Debates of Nov. 1st, 2006

Human Resources and Skills Development—Main Estimates 2006-07

[Gerald Keddy, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margaret's, NS]

Mr. Chair, my question is a direct one. Quite simply, could the hon. parliamentary secretary more fully elaborate on the targeted initiative for older workers?

[Lynne Yelich, Conservative, Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Human Resources and Social Development]

Mr. Chair, it is my pleasure to rise this evening to elaborate on the targeted initiative for older workers. This particular program is cost shared federally, provincially and territorially. It is an employment program created to provide a range of employment activities to older workers who live and work in vulnerable communities and who have lost their jobs.

The projects will include activities such as assessment counselling, skills upgrading and work experience for new jobs. It will target communities experiencing ongoing high unemployment and/or high reliance on a single employer or industry. The census metropolitan areas with populations greater than 250,000 are now eligible for the programming.

I would like to say that we already have an agreement with Quebec, and six more provinces and two territories are already interested in working with us.

It is essential, we have found, that we keep older workers active in the labour market. We need to find ways of working with our provincial partners to reintegrate older workers into the workforce as quickly as possible. Not only does this supply the labour market with much needed workers, but it allows older workers to continue their contributions to their communities and to share their wisdom with others.

I am not alone in saying this. In a recent job strategy and thematic review, the OECD strongly indicated that more focus should be given to strategies that retrain and integrate older workers into the labour market.

[Mike Lake, Conservative, Edmonton—Mill Woods—Beaumont, AB]

Mr. Chair, earlier tonight the member for Oakville implied that in order for our children to be “the best and the brightest”, they need to be cared for by a massive government child care system. I want to take issue with that statement on behalf of stay at home parents across Canada.

My wife Debi and I have two kids. Early on, we made a decision that she would stay home with the kids. At the time we made the decision I was making a little under $40,000 per year, so it was a sacrifice for us. My wife did an absolutely amazing job. In my mind, she works as hard as anybody who actually gets paid for full time employment.

My daughter Jenae is now seven years old. She is in grade two and, in my mind, is among the best and the brightest. I often tell her that when she grows up she will be able to do anything she wants to do.

My questions are the following. Did we make a mistake by choosing to raise our own kids? Should I lower my daughter's expectations? Can she perhaps not do anything she wants to do because she was raised by her own parents? In the government's mind, who is best able and responsible to decide and choose how to raise our own kids to be the best and the brightest?

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

Mr. Chair, the foundation of our whole universal child care plan is that parents are in the best position to make the best choices in the best interests of their children.

[France Bonsant, Bloc, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

Mr. Chair, just yesterday, the minister gave an uninspiring account of her department's plans and priorities to the Standing Committee on Human Resources, Social Development and the Status of Persons with Disabilities. Today she is giving us more of the same.

Yesterday, at least, the minister spoke of allocations for child care, old age security, affordable housing, training, the fight against homelessness and older workers. However, I have a string of regrettable examples from this department. I only have to think of the cuts announced on September 25, cuts in the order of $55 million to investment in youth.

Can the minister explain how she intends to provide skilled labour when she is cutting programs that allow thousands of youths to have an interesting first job experience leading to a future career?

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

Mr. Chair, we are ensuring that funds are available to help those students who need help to find summer jobs. We believe it is important that they get the work experience that helps them in the future and also that they have opportunities to earn the money to help them pay for their education.

We are going to be focusing our efforts and our dollars on areas where students need help to overcome barriers to finding summer employment. We do not believe we should be helping employers who would hire students anyway.

[France Bonsant, Bloc, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

Mr. Chair, the minister rejected out of hand the 14 recommendations of the committee on the summer career placement program. Can she tell us why she rejected outright these 14 recommendations even though members of her own party supported them?

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

In fact, Mr. Chair, we are focusing on the students. We are going to be making changes to the program. I am pleased to announce that we will be issuing a call for proposals for this program in January 2007.

[France Bonsant, Bloc, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

Mr. Chair, I am very happy.

