Debates of Feb. 13th, 2001

Home Heating Assistance

[Paul Martin, Liberal, Minister of Finance]

Mr. Speaker, we proceeded in this fashion for the same reason that the provinces did. It was the most effective way to give these cheques to the poor.

If we had chosen another solution, these people would have received their cheques next summer instead of in January. I can assure the hon. member that it is a lot colder in January than in July.

Minister Of Finance

[Brian Pallister, Canadian Alliance, Portage—Lisgar, MB]

Mr. Speaker, it is time for somebody on the front bench of the Liberal government to stand up for the truth about the unethical conduct of the Prime Minister. Where I come from, a person who knows that a wrong has been done and remains silent about it is as guilty as the perpetrator of the act and becomes an accomplice.

It is time for the Minister of Finance to stop defending the indefensible actions of the Prime Minister by his silence. Will the Minister of Finance today distance himself from the inappropriate actions of his leader, or will he remain silent and condone them?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Deputy Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member is a newcomer to the House. He has been—

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh.

[The Speaker]

Order, please. It is impossible for the Chair to hear the answer the Deputy Prime Minister is giving to the question.

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Windsor West, ON]

Mr. Speaker, it is well known in the House, and I think it is the principle even in the house in which the member served before, that we can only expect ministers to answer on matters under their administrative responsibility. The hon. member is trying to paint a misleading picture to the public who has been watching this on TV by asking this question.

I notice how the hon. member ran away from the Conservative Party when he did not end up as its leader. I do not think he should be giving any lessons to anybody on these kinds of subjects.

[Some hon. members]

More, more.

[The Speaker]

I know many hon. members are wishing to ask questions and many members are wishing to give answers. If we take up time like this we will not get them all in.

[Brian Pallister, Canadian Alliance, Portage—Lisgar, MB]

Mr. Speaker, I thank the Deputy Prime Minister for letting us all know that truth is not in the purview of the Minister of Finance. My question—

[The Speaker]

I think we will move on to the next question.

Amateur Sport

[Jeannot Castonguay, Liberal, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Secretary of State for Amateur Sport.

Can the hon. member can tell us what the Government of Canada is planning to do to help our athletes prepare for the 2002 winter games in Salt Lake City?

[Denis Coderre, Liberal, Secretary of State (Amateur Sport)]

Mr. Speaker, on April 27 and 28, as the House knows, the Prime Minister of Canada will be chairing the National Sport Summit in order to put in place a new Canadian sport system.

In the meantime, we must respond to immediate needs in order to create conditions that will help our athletes reach their objectives.

Today, I am announcing an additional $1.2 million in funding to help our Olympic and Paralympic athletes achieve their dreams. Let us all support our athletes and be proud of them.

Health

[Libby Davies, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Mr. Speaker, last night on the CBC there was a very alarming report about Canadian diabetics who suffered severe impacts from using genetically engineered insulin.

Indeed, at least 121 serious complaints from physicians, and I suspect there are more, beg the question as to why Health Canada is leaving these diabetics at risk by not ensuring that animal insulin is accessible and available from pharmaceutical companies.

What will the government do to protect the health of these Canadians?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Deputy Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I thank the hon. member for raising the topic. It is an important one. I will look into it and get back to her as soon as possible.

[Judy Wasylycia-Leis, NDP, Winnipeg North Centre, MB]

Mr. Speaker, if the government is as concerned about food safety as it has claimed throughout the whole Brazilian beef episode, why then would it consider the very scientists who are responsible for human health and food safety to be irrelevant to this issue?

The Deputy Prime Minister said yesterday that it was okay to gag scientists for speaking out about public health because, as he said, they had no responsibility in the area.

That begs the question, why in heaven's name were they not involved from the beginning and will they now be included in developing a science based, fail safe system of dealing with the potential threat of mad cow disease?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Deputy Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member would have more credibility if she had quoted me accurately. I said that the officials in question were not working directly on the matter of the ban on beef from Brazil.

They are not in the Canadian Food Inspection Agency. They work in an area of the Department of Health that was not dealing with this issue. I think this is a fact that should be put on the table. She ought to revisit her question in light of this fact and other facts in this matter.

Business Development Bank Of Canada

[André Bachand, Progressive Conservative, Richmond—Arthabaska, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister is up to his neck in the Auberge Grand-Mère affair.

He made improper use of his prerogative as Prime Minister by intervening directly with the federal Business Development Bank of Canada. He made improper use of his prerogative as Prime Minister by intervening to change the head of the BDC. He made improper use of his prerogative as Prime Minister by intervening directly in a matter that was indirectly in his own personal interest. He made improper use of his prerogative as Prime Minister by not ensuring that the shares he held until 1999 were put in trust. Why?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Deputy Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, the only improper use I see is the improper use of logic in this farfetched question. The ethics counsellor has stated on numerous occasions that the Prime Minister had not broken any rules in this connection and had acted within the rules. He has done nothing wrong.

[Joe Clark, Progressive Conservative, Calgary Centre, AB]

Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Industry. Will he table the documents I requested yesterday regarding the specific search firms used in the specific cases of Bernie Schroder, Michel Vennat and Jean Carle?

Will he also confirm that the suggestion to use the firm Spencer Stuart to facilitate the hiring of Mr. Jean Carle was a suggestion made during a hockey game to Mr. François Beaudoin by Mr. Jean Pelletier, chief of staff for the Prime Minister of Canada?

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh.

[The Speaker]

Order, please. The Chair has to be able to hear the question and the answer. It was getting difficult at the end of the question and it is impossible now.

[Brian Tobin, Liberal, Minister of Industry]

Mr. Speaker, I was wondering why the leader of the Conservative Party was running away from his questions of yesterday. Perhaps it is because he has discovered his assertion that search firms were switched is a false assertion.

There are not one or two executive search firms. There are at least 10 of which I know. They are all employed for different jobs that need to be filled.

No direction is given to BDC on who it hires as an executive search firm. I can say it is something I do not do. I spoke to my predecessor and it is something he did not do. As for hockey games and fishing trips, I wish the member well.

Ethics Counsellor

[Monte Solberg, Canadian Alliance, Medicine Hat, AB]

Mr. Speaker, the authorities who wrote the book on ethics are starting to speak out about the Prime Minister's conduct.

Gordon Robertson, a clerk of the Privy Council for 12 years under both Lester Pearson and Pierre Trudeau, said “I don't trust the government. What happened in Shawinigan never would have met the standards set in Pearson's ethics code. I should know. I drafted it”.

Why does the Prime Minister allow lower ethical standards to be kept in his government than he had to live with in the Pearson and Trudeau governments?

[Herb Gray, Liberal, Deputy Prime Minister]

Mr. Speaker, I think I will have to check the alleged quote in the context of which it was stated. Often when members of the opposition get up on things like this and then we look to see what was actually said, it turns out to be far different from what is alleged.

For example, yesterday the Leader of the Opposition said he had Quebec government documents about investor flow of funds. Our office tried to get copies of those documents. So far the Leader of the Opposition's office has failed to provide them. I wonder why.

[Monte Solberg, Canadian Alliance, Medicine Hat, AB]

Mr. Speaker, Mr. Robertson said the shenanigans in Shawinigan would never have happened under Lester Pearson. He said “The Prime Minister has lowered the bar” on ethics.

Why is it that no matter how low the ethical bar goes, the Prime Minister always finds a way to limbo under it?