House of Commons Hansard #142 of the 35th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was agreement.

Topics

TaxationOral Question Period

2:15 p.m.

LaSalle—Émard Québec

Liberal

Paul Martin LiberalMinister of Finance and Minister responsible for the Federal Office of Regional Development-Quebec

Mr. Speaker, the finance committee suggested that, considering the lag between spending cuts and their actual impact on the deficit, if necessary we might consider other taxes. The committee told us that the tax hike they were concerned about most was an increase in interest rates. And I must say I think they are right.

TaxationOral Question Period

2:15 p.m.

Bloc

Michel Gauthier Bloc Roberval, QC

Mr. Speaker, does the Minister of Finance agree that the best way to get rid of the underground economy would be to stop taxing the middle class to the hilt, eliminate tax inequities-something we have been talking about for the past year-and introduce a more effective tax collection system, so that all taxpayers will pay their fair share and, in fact, pay what they owe the government?

TaxationOral Question Period

2:15 p.m.

LaSalle—Émard Québec

Liberal

Paul Martin LiberalMinister of Finance and Minister responsible for the Federal Office of Regional Development-Quebec

Mr. Speaker, the absolute necessity of building greater fairness and equity into our tax system and making sure that all Canadians are confident that the burden is being shared fairly is something this government has not only spoken about, but was also installed in the last budget more than in any other previous budget.

We filled in more loopholes in the last budget. We attacked the tax system in a way that will make it fairer. In fact the results are already being seen. Our corporate revenues are up higher than they have been in a long time.

This party takes a back seat to no one in its desire to build fairness and equity into the system. What I fail to understand is why the opposition consistently refuses to join us in that effort.

TaxationOral Question Period

2:20 p.m.

Bloc

Yvan Loubier Bloc Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC

Mr. Speaker, in addition to recommending an eventual tax increase for all taxpayers, the Liberal members are proposing new taxes which would directly hit the middle class. For example, they suggest imposing a new annual tax of $500 million on gas, while also leaving open the possibility of taxing group insurance benefits, RRSPs and retirement pensions.

Will the Minister of Finance pledge to reject the recommendations made by the Liberal members of the finance committee to impose a new tax on gasoline and to eventually tax RRSPs and group insurance benefits?

TaxationOral Question Period

2:20 p.m.

LaSalle—Émard Québec

Liberal

Paul Martin LiberalMinister of Finance and Minister responsible for the Federal Office of Regional Development-Quebec

Mr. Speaker, I find it very hard to understand the position of the Bloc Quebecois and its finance critic, since they had the opportunity to submit a constructive report and to make suggestions, not just nice speeches, but suggestions to really help us get rid of this plague called the deficit.

Instead of rising in the House to tell us about their own report and make suggestions, Bloc Quebecois members can only attack the government and, I must say, they do a poor job of that too.

We will solve the problem, but I invite the hon. member to participate in a joint effort. Deficit reduction should not be subject to partisan attacks: it should be a common goal for everyone.

TaxationOral Question Period

2:20 p.m.

Bloc

Yvan Loubier Bloc Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC

Mr. Speaker, I realize that the Minister of Finance does not always read the documents he receives. We have been making recommendations to him for a year now and, just recently, when he appeared before the finance committee, we made ten recommendations which have the advantage of not targeting the middle class or the poor. That is why he will not implement them.

Canadians and Quebecers will soon have to decide whether to invest in RRSPs. This is a serious issue involving billions of dollars.

For that reason, I ask the Minister of Finance to be clear and serious and to rule out, once and for all, taxing RRSPs. As I said, there are billions of dollars involved and this is a very serious matter.

TaxationOral Question Period

2:20 p.m.

LaSalle—Émard Québec

Liberal

Paul Martin LiberalMinister of Finance and Minister responsible for the Federal Office of Regional Development-Quebec

Mr. Speaker, I have said time and again that these questions would be answered when I table the budget. This is not really the time to preclude consultation. I want to ask the hon. member, like I did on Friday, if he supports the suggestion made at his first press conference by the economic

thinker for the separatist movement, Mr. Richard Le Hir, to the effect that, to eliminate the deficit, we should shut down VIA Rail and make cuts in old age pensions. That is the suggestion made by the great economic thinker for the separatist movement.

So I ask the member: Does he support that position?

TaxationOral Question Period

2:20 p.m.

Some hon. members

Hear, hear.

Immigration And Refugee BoardOral Question Period

2:20 p.m.

Reform

Art Hanger Reform Calgary Northeast, AB

Mr. Speaker, a little over a month ago the minister of immigration did the honourable thing and called a judicial inquiry into the activities of Michael Schelew, the vice-chair of the Immigration and Refugee Board.

Serious accusations of intimidation and artificially inflating refugee acceptance rates had been levelled at Schelew. The minister said an inquiry would dispel any notion that his department wanted to cover the matter up. On the day the inquiry was to begin it was abruptly cancelled. We learned that Mr. Schelew was given $100,000 in exchange for his resignation.

Mr. Schelew may be gone but the problems with the IRB remain. Will the minister order an immediate public review of the entire Immigration and Refugee Board?

