Transport Committee on Sept. 14th, 2017

[Marc Garneau, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Westmount, QC]

If you're referring to the national trade corridors fund, yes, they're eligible to apply for funding under it. As you know, on September 5, we closed the first call for expressions of interest from across the country. I know that there were hundreds, and I'm looking forward to seeing them.

To be totally frank with you, I think the challenge with the short-haul railways is not so much that they.... The basis of the trade corridors fund is to remove bottlenecks, and I think their primary challenge is maintenance of their infrastructure, which is not quite the same thing. This is a challenge from that point of view. As I say, Transport Canada is looking at that as a separate matter at this point in time.

[Sean Fraser, Liberal, Central Nova, NS]

There are a number of different items about which, as you mentioned, the shippers will say, “We like this. Maybe we could have that.” The rails might say something similar.

One of the themes I heard amongst most of the shippers and some producers as well was on the need for enhanced data. If we're going to be able to make decisions in real time, we need full information to do that. If we were to, say, tinker with the measures impacting data, would doing that potentially upset what you described as a fairly fine balance in the legislation among shippers, railways, and producers with regard to getting goods to market efficiently and allowing everyone to make money?

[Marc Garneau, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Westmount, QC]

It's a very good point that you bring up, and it's an important one to take into consideration along with the very crucial importance of having a greater amount of shared data. It has been a complaint from shippers in the past that to establish rates for transportation, they felt they needed more insight into some of the data from the railways. We recognize that. We're coming up with a process, for example, in LHI, so that the Canadian Transportation Agency can determine comparable rates so that we are providing competitive rates to the railways. Doing that requires us to have a certain amount of information, which is not available at the moment, so that we can set those. That involves actually having waybill information, and this is crucial to the whole thing.

In terms of making that public though, we do recognize that there are sensitivities with respect to the operations of the railways. The data will be made public but in aggregate form so that we are respecting the need, from a competitive point of view, not to put everything on the table.

[Sean Fraser, Liberal, Central Nova, NS]

One of the other issues that Mr. Emerson raised while he was here was the notion that transportation is not a one-time project in Canada. We must seek continued improvement. We've heard from a few witnesses that implementing a mandatory periodic review into the legislation would be a helpful thing. Is this something that you think would be helpful or do you think the power to initiate a review from the ministry is as effective?

[Marc Garneau, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Westmount, QC]

I don't think we need to put that in the legislation. It's the responsibility of all governments to continually review a situation to see if they can make it better, if there are flaws that were not anticipated, so I think the mechanisms are there. They don't need to be in the legislation.

[Sean Fraser, Liberal, Central Nova, NS]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Ms. Moore, are you ready to go or would you like me to hold it down a little bit longer for you?

[Christine Moore, NDP, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

If possible, I would like to ask a few questions.

In your bill, you claim that a passenger bill of rights will protect travellers against unfair treatment by airline companies.

Can you name a single provision that sets the specific amount that an airline company will have to reimburse passengers if a flight is cancelled?

[Marc Garneau, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Westmount, QC]

Those amounts will be proposed by the Canadian Transportation Agency and I will have the final word. I can tell you, nonetheless, that if a passenger's rights have been violated and the airline is at fault, the amounts will be quite sufficient. This is not something the airlines will want to do on a regular basis.

[Christine Moore, NDP, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

Do you know how passengers will be informed of the measures that will enable them to claim those amounts?

Flights are cancelled on a regular basis and the airlines will try anything because passengers do not necessarily know their rights.

What is your strategy to make sure that all passengers are aware of the process and do not have to go through endless bureaucratic red tape to be compensated?

[Marc Garneau, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Westmount, QC]

It is certainly important for passengers to be informed. Once the information is released, I think passengers will follow it very closely in the media, so they will be well informed.

[Christine Moore, NDP, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

Your department does not have a strategy in mind?

[Marc Garneau, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Westmount, QC]

When you purchase a ticket, you receive information. If you do so on line, in particular, the first page describes your flight, but there are about six more pages that cover various other topics. They provide clear information, in French and English, about the steps to be taken if your rights have not been respected.

[Christine Moore, NDP, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

You do not have a specific communications strategy in this regard?

[Marc Garneau, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Westmount, QC]

When we finalize and implement the passenger bill of rights, we will probably implement a communications strategy in order to keep Canadians well informed. The information will then be available when people purchase their tickets.

[Christine Moore, NDP, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

Okay.

