Evidence of meeting #55 for Status of Women in the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was fields.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Danniele Livengood  Secretary, Society for Canadian Women in Science and Technology
Suzanne Winterflood  Executive Director, Centre for Education and Work
Kate McInturff  Senior Researcher, National Office, Canadian Centre for Policy Alternatives
Natalie Linklater  Engineering Co-Chair, Carleton University Women in Science and Engineering
Rim Khazall  Science Co-Chair, Carleton University Women in Science and Engineering
Marjorie Marchinko  Senior Adult Learning Specialist, Centre for Education and Work
Sandra Eix  Member, Outreach & Make Possible Volunteer, Society for Canadian Women in Science and Technology

11:55 a.m.

NDP

Mylène Freeman NDP Argenteuil—Papineau—Mirabel, QC

I'm going to throw out another wide question.

What would a gender-responsive budgeting process look like to you in order to create more pay equity? What would be the specific targeted things you would see that would empower women to go into these types of jobs?

11:55 a.m.

Senior Researcher, National Office, Canadian Centre for Policy Alternatives

Dr. Kate McInturff

I think any successful economic policy needs to recognize that women work in different sectors. We might wish that not to be the case, but that is the case right now, here today in 2015. They have different constraints on their economic lives because of the double burden of unpaid work. They are far more likely to take parental leave, so that's a reality. If you want to build a successful economic policy for job growth and one that is responsive to the needs of men and women in your society, then your economic policies need to address that fact.

For example, with job creation, you need to look at what kinds of job creation stimulus polices are going to create jobs for men and for women. This is crucial. Just to go back to the oil prices, which are on everyone's mind right now, if you put family policies in place that make women's economic lives more secure and increase women's employment.... There's tons of evidence from Canada and from the OECD that, for example, accessible and affordable child care increases women's labour force participation and makes it more likely that they can go into whatever job they want, at whatever point they want. We're not talking about women going back to work the day after they have a baby. Women go back to work at various stages in their children's lives. If you put that in place then, because women tend to work in different sectors, what that means is that in families where you have a man and a woman, when a male-dominant industry, like the oil industry, is hit by an economic shock like a drop in oil prices, that family is more secure.

11:55 a.m.

NDP

The Chair NDP Hélène LeBlanc

Thank you very much.

Thank you very much. I know that there is probably a lot more to say on that topic, but there is no more time.

Mrs. O'Neill Gordon, go ahead for seven minutes.

11:55 a.m.

Conservative

Tilly O'Neill-Gordon Conservative Miramichi, NB

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Welcome to all of you. I want to thank you for offering us such a great presentation here today. We all know that change is happening. It's not happening at the pace we'd like to see. It's rather a slow pace but it is a change. That in itself is a positive message we can have out there.

I want to start off with Women in Science and Engineering. Natalie Linklater, I know Rim has told us what her favourite practice was. I'm wondering if you'd like to share what yours was.

11:55 a.m.

Engineering Co-Chair, Carleton University Women in Science and Engineering

Natalie Linklater

Sure. I really am partial to the yoga, but it's not really a program. It's just something we do to help the girls relax. We have a really great fitness instructor now who's doing a master's in biomedical engineering so she does our little yoga program.

I'm partial to the Go ENG Girl program. I'm an engineer and we have a lower representation out there so we specifically like the engineering program, but it's the hands-on aspect I really like. We introduce the concept of aerodynamics for example, and then they do a simple activity to practise that concept right away. A lot of people are familiar with the science process, the hypothesis. You build an experiment and you retest your hypothesis, but there's also, we call it, the engineering process. They have a problem. They have to do some research. They have to do a design, and then they have to test their design. Then they have to do iterations until their design works the way they want it to work.

They had to build a rocket that would travel up. They have a straw and a string, and they have to make the straw travel up the string carrying an object. This was like a space race. They had to carry a pen, which we realized halfway through was very heavy. But we talked about propulsion and we talked about drag. I said let's add some balloons or something. Let's get that pen to space.

It really is the concepts. You take two slides. We introduce this concept, and then we get to practise it right away, and then it's the iterations, the engineering process, we want to show them.

Those are my favourites.

Noon

Conservative

Tilly O'Neill-Gordon Conservative Miramichi, NB

I like the hands-on, the early initiative you are offering the young girls. I like the idea of bringing in the parents because I know as many as 90 years ago—no, not really—if I had come home and said I was going into engineering or something like that.... I ended up being a teacher; that was the kind of thing you did. I like the idea that you're bringing in the moms, and I'm wondering if you bring the moms and dads or just the moms.

Noon

Engineering Co-Chair, Carleton University Women in Science and Engineering

Natalie Linklater

Yes. Whoever wants to come.

Noon

Conservative

Tilly O'Neill-Gordon Conservative Miramichi, NB

Could you elaborate a little on how that works? What age did you say that was?

