Evidence of meeting #49 for Status of Women in the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was commissioner.

A video is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Sharon Woodburn  Director General, Workforce Programs and Services, Royal Canadian Mounted Police
Michael O'Rielly  Director, Legislative Reform Initiative, Royal Canadian Mounted Police
Catherine Ebbs  Chair, Royal Canadian Mounted Police External Review Committee
David Paradiso  Executive Director and Senior Counsel, Royal Canadian Mounted Police External Review Committee

8:50 a.m.

NDP

The Chair NDP Marie-Claude Morin

Good morning everyone. I see we have a quorum, so we'll get started.

Welcome to the 49th meeting of the Standing Committee on the Status of Women. Today, pursuant to Standing Order 108(2), we are continuing our study of sexual harassment in the federal workplace.

We have with us this morning, from the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, Assistant Commissioner Sharon Woodburn, Director General of Workforce Programs and Services, and Superintendent Michael O'Rielly, Director of the Legislative Reform Initiative.

Good morning and welcome. Thank you for joining us today. Your input will certainly make for a more in-depth study by the committee.

Without further ado, I turn the floor over to you. You have 10 minutes for your presentation, and then we will move on to questions and answers.

You may go ahead.

8:50 a.m.

C/Supt Sharon Woodburn Director General, Workforce Programs and Services, Royal Canadian Mounted Police

Good morning, Madam Chair, members of the committee, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you so much for this opportunity to come before the committee to contribute to your study of sexual harassment in workplaces in the federal jurisdiction.

Here with me today is Superintendent Michael O'Rielly, who is leading the legislative reform initiative for the RCMP. He will be able to answer any questions relating to Bill C-42.

The work of the RCMP has a profound impact on all Canadians. The RCMP's mandate is multi-faceted, and every employee within the force contributes their skills and expertise to deliver quality policing services. All employees of the RCMP are responsible for enhancing and maintaining the health and strength of the organization. The commissioner and senior management have committed to an “every employee engaged” approach, whereby expectations of conduct relating back to our core values are discussed with each RCMP employee and agreed to.

Men and women are recruited into the RCMP with the expectation that they will become part of a world-class policing organization. Employees of the RCMP expect that their colleagues, no matter their position or role, will do their very best to maintain and further this image, in how they deal with the public and each other.

The RCMP is privileged to enjoy high levels of public approval and support, and the vast majority of the women and men carry out their duties every day in a professional and diligent manner. However, over the past few years, concerns regarding harassment, accountability, and existing human resource management practices have been raised. In this regard, we are not meeting the high expectations of Canadians.

I would like to take this opportunity to describe some of the efforts we are making to show accountability and establish a work environment with zero tolerance for inappropriate behaviour, such as harassment.

The RCMP is taking steps to effect organizational change that will address two key factors: numerative inequality, or the difference between the number of men and women in the workplace; and normative standards, or those aspects of organizational culture that can contribute to harassment.

According to Statistics Canada, the representation of women within policing services across Canada has increased from 17.3% in 2005 to 19.6% in 2011. The representation of female regular members within the RCMP has kept pace with this increase, rising from 18.1% to 20.1% over the same period. In spite of this, these rates remain below the labour market availability for women who are interested in a career in policing, which was estimated to be 27% in the 2006 census. This means there is room to have more women in policing.

The commissioner has announced an increase in the recruiting benchmark for women from 30% to 35% to have a more equitable level of representation of female police officers in all ranks throughout the RCMP. We are committed to achieving a more equitable gender balance to help create a better, more respectful workplace.

I will now talk about the normative factors. The RCMP must develop the means to change behaviours, to set new standards and expectations, and to hold all employees accountable for their behaviours.

The results of the Public Service Employee Survey, in both 2008 and 2011, indicate that about 30% of RCMP respondents reported being harassed in the past two years. This percentage is essentially the same as those found throughout the core public administration.

Since 2005 there have been 1,102 complaints of harassment filed in the RCMP. This is an average of 150 complaints a year. Of these, 57% refer to interpersonal deportment; 36% are identified as abuse of authority; 4% relate to discrimination, as defined under the Canadian Human Rights Act; and 3% relate to sexual harassment.

What this tells us is that harassment continues to be reported at a consistent rate in the RCMP. This is unacceptable. The steps we are committed to taking to overcome this issue include focusing on a more respectful workplace, improving training practices, and establishing procedures and processes to prevent, investigate, and resolve harassment complaints.