Immigration And Refugee BoardOral Question Period

2:20 p.m.

York West Ontario

Liberal

Sergio Marchi LiberalMinister of Citizenship and Immigration

Mr. Speaker, it is absurd to suggest that the government has anything to cover up or hide.

Looking back at the process, I received a number of complaints. I gave those complaints to the chairperson of the board. The board recommended a course of action, namely an inquiry. The government, after thoughtful consideration of both the chairperson's and Mr. Schelew's response, suggested an inquiry which was started. Subsequent to the calling of that inquiry, Mr. Schelew tendered his resignation. It was the opinion of the Federal Court judge that the inquiry was moot and I accept his recommendation.

Immigration And Refugee BoardOral Question Period

2:25 p.m.

Reform

Art Hanger Reform Calgary Northeast, AB

Mr. Speaker, Canadians should be appalled at the way this government does business.

The minister appoints a good friend to the IRB who is then the subject of some very serious allegations. The minister orders a judicial inquiry into his friend's actions, citing concerns about the integrity of the IRB and the public's perception of a cover up. Suddenly the minister's headache disappears, at a cost to the taxpayer of $100,000.

Does the minister not think that the whole Schelew affair has seriously damaged the credibility of the IRB? Did he know beforehand about the $100,000 given to Schelew upon his dismissal?

Immigration And Refugee BoardOral Question Period

2:25 p.m.

York West Ontario

Liberal

Sergio Marchi LiberalMinister of Citizenship and Immigration

Mr. Speaker, it is very unfair to characterize Mr. Schelew or anybody else as a crony of the government. That is simply not the case. The whole question of the inquiry was simply to the alleged conduct of one individual.

I have said to this Chamber and publicly that there is the agency review, which is the review of government-wide commissions and agencies. Reforms will be reported early in the new year. Also, the IRB will be responding to the Hathaway report which it commissioned. I will be meeting with the chairperson of the board this week to discuss a number of issues and to consider any other possible measures.

In so far as the settlement is concerned, I was never personally involved with settlements, nor should any ministers concern themselves about settlements. The settlement was done by the appropriate officials. I am told it was in line with settlements for other public servants. The settlement package is less than one year's salary for Mr. Schelew. That was not conducted by me. I was involved with the inquiry and the inquiry exclusively.

Immigration And Refugee BoardOral Question Period

2:25 p.m.

Reform

Art Hanger Reform Calgary Northeast, AB

Mr. Speaker, the parliamentary secretary certainly knew all about the settlement.

Mr. Schelew did not operate in a vacuum. He could not have caused such an increase in refugee acceptance rates without the assistance of other Immigration and Refugee Board members. The Canadian acceptance rate for refugee claimants is now at an astronomical 70 per cent. One man could not have created this wave them through attitude all by himself.

I ask again, will the minister in the interests of preserving the integrity and legitimacy of the Canadian refugee determination system hold a public review of the Immigration and Refugee Board?

Immigration And Refugee BoardOral Question Period

2:25 p.m.

York West Ontario

Liberal

Sergio Marchi LiberalMinister of Citizenship and Immigration

Mr. Speaker, with reference to the first part of the question, I only found out the details of the settlement on Friday of last week. That was the day the judge suggested the inquiry should not proceed.

With respect to the IRB, I do not believe the party across the way is concerned about building up this institution, but we are on this side of the House. It would be grossly unfair for the hon. member and his party to suggest that because of the alleged conduct of one individual the entire institution should be undercut or undermined. I said that reforms to the institution will be coming in the early part of next year as part of the agency and program review which is being conducted by the government.

Collège Militaire Royal De Saint-JeanOral Question Period

2:25 p.m.

Bloc

Claude Bachand Bloc Saint-Jean, QC

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs.

It would appear that, after refusing for three weeks, the minister has finally decided to act upon the request made by the mayor of Saint-Jean, and send officials to negotiate with the Quebec government and municipal authorities on the basis of the mayor's proposal. This proposal allows for a gradual and more civilized closure of the college in Saint-Jean.

Can the minister confirm that he has agreed to send officials to Saint-Jean to negotiate, this week, a binding agreement with Quebec on the basis of Mayor Smereka's proposal?

Collège Militaire Royal De Saint-JeanOral Question Period

2:30 p.m.

Hull—Aylmer Québec

Liberal

Marcel Massé LiberalPresident of the Queen's Privy Council for Canada

Mr. Speaker, I myself met with the mayor of Saint-Jean to discuss this issue. My office has been in contact with him on several occasions. It is true that, on Saturday, we came to the conclusion that it would be useful to resume negotiations, since the chances were very good to finally conclude the negotiations on item 6 of the July 19 agreement, in order to make it possible for the college in Saint-Jean to keep operating as a civilian university.

Unfortunately, I learned just a few hours ago that, during a press conference, the Quebec minister, Ms. Beaudoin, who presumably was apprised of the letter faxed to her on Friday and of my press release, chose to misrepresent quite a few things.

In view of Ms. Beaudoin's position, I am no longer so sure that we can reach an agreement.

