Status of Women Committee on June 15th, 2017

[Karen Vecchio, Conservative, Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON]

Thank you very much.

[Samantha Letourneau]

We're seeing something very similar in the Nanaimo and the central Vancouver Island region, where newcomer women are trying to find a means of making money while taking care of their and other children at home. Again, there is the concern about safety and making sure that—

[Karen Vecchio, Conservative, Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON]

Making sure that there is the right environment, yes.

[Samantha Letourneau]

Yes.

[Karen Vecchio, Conservative, Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON]

Absolutely.

Thank you very much.

I just want to switch over to Connie.

Connie, we and the human resources and skills development committee are studying poverty reduction. One thing we've found is that there is a marginal tax effect on many of the disabled people who are going back to work. We have to recognize that many of the social benefits that are received are non-taxable. Things like medical and health support are also provided through many of our provincial programs. What we've found is that when people go back to work, they are actually losing money.

Because you work in this area, I would like your thoughts about moving forward, so that we can make sure that those who are disabled do not have a marginal tax rate and can get out there. We recognize that many of them have skills. They may need a little bit more training. A few things may need to be altered a little bit so that they can be more successful. What would you recommend to ensure we are enticing and giving opportunities for the best chances ever to those persons who are disabled?

[Connie Laurin-Bowie]

Thank you for that question. I think that's a really important issue for women and men with disabilities.

I think the real challenge is to distinguish between the costs associated with the person's disability—some of the things you've just mentioned—and the income security piece. If you cover the costs of disability when a person is not working, there's no reason why those costs shouldn't be covered when that person is working.

I think what happens is that, between the tax system and disability supports at a provincial level, we haven't figured out that balance. There are provisions in the tax system that could be enhanced. They would compensate for the hidden costs of having a disability when working and for the more specific ones. Go through the disability tax credit and the medical expense tax credit.

[Karen Vecchio, Conservative, Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON]

So, a refundable disability tax credit is what you are—

[Connie Laurin-Bowie]

There are some ways.... Exactly.

I think one of the challenges is to get the provinces to keep their disability supports in place when people go to work. So, it's about ensuring that they not retract those, and then about making sure that, at the tax level, we're recognizing the undefined costs associated with having a disability.

[Karen Vecchio, Conservative, Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON]

Excellent.

Samantha, I just have one simple question for you. Your annual report shows that your organization, as of March 2016, had received eight Syrian families.

[Samantha Letourneau]

We have more than that now.

[Karen Vecchio, Conservative, Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON]

Yes, those were just the stats for March 3, 2016. If we look at the period when they came and compare it to now, what is their economic stability? Are they using food banks? Have they found employment? What are you finding from within your own community?

[Samantha Letourneau]

It's a total mix. We are seeing many who are still trying to work on their language skills. As I said, without fluency in English, it's very hard for them to obtain employment, so many of them are still using food banks. Many of them are on income assistance. There is a need for employment training and things like that. Some have found employment, and others are having a very hard time.

[Karen Vecchio, Conservative, Elgin—Middlesex—London, ON]

Thank you very much, Samantha.

[The Chair, Conservative, Marilyn Gladu]

All right.

Now we'll go to Ms. Malcolmson for seven minutes.

[Sheila Malcolmson, NDP, Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Samantha Letourneau, a great thank you from me to the Central Vancouver Island Multicultural Society. You're doing huge and heroic work in the community with no extra resources. It's a huge responsibility. Thank you to your whole team.

We heard on Tuesday from Immigration Canada and a couple of weeks ago from the Immigrant Services Association of Nova Scotia some of the same things you were drawing out. They mentioned that language training is one of the most significant barriers to economic justice and economic security for new Canadian women accessing jobs. They also mentioned child care and transportation. Because you've touched on some of those, too, I'm not going to focus there so much.

However, I still feel that, for the committee, we don't really have a full picture drawn with just the words “access to language is a barrier”. Can you draw us more of a picture of what the economic circumstances are for those women right now? Also, can you project that forward to what their life will be, even into retirement, if they can't get access now to good jobs that allow them to build a bit of security and stability?

[Samantha Letourneau]

It's very isolating when you can't speak the language of the country where you're living. When things delay your ability to access English classes—child care, taking care of your elderly parents, a cultural background where the woman stays home to care for the children, or whatever it may be—it's very hard for a woman to find stable employment. If you can't speak the language, yes, you can find some very basic jobs. However, moving up into, let's say, management or administrative roles is incredibly challenging.

