Public Safety Committee on May 15th, 2017

[The Chair, Liberal, Rob Oliphant]

Thank you, Minister.

We will now move on to Mr. Di Iorio.

[Nicola Di Iorio, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Goodale, thank you for your generous remarks.

I would also like to thank the people with you, the directors, senior officials or people at the top of their organization.

I would also like to thank Mr. Paulson and Mr. Coulombe for their fine work with the committee, at least while I have been here. My first question is for them.

Canada is in a particular situation. Mr. Paulson and Mr. Coulombe will be leaving their positions at nearly the same time. We are all concerned about governance in this regard.

Since you yourself referred to their positions as being the most important, how can we reassure Canadians?

[Ralph Goodale, Liberal, Regina—Wascana, SK]

Mr. Di Iorio, I think the RCMP and CSIS lead two very expert organizations. They are fine leaders in their own right, but they have also cultivated others with leadership skills and capacities, and as they take their leave from their onerous responsibilities, Canadians can be assured that the others who will fill that space will be competent successors.

In the case of Monsieur Coulombe, the Prime Minister has announced David Vigneault will become the new director of CSIS. I believe David will take charge toward the end of June. In the meantime, Jeff Yaworski, the deputy director in charge of operations, will be managing the CSIS apparatus.

David, who will become the full director toward the end of June, brings with him a huge amount of experience in the security and intelligence portions of the PCO, as well as previously in CSIS, CBSA, and CSEC. He has broad experience in the agencies of the Government of Canada that deal with security issues.

In the case of the commissioner of the RCMP, this is a hugely important selection, and as I said in response to an earlier question, we have established or are in the process of establishing a selection committee that will represent the broad strengths of Canadian society. It will be up to that group of people to search the recruitment and they will present a list of excellent alternatives to provide the Prime Minister with options for a successor to Commissioner Paulson. It's a very solid process because we are in search of the best of the best.

[Nicola Di Iorio, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Goodale.

I would like to move on to another topic, one that I call sexual safety.

This issue obviously affects women more than men. It can certainly happen to men, but in terms of the numbers, it happens to women more often.

Mr. Goodale, we are in a country where, it must be said...

You referred to it. You have even begun a process to review sexual assault complaints and to ensure that, if those complaints were deemed unfounded in the past, they are properly examined to determine whether they are founded. So a review process is under way.

What I am saying is that we have to go much further than that.

Mr. Goodale, as I said, women experience this much more often than men do.

We must ensure the sexual safety of Canadians. Our system of government was devised in the 19th century and smacks of the Middle Ages. The reality is that sexuality and sexual development are experienced in a different way in the 21st century. The concept of consent has also evolved.

Should action not be taken to reflect this reality so that women can come and go in the world and develop sexually without the fear of violence, assault or any kind of force directed against that freedom they have?

[Ralph Goodale, Liberal, Regina—Wascana, SK]

Part of the answer, Mr. Di lorio, comes from the publicity around this issue in the last number of years, and indeed within the last year here in Canada. It is very publicly discussed now. I wonder when the last time was that somebody asked that kind of a question in a committee of Parliament. It's getting greater public attention, and that's good.

I was pleased when I saw the media stories back in the winter that put this issue on the front pages and prompted a reaction from governments and police forces all across the country. It's good that we're developing that kind of momentum.

Part of the government's response—and it can't be the only part—is the commitment of more than $100 million in the federal budget for a new strategic approach to gender-based violence. Together, the minister responsible for the status of women and my department will be looking forward to an early opportunity to roll forward the details of that, a significant portion of which will be the activities of the RCMP. They were already proactive on this file before the fact, but they will play a very important role in the strategy and the work of the Government of Canada on gender-based violence.

We also look forward to every opportunity to work with our provincial and territorial colleagues to make sure this is a coherent, seamless, national effort.

[The Chair, Liberal, Rob Oliphant]

Thank you, Mr. Di Iorio.

[Nicola Di Iorio, Liberal, Saint-Léonard—Saint-Michel, QC]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Rob Oliphant]

You have seven minutes.

Mr. Miller.

[Larry Miller, Conservative, Bruce—Grey—Owen Sound, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thanks again, Minister, for being here.

A couple of issues on firearms-related bills and issues that have been irritants in the firearms community, Mr. Minister, arise from the legislation proposed in Bill C-47. There are a number of clauses, but one that's particularly disconcerting to people in the firearms community is the fact that a lot of people who hunt will hunt internationally as well.

