House of Commons Hansard #132 of the 35th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was finance.

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World Trade Organization Agreement Implementation ActGovernment Orders

7 p.m.

Reform

Jim Silye Reform Calgary Centre, AB

Mr. Speaker, the Reform Party members present today vote yea.

World Trade Organization Agreement Implementation ActGovernment Orders

7 p.m.

NDP

John Solomon NDP Regina—Lumsden, SK

Mr. Speaker, the members of the New Democratic Party vote no on this motion.

(The House divided on the motion, which was agreed to on the following division:)

World Trade Organization Agreement Implementation ActGovernment Orders

7 p.m.

The Acting Speaker (Mr. Kilger)

Colleagues, for those of us who must continue with the proceedings on the adjournment motion, I would ask those of you not involved to please retire

from the Chamber so that we might continue with the proceedings.

A motion to adjourn the House under Standing Order 38 deemed to have been moved.

World Trade Organization Agreement Implementation ActAdjournment Proceedings

7 p.m.

Bloc

Osvaldo Nunez Bloc Bourassa, QC

Mr. Speaker, on November 16, I asked a question of the Minister of Citizenship and Immigration about the system of patronage created by the previous government in the IRB and maintained by this government in its appointments to the board.

Indeed, there are very serious internal problems within the board between members appointed by the Conservatives and others appointed by the Liberals. That patronage had been denounced in the report commissioned by the minister himself and written by Professor James Hathaway of York University in Toronto. Unexpected and unexplained resignations and suspensions have occurred recently in that quasi-judiciary body.

For instance, we can mention the cases of Michael Schelew, deputy chairman, who is actually under a judiciary investigation; Greg Fyffe, executive director, who resigned under unexplained circumstances. Board member Singh Bal had to resign following a review of appointments by the Standing Committee on Immigration and Citizenship because he came to Canada illegally.

For all those reasons, the Bloc Quebecois has asked and will continue to ask for a thorough investigation on the general operations of the board.

I take this opportunity to once more draw to the attention of the government the genocide in Rwanda and the tragic situation of its people. Unfortunately war has not ended in that country. Thousands upon thousands of people are murdered or forced to leave their country and Canada does very little to help those refugees.

As opposition critic for citizenship and immigration, I receive complaints just about every day regarding the unjustified refusal to grant visas as well as the red tape to which Rwandans in Nairobi, Kenya, are being subjected. The government must be more open, more generous with Rwandan refugees.

Finally, I would like to say a couple of words about proposition 187, adopted by referendum in California, on November 8, during the American elections. If enacted, this proposal will deny illegal immigrants and their family, especially their children, access to health care, education and social services. The victims of this attack against fundamental human rights are, for the most part, Hispanics from Mexico and Central America.

I recently travelled to Costa Rica where I witnessed the unanimous condemnation of this proposal by the different governments of this region. The Secretary General of the OAS also criticized this measure. In the United States, President Clinton, the Conference of Catholic Bishops, and agencies fighting racial discrimination denounced this measure.

I join the thousands of Hispanics living in the United States who are protesting this proposition, and assure them of my support.

World Trade Organization Agreement Implementation ActAdjournment Proceedings

7:05 p.m.

Halifax Nova Scotia

Liberal

Mary Clancy LiberalParliamentary Secretary to Minister of Citizenship and Immigration

Mr. Speaker, while I thank the hon. member for his intervention, I have to say that I am at a bit of a loss as it bears little or no relation to the question that he asked at the time. However, I will be happy to respond.

I certainly agree with the hon. member, as would just about everybody on this side of the House, with regard to his comments relating to the situation in California. I would like to assure the hon. member that he need not fear any such situation ever taking place in this country, at least not while this government is in charge of policy.

With regard to the situation in Rwanda, as the minister has told the member on several occasions, the situation is extremely difficult and complicated. The immigration service overseas is doing the very best it can given the chaotic situation. It would be unwise of us, not to say criminal, to put Canadian personnel at risk. It would not help the situation of refugees if we put Canadian personnel in a situation in which they would be unsafe.

We are dealing with the matter as expeditiously and as quickly as we can under the auspices of the UNHCR and we will continue to do so. We thank the member for his interest. We suggest to him that if he knows of specific situations in which things are going wrong through some difficulty with the department he should let us know.

World Trade Organization Agreement Implementation ActAdjournment Proceedings

7:05 p.m.

Bloc

Gilbert Fillion Bloc Chicoutimi, QC

Mr. Speaker, last week, last Tuesday to be more precise, I asked the Minister of Transport, following the two train tragedies, if he had instructed VIA Rail officials to immediately correct the shortcomings with respect to emergency measures and first aid for passengers in case of a train accident.

The minister did answer my question, confirming that he had asked VIA Rail to take all necessary measures on a provisional basis to try and correct the shortcomings, thereby ensuring to the extent possible the safety of passengers and employees. That is where the problem lies. The minister said: "to the extent possible".

Does the minister realize that what is possible is determined by his office? Indeed, the emergency measures and all first-aid kits met DOT standards. It is up to the minister to upgrade these standards.

I am not satisfied with the minister's answer when he says that the measures required, the applicable measures will be determined on the basis of the investigation. The Minister of Transport knows full well what safety measures are required. It is those he has implemented in other means of transportation.

The minister must have the same measures apply to rail transportation, starting immediately. The minister may be hiding behind the fact that trains are the safest means of transportation. He even told me that it was an unprecedented situation.

However, that is no reason not to review safety standards in case of accident. We should not wait for another accident to happen before taking action. It is up to the Minister of Transport to act, and he must act now by upgrading safety standards. We must not forget that the statements of accident victims show that VIA Rail is not prepared and equipped for emergencies, as evidenced by the fact that the passengers could not open the doors, that they had to break the windows to get out, that first-aid kits only contained bandage rolls.