Sorry, I'm just drawing a blank. I'm a little tired from travelling here.

[Sheila Malcolmson, NDP, Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC]

I imagine that if the only jobs you can access are, say, labour positions, maybe they're not safe, maybe they're seasonal. They don't give you a full-time job that allows you to access employment insurance or a pension, and so it can have—

[Samantha Letourneau]

There's that as well; they're temporary jobs; they're not safe. They could be farm labour jobs. We've seen stories of this happening in British Columbia, with women who have come from India working on farms in very dangerous conditions because it's the only employment they can find.

We see issues like that happening in the central Vancouver Island region as well. Being consistently poor and not being able to move forward because your language skills aren't there creates a spiral. It isn't because you do not want to have those language skills, but lack of access to be able to learn.

[Sheila Malcolmson, NDP, Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC]

In your other conversations, including with your clients, you have described very compellingly that if someone doesn't have the networks in the community, they won't find out about the jobs and won't have the personal references and won't be able to get to the job interview because they don't have child care. There are a number of spirals.

[Samantha Letourneau]

Many spirals happen, and I'll give you another example. We have some women who have come here as government-assisted refugees, incredibly intelligent women with masters' degrees in mechanical engineering, Ph.D.s in arabic literature, etc., but they're not going to be able to move into positions like that in Canada, without recognition of their foreign credentials first—which is a whole other thing we could open up here, as well as the language skills. It's also very dangerous if you're put into a job and you can't speak that language to be able to follow directions. This comes back to the issue of safety. If your employer isn't willing to help support you in understanding, this can bring further challenges.

[Sheila Malcolmson, NDP, Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC]

Thank you for mentioning the United Nations Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination against Women. Consistent with your testimony, I note that the November 18 report of CEDAW expressed the committee's concern about the slow progress made by Canada in the field of employment and, more specifically, about limited access to the labour market by indigenous Afro-Canadian migrant, refugee, and asylum-seeking women as well as women with disabilities. Then in paragraph 39(e) they make very specific directives to this government right now.

We only get these reports every five years, and it has informed our study. Thank you for raising it.

The Inclusion International witness talked about families being the primary support for individuals with disabilities and recommended that government invest more deeply in services for people with disabilities and their families.

Can you briefly describe what greater access to the CPP disability benefits might mean for these families?

[Connie Laurin-Bowie]

I think that families have long-term economic insecurity. It's what you're pointing to in their relationship to the labour market. Having access to CPP disability would be a potential longer-term income security piece. I think though that the challenges are related not just to disability supports, but also supports for families who are caring for a family member with a disability. While the individual with the disability has their own income insecurity, the measures we might take to support families could be in addition to the supports we provide to the people with disabilities themselves.

I'm not sure I'm answering your question directly, but I think there are two aspects to that income insecurity: the individual who needs the supports to be independent and live in the community—and we would love to encourage people to leave their family home when they become adults—but also those families who have been providing care, who need some compensation, either through recognition of their caregiving role or through an income support role, which could be in the form of CPP disability.

[Sheila Malcolmson, NDP, Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC]

Ms. Letourneau, we've heard from the Ontario Council of Agencies Serving Immigrants that refugee and immigrant women are overrepresented in precarious low-income work. Can you talk a little about the impact the increased minimum wage might provide?

[Samantha Letourneau]

Yes. Look, for example, at a snapshot of a family that's come here as refugees and begins by living on government-assisted benefits that are very limited and equivalent to income assistance rates in the province.

That brings us to the point of affordable housing and lack of it, and then after that year they have to try to find employment, or apply for income assistance, because the benefits are no longer there. Many of them don't want income assistance, but these are the options available to them, so they take a minimum-wage job—which is quite low right now in British Columbia—and they can't afford housing, or food, or to raise their family.

What they need, then, is additional support, and those funds aren't there, so they continue to live in poverty. Increasing the minimum wage would definitely help, especially with extremely large families. Many of the government-assisted refugees who have come are large families. We're looking at six to seven people per family.

[The Chair, Conservative, Marilyn Gladu]

Very good.

We'll go over to Mr. Fraser for seven minutes.