Public Safety Committee on Dec. 16th, 2021

[Raquel Dancho, Conservative, Kildonan—St. Paul, MB]

Minister, I'm sorry to cut you off. My question was specifically about what you're doing to speak to border communities, but now that you've answered that, I'm going to cede the rest of my time to my colleague Mr. Lloyd.

[Dane Lloyd, Conservative, Sturgeon River—Parkland, AB]

Thank you, Minister.

A message from my constituents.... In your opening remarks, you said that there is one common denominator for all of these crimes and that's a firearm. Well, you're missing the obvious thing, Minister. The other obvious common denominator is the criminals themselves, and it's time to focus on the criminals in this matter.

You also claimed in your statement that you want to increase penalties on gun smugglers, yet Bill C-5, your government's policy, is seeking to reduce mandatory minimum sentences. In fact, in the last Parliament, when our Conservative colleague Bob Saroya brought up Bill C-238 to increase penalties for the possession of smuggled firearms, you and your party voted against that policy.

Why do your actions not match your words, Minister?

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

In fact, as I have said, Bill C-5 ensures that we would be raising maximum penalties for serious gun crimes, because we believe that is the right thing to do. I would simply point out that, in addition to taking that position on Bill C-5, we have put in place additional gun control that does focus on illegal gun crime. That is how we are going to ensure that we create safer communities, Mr. Lloyd.

I know that the Conservative Party sometimes takes a fundamentally different view—

[Dane Lloyd, Conservative, Sturgeon River—Parkland, AB]

A better view.

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

—with regard to how to create safer communities. The Conservative Party opposed the assault rifle ban, Mr. Lloyd. We disagree. We think that, by banning assault rifles, we're going to create safer communities.

The Conservative Party objected to Bill C-71, which would ensure stronger background checks and verification to ensure that we are not allowing criminals to get their hands on guns. We think those steps are smart and prudent. They are informed by many experts, including frontline and executive members from—

[Dane Lloyd, Conservative, Sturgeon River—Parkland, AB]

Mr. Chair, that's been over time by about 30 seconds.

[The Chair, Liberal, Jim Carr]

Thank you, Minister.

We'll now move to Mr. Zuberi, who will have five minutes.

The floor is yours.

[Sameer Zuberi, Liberal, Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC]

Thank you, Minister, for being here.

As a Quebecker and a Montrealer, I find this study extremely important.

I would like to talk about the source of the illegal diversion of firearms for criminal purposes. In your opening remarks, you mentioned some statistics on the number of firearms that are diverted nationally.

Can you tell us more about that? What are you going to do to address this problem?

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Thank you very much for the question.

You are right. We have invested in our police services to increase our gun violence operations. In terms of arrests and seizures of firearms by the RCMP, the numbers are very high. The RCMP could explain the numbers in detail, but the most important point is that our government believes in continuing to put resources where we need them, which is on the front lines of law enforcement by our police services, and at the borders, to stop the flow of illegal firearms.

Initiatives to prevent gun violence must also be encouraged. That's why our government is investing $250 million to create safe spaces for communities across Canada. We are making investments in collaboration with police services, but we must also study and implement concrete solutions to prevent gun violence.

[Sameer Zuberi, Liberal, Pierrefonds—Dollard, QC]

Thank you.

I will be splitting my time with a colleague of mine, Paul Chiang, but I also very briefly want to ask you about the priorities that you hope to accomplish in this mandate. Do you want to add anything before I pass the time that remains to my colleague?

[The Chair, Liberal, Jim Carr]

There are only two minutes left in this session, so let's talk fast.

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

Briefly, I would say it's to work with all members of this committee, all members in the House and all Canadians to reduce gun violence. We believe we have more steps to take around gun controls. As we have seen, there is an increase in gun violence, particularly related to violence that is caused by handguns.

We need to work closely with our provincial and territorial partners to find new solutions and ways to get handguns off our streets. They're causing the loss of too many innocent lives.

We also need to ensure that we are preventing gun violence from occurring in the first place. Quite often I think we can put a lot of emphasis on law enforcement, on using the criminal law as a way to deter and to bring those who committed gun crimes to justice, but we also need to be focused on preventing future loss of life. I think about our kids. I think about our communities. I think about women, who have been disproportionately impacted by gun violence. The agenda that our government has aims at working to reduce gun violence.

I want to do that work with all of you, and we have to be committed to doing that work.

