Debates of Dec. 12th, 2002

Firearms Registry

[Garry Breitkreuz, Canadian Alliance, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

Mr. Speaker, rhetoric does not save lives.

This morning the justice minister in his statement said he will pull money out of other programs to fund the gun registry. Parliament demonstrated its lack of confidence in the registry by removing $72 million from the scheme last week. Now the minister will be using sleight of hand to keep it on life support.

What programs will he take the money from to fund the registry?

[Martin Cauchon, Liberal, Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, we have been talking about transparency. I made my statement this morning because I respect this parliament and as well, the notion of transparency. It is important as well to inform the Canadian population.

As I have said many times, we believe in that policy. The policy is working. The gun registry is up and running. Of course we will keep proceeding at low cost. As I said this morning, there is still funding in the program. Of course at one point we will have to proceed with the same cash management as departments are doing on a regular basis.

[Garry Breitkreuz, Canadian Alliance, Yorkton—Melville, SK]

Mr. Speaker, Parliament is still being kept in the dark. The minister could not make it work when he spent $1 billion. Logic tells anyone that it will not work when it is funded at minimum levels.

Today the justice minister once again refused to extend the gun registration deadline and as a consequence will criminalize one million law-abiding Canadians. The Auditor General reports a 90% error rate in the registry. Only one-third of the guns are registered. Gun owners cannot register their guns even if they want to.

One more time, Mr. Speaker, will he please tell us how much it will cost to complete and how much will it cost to maintain?

[Martin Cauchon, Liberal, Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member has to understand that there is a deadline. Actually I would like to report that 70% of the guns have been registered at this point in time.

The policy works. The program is up and running as well. We will keep proceeding at low cost, as I said. This morning my statement was about transparency, telling Canadians that we are proceeding and at one point we will have to proceed with cash management. As I said, this is done on a regular basis by most of the departments.

École de médecine vétérinaire de Saint-Hyacinthe

[Yvan Loubier, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Mr. Speaker, unlike the other schools of veterinary medicine in Canada, the École de médecine vétérinaire de Saint-Hyacinthe has never benefited from major financial support from the federal government in the past. It is now required to invest $100 million to regain its full accreditation from the American Veterinary Medical Association.

Since the Government of Quebec has already covered its share of the $100 million, which amounted to $41 million, can the federal Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food tell us if he intends to contribute the federal government's full share, which comes to $59 million, and not $35 million, as he said earlier this week?

[Lyle Vanclief, Liberal, Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food]

Mr. Speaker, as I said to the hon. member in the House yesterday, this is an area that the federal government has never been involved in before. However, we recognize the importance of veterinary colleges for animal health and human health. We made a contribution of $113 million to assist all of our vet colleges to maintain their accreditation, and $35.46 million of that went to the college at Saint-Hyacinthe.

[Yvan Loubier, Bloc, Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC]

Mr. Speaker, the minister is wrong, because in the past, the three other schools of veterinary medicine in Canada, the ones in Saskatoon, Prince Edward Island, and Guelph, benefited from up to 50% of the construction and modernization costs in the 1980s, yet Saint-Hyacinthe got nothing.

Does the minister fail to understand the problem is not solved by a partial payment, that there is still a $24 million shortfall, and that this money needs to come from him, and him alone, if he wants to treat Saint-Hyacinthe the same as the other veterinary schools in Canada?

Will he understand this and will the federal government, for once, contribute its fair share for the construction and modernization costs of the École de médecine vétérinaire de Saint-Hyacinthe?

[Lyle Vanclief, Liberal, Minister of Agriculture and Agri-Food]

Mr. Speaker, technically this is an area of provincial jurisdiction and the presidents of all the four universities asked the federal government to contribute. Based on their request to us we are contributing 60% of what they said was required. The provinces will therefore have the opportunity to provide the other moneys that are required.

In reference to the comments the member made about other colleges, they receive money through the Canada Foundation for Innovation but that is a totally different situation.

Firearms Registry

[Myron Thompson, Canadian Alliance, Wild Rose, AB]

Mr. Speaker, a six month grace period will not solve the massive backlog of registrations or fix the problems facing those currently trying to register firearms. Phone calls go unanswered and registration forms are hard to find. Government mismanagement has made registering nearly impossible. In the end it is the gun owners who will pay for the government's incompetence through fines and jail time.

The Liberal government is spending $1 billion to make one million criminals. Why will it not just scrap the registry?

[Martin Cauchon, Liberal, Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, I do not understand the comments of the hon. member. When we are talking about the registry, as I said, it is a policy that is working. It is about public safety. It is about protecting the Canadian population. On this side of the House we do believe in public safety.

Having said that, the gun registry works well at this point in time. We will be proceeding at minimum costs, as I said. It is important to respect the legislation and therefore to respect the deadline.

[Myron Thompson, Canadian Alliance, Wild Rose, AB]

Mr. Speaker, the registry is not working well. Last week Parliament said no to additional money for the firearms registry. This morning the minister said he would find additional money from other resources.

