Evidence of meeting #122 for Status of Women in the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was data.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Eva Kratochvil  Survivor and Frontline Worker, Hiatus House, As an Individual
Anita Olsen Harper  Research Consultant, National Aboriginal Circle Against Family Violence, As an Individual
Dawn Clark  Acting Executive Director, Haven Society
Bob Bratina  Hamilton East—Stoney Creek, Lib.
Yvan Clermont  Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
Kathy AuCoin  Assistant Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada
Sonia Sidhu  Brampton South, Lib.

4:45 p.m.

Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada

Yvan Clermont

Okay.

Yes, exactly.

Ms. AuCoin, does the 2019 survey provide more details on the forms of abuse?

4:45 p.m.

Kathy AuCoin Assistant Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada

The upcoming survey will include more data.

We did a two-year consultation of our survey managers.

The three key points they wanted us to collect were women seeking shelter with disabilities and the types of disabilities. When we were looking at indigenous women, they wanted more clarity on first nations and Métis. They were very comfortable with the forms of abuse that were being asked about.

Remember, this is just one tool. We also have the General Social Survey—Victimization, which is self-reported, where we really get a lot of detailed information about the types of abuse women are suffering. We also get that through the Uniform Crime Reporting Survey when there's a weapon involved, if there's an injury, so there are multiple different data sources that we're using.

4:50 p.m.

Liberal

Marc Serré Liberal Nickel Belt, ON

Is that survey done every seven years? I think we heard in the past that it should be done more often than every seven, but resources are needed.

4:50 p.m.

Assistant Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada

Kathy AuCoin

That's a valid statement. It's done every five years, but in addition, through funding from Status of Women, we're doing a survey of safety in public and private spaces. That is in the field now, with a very large sample, and it will complement the other survey. It will add to our knowledge.

4:50 p.m.

Liberal

Marc Serré Liberal Nickel Belt, ON

Based on a lot of that information, in 2019 you're looking at data on first nations, disability, and immigration, which are things you didn't have the resources to do in the past.

4:50 p.m.

Assistant Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada

Kathy AuCoin

That's correct.

4:50 p.m.

Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada

Yvan Clermont

As we said at the conclusion of our presentation, we're going to have information from two different sources coming out in 2019—the new redesigned aggregate survey on shelters and the survey on safety in public and private spaces.

4:50 p.m.

Liberal

Marc Serré Liberal Nickel Belt, ON

I want to thank you for the work.

I just want to go back to the disability aspect. We don't have any data on disabilities. Do you have any other data that you could provide to the committee regarding support within the shelters?

Second is the dependencies.

I'm talking about the social problem of dependence.

4:50 p.m.

Assistant Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada

Kathy AuCoin

What we could tell from the transition home or shelter information was the number of people, or individuals, or women turned away because of alcohol or dependency issues. I'm sure you've heard from other witnesses that that's a core group whose needs are perhaps not being met, and they're being turned away.

Further to that, what we can release and what we have released is prevalence of women with disabilities and their prevalence of being a victim of intimate partner violence. I could send a report that we did. They are at greater risk.

Again, I'm sure you've heard from other witnesses who are shelter managers regarding what they have available to service that community. The data from here doesn't really dig into that aspect, but I can provide you with the overall prevalence of women with disabilities and their likelihood of being a victim of this type of violence.

4:50 p.m.

Liberal

Marc Serré Liberal Nickel Belt, ON

Thank you very much.

4:50 p.m.

Liberal

The Vice-Chair Liberal Pam Damoff

Thank you very much.

Madame Boucher, you have seven minutes.

4:50 p.m.

Conservative

Sylvie Boucher Conservative Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC

Thank you.

I'm new to the committee because I'm standing in for someone. This is a very important issue in my view. The Liberal member asked about rural versus urban violence. I happen to think there is a difference.

You talked about violence involving a firearm. A recent study in Quebec revealed that a lot of incidents involve knives, as well as bare hands. They are all lumped together in the same category so as not to capture only incidents involving firearms because domestic violence is often not clear-cut.

In your opening remarks, you talked quite a bit about domestic violence involving indigenous versus non-indigenous women. Did you apply a similar lens to immigrants, whose numbers are growing in Canada? Do they experience violence at the same rate as everyone else? What forms of abuse do they experience based on where in Canada they settle?

4:50 p.m.

Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada

Yvan Clermont

I'll try to answer your first question as best I can.

It is possible to establish differences in the modus operandi used in domestic violence from an urban versus rural standpoint. One of the things we look at is whether the domestic violence involves handguns, knives or fists, so that comparison between urban and rural areas is something we can do. We can provide you additional information on that.

You also asked whether domestic violence differs depending on whether it involves indigenous or non-indigenous people or different ethnic populations. We aren't able to break down police-reported domestic violence incidents for each of those groups, because police aren't consistently able to identify whether individuals are from the indigenous or non-indigenous community, belong to the immigrant population or have a particular ethnic background. That applies to both victims and accused.