Collège Militaire Royal De Saint-JeanOral Question Period

2:30 p.m.

Bloc

Claude Bachand Bloc Saint-Jean, QC

Mr. Speaker, how can the minister justify having procrastinated for so long, and how can he justify procrastinating in following through with the proposal made by the mayor of Saint-Jean, while faculty members and their families have been living with a great deal of uncertainty for the last few months and must make a decision in the coming days on their transfer to Kingston?

Collège Militaire Royal De Saint-JeanOral Question Period

2:30 p.m.

Hull—Aylmer Québec

Liberal

Marcel Massé LiberalPresident of the Queen's Privy Council for Canada

Mr. Speaker, in the last few months, I put great effort into trying to reach an agreement that would keep the college in Saint-Jean open and allow the community to benefit economically from its operation.

On July 19, we reached an agreement that would have done just that. The Quebec government consistently refused to implement it. At last, thanks to the co-operation of the mayor of Saint-Jean, we finally succeeded in putting together a series of proposals which will or could lead to an agreement that would keep the Collège de Saint-Jean open as a civilian university.

But once again, Minister Beaudoin's bad faith has jeopardized the agreement we could have reached.

Immigration And Refugee BoardOral Question Period

2:30 p.m.

Reform

Philip Mayfield Reform Cariboo—Chilcotin, BC

Mr. Speaker, one thing is obvious to Canadians with regard to the Schelew affair: the matter has been closed. We have no answers and it has cost us another $100,000.

The facts of the matter are clear. To avoid any sense of avoiding the issue to have been brought before this cancelled inquiry there needs to be a full explanation by the minister.

Will the minister clear up any misunderstanding or lack of transparency in the matter by implementing a full public inquiry and including a full examination of the IRB and its executive?

Immigration And Refugee BoardOral Question Period

2:30 p.m.

York West Ontario

Liberal

Sergio Marchi LiberalMinister of Citizenship and Immigration

Mr. Speaker, Reform Party members would not recognize facts if they tripped over them.

The facts are very clear. An inquiry was called pursuant to section 63 of the Immigration Act with a reference to look into the alleged conduct of an individual. The board continues to work and discharges a very important mandate. It was the recommendation of the judge leading the inquiry, not the government, that the inquiry be stopped.

That does not mean to say the status quo of any board, commission or institution should be static and stay unchanged. I say again that reforms to institutions have already been part of the agency review for months. That review will be reporting early next year. The Hathaway commission has ushered in changes.

It is absolutely unfair for that party to try to discredit an entire institution that is working well with public servants who are doing a laudable job.

Immigration And Refugee BoardOral Question Period

2:35 p.m.

Reform

Philip Mayfield Reform Cariboo—Chilcotin, BC

Mr. Speaker, I thank the Minister of Citizenship and Immigration for moving a small step forward from his previous position.

To continue with my questioning on the same matter, the Minister of Citizenship and Immigration has talked about

transparency and about accountability. They are all things we are calling for. He says he wants the refugee determination system to work as well as it can, and I applaud this.

But will the minister put his money where his mouth is and change the refugee determination system so it is truly accountable and truly transparent?

Immigration And Refugee BoardOral Question Period

2:35 p.m.

York West Ontario

Liberal

Sergio Marchi LiberalMinister of Citizenship and Immigration

Mr. Speaker, in terms of trying to build up an institution and trying to make the system work, we have not had one constructive recommendation in over a year from that party.

All it is interested in is trying to exploit a situation that, granted, was not easy for the IRB. Again I say it would have been completely unfair to tarnish every member of the IRB and tarnish the entire institution with the same wide brush.

I have said we are interested in reforming the institution and it will be done. I invite and welcome any constructive advice or recommendation that may flow from that side rather than simply trying to cloak all the discussion in inquiries or royal commissions.

Immigration And Refugee BoardOral Question Period

2:35 p.m.

The Speaker

I appeal to members once again to make their questions and answers shorter.

Low Level FlightsOral Question Period

2:35 p.m.

Bloc

Jean-Marc Jacob Bloc Charlesbourg, QC

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of National Defence. The Department of National Defence proposes to invest over $68.5 million to build new facilities at the base in Goose Bay so that the number of low level flights can increase from the current 8,000 to over 18,000. Yet, there is no new firm contract with participating NATO countries to justify such an investment.

How can the minister be planning to authorize such additional spending to increase the number of flights when he knows full well that the U.S. withdrew from this Canadian agreement in 1991 and that Germany signed an agreement for such flights with New Mexico last May?

Low Level FlightsOral Question Period

2:35 p.m.

Don Valley East Ontario

Liberal

David Collenette LiberalMinister of National Defence and Minister of Veterans Affairs

Mr. Speaker, as the hon. member knows, the whole issue of low level flying in Labrador is subject to environmental assessment panel hearings that have been ongoing. It should bring down its conclusions shortly.

Once we receive the recommendations of that panel the Department of National Defence will know whether or not it will be able to continue with agreements with our allies for low level flying and whether or not any subsequent infrastructure should be added.