The government announced that it was cutting funding for unnecessary and inefficient programs. From what the ministers said, the government was trimming the fat. If the government had consulted a bit before making the cuts, it would have understood that the programs it gutted have a positive impact on organizations in Quebec including tourist centres, non-profit organizations and many others.

In light of this, can the minister tell us why she decided to slash nearly $18 million from adult learning, literacy and essential skills development programs? Does she feel that literacy is no longer necessary to acquire the skills needed to enter or re-enter the labour market?

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

Mr. Chair, we decided to stop funding programs that were not delivering results to Canadians. We are no longer going to fund programs to the tune of $350,000 a year so they can answer 300 phone calls at $1,000 a call and one call per day. That is not efficient. That is not effective. That is not teaching anyone how to read or write. We are going to focus on programs that will help people learn to read and write.

[France Bonsant, Bloc, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I received an open letter to the Prime Minister from 24 organizations that were never consulted on literacy. The minister may not be able to produce a list of the people she contacted, but I can provide her with a list of the people she did not contact.

The Minister of Human Resources and Social Development has specific objectives, but with the cuts announced over a month ago, it will not be possible to achieve all those objectives. I want to come back to the department's priorities, because with the cuts made on September 25, it will be impossible to improve Canadians' quality of life, build a highly skilled workforce, eliminate barriers to work and learning and ensure that programs in place produce the desired results. On the contrary, the government's plans are nothing less than impediments to the most vulnerable in our society, who are trying to get ahead.

The $13 billion surplus, $2 billion of it from the employment insurance surplus, does not seem to have been enough for the current government, because it has cut another $1 billion from programs that benefit the poor and the most vulnerable in our society.

How can the minister explain that she is cutting funding for employability programs, when $2 billion from the employment insurance fund is already being used for a purpose other than the one it is intended for?

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

Mr. Chair, as the member is undoubtedly aware, the surplus or deficit in the EI account does not correspond directly, yet, to EI programming. That is the target. We are trying to achieve break even with the new rate setting mechanism where the rates that are charged match the benefits that are paid out. That is the sensible way to do it. In the meantime, we are working on other program.

However, we are investing in our EI programs. We have announced several new programs recently such as the compassionate care benefit, extension of the definition, the five weeks program and related to that, $70 million for the older workers program. We are trying to make these programs innovative, ensuring that they meet the needs of Canadians.

[France Bonsant, Bloc, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

Mr. Chair, in order to help people, one of two things is needed: either the sovereignty of Quebec or the correction of the fiscal imbalance. As you know, I wish for the first with all my heart, but in the meantime, the Bloc Québécois will fight to correct the fiscal imbalance.

Despite the government's lofty promises, the federal withdrawal from the field of human resources is only adding further to this imbalance. As far as the Bloc is concerned, skills training is a matter of Quebec jurisdiction.

Rather than cutting funds related to skills training, why were they not simply transferred to the provincial governments?

Does the minister understand that, with the most recent cuts, her government is only adding to the fiscal imbalance?

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

Mr. Chair, when the hon. member does her arithmetic, I ask her to add in the $100 a month for each child under the age of six being delivered into Quebec. This is money is going directly into the hands of parents and directly into the economy. If people need to spend it on a specific program, they have that freedom, they have that flexibility because it is their choice to help with the education of their children.

When it comes to the other programs, we are investing significant dollars and we are investing them wisely in literacy programs so people in Quebec and other Canadians can become employable.

[France Bonsant, Bloc, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

Mr. Chair, I will ask one last question, then turn it over to my colleague.

Has the government completed the feasibility study on the income support program for older workers, which was included in the budget?

When does it intend to make it public?

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

Mr. Chair, no, we have not yet completed it. We believe it is essential that we take the time to really understand the depth of the issues and we look at the wide range of alternatives available to us.

In the meantime, however, we have brought in the targeted initiative for older workers so we can know that these workers were getting some assistance right now without waiting for the longer term. We do not want to keep them waiting. That is why we brought in this program, to give them the help they need now.

I encourage the hon. member to encourage her provincial government to sign on to this agreement so we can get the projects started to help these individuals.