The facts are obvious. Safety standards are clearly inadequate and must be upgraded without delay, especially since even VIA Rail employees feel that they lack the training and the equipment needed to respond effectively to such an emergency. It is a very serious situation when the employees themselves feel they are poorly trained to deal with a situation like this.

I reiterate my question to the minister: Does the minister intend to upgrade safety standards? The minister must be aware that more people could have been hurt or killed in this accident and that we must do all we can to avoid this kind of tragedy in the future.

World Trade Organization Agreement Implementation ActAdjournment Proceedings

7:10 p.m.

Bonaventure—Îles-De-La-Madeleine Québec

Liberal

Patrick Gagnon LiberalParliamentary Secretary to Solicitor General

Mr. Speaker, I would like to take this opportunity to respond to the comments of the hon. member for Chicoutimi with respect to the railway accidents at Brighton and Rimouski.

I would like to start by saying I probably travel more by train than any other member in this House and, incidentally, my father was on the train going to the Gaspé when it jumped the tracks, so what the hon. member said touched a personal chord.

I have nothing to add to what was said by the Department of Transport last week. Emergency exits, first aid kits and emergency evacuation procedures are all matters of concern. I may remind hon. members that the Minister of Transport, the government, VIA Rail and Transport Canada see these elements as a priority and intend to ensure there is a thorough investigation.

However, the Transportation Safety Board, as the minister pointed out, is the body that was created by Parliament to investigate transportation accidents, which it is doing in this particular case. If the investigation reveals any irregularities with respect to the ability to intervene, it will be in a position to advise Transport Canada immediately.

The police forces concerned, both the VIA Rail contingent and the public police forces, are either conducting their own investigations or pooling their efforts, as well as stepping up the application of regulations and their own readiness. Furthermore, VIA Rail has already started a preliminary review of the accident and internal procedures.

In concluding, I would like to quote what was said by the minister: "We are going to do everything we can at VIA Rail, at Transport Canada, and at the police forces. Every possible avenue will be explored to make sure that the people who travel in Canada on VIA Rail trains can do so in safety and security".

World Trade Organization Agreement Implementation ActAdjournment Proceedings

7:10 p.m.

NDP

Audrey McLaughlin NDP Yukon, YT

Mr. Speaker, on September 20, I asked the Prime Minister a question that I think is extremely important if we are to have a federal health care system in this country. The question related to the private clinics in Alberta and what action the right hon. Prime Minister was prepared to take on this contravention of the Canada Health Act. At the time the Prime Minister responded that he was committed to maintaining a system where medicare was free and portable for everybody.

Clearly what we see in Alberta is a two-tier health care system in operation. It is not hypothetical but in operation. There is no doubt that private clinics are part of the two-tier system. Certainly any research that has been done indicates that it would be a contravention of the Canada Health Act. Yet the federal government has refused to act.

At the same time we see the premier of Alberta cutting back general health care by some 20 per cent from the province's health care budget by 1997, as he has projected. While it is clear that many ordinary Albertans will have difficulty getting health care, at the same time the two-tier system is allowed to flourish.

If one looks at the current situation in Alberta, one example is that the number of hospital beds in Edmonton has been reduced by 20 per cent. These cuts have had very tragic consequences for many Albertans. Now we hear many stories coming from Alberta about the devastating effects of some of the cuts. If the transfer payment system continues as it is, federal transfers will be phased out for all provinces by the year 2015. That indeed would be the end of a truly national system.

On the one hand in private clinics patients are being charged a fee on top of what the clinic charges the government health insurance plan. Clearly it is a case of government health care plans paying and the consumer paying on top of that.

It is clearly a violation of the Canada Health Act. It is one that must be dealt with immediately and effectively if the federal government is to fulfil its commitment to have a Canada health care system and preserve the five important components of the system. Of course it will not be done if the federal government does not continue its contribution through the equalized program funding.

In answer to my question on September 20 the right hon. Prime Minister concluded by saying: "I hope that Mr. Klein will respect the laws of Canada".

I would like to raise the question again. Hoping that this breach of the Canada Health Act will be dealt with is not good enough. I repeat my question: What is the government prepared to do?

World Trade Organization Agreement Implementation ActAdjournment Proceedings

7:15 p.m.

Halifax Nova Scotia

Liberal

Mary Clancy LiberalParliamentary Secretary to Minister of Citizenship and Immigration

Mr. Speaker, I thank the leader of the New Democratic Party for keeping to the question that she had originally asked. It is refreshing.

The government believes it is very doubtful that a private system offering health services as consumer goods for profit would benefit the health of Canadians.

At the September 1994 conference of health ministers all ministers present, with the exception of Alberta, reached an agreement to regulate private clinics. It is clear that all provinces, with the exception of Alberta, are ready to take steps to end charges for medically necessary care at private clinics.

The imposition of facility fees is not a direction in which these provinces and the federal government see our health care system moving. Our health care system is evolving. Alternatives for health care may involve care clinics instead of an institutionalized setting. This can be beneficial. However, if it is accompanied by charges for medically necessary care, it will not be consistent with what has been the history of our publicly funded system.

World Trade Organization Agreement Implementation ActAdjournment Proceedings

7:15 p.m.

The Acting Speaker (Mr. Kilger)

Pursuant to Standing Order 38 the motion to adjourn the House is now deemed to have been adopted. Accordingly the House stands adjourned until tomorrow at 10 a.m. pursuant to Standing Order 24.

(The House adjourned at 7.20 p.m.)