What part of no does the minister not understand?

[Martin Cauchon, Liberal, Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, what we are talking about here is transparency. We have frozen all major spending in regard to the program, but we will keep proceeding with the registry. It is up and running. We have legislative obligations and we will meet those obligations.

Iraq

[Francine Lalonde, Bloc, Mercier, QC]

Mr. Speaker, we parliamentarians voted for the ratification of the Kyoto protocol by the government. It was essential that we do so. So what about the possible involvement of Canadian troops in a conflict against Iraq, which may result in young Quebeckers and Canadians getting killed?

Does the Prime Minister recognize that if he sought the approval of parliamentarians on the ratification of Kyoto, it is no less essential that he give them a say in any plans for Canadian participation in a war against Iraq?

[Don Boudria, Liberal, Minister of State and Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member is no doubt aware that each time troops were deployed in the past, Parliament was consulted and debates were held in this House.

Should she wish that a parliamentary committee sit during the break, I am prepared to discuss this possibility with her House leader and the other leaders.

[Francine Lalonde, Bloc, Mercier, QC]

Mr. Speaker, in the same way that prior approval by the Security Council alone can confer international legality on any military action in Iraq, only a vote by Parliament can ensure that the participation of Canada's armed forces in a conflict in Iraq is legitimate.

Will the Prime Minister promise to convene the House of Commons to allow parliamentarians to take a vote before getting Canada involved in Iraq, as his own party requested at the time of the Gulf war, in 1991?

[Don Boudria, Liberal, Minister of State and Leader of the Government in the House of Commons]

Mr. Speaker, the precedent was used on several occasions. There is even a procedure recognized by all the parties for consultation among them. It normally takes the form of a debate in this House.

There have even been precedents where, between sessions, committees met to discuss such issues. As I said earlier and at the risk of sounding repetitive, I am prepared to have discussions with her House leader and all other leaders.

Justice

[Kevin Sorenson, Canadian Alliance, Crowfoot, AB]

Mr. Speaker, the government forced innocent firearm owners to register millions of firearms retroactively at a cost of $1 billion, yet it has failed to allow for retroactive registration of convicted sex offenders.

My question is for the Solicitor General. Why the cop-out? Why would all convicted sex offenders not be registered?

[Wayne Easter, Liberal, Solicitor General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, there was consensus that when the legislation was brought in it could not be brought in retroactively because it might not stand up to the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. This sex offender registry will certainly help make our streets safer and be an investigative tool for police forces in terms of solving sex crimes.

I would think the hon. member opposite would be more supportive of us taking these steps and moving forward.

[Kevin Sorenson, Canadian Alliance, Crowfoot, AB]

Mr. Speaker, failure to register a firearm can end up with a prison term of 10 years. Failure to register as a convicted sex offender is punishable by only six months in prison. Firearm owners who provide false information are liable for up to five years in prison. Convicted sex offenders who provide false information are liable for up to six months in prison.

Does the government really believe that innocent firearm owners are a greater threat to public security than convicted sex offenders?

[Wayne Easter, Liberal, Solicitor General of Canada]

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member should know that the legislation has had first reading in the House. We must debate this issue further.

I would think the hon. member would be getting up and thanking us for coming forward with this forward looking initiative. We have consensus from the provinces to move forward with this initiative. We intend to bring it forward so that it will stand up to any court challenges in the future. The bottom line is, we will have a better investigative tool for the police to do its work.

Aboriginal Affairs

[Peter Adams, Liberal, Peterborough, ON]

Mr. Speaker, three weeks ago there was a breakthrough on the residential schools file through an agreement on liability with the Anglican Church. At that time the government indicated that it was having discussions with other denominations.

With the House about to take a break could the minister responsible for residential schools bring us up to date on this matter?

[Ralph Goodale, Liberal, Minister of Public Works and Government Services]

Mr. Speaker, for the second time in three weeks the Government of Canada has settled with another church on sharing compensation to victims of abuse at Indian residential schools.

I am pleased to say that last month it was with the Anglicans, today it is with the Presbyterian Church in Canada. Now, rather than debating legal points, we can all focus on humane solutions for the 100% compensation to victims for validated claims.

I wish to commend the Presbyterians as I did the Anglicans for their courage and moral leadership on this file.

Tobacco Industry

[Svend Robinson, NDP, Burnaby—Douglas, BC]

Mr. Speaker, over a year ago the then minister of health promised to ban light and mild labels on cigarette packages. Since then big tobacco companies have threatened to sue the government under NAFTA's chapter 11 if the ban goes ahead.

I want to ask the Minister for International Trade, when will the government finally stand up for the health of Canadians, ban these deceptive labels, and get rid of NAFTA laws that allow big corporations to threaten to sue the Canadian government under chapter 11 for protecting the health and environment of Canadians? When will the government finally act?

[Jeannot Castonguay, Liberal, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Health]

Mr. Speaker, this is a very important question and I thank my hon. colleague for having raised it in the House. It is also a very complex question.

[Some hon. members]

Oh, oh.