House of Commons Hansard #198 of the 35th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was internet.

Topics

Hate Propaganda Via Electronic HighwayPrivate Members' Business

5:55 p.m.

Portage—Interlake Manitoba

Liberal

Jon Gerrard LiberalSecretary of State (Science

Mr. Speaker, I rise in support of the motion put forward by my colleague, the hon. member for Winnipeg North. I applaud his efforts on behalf of Canadians in bringing this to the attention of the House and moving to take an important step by recommending we take action and move forward in abolishing hate and hateful messages on the information highway.

It is clearly not an easy aspect to consider as the Internet is travelled and is accessible from anywhere in the world. It is important subject matter and an important area for us to be concerned about as our children increasingly participate in and use the Internet and computers generally.

We must think not only of Canadians. Our messages travel around the world. We must think about people in other countries as well. Canada is a society that has grown and developed a very important ethic of tolerance, an ethic in which we disagree with those who tend to promote hate. We would like this concept of tolerance that we have developed in Canada to be spread around the world through media like the Internet through approaches like the worldwide web.

Let us keep in mind at the moment that the problem is relatively small. At this point only a tiny proportion of the 5,000 Usenet discussion groups have any problems that might come under this concept of hateful material.

Nevertheless, it is important because of the rapidity with which the Internet is expanding, which it is estimated now reaches some 40 million people around the world, that we start to move in this area. In doing so, I think it is important to first recognize that there are areas under the current telecommunications legislation and regulations where offensive and unsolicited content or messages can be dealt with.

For example, under section 8.2 of Bell Canada's terms of service which sets out the basic rights and obligations of telephone companies and their subscribers, customers are prohibited from using the public telephone network in a way that is contrary to law for the purpose of making annoying or offensive calls. Originators of such calls, hate or racist messages on a telephone answering machine can be prosecuted. The public can file complaints with the telephone company or the CRTC who will pursue these investigations.

Section 41 of the Telecommunications Act authorizes the CRTC to take regulatory steps to protect consumers against possible abuses from unsolicited telecommunications, computerized solicitations or junk faxes which may contain offensive content. Under this section, the commission introduced regulations restricting the use of automatic dialling and announcing devices for the purpose of broadcasting commercial messages, as well as various safeguards to protect consumers against unsolicited messages such as call blocking. While not intended specifically to control the dissemination of offensive content, these regulations can nonetheless be used to discourage abuses in this area.

Section 36 of the Telecommunications Act gives the commission some latitude in allowing telecommunications carriers to take into account the content or the message it carries over its facilities.

A case in point is the commission's approval of a number of safeguards to protect consumers, particularly children, against unwanted exposure over the 900 number telephone service which delivers audiotext services, including so-called adult entertainment.

The commission granted the telephone companies some discretion to refuse to provide billing and collection service to certain 900 service operations which in the opinion of the telephone company offer a program or service which does not comply with the program content guidelines approved by the commission. This forces the service provider to use an alternative billing method such as credit card billing, prepayment or some other approach which provides greater control by consumers over the use of the service. The CRTC has also provided a number of other protection measures, including the provision of call blocking of 900 service upon request.

Consequently, in situations where the material is not illegal under the Criminal Code there may still be levers to block, control or limit its dissemination.

There is of course no reason to believe that the Criminal Code itself cannot be used on the information highway, although to date it has not been so applied, but it remains there. It is an area

which as in other forms of communication, print media, et cetera, can certainly potentially be used.

Under the information highway advisory council there are some initiatives already under way. The advisory council, which we appointed last year, has been looking at this area along with a number of other areas in terms of how Canada should have solid initiatives and policies in the area of the information highway.

At its most recent meeting on April 21 the council brought forward for third reading a four-pronged approach to the limitation or attack on any hate messages which might be found on the information highway. The four-pronged approach includes attention to law enforcement in this area, to the development of a code of ethics as it applies to the information highway, and also education and public awareness. This area is growing very rapidly in use. It is important for school children and people in communities and for all Canadians to develop an awareness of what the media is, how it works, and the limitations and advantages of it.

Another approach is the technological approach. It is rather interesting that the technology to block, monitor or interfere with hate messages and hate propaganda is something which is coming. It may provide users of the information highway with approaches that will be very useful in the future.

With regard to the already existing legislative measures, I would like to talk about four points briefly.

Criminal Code sections 318 to 320 may apply. Also section 13 of the human rights act can apply. One problem is that computers on the Internet do not recognize international boundaries. It would therefore be rather difficult unless there are common international standards, regulations or laws to control it when it originates from other countries. There may be potential for bilateral and multilateral arrangements. This is something that could and should be pursued.

The second prong of the approach suggested by the Information Highway Advisory Council deals with development of a code of ethics. Other areas of communication, for example many of the established media industries such as broadcasting, cable television and sound recording have successfully adopted voluntary guidelines to deal with offensive content. We feel it is advisable to move in this area on the information highway.