In homicide cases, it's different because a much more in-depth investigation is conducted. For police-reported assaults and threats, however, the information is not always collected and dealt with here. The General Social Survey does provide us with some indicators, though. The sample-based survey allows for that differentiation, because it tells us whether an individual is an immigrant, a member of a particular ethnic community or an indigenous person.

4:55 p.m.

Conservative

Sylvie Boucher Conservative Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC

Thank you very much.

Do I have time left?

4:55 p.m.

Liberal

The Vice-Chair Liberal Pam Damoff

You have three and a half minutes.

4:55 p.m.

Conservative

Sylvie Boucher Conservative Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC

We are talking about intimate partner violence. Back when I was Parliamentary Secretary for Status of Women, we travelled up north, to Iqaluit. There, everyone knows where the shelters are. Everyone knows where the shelter in town is. In the provinces, at least in Quebec, the partner of a woman who goes to a shelter isn't supposed to know where it is. Is that the same for all provinces, or is it only in Quebec that the location of the shelter isn't supposed to be known? Do you have that information?

4:55 p.m.

Assistant Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada

Kathy AuCoin

That would be a good question for one of the shelter associations. We don't ask that question, but you're right that most of them are confidential, to protect the women. However, my understanding is that in smaller communities where they only have one shelter, some women leave their community in order to find safety. Then the transportation becomes an issue. Again, that wasn't in the survey.

4:55 p.m.

Conservative

Sylvie Boucher Conservative Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC

That would be something to consider, then. The committee would have to put the question to the shelter representatives.

We saw that New Brunswick, Quebec and Ontario have the most incidents of violence. Does it have to do with the provinces being bigger? Frankly, I was surprised to see that there were more incidents in Quebec and New Brunswick than in British Columbia, not because I think it's a more violent province, but because it's much larger geographically, so I would've thought the number of incidents would be higher.

November 19th, 2018 / 4:55 p.m.

Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada

Yvan Clermont

Yes. I think you're referring to the increase in the rates of police-reported violence from 2014 to 2017.

4:55 p.m.

Conservative

Sylvie Boucher Conservative Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC

Yes, of course.

4:55 p.m.

Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada

Yvan Clermont

The rates changed from 2014 to 2017. That said, we are not talking about levels. In my speaking notes, I pointed out that, despite the larger increases in certain provinces, including in the Maritimes and Quebec, the levels remain higher in the territories and western provinces, specifically Saskatchewan, Manitoba and Alberta. You were right to notice it. These are year-over-year changes, but when you look only at the levels—and we could have shown this here—they are higher in the western provinces. It's consistent with the overall crime rate trends in those places.

5 p.m.

Conservative

Sylvie Boucher Conservative Beauport—Côte-de-Beaupré—Île d’Orléans—Charlevoix, QC

Thank you.

5 p.m.

Liberal

The Vice-Chair Liberal Pam Damoff

Thank you very much.

Sheila, you have the next seven minutes.

5 p.m.

NDP

Sheila Malcolmson NDP Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you to the witnesses. The timing is really good to bring this information together.

On November 8, your Centre for Justice Statistics in Stats Canada released a report called “Police-reported sexual assaults in Canada before and after #MeToo, 2016 and 2017”. The numbers were pretty striking. There were 25% more victims of police-reported sexual assault in the three months after #MeToo first went viral. The average number of police-reported sexual assault victims went from 59 per day before #MeToo to 74 per day after #MeToo.

I'm hearing that this is increasing the load on the front-line women's organizations, whether they're operating domestic violence shelters.... It's all sexual assault prevention. They're very intertwined.

I'm curious as to whether you have data or are planning to collect data, now that the taboo on reporting is being lifted, on how this increase in demand is stretching the limits of these sexual assault support centres and the rape crisis centres, the help lines, the trauma lines. There are so many that are involved in this.

Is this something that StatsCan is collecting or is planning to collect?

5 p.m.

Assistant Director, Canadian Centre for Justice Statistics, Statistics Canada

Kathy AuCoin

Over the past two years we have been working with the directors of victim services from the provinces and territories with a new survey that's looking at the number of victims coming to various services. That's not just shelters, but any type of service. We are monitoring that closely.

Similarly, we will be watching and looking at the police data more closely to see if the number of police-reported sexual assaults sustains itself and continues.

The pre-MeToo and post-MeToo report that you referred to was very interesting. We looked on a quarterly basis, every three months, to see the increase of police-reported sexual assaults. We looked at it by province as well as by large cities. We noted that after the #MeToo social media phenomenon, there was a very substantial increase, but then it decreased. We're not sure why. It could have been two things happening. We know that some police services were advertising new hotlines, and we knew that Canadians were out there—it was in the media—and maybe more victims were feeling more comfortable to report what they experienced to the police.

We will be monitoring to see if those numbers keep going up, and we will be working with the directors of victim services to collect information from them.