Debates of May 24th, 1994

Peacekeeping

[André Ouellet, Liberal, Minister of Foreign Affairs]

Mr. Speaker, I want to say to the hon. member that Canadian policy calls for the equitable sharing of peacekeeping costs by all member states of the UN.

I remind the hon. member that the U.S. administration has recently published a presidential decision, directive 25, which reaffirms that the U.S. intends to pay its full arrears in a timely manner. I believe this should be acknowledged as a substantial step forward.

We will be discussing with the Americans and with other countries the best way to make sure that all UN members pay their fair share of peacekeeping missions throughout the world.

Immigration

[Sharon Hayes, Reform, Port Moody—Coquitlam, BC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Citizenship and Immigration.

Several weeks ago the minister was quoted as saying that only 16 deportation orders against criminals had been overturned last year. He argued that this meant the immigration and refugee board was working just fine.

Recent reports indicate that at least 242 non-residents, most with criminal records, had deportation orders overturned.

Was the minister unaware of the numbers of criminal deportations overturned? If not, why did he choose not to reveal the true number?

[Sergio Marchi, Liberal, Minister of Citizenship and Immigration]

Mr. Speaker, the number that I referred to some time ago in the House was the number of overturned cases. The cases that the hon. member talks about include a large number of cases that were stayed. There is a difference between overturning and staying.

I have also said that I do not look kindly on those individuals who clearly poke fun at our system, who abuse our system. We will have a bill in the House of Commons before we go home in the summer and I look forward to the hon. member's support as well as that of her party to deal with it.

[Sharon Hayes, Reform, Port Moody—Coquitlam, BC]

Mr. Speaker, the minister has also tried to reassure Canadians that the vast majority of deportations are carried out after they are ordered, but of approximately 25,000 deportations ordered last year fewer than 9,000 have actually been carried out.

Canadians deserve to know how the immigration enforcement system is working.

Will the minister agree to the public disclosure of the percentage of deportation orders successfully carried out, especially in light of his recently announced amnesty agenda?

[Sergio Marchi, Liberal, Minister of Citizenship and Immigration]

Mr. Speaker, I do not know where the hon. member is getting this amnesty agenda. The government did no such thing. She is obviously twisting the facts of what we did last week, which was to impose a number of interim measures, because I believe that the agency and the automatic review after failed claims were not well defined and that discretion rested solely with the minister. What we had were end runs around the system to try to get to members of Parliament, to ministers, to NGOs, to the media, to church sanctuary.

Rather than having something undefined I chose instead to put discretion back into the system, define what it means to have an automatic review and what it means to have a humanitarian and compassionate review so that the people and the council know the rules by which they have to appeal. I think that makes sense, rather than having the system overtaxed.

The hon. member should be careful in how she uses the word amnesty because first, it is not an amnesty; second, the people who can apply for that are post-93; and third, those with criminal records are not eligible.

Amateur Sport

[Suzanne Tremblay, Bloc, Rimouski—Témiscouata, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the minister of heritage has just received the report of a committee which looked into the funding of amateur sport in Canada. In particular, the report recommends that the grants awarded to several federations representing sports such as the biathalon and freestyle skiing be cut. These are sports in which Quebec athletes excelled and won gold medals at the Lillehammer Games.

Can the minister of heritage tell us if he intends to follow up on the Best report?

[Michel Dupuy, Liberal, Minister of Canadian Heritage]

Mr. Speaker, I am delighted that our colleague has given me this opportunity to shed some light on this situation. Last week, I received a copy of the report that had been tabled. The only ministerial decision that was taken was to make the report public. Any further decisions will not be made until the report is examined.

I might add that not only will recommendations be examined, but also the very concept on which the report is based, that is the concept of mainstream sport. We will examine all of this and make our decisions known in due course.

[Suzanne Tremblay, Bloc, Rimouski—Témiscouata, QC]

Mr. Speaker, will the minister commit to fully maintaining the level of assistance provided to athletes and will he agree to focus his cost-cutting efforts instead on the real waste within his department, particularly the waste associated with the Canadian Museum of Nature?

[Michel Dupuy, Liberal, Minister of Canadian Heritage]

Mr. Speaker, we should not be mixing apples and oranges. A museum and athletes are two very different things. I can, however, reassure our colleague that I have always given priority consideration to hard-working athletes in whom we take great pride. She can rest assured that they will have the consideration of the minister of heritage.

Aboriginal Commercial Fishery

[John Cummins, Reform, Delta, BC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Fisheries and Oceans.

In June 1993 the B.C. Court of Appeal ruled that there is no inherent right to an aboriginal commercial fishery yet the previous government persisted with just such a policy.

Is the minister committed to continuing the policy of the previous government establishing this aboriginal commercial fishery?

[Brian Tobin, Liberal, Minister of Fisheries and Oceans]

Mr. Speaker, the previous government did not establish an aboriginal commercial fishery. The previous government established a number of test sale projects in British Columbia with respect to the aboriginal fishery. That is what was established.

That policy has now been reviewed by the current government as was required under the cabinet directive of the day and a proposal or an announcement on the future of the aboriginal fisheries strategy will be forthcoming very soon.

[John Cummins, Reform, Delta, BC]

Mr. Speaker, we are pleased to hear that an announcement will be coming soon. The minister persistently and consistently refused to meet with the B.C. Fisheries Survival Coalition, a group formed to deal with and address that particular issue.