The third prong of the council's strategy deals with public awareness, an important initiative which we need to undertake. It also deals with technological approaches which can be used to block transmission to allow schools and parents to filter content coming into homes and schools. I think we will see these sorts of filters more widely used. These can be very helpful in allowing individual Canadians to control access and content coming to them.

These sorts of initiatives are coming from the Information Highway Advisory Council. This is a grassroots move and is strongly supported by my hon. colleague for Winnipeg North. The motion is an important step forward. I support it and think we can move forward together and create an electronic world which is not only exciting, but is also one which is ethical.

Hate Propaganda Via Electronic HighwayPrivate Members' Business

6:05 p.m.

Liberal

Gurbax Malhi Liberal Bramalea—Gore—Malton, ON

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to rise today in support of the motion by the hon. member for Winnipeg North.

The information highway has the potential to become one of the most glorious tools ever imagined, providing links between people all over the globe. Its potential for positive interaction for the sharing of information and ideas and education is unlimited.

How tragic to think of it instead as a tool for those who would use it to spread their own malicious, bigoted, racist ideas, particularly to our children. I have read some of the vile messages these people have posted. The thought that my children might also read them makes me sick at heart.

Canada has long had a reputation as a tolerant and compassionate nation, accepting with open arms immigrants and refugees from all over the world. Many of these people have fled their homelands to escape persecution. Many were being persecuted on the basis of their race alone. They have come to this great country believing that at long last they will be free to live their lives in peace. I can only imagine their horror when they discover their young children innocently tapping into a cesspool of hate propaganda.

What of our older citizens who have lived through the unspeakable horrors of the second world war, some as fighters in our armed forces, some as victims of the madness of the Nazis? This year and this week in particular we are remembering the end of the second world war in Europe 50 years ago. We are once again celebrating the victories of those men and women who fought so valiantly to make the world safe for democracy. We are remembering those who lost their lives so that we could live in freedom and dignity. Were these sacrifices for nothing? Do we not owe it to them to continue the fight?

Our veterans came back to Canada from the war with an understanding of what happens when one group of people determines that another is inferior to themselves. They saw firsthand the inhumanity man can inflict on his brother in the name of nationalism and racial superiority. They taught their children and their children taught their children the importance of tolerance for the beliefs of others. How sad that their great-grandchildren are being targeted for this misinformation. How sad that the very first information they might receive about

the Holocaust could be misinformation from a revisionist intent on reviling the Jewish people.

People have fought and died to preserve the rights and freedoms we enjoy in this country, but they did not fight and die to preserve the right of one group of people to defame the reputation of another. They did not fight and die so a skinhead using equipment at a publicly funded university could call into question the rights of Asian and black people to live in freedom and bear children.

Freedom of speech and expression is one of the most important and basic rights of all Canadians, but it is not a right without limitation. We have laws in this country prohibiting the public incitement of hatred. These people are breaking our laws.

We have heard that the users of the Internet are a self-policing group and are flooding those who are spreading hatred with messages countering their arguments. I commend these people for caring enough to try to counteract the hate propaganda, but my concern is that these messages are still being received. Right now it seems impossible to stop the perpetrators of hate propaganda on the Internet. That is why it is so important to start looking for solutions immediately.

The hon. member for Winnipeg North has suggested a number of areas in which the Canadian government can begin looking for solutions. I am in full agreement with all of these suggestions, particularly his suggestion that these measures must be taken immediately. Time is of the essence. We must stop this flow of hateful and hurtful information now. The information highway must be a conduit where all people feel welcome.

Hate Propaganda Via Electronic HighwayPrivate Members' Business

6:10 p.m.

Liberal

Rey D. Pagtakhan Liberal Winnipeg North, MB

Mr. Speaker, certainly I am very delighted over the last two hours of debate on the motion to have observed a unanimity of hearts and minds on this very crucial issue. I feel a resolve on the part of Parliament not to allow hate in Canada. It is a commitment to a fundamental Canadian value.

On that note, I would appreciate it if you would seek unanimous consent, Mr. Speaker, to adopt the motion.

Hate Propaganda Via Electronic HighwayPrivate Members' Business

6:10 p.m.

The Deputy Speaker

Is the House ready for the question?

Hate Propaganda Via Electronic HighwayPrivate Members' Business

6:10 p.m.

Some hon. members

Question.

Hate Propaganda Via Electronic HighwayPrivate Members' Business

6:10 p.m.

The Deputy Speaker

Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?

Hate Propaganda Via Electronic HighwayPrivate Members' Business

6:10 p.m.

Some hon. members

Agreed.

(Motion agreed to.)

Hate Propaganda Via Electronic HighwayPrivate Members' Business

6:10 p.m.

The Deputy Speaker

It being 6.17 p.m, the House stands adjourned until tomorrow at 10 a.m.

(The House adjourned at 6.17 p.m.)