Part of changing our culture is the identification and handling of harassing behaviour at the onset. Some unacceptable actions are more obvious than others, and some forms are more insidious.

Any definition of harassing behaviour, sexual or otherwise, will always be subjective to a certain extent. The challenge is to clearly define what is considered to be unacceptable conduct and to know when to intervene.

By identifying such behaviours, expectations can be established that action will be taken to point out and stop improper conduct immediately. The RCMP is identifying and developing a continuum of what is considered to be disrespectful and harassing conduct to better hold employees, especially supervisors and managers, accountable for taking action.

Establishing the responsibilities of supervisors and managers is also vital to achieving this. The commissioner or senior manager, such as commanding officers, cannot oversee the daily interactions of every employee. We put this trust in our many managers and supervisors. We must also give those managers and supervisors the training and tools to prevent and effectively handle conflict in the workplace and any inappropriate behaviour they see at an early stage.

The RCMP has had mandatory online harassment awareness and prevention training for all employees since 2005. This was a step in the right direction in raising awareness; however, we recognize the need to do more.

We are also enhancing leadership development focusing on core components, such as how to manage workplace relations, how to identify and address conflict and harassment, and how to build and maintain respectful workplaces.

The RCMP is implementing a respectful workplace program that sets out expectations for all employees of what supports respectful and harassment-free workplaces. The program also outlines how to recognize when these expectations are not being met, how to engage in early intervention, and how to rebuild relationships. The program is built on the Treasury Board policy on the prevention and resolution of harassment in the workplace and supplemented by the RCMP Act; however, the two processes do not align in purpose, process, or outcome.

Bill C-42, the Enhancing Royal Canadian Mounted Police Accountability Act, if passed, would provide the RCMP with a number of tools in the areas of conduct, grievances and discipline.

The proposed legislation will provide the commissioner with the authority to deal with harassment directly, by establishing streamlined procedures for the investigation and resolution of harassment complaints.

I would like to thank the committee for inviting us here today and for undertaking this study. Our intention is to continue making changes through the actions that I have outlined today. Our goal is to become a primary contributor to the creation of safe, healthy, and respectful workplaces in the federal public service.

Thank you.

My colleague and I would be pleased to provide further information in response to any questions.

8:55 a.m.

NDP

The Chair NDP Marie-Claude Morin

Thank you very much.

We will now move right into questions.

Ms. Truppe, you have seven minutes.

8:55 a.m.

Conservative

Susan Truppe Conservative London North Centre, ON

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'd like to thank you both for coming. I know everyone here has been looking forward to your visit, and I'm sure everyone has a lot of great questions for you.

You mentioned just a few minutes ago that the RCMP had taken some steps to increase accountability and transparency within the RCMP. Could you just reiterate again what they were and the steps they would be taking, and have you noticed any impacts so far?

8:55 a.m.

Director General, Workforce Programs and Services, Royal Canadian Mounted Police

C/Supt Sharon Woodburn

There are a bunch of different steps related to different aspects of trying to get to the respectful workplace and transparency. Obviously, there are the policies. We are updating all of our policies, and we are working with Treasury Board to do that. We're also building some guides right now for employees so that they understand what harassment is, what a respectful workplace is. The guides are also for the human resource personnel who work with them. We're looking at service standards for timelines and such.

In the area of leadership, that's been very important. The commissioner's Every Employee Engaged initiative, which he started in July, directly applies to your question, I think. He met with all of his senior leaders across the force and explained what he expected from us. He also explained five points that he wanted to emphasize, one of which was directly related to a respectful workplace, but also supervision, accountability, transparency, discipline, and those sorts of things. He followed that up with a video message to all employees in the RCMP.

I forget the second part of your question.

8:55 a.m.

Conservative

Susan Truppe Conservative London North Centre, ON

Just if you noticed any impacts so far. Maybe it's a little too early.

8:55 a.m.

Director General, Workforce Programs and Services, Royal Canadian Mounted Police

C/Supt Sharon Woodburn

It's probably too early to see impacts, but I do know that the topic itself really seems to come to the forefront. We're very much talking about these things, which is a good thing, I think.

8:55 a.m.

Conservative

Susan Truppe Conservative London North Centre, ON

Great. Thank you.