To take their firearms and go to another country—let's use the U.S. as an example—their understanding is that there are going to be huge problems bringing their firearms back into Canada. I hope you have your people take a good look at that.

Another issue here is that I was assured some time ago, last fall, by your former parliamentary secretary, that the government was quite aware there were problems with the term “variant” in the—

We seem to have some music on.

[Ralph Goodale, Liberal, Regina—Wascana, SK]

It's a good song, though.

[Tony Clement, Conservative, Parry Sound—Muskoka, ON]

I've danced to that song before.

[Larry Miller, Conservative, Bruce—Grey—Owen Sound, ON]

I hope this isn't eating into my time.

There's an issue, Mr. Minister, with the lack of definition for the term “variant”, which is used in the Firearms Act 97 times. I've been assured that the government is aware there's a problem, and it was implied to me that you're going to fix it.

I would like to know what the timing is on that, and whether there will be consultations with the firearms community.

[Ralph Goodale, Liberal, Regina—Wascana, SK]

There are consultations on everything, so I think you can be assured that there will be.

[Larry Miller, Conservative, Bruce—Grey—Owen Sound, ON]

I don't remember that being the case back in 1995, when the long-gun registry was brought in.

[Ralph Goodale, Liberal, Regina—Wascana, SK]

I see what you're referring to. I was thinking more of the last year and a half.

I would be more than happy to take the details of the two situations you referred to—the border crossing issue and the definition of “variant”—and get back to you with further details about the exact steps.

[Larry Miller, Conservative, Bruce—Grey—Owen Sound, ON]

Thank you. I would appreciate that very much.

I also had some questions on the sexual assault case with the RCMP, but I think my questions there were answered.

You mentioned a study, and I might have missed the terminology there—my hearing isn't so good. You talked about the mental capacity of inmates, and mental health generally.

[Ralph Goodale, Liberal, Regina—Wascana, SK]

Mental health issues, yes.

[Larry Miller, Conservative, Bruce—Grey—Owen Sound, ON]

I'd like a little more understanding, Mr. Minister, of exactly where you'll go with that, because some people might say that for a lot of people in the prison system their mental health might have had something to do with why they're there to start with—not all, of course. Could you give us a little understanding of exactly how that study and that work will be carried out?

[Ralph Goodale, Liberal, Regina—Wascana, SK]

In terms of the exact application of the funding in the budget, Mr. Head would be in the best position to describe the kind of programming that he has in mind to deal with people in these situations.

If you recall, at the time of the election, the platform identified two particular groups that appear to be overrepresented in the population within correctional systems, and where some additional attention was required to try to make sure that they were being dealt with in an appropriate manner that would actually contribute more to the prospect of rehabilitation, and ultimately, community and public safety. Those two groups were indigenous people, who are clearly overrepresented, constituting about 4% or 5% of the general population but representing 25% of the population in the correctional system, and people suffering from various kinds of mental health issues.

A primary example there that was very prominent in the last number of years was the case of Ashley Smith, a young woman of 19 years of age, I believe, who—

[Larry Miller, Conservative, Bruce—Grey—Owen Sound, ON]

Unfortunately, we're—

[The Chair, Liberal, Rob Oliphant]

I'll give you extra because of that music.

[Larry Miller, Conservative, Bruce—Grey—Owen Sound, ON]

Yes, we're quite aware of that very sad case.

[Ralph Goodale, Liberal, Regina—Wascana, SK]

We're following through on both of those priorities: the treatment of indigenous people and the treatment of people with mental health issues.

[Larry Miller, Conservative, Bruce—Grey—Owen Sound, ON]

Okay. I appreciate that.

I have one last quick question. Formerly, a government ministry ran an equine therapy program that was very successful. The reason I ask about this is that the marijuana law your government is bringing in shortly, could, I'll say, create a lot of problems with drugs and youth and what have you. That's what this equine therapy was about. I'm wondering if your government is considering any other programs like that or using examples from the past to help deal with those issues when the time comes.

[Ralph Goodale, Liberal, Regina—Wascana, SK]

We are very much in favour of evidence-based decision-making, and where a program or a service can be demonstrated as effective and useful, obviously we're open to consideration, based on the facts. That's why we've taken the position on marijuana that we have.

We have an approach now that costs about $2.5 billion a year to administer, yet Canadian young people are among the heaviest users of marijuana in the world. At the same time, $8 billion to $9 billion is going into the hands of organized crime. We have to do better than that, and we believe the system that we've proposed in legislation will actually achieve a better result to better protect our kids, stop the flow of illegal cash to crime organizations, and establish a regime that will make society overall safer and healthier.