Pate.

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal John McKay

Is there any debate?

(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])

We're on amendment PV-6.

3:50 p.m.

Green

Elizabeth May Green Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC

Thank you. Mr. Chair, we're still in—

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal John McKay

Sorry for that. I have to ask whether clause 5 carries.

(Clause 5 agreed to on division)

(On clause 6)

We are now on clause 6.

On amendment PV-6, go ahead, Ms. May.

November 29th, 2018 / 3:50 p.m.

Green

Elizabeth May Green Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC

Thank you.

Again, I think the committee was already guided by this notion that we changed with the first amendment that was carried after it was amended. This reintroduces language of least restrictive measures, also present in Bill C-56. It was formerly in the “principles” section of the Corrections and Conditional Release Act.

The amendment says that if a person is to be confined, the Correctional Service shall take all reasonable steps to ensure that the penitentiary in which they are confined is one that provides them with the least restrictive environment for that person.

That amendment achieves a goal that is quite similar to that of the first one that the committee just accepted.

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

The Chair Liberal John McKay

Okay.

Go ahead, Ms. Damoff.

3:50 p.m.

Liberal

Pam Damoff Liberal Oakville North—Burlington, ON

I just want to thank my friend from Saanich—Gulf Islands. That's an excellent amendment, and we'll be happy to support it.