Will your party be open if the NDP puts forward amendments to improve Bill C-49 and clarify compensation measures, specifically as regards overbooking in order to limit the removal of passengers from aircraft, for example? Can we expect your government to take a collaborative approach?

[Marc Garneau, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Westmount, QC]

That is exactly why we will be creating regulations. That will give us the required flexibility to make any changes that prove necessary without having to present them to Parliament in another bill. The regulations will describe the passenger bill of rights. Should we decide that we need to amend the charter for some reason at a later date, we would have much more flexibility to do so.

[Christine Moore, NDP, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

As to the provisions pertaining to overbooking, do you have a specific plan or will regulations on this matter be forthcoming?

This is an increasingly serious problem, especially for destinations in Canada to which there are only two or three flights per day. Overbooking can lead to a 12-hour delay. People sometimes even have to wait until the next day.

What are your plans with regard to overbooking? Do you know what measures you will be taking or will that also be set out in the regulations?

[Marc Garneau, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Westmount, QC]

Yes, that will be set out in regulations and they will be very clear. They will indicate the compensation when the airline has overbooked. That is what we have said since the beginning.

[Christine Moore, NDP, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

Right now, there is only financial compensation. There are no protection measures for passengers who face major complications as a result of having to take a subsequent flight. I am thinking of passengers who are are kicked off flights and then miss a funeral or other important event.

[Marc Garneau, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Westmount, QC]

That is precisely why we are establishing a passenger bill of rights. The bill will very clearly indicate that there will be compensation in such cases.

I should perhaps add that the airline will be required to re-book those passengers. A new flight will be arranged for those passengers and they will be offered compensation. Moreover, the compensation will be significant.

[The Chair, Liberal, Judy Sgro]

Thank you, Mr. Garneau.

Thank you, Ms. Moore.

Mr. Badawey.

[Vance Badawey, Liberal, Niagara Centre, ON]

Madam Chair, I have to say, it's been an enjoyable process, as I said earlier, because not only are we dealing with how Bill C-49 is going to enhance the overall transportation strategy and transportation 2030, but what we also accrued over the last few days was, I'll use the word “residual” discussion, dialogue, and therefore objectives. We spoke about asset management and how overall within the transportation 2030 recommendations and the movement of that it's going to breathe, how it then lends itself to integrating our distribution and logistics system, and the integration of transportation between the four methods of transportation—road, rail, water, or air—how they come closer together.

As we look at the Emerson report and now bring it into a manner of being pragmatic and really take on some of the recommendations that Mr. Emerson made, with that is the...I won't say smaller in terms of size, but I'll say they don't recognize in the Emerson report how we now have to bring things like short-line railways into the bigger picture. It will be my intent today to actually ask for a report, to then proceed with recommendations, all of us working together as we have been for the last few days, to look at short-lines as becoming a larger part of the overall integration of those transportation methods.

I have to zero in on one question, Minister, and I fully respect the efforts that all governments in the past have made with respect to the passenger bill of rights. I have to ask, one, how it evolved. Two, and most important, and I know the NDP put forward a private member's bill in the last session, how does the passenger bill of rights proposed now, differ from the previous approaches and the previous dialogue that we had with the industry, differ from the PMBs and the discussion of past Parliaments? How is this approach now different and how is it going to be more pragmatic, workable, and of course, advantageous to the priority, the customer, the passenger?

[Marc Garneau, Liberal, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Westmount, QC]

Thank you for your question. l've been a member of Parliament coming up to nine years now and, yes, it's not the first time the issue of a passenger bill of rights has come up. It has come up. You mentioned the NDP. It came up before that with the Liberals, with Gerry Byrne, in fact, who was a very big proponent of it.

I guess the big difference is that we were in opposition and it was not picked up by the government; however, we are now in a position to put it in place. That's the big difference, and we feel that it is something long overdue. We have an interest in doing it because I've heard the message very clearly from Canadians that we need to have a passenger bill of rights. That's the big difference, and that's why we are putting legislation forward that will make that happen.

[Vance Badawey, Liberal, Niagara Centre, ON]

Now I'll move forward and go to the preamble that I spoke of earlier, like the passenger bill of rights and the dialogue that's happened among all three parties over the course of time, the current government being pragmatic and moving forward with the bill, as I mentioned earlier, the short-line integration, transportation methods, looking at capital operating sides of the strategy. Is it your intent and the ministry's to take a lot of those residual discussions and dialogue we've had with the industry, with our partners, with our colleagues, and to take the next steps in a short amount of time, to now start implementing those other parts of the overall transportation 2030 strategy?