Public Safety Committee on March 10th, 2021

[Patty Hajdu, Liberal, Thunder Bay—Superior North, ON]

Mr. Harris, it's nice to meet you virtually as well.

Yes, I do, and I think one indication of that is the deep collaboration we've had with the United States over two administrations now. Both administrations have agreed that non-essential travel should be curtailed as our countries fight COVID-19 and work to reduce the cases of COVID-19 in our communities. We've worked really hard with our American partners.

I will turn to Minister Blair in a moment to speak about that work, because he's been leading the charge, largely to ensure that we can continue the flow of essential workers and goods while also—

[Jack Harris, NDP, St. John's East, NL]

I understand that. Maybe I should interrupt. It was a simple question, and I think you've given the answer that you do indeed regard them as reasonable.

It was a kind of trick question, in a way, because the provision for quarantine regulations under the Quarantine Act says that you can't undertake certain measures unless there's no reasonable alternative.

I'm comparing the measures for the land border measures with the air travel measures, particularly with respect to the hotel quarantine. There's no reasonable alternative to the hotel quarantine, I would have to assume.

If I ask you that, then I will ask you the following question. How is it, then, that it's possible—and we've heard a number of MPs talk about this in the last number of days—for people to bypass this by landing in the U.S. and then taking a bus across the border and all of that? How is it that it's a reasonable alternative to have a land border without a hotel quarantine, but it's not in the case of air travel?

[Patty Hajdu, Liberal, Thunder Bay—Superior North, ON]

Minister Blair, I think you were jumping in.

[Bill Blair, Liberal, Scarborough Southwest, ON]

I was.

Jack, I'll try to answer this briefly, and I don't mean to interrupt Minister Hajdu.

I would point out that there are 117 land points of entry at which Canadians can currently cross when they're returning from the United States. In addition to returning non-essential travellers, more than 90% of the people who cross at those land border points of entry are truck drivers. They're essential workers; they are bringing essential supplies to and from Canada. It's a very small cohort—in most border locations, fewer than 5%—of the travellers who are coming to that border who are non-essential in nature.

I would also point out that although some of them these border crossings are located in fairly densely populated urban areas, the vast majority of them are quite remote. They are hundreds of kilometres, and in some cases several hundreds of kilometres, from any possibility of a hotel or even PHAC staff at these things.

We've implemented the measures that we believe are appropriate, necessary and effective, given the size of the cohort of people we're dealing with. More than 90% of the people arriving at the airport are non-essential travellers, while a significantly smaller proportion of people at land borders are non-essential. The measures we've put in place, we believe, are the right measures.

I would also point out that at the airports we've limited all international travel to four international airports. They're located in Montreal, Toronto, Calgary and Vancouver—clearly, large urban centres where hotels and PHAC staff are available to manage the measures that have been put in place there.

[Jack Harris, NDP, St. John's East, NL]

Basically, Minister, you're saying that the alternative measures that are available at the border are not available at these major airports for incoming traffic. I find it a contradiction, I'm afraid.

[Bill Blair, Liberal, Scarborough Southwest, ON]

It's quite the opposite. The measures that are available at the major airports are not available in Snowflake, Manitoba. They're not available in Beaver Creek in the Yukon. We've, therefore, had to implement measures that are appropriate to that environment and those circumstances.

[Jack Harris, NDP, St. John's East, NL]

I have another follow-up question, and I wasn't here for your presentation, Minister Blair, because I was told by our whip's office that the committee had been rescheduled to five o'clock as a result of the votes. It's unfortunate if I'm repeating something that has already been answered.

We've been told that the designation of people to a particular hotel and all of those rules are actually determined under the Quarantine Act. Reading from the note here, it says with travellers quarantining in a hotel, the facility is required to safely transport travellers from the airport to the hotel and provide travellers with lodging as set by the Public Health Agency, and also to provide the travellers with necessities and a safe and accessible environment.

I'm wondering, does this mean that you've downloaded the responsibility for safe transport from the airport to the hotels to the hotel owners, and also the safety within the hotels to the hotel owners as well? Is that the case, or is it still the responsibility of CBSA, as quarantine officers, to make sure that travellers safely get to the hotels and that while they're in quarantine, under government obligation, they are protected by the officials of the Canadian government, the quarantine officers or whoever else is appointed for their safety?

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Unfortunately, that question is going to have to go unanswered because Mr. Harris has gone through his six minutes.

Colleagues, we have 25 minutes—

[Jack Harris, NDP, St. John's East, NL]

It's a very important question though, sir, so maybe somebody could answer at some point.

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Yes, I'm sure someone will work it back.

Colleagues, we have 20 minutes left in the time allotted, but we have 25-minutes worth of questions. Unless I see real objection, I propose to do a full second round and go past the time.

With that, I could call on Madam Rempel Garner.

Welcome to the committee. You have five minutes, please.

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

Thank you, Chair.

Minister Hajdu, is the government in possession of data that show that the quarantine hotel program is more effective in preventing the spread of COVID-19 variants than at-home quarantine, coupled with pre- and post-arrival testing?

[Patty Hajdu, Liberal, Thunder Bay—Superior North, ON]

The quarantine and mandatory quarantine has been an important part of protecting Canadians—

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

That's not what I asked.

[Patty Hajdu, Liberal, Thunder Bay—Superior North, ON]

—from the importation of COVID-19.

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

Chair, that's not what I asked. I only have five minutes. Is the government in possession of data that show that the quarantine hotel program is more effective at preventing the spread of COVID-19 variants than at-home quarantine, coupled with pre- and post-arrival testing, yes or no?

[Patty Hajdu, Liberal, Thunder Bay—Superior North, ON]

The government has proceeded in this way to make sure that people have a safe place to stay while they receive the results of their tests at the airport. This test is very important, as I've mentioned before. It will, first of all, show if someone is positive for COVID-19—

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

Chair, through you—

[Patty Hajdu, Liberal, Thunder Bay—Superior North, ON]

Secondly, it allows—

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

Chair—

[The Chair, Liberal, John McKay]

Madam Rempel Garner, generally speaking I allow the same amount of time to answer the question as to asking the question. You had about 20 seconds to ask the question. Minister Hajdu was right on the 20-second mark, and I anticipate that she'll be able to complete her answer without further interruption.

With that, I'm going to have to restart this clock somehow or other. You have about 10 seconds to answer the question, and I don't know where I am with Ms. Rempel Garner's time.

[The Clerk of the Committee, Mr. Mark D'Amore]

Five more minutes.

[Patty Hajdu, Liberal, Thunder Bay—Superior North, ON]

Thank you.

The new approach allows the government to test all samples for variants of concern. As I mentioned, this is a very critical time in our fight against COVID and those variants of concern, both known and unknown, are important to understand.

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

Through you, Chair, various charter challenges have asked for data from the federal government showing that the hotel quarantine program is more effective at preventing the spread of COVID-19 variants than at-home quarantine, coupled with pre- and post-arrival testing. Does the minister have those data?

[Patty Hajdu, Liberal, Thunder Bay—Superior North, ON]

Mr. Chair, we have had participation with a number of provinces and territories and other partners to understand various approaches at the border in terms of quarantine and the combination of quarantine and testing. We're continuing that research with partners to understand—

[Michelle Rempel, Conservative, Calgary Nose Hill, AB]

Mr. Chair, am I safe to take that as a no?