Transport Committee on Dec. 7th, 2010

[Martin Eley]

It's something that evolved when we devolved a lot of the airports. We're talking about 10 years ago, I think, for the most part. I'm not sure I have the exact date.

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

Ten years ago, okay. Then you wouldn't necessarily recall the enabling legislation, if I'm looking for a place to go back to, to see what's been enabled. Can you get that information for the committee? I wouldn't know where to start.

[Martin Eley]

Yes. We'll confirm the details of what was in place, but it really was through policy, as part of the lease, as opposed to through regulation. There isn't a specific regulation there about the way we do it.

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

So the decision to create that as a policy was taken some 10 years ago, you're saying?

[Martin Eley]

Yes.

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

If there is a weakness, as Madam Jennings said, we can go back and look at where that weakness started.

What is Transport Canada doing to reduce the level of aircraft noise in urban centres, say Montreal or Vancouver? Can you walk us through what that generally looks like?

[Martin Eley]

I mentioned the other day that we work on three things. One is to make sure we meet the highest possible standards in terms of aircraft noise, and we're part of the process. ICAO raises those standards periodically. We're certainly very much involved, and more changes are coming in the next few years. So it's making sure we have aircraft that clearly meet the latest standards--and those have always been applied consistently in Canada--and that applies not only to our aircraft but foreign aircraft coming in. That has an across-the-board impact when those standards get raised.

The noise abatement procedures—there are some standard solutions, if you like, in terms of noise abatement, depending on the circumstances. Those are used fairly consistently and they are meant to represent the best practices in terms of how you deal with noise abatement. They're subject to whether or not you're dealing with perhaps a residential community very close to the airport or further away. There are a couple of different profiles they'll typically use, but again—

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

Is there a requirement for ongoing consultation or periodic consultation that is part of this noise abatement procedure, or is it written into the leases that there is an ongoing responsibility for consultation, or is it a snapshot in time and it's not—

[Martin Eley]

The consultation is required when they're changed, if they want to change the procedures, either because it's a new airport and they put them in place or there are changes that need to be reworked for other reasons. It's not ongoing. It's—

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

There's a third area, you said. You've only mentioned two so far.

[Martin Eley]

Yes, sorry.

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

That's okay. I interrupted you, that's why.

[Martin Eley]

It has escaped me for a minute; I apologize.

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

The third one has escaped you.

[Martin Eley]

Yes.

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

What are the penalties for anyone who contravenes the noise standards? I'm talking about enforcement of—

[Martin Eley]

There are limits for individuals and there are limits for companies. There are limits for individuals of $5,000--so anything up to $5,000 for an individual and anything up to $25,000 for a company. Depending on the frequency and the severity, if you like, there's some judgment from an enforcement point of view as to what particular penalty is applied in each case.

[Jeff Watson, Conservative, Essex, ON]

Those penalties don't escalate with subsequent violations. It's just a standard thing.

[Martin Eley]

That's all part of the enforcement action. When you see the same offenders, you will more likely be more severe on subsequent violations.

[The Chair, Conservative, Merv Tweed]

Thank you.

We're just going to take a two-minute recess. I'm going to invite our guests from Nav Canada to join us.

I'd like you to stay at the table, if you would, and then we'll have their presentation and do another round of questioning.

If our guests from Nav Canada would step up and join us.... We'll take a two-minute recess.

[The Chair, Conservative, Merv Tweed]

Thank you, and welcome back.

Before I introduce our guests, I have Madam Jennings on a point of order.

[Marlene Jennings, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC]

Thank you, Chair.

In response to an answer Mr. Eley gave to Mr. Watson, I believe, stating that the situation of delegating authority for noise abatement to the airport authorities took place 10 years ago, I would like to read two short paragraphs from a letter signed by the Hon. Lawrence Cannon, when he was Minister of Transport, in response to a letter to me. His letter is dated April 20, 2008, and it reads:

Dear Ms. Jennings:

Thank you for your letter of April 4, 2008, in which you shared that residents in your riding were dissatisfied with an Aéroports de Montréal (ADM) pilot project on a possible new flight path for airlines flying out of Pierre-Elliott-Trudeau International Airport (Montreal-Trudeau), which would take them over the Lachine borough.

I read the content of your letter carefully. However, as you know, on July 31, 1992, Transport Canada and ADM signed a 60-year lease transferring the use, management and development of the Montreal-Trudeau and Mirabel airports to ADM. This means that all decisions that fall under these areas at the aforementioned airports, including noise management and complaints, are now the responsibility of ADM.

I am simply reading this. I'm prepared to hand a copy of the letter over.

So it was not 10 years ago; it was in 1992, with regard to the international airport in Montreal, the Montréal-Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport.

[The Chair, Conservative, Merv Tweed]

Thank you.

I will ask you to table that.

I will rule it is not a point of order; it's a subject for debate.

Monsieur Gaudet.

[Roger Gaudet, Bloc, Montcalm, QC]

Mr. Chairman, there is a question to which we were unable to obtain an answer earlier. I would like to know whether Mr. Eley could send it to the clerk in writing.

[The Chair, Conservative, Merv Tweed]

I will ask him to do that through the chair, and we'll distribute it.