The Minister of Public Safety, in consultation with Commissioner Paulson, referred the matter of sexual harassment complaints to the Commission for Public Complaints Against the RCMP. Can you advise the committee of the progress of this investigation and when we might expect a report?

8:55 a.m.

Director General, Workforce Programs and Services, Royal Canadian Mounted Police

C/Supt Sharon Woodburn

I'm not sure on the exact date of the report. I know that we gave full cooperation and opened up all of our files, of course. They were even in our building for a while reading the files, but I'm not sure of the exact date.

8:55 a.m.

Conservative

Susan Truppe Conservative London North Centre, ON

Do you know how many submissions related to sexual harassment in the workplace have been received by the Commission for Public Complaints Against the RCMP so far, or would you have that data?

9 a.m.

Director General, Workforce Programs and Services, Royal Canadian Mounted Police

C/Supt Sharon Woodburn

No, I don't have that data.

9 a.m.

Conservative

Susan Truppe Conservative London North Centre, ON

What sorts of policy and procedural recommendations is the Commission for Public Complaints Against the RCMP empowered to make? Policy recommendations? Training recommendations? Are there other recommendations? Do they have carte blanche?

9 a.m.

Director General, Workforce Programs and Services, Royal Canadian Mounted Police

C/Supt Sharon Woodburn

Given that it's a recommendation, I'm not sure there is a limit on it, but I don't know the specifics of that, I'm sorry.

9 a.m.

Conservative

Susan Truppe Conservative London North Centre, ON

That's okay.

In your remarks you mentioned that the RCMP has had mandatory online harassment awareness and prevention training for all employees since 2005. How is this monitored? If it's mandatory, how do we know everybody is doing that?

9 a.m.

Director General, Workforce Programs and Services, Royal Canadian Mounted Police

C/Supt Sharon Woodburn

It's monitored from the policy centre. That's part of the central oversight. I know that the statistic as of last week was that 94% of all employees had taken that course.

9 a.m.

Conservative

Susan Truppe Conservative London North Centre, ON

Then you also mentioned that they would be establishing procedures and processes to prevent, investigate, and resolve harassment complaints. Have they been established?

9 a.m.

Director General, Workforce Programs and Services, Royal Canadian Mounted Police

C/Supt Sharon Woodburn

For the most part, the procedures.... Our policy has been in existence since 2005, so we already have procedures and policies. We are amending those; they're evolving. Little bits are changed as the policy goes along, but we're looking at a more substantial change presently to match the Treasury Board policy that just came out.

9 a.m.

Conservative

Susan Truppe Conservative London North Centre, ON

Will a harassment policy that directly includes sexual harassment be implemented? Are they going to have one specifically for sexual harassment?

9 a.m.

Director General, Workforce Programs and Services, Royal Canadian Mounted Police

C/Supt Sharon Woodburn

No, not at this point. It's within the definition of harassment, but there isn't a separate policy for sexual harassment.

9 a.m.

Conservative

Susan Truppe Conservative London North Centre, ON

Also in your remarks you mentioned that the commissioner had announced an increase in the recruiting benchmark for women from 30% to 35%, to have a more equitable level of representation of female police officers throughout the RCMP. How are they doing this? How are they going to bring that benchmark up from 30% to 35%?

9 a.m.

Director General, Workforce Programs and Services, Royal Canadian Mounted Police

C/Supt Sharon Woodburn

The proactive portion of recruiting has the ability to focus on certain segments of society, and in this case it depends on where you are located. There are many different initiatives going on to bring up the rate of women applying to the RCMP, things such as women-only exam sessions or women-only physical testing or information sessions—your imagination is the limit really for those types of things.

9 a.m.

Conservative

Susan Truppe Conservative London North Centre, ON

Are they having a different type of recruiting seminar for women who might be interested?

9 a.m.

Director General, Workforce Programs and Services, Royal Canadian Mounted Police

C/Supt Sharon Woodburn

Yes, that's right. They would have recruiting information sessions. That's one of our first stages. They would be targeted for women only, for instance. I'm not sure exactly how the information would differ, but it would be specific to the women in the audience.

9 a.m.

Conservative

Susan Truppe Conservative London North Centre, ON

Do you think the changes brought forth in Bill C-42 would allow the RCMP to address the issues of harassment within the RCMP?

9 a.m.

Director General, Workforce Programs and Services, Royal Canadian Mounted Police

C/Supt Sharon Woodburn

I will have to address that to my colleague.