[Yves Lessard, Bloc, Chambly—Borduas, QC]

Mr. Chair, two days ago, the chief actuary of the Canada employment insurance commission submitted his annual report. Under the regulations, the minister must, by October 15 of each year, give the chief actuary the plans for employment insurance changes.

However, we have learned from the chief actuary that the minister did not submit any plans. Therefore, he concludes that the minister has no plans for the coming year.

How can the minister justify the decision not to make any changes to the employment insurance program when we are hearing from all sides that the program no longer meets current requirements?

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

Mr. Chair, I believe what the chief actuary said was that the minister provided no additional information beyond what was already announced. I think that was the clarification, if we were to check the record.

The new numbers in the report of the EI commission are due to be released later this month.

[Yves Lessard, Bloc, Chambly—Borduas, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I would ask the minister to reread the text. In it, the actuary said that the minister had not requested any modifications for the coming year. The actuary therefore concludes that no changes will be requested for the coming year.

Having clarified that, my second question is about income support for older workers. All evening, the governing party has talked about reintegrating older workers, as though that were a possibility for all older workers.

The Bloc agrees that there should be reintegration programs, but we must also recognize that some people cannot be reintegrated for a number of reasons. Retraining can be a problem because of age, work experience and lack of jobs in the regions.

The Conservatives have a magic formula. They say that if there is no work in one region, all we have to do is send those workers, including older workers, to Alberta. This implies that older workers are the solution to the labour shortage in western Canada. They are refusing to acknowledge what is really happening in the regions where older workers do not have work or cannot get back into the labour market.

Will the minister introduce an income support program for older workers as Quebec is now doing for older workers in the softwood lumber sector?

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

Mr. Chair, we have already done that. In our targeted initiative for older workers there is income support while these displaced older workers learn, get new skills, develop job hunting skills and even gain work experience.

However, the targeted initiative for older workers was designed to be flexible so that it could work with any wide range of economic development initiatives that the hon. Minister of Labour, as the regional minister, might be developing in conjunction with groups, provinces, communities or other partners right across the province of Quebec. We want these things to work together, not in silos. All these programs need to be flexible enough to meet the overall needs, with everyone playing the role that they need to play, whether federal, provincial or local.

[Yves Lessard, Bloc, Chambly—Borduas, QC]

Mr. Chair, I think the minister, in her response, has just confirmed what I am saying. She has just one solution to reintegrate older workers into the labour market.

With respect to older workers who can no longer return to the labour market, who have no income after their employment insurance benefits run out and whose only future is to become welfare recipients, Quebec and the provinces will have to take care of them. As a result, this will accentuate the fiscal imbalance and will shift responsibility to the provinces and Quebec for which the federal government is withdrawing money from the EI fund.

What will she do for workers who no longer have a future at work, who are older and who need income support to bridge the gap between losing their job and receiving their pension?

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

Mr. Chair, we will be taking full advantage of the wide range of programming that we have available to help people in those circumstances to acquire new skills, get retrained, get new jobs or create jobs by becoming entrepreneurs. We have programs within our EI that help people go into business for themselves.

We cannot rule out this talent because the country needs it. We just need to ensure we give them the tools they need to succeed and to meet this demand.

[The Chair, NDP, Bill Blaikie]

I am sorry to interrupt the hon. member, but the 15 minutes are up.

The hon. member for Don Valley East.

[Yasmin Ratansi, Liberal, Don Valley East, ON]

Mr. Chair, I will be sharing my time with the member for Yukon and the member for Labrador.

The minister in her remarks claimed that the new Conservative government was investing in the vulnerable. I would like to ask her how the vulnerable are being helped by eliminating 14,000 child care spaces in Ontario. As well, these vulnerable are the working poor and new immigrants where both parents must work.

How will the net amount of $60 help the vulnerable when it does not even pay for one day of child care?

[Diane Finley, Conservative, Haldimand—Norfolk, ON]

Mr. Chair, the existing spaces were created by the Ontario provincial government, not by the previous Liberal government, and it is up to the provincial government to be responsible for these spaces.

Our new child care initiative is designed to create the spaces. That is why we are working with so many groups to make that happen.