Does the minister believe that in refusing to meet with this group while declaring that he intends to make an announcement soon, he will generate support for the government's position?

[Brian Tobin, Liberal, Minister of Fisheries and Oceans]

Mr. Speaker, I know the member would want all members of the House to have all of the information available regarding this important matter. The member for Delta knows that I have met with almost every individual component part of the aboriginal fisheries strategy group.

I have met with the FCBC of British Columbia. I have met with the union. I have met and addressed the Pacific Troller's Association at its annual meeting. I have met a variety of other groups. I have probably held more meetings with groups-the member I think would acknowledge this-in British Columbia on the question of the British Columbia fishery, in particular getting ready for an aggressive campaign to try to resolve our differences with the Americans than any other minister for a heck of a long time.

When the member says I have not met with each of these component groups under something called the Survival Coalition as one group, he is right, but I have met every one of the individuals involved on numerous occasions.

Mr. Speaker, you do not get meetings with ministers by occupying the offices of federal MPs. If you want good faith, show good faith. That is my message to the people I want to work with in the province of British Columbia.

Trade

[David Iftody, Liberal, Provencher, MB]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food.

The United States secretary of agriculture is now sending a team to Brazil to attempt to gather unfounded evidence of alleged Canadian dumping of wheat.

Time and again the Canadian Wheat Board has been found by international tribunals to be trading fairly. The United States is again creating mischief, this time among Canada's trading partners in South America.

Will the minister of agriculture intervene to counter this ongoing harassment and attacks against Canadian farmers by the U.S. government?

[Ralph Goodale, Liberal, Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member and the House can be absolutely assured that the Government of Canada will vigorously defend Canada's vital interests, including the interests of Canadian grain farmers.

We have consulted and will continue to consult with our customers and our competitors alike. In recent days we have

been in touch with the Brazilians, the Argentinians and the Mexicans and we will continue that dialogue to resolve any concerns they might have. We want to ensure full and accurate information so our customers and competitors do not have to rely on misinformation or disinformation that might be provided by the United States.

In the circumstances being complained about by the United States at the present time, the U.S. is wrong. Its allegations are false. It is ironic that those allegations should be coming from a country that spends $1 billion U.S. annually on its export enhancement program which is the most manipulative and trade distorting program on the face of the earth.

Collège Militaire Royal De Saint-Jean

[Claude Bachand, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs recently stated that an agreement had been reached with the Quebec government regarding the future of the military college in Saint-Jean.

However, the Premier of Quebec denied that such an agreement on the future use of the college existed. Can the minister tell us whether or not an agreement was reached with the Quebec government regarding the use of the college in Saint-Jean, as he announced at the Liberal convention last week?

[Marcel Massé, Liberal, President of the Queen's Privy Council for Canada]

Mr. Speaker, the negotiations on the future use of the college in Saint-Jean are ongoing. We clearly had a meeting of the minds on a number of items that will be part of the final round of negotiations. But, as I indicated last week, the final agreement is not ready yet. When it is ready, I will be happy to give a copy to the opposition member.

[Claude Bachand, Bloc, Saint-Jean, QC]

Mr. Speaker, could the minister tell us exactly what, in his current negotiations with the Quebec government, is the federal government's proposed use for the college in Saint-Jean?

[Marcel Massé, Liberal, President of the Queen's Privy Council for Canada]

Mr. Speaker, as usual, we have been very flexible in our negotiations with the provinces, and in this case with Quebec. We are still flexible. Therefore, until we have a final decision, we cannot announce it, because we are giving Quebec the opportunity to continue to discuss some of the items.

Health Care

[Margaret Bridgman, Reform, Surrey North, BC]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Health.

One of the five principles of the Canada Health Act is accessibility. Traditionally this principle has been interpreted narrowly, that is, ensuring that health care is not denied for financial reasons.

The greatest barriers to health care today are the line-ups and waiting lists Canadians encounter when they require health care services.

Does the minister agree that accessibility for health care must be defined in terms of timeliness as well as affordability?

[Diane Marleau, Liberal, Minister of Health]

Mr. Speaker, accessibility is a case of affordability as well as timeliness.

When extra billing is involved it means that some people very much do not have access to treatment. We are looking at all five principles to make sure that as much as is possible within our system we can withstand the pressures that are there. We have the best health care system in the world, bar none.

[Margaret Bridgman, Reform, Surrey North, BC]

Mr. Speaker, my supplementary question is for the Minister of Health. The minister has reduced access to health care services in her recent decision to cut funding to British Columbia.

Access to health care is the right of all Canadians. How can the minister say she is complying fully with the Canada Health Act when her actions are making health care less and less accessible?

[Diane Marleau, Liberal, Minister of Health]

Mr. Speaker, it was not a choice I had. I had a duty to enforce the Canada Health Act.

The Canada Health Act is very specific. Extra billing is not allowed. Once a year provinces are asked to submit a report on the extra billing that is going on in their province. When this report was sent to me I had no choice but to act on it because extra billing restricts access for people.

I ask the hon. member, how can paying extra money for a physician give everybody better access? All it does is make some physicians richer than others.

Presence In Gallery

[The Speaker]

I would like to draw to the attention of hon. members the presence in our gallery of Mr. Riccardo Jagmetti, Speaker of the Council of States of the Swiss Confederation.

[Some hon. members]

Hear, hear.