Noon

Engineering Co-Chair, Carleton University Women in Science and Engineering

Natalie Linklater

This one is grades 7 to 9 where they come with their parents, so it's before they enter high school, before they have to make any of those decisions like math and science, and the academic stream versus the applied stream. We're really trying to say, and we tell them, girls are just as good in math and science as guys are. There's no gender difference in that. You lack the confidence.

A girl would be devastated if she gets a B. A guy gets a C, and he thinks he's awesome at math. This attitude persists even in engineering.

We're trying to tell them that's a fact and say it's okay. There's a panel discussion as well so they get to ask questions of current students. A lot of the messages are that they came into engineering and failed a couple of classes, and that's no big deal. You just pick up and go again. A lot of the girls respond positively to it and the parents as well. They really like the fact that we're telling them how it is. We're not sugar-coating it at all. Also a lot of the parents thank us for it. They are happy we're telling them the story.

Noon

Conservative

Tilly O'Neill-Gordon Conservative Miramichi, NB

Do you see a change as a result of that?

Noon

Engineering Co-Chair, Carleton University Women in Science and Engineering

Natalie Linklater

Yes. That is a very good question.

We do see a change. Our program Go ENG Girl has been going on maybe for seven years now, maybe even more, and we have seen girls who have gone through the Go ENG Girl program and are now in engineering. They told us they're here because we introduced them to this early on. It's amazing. They are volunteers now with CUIs, and they help us run the Go ENG Girl. It's really great; it really touches my heart.

Noon

Conservative

Tilly O'Neill-Gordon Conservative Miramichi, NB

Mine too I guess. Being a former teacher it really does. I love to see that the children are doing something and something they like to do as well.

Noon

Conservative

Tilly O'Neill-Gordon Conservative Miramichi, NB

Suzanne, I know you mentioned that participation of women is not on a par with where you would like to see it. Has the rate changed in recent years, and how do you feel that has come about?

Noon

Executive Director, Centre for Education and Work

Suzanne Winterflood

Perhaps Marjorie would like to answer that.

Noon

Marjorie Marchinko Senior Adult Learning Specialist, Centre for Education and Work

I'm not sure if I would “like” to answer it, because the answer isn't encouraging. Since 2006, there has been no improvement in the trades in Manitoba. Remember, when we talk about trades, we're not talking about cooking or hairdressing. When you remove those traditional female roles, no, there hasn't been any improvement. A lot of the folks who we work with around the trades are struggling in terms of increasing numbers and acceptance. For whatever reason, which we can't really speak to at this point, Manitoba has a lower participation rate in the trades than does even Saskatchewan next door; you know, kind of a Prairie environment as well. It's a troubling situation.

Noon

NDP

The Chair NDP Hélène LeBlanc

Thank you very much.

Ms. Duncan, you now have the floor for seven minutes.

Yes.

12:05 p.m.

Conservative

Pat Perkins Conservative Whitby—Oshawa, ON

Did Madam O'Neill Gordon have seven minutes?

12:05 p.m.

NDP

The Chair NDP Hélène LeBlanc

Yes, indeed.

12:05 p.m.

Conservative

Pat Perkins Conservative Whitby—Oshawa, ON

Well, I have a problem with whoever is timing this. You told Madam O'Neill Gordon that she had—

12:05 p.m.

NDP

The Chair NDP Hélène LeBlanc

Yes, it was difficult. Yes, thank you.

12:05 p.m.

Conservative

Pat Perkins Conservative Whitby—Oshawa, ON

—one minute left and at that point she had two minutes left, so I'm having some difficulty. I have put it on here because there have been several of those, so I'm very concerned that people are being short-timed.

Thank you.

12:05 p.m.

NDP

The Chair NDP Hélène LeBlanc

Thank you very much for your concern.

We have a timer here and I always make sure that all members have all their time.

Thank you very much.

I think it is good that we have one timer, which is mandated by the—

12:05 p.m.

Conservative

Joan Crockatt Conservative Calgary Centre, AB

I have to object here, Madam.

When a member of the committee is bringing a problem to your attention, I wonder if you could just take that into account. We may have a problem with our timer, the actual equipment we have here, so that's just what my fellow member is raising here.

12:05 p.m.

NDP

The Chair NDP Hélène LeBlanc

Thank you very much.

Mrs. O'Neill Gordon had about a minute and a half, which was difficult for me to interrupt while she was...and I gave her a question, and I wanted to leave time for the witnesses to be able to answer, so I knew she had plenty of time, and I never wanted to short-change her.

Thank you for pointing that out.

We will continue with Ms. Duncan. You have seven minutes.

April 23rd, 2015 / 12:05 p.m.

Liberal

Kirsty Duncan Liberal Etobicoke North, ON

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I really do appreciate the fairness in this committee. I want to recognize that.

I want to say thank you to all of you. These were excellent presentations.

I will begin with Ms. Linklater and Ms. Khazall—soon to be Dr. Linklater and Dr. Khazall, we hope.

At the university we have many young women at the bachelor's level—in fact, more than young men now—but we lose them going to the master's and the Ph.D. levels. I'm wondering if you have thoughts on why.