[The Chair, Liberal, Jim Carr]

Mr. Chiang, unfortunately you have only 20 seconds to ask what they would say would be a short snapper.

[Paul Chiang, Liberal, Markham—Unionville, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Minister, while in office, the Conservatives slashed the RCMP and CBSA budgets by over $900 million, which resulted in the loss of 3,000 employees. What is your ministry doing to accomplish building back these jobs at the RCMP and the CBSA?

[The Chair, Liberal, Jim Carr]

I'm sorry, Minister, but that slot has run out of time. Maybe it would be possible for you to offer a written response to that question.

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

I'd be happy to do it.

[The Chair, Liberal, Jim Carr]

I'm sorry, I'm just constrained by the rules.

Now we move to a two-and-a-half-minute segment.

Madame Michaud, you have the floor for two and a half minutes.

[Kristina Michaud, Bloc, Avignon—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I will pick up where I left off earlier. The minister said that some 74 weapons had been seized by the RCMP. That is good, but it is not enough. Some 700 weapons were seized by Montreal police last year. And, again according to TVA Nouvelles, there are almost as many guns coming across the border per week as police across Canada seize in a year.

What we understand from the minister's comments is that current gun control measures are adequate, but more are needed. However, according to journalistic investigations, these measures are clearly not sufficient and are therefore not adequate. We need a change of direction. In Montreal right now, an American-style gun culture is taking hold. People are thinking of getting a gun to protect themselves and their children and they are obviously getting their guns illegally. In Montreal, young people are dying in libraries or on the street, in broad daylight or when it's not very late at night. Yet, the only measure adopted so far by the government has been to introduce Bill C‑5, which provides for the elimination of mandatory minimum sentences for firearms-related crimes. We're calling for something a little more serious to control guns and stop their illegal trafficking.

Does the minister have a plan? In the coming months, what does his government intend to do concretely to fight against firearms trafficking?

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

I thank the member for her question.

I share my colleague Ms. Michaud's sentiment. There are indeed too many tragedies happening on the streets of Montreal, Toronto, Vancouver and other major cities across the country. That's why our action plan builds on the progress we've made through our investments, working with the Government of Quebec, as well as with our international partners, like the Americans, on the joint issue of banning and seizing guns.

We had made a lot of progress, but I agree that more needs to be done. We also need to study and take action on a prevention strategy and I hope to work with the Bloc...

[The Chair, Liberal, Jim Carr]

You have 10 seconds, Minister.

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

...to seek your support for the investments that we will make to prevent further innocent victims from losing their lives.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Jim Carr]

Thank you, Minister.

We now have a two-and-a-half-minute slot for Mr. MacGregor.

Mr. MacGregor, the floor is yours.

[Alistair MacGregor, NDP, Cowichan—Malahat—Langford, BC]

Thank you, Chair.

Minister, I agree with you. I think in your opening statement you made a comment about the fact that the Criminal Code is an important part of our justice system, but it is a reactive part of it, in that it comes into effect after a crime has been committed. I'm very interested in policy that seeks to prevent crimes from happening in the first place.

We know that gangs in major urban centres across Canada often recruit their members from vulnerable communities. These can include communities that are made up of racialized Canadians, Black and indigenous Canadians. At the same time, many of these communities also have a very deep sense of distrust of our police services. This has been written about, most recently with the report in the last Parliament about systemic racism in policing in Canada.

If we are to try to prevent gang recruitment, if we are to try to regain the trust of these communities so that they can have that positive and healthy relationship with our police services, I'd like to know from you, Minister, what steps you are taking as minister to direct Public Safety Canada to help police services across Canada so that we can start to re-establish a relationship of trust, effectively combat gang recruitment, and try to nip this problem in the bud rather than always treating the symptoms.

[Marco Mendicino, Liberal, Eglinton—Lawrence, ON]

I think looking at some of the root causes of gun violence and violence writ large across the country does mean confronting systemic challenges within our institutions, including within the criminal justice system. We see far too much overrepresentation of indigenous and racialized people in our jails. That is a problem that we need to address.

I know that in my discussions, not only with colleagues in government but equally with the commissioner.... I want to commend her leadership and the leadership of the RCMP to take the steps that are necessary to ensure that we transform and modernize the way we do criminal justice. It is very much a downstream aspect to our strategy. I think the root causes have to do with ensuring access—

[The Chair, Liberal, Jim Carr]

You have 10 seconds, Minister.