House of Commons Hansard #136 of the 39th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was troops.

Topics

Employment Insurance ActPrivate Members' Business

5:15 p.m.

Conservative

The Acting Speaker Conservative Royal Galipeau

Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?

Employment Insurance ActPrivate Members' Business

5:15 p.m.

Some hon. members

Agreed.

No.

Employment Insurance ActPrivate Members' Business

5:15 p.m.

Conservative

The Acting Speaker Conservative Royal Galipeau

All those in favour of the motion will please say yea.

Employment Insurance ActPrivate Members' Business

5:15 p.m.

Some hon. members

Yea.

Employment Insurance ActPrivate Members' Business

5:15 p.m.

Conservative

The Acting Speaker Conservative Royal Galipeau

All those opposed will please say nay.

Employment Insurance ActPrivate Members' Business

5:15 p.m.

Some hon. members

Nay.

Employment Insurance ActPrivate Members' Business

5:15 p.m.

Conservative

The Acting Speaker Conservative Royal Galipeau

In my opinion the nays have it.

And five or more members having risen:

Pursuant to Standing Order 98, the recorded division stands deferred until Wednesday, April 25, 2007, immediately before the time provided for private members' business.

Employment Insurance ActPrivate Members' Business

5:15 p.m.

Liberal

Karen Redman Liberal Kitchener Centre, ON

Mr. Speaker, I rise on a point of order.

I recognize the fact that everybody is in the spirit of cooperation. We agreed to see the clock as 5:30 p.m. I am wondering with the indulgence of the House and the Chair if we could suspend the sitting for perhaps 10 minutes because we do have members who are en route to the House for the late show. They were doing television shows and other things and were unable to come to the House.

I would seek unanimous consent to suspend for 10 minutes.

Employment Insurance ActPrivate Members' Business

5:15 p.m.

Conservative

The Acting Speaker Conservative Royal Galipeau

I am not experienced in suspending the House for the adjournment, but I suppose if we could get the unanimous consent of the House, the House can be the master of its own destiny.

Is there unanimous consent?

Employment Insurance ActPrivate Members' Business

5:15 p.m.

Some hon. members

Agreed.

Employment Insurance ActPrivate Members' Business

5:15 p.m.

Conservative

The Acting Speaker Conservative Royal Galipeau

(The sitting of the House was suspended at 5:19 p.m.)

(The House resumed at 5:30 p.m.)

A motion to adjourn the House under Standing Order 38 deemed to have been moved.

5:30 p.m.

Liberal

Marlene Jennings Liberal Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC

Mr. Speaker, a few weeks ago, I asked a question in the House, directed to the Minister of National Defence. I will repeat it:

--in January the Military Police Complaints Commission received a complaint about allegations of abuses suffered by Afghan detainees captured in April 2006 by members of the Canadian Forces. As part of a regular National Defence policy, the minister [of national defence] was informed about the fate of these detainees in a confidential report. Why did the minister wait for months before investigating these reports?

The minister had the gall to say:

--all these various issues are under investigation. When the results come out, we will all learn the truth.

In my supplementary, I made it very clear that I did not ask “how many investigations there were”. I asked the minister “why it took him so long to start the investigations” when it was clear, under his department's policies, that he was informed that Canadian Forces had taken Afghan individuals, detained them, and had handed them over.

The Chief of the Defence Staff submits reports directly to the minister about the transfer of Afghan detainees and about the health of these detainees. However, it took a complaint from an Ottawa professor to the Military Police Complaints Commission about the allegations of abuses allegedly suffered by Afghan detainees captured in 2006 to force an investigation.

My question, again, is why, having been briefed about the transfer of Afghan detainees and about the health of those detainees, did it take the minister so long before an investigation was launched? Why did it take a complaint from an Ottawa professor to the Military Police Complaints Commission before an investigation was launched? We all know that at one point DND attempted to block that investigation. There is a letter to that effect.

I cannot believe that the Conservative government, which prides itself on its so-called transparency and accountability, would not immediately institute an investigation as soon as the minister had received the report about the transfer of the Afghan detainees and about their health. That is the first thing. That is lesson A. That is A, B, C.

The second thing is that we already know that the minister has had to apologize to this House for misleading it. He had to stand in this House for misleading the House. It is shameful behaviour for a minister to mislead the House. Thankfully, he had sufficient honour to acknowledge that he misled the House and to apologize for it and correct the record.

I would now ask that the minister correct the record on this issue with regard to his frivolous answer, his non-answer, about why he took so long to have an investigation launched into the alleged abuses. I did not say abuses; I said alleged abuses of the Afghan detainees.

5:30 p.m.

Oxford Ontario

Conservative

Dave MacKenzie ConservativeParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Public Safety

Mr. Speaker, Canada is in Afghanistan to assist the democratically elected government. This includes helping it improve its justice and security system as well as its detention system.

In keeping with this, the Government of Canada supports the principle that the Afghan authority should be responsible for handling detainees captured in its sovereign territory. Canada's policy to transfer detainees captured in Afghanistan to Afghan authorities is consistent with this principle.

It is Canadian policy to treat all detainees in accordance with the standards set out in the third Geneva convention, regardless of their status.

The protection of human rights is a central value to all Canadians and our government's commitment is to ensure it is upheld no matter where our forces serve.

In December 2005 Canada and the government of Afghanistan signed an arrangement which sets out general policy on the treatment and transfer of detainees, as well as notification procedures.

Specifically, the arrangement provides that the Afghan authorities will accept detainees who have been detained by the Canadian Forces and will be responsible for maintaining and safeguarding them.

Canada and Afghanistan will treat detainees in accordance with the standards set out in the third Geneva convention which provides for humane treatment as well as protection against violence, intimidation, reprisals and other unlawful acts.

Afghanistan and Canada will notify the International Committee of the Red Cross through appropriate national channels upon transferring a detainee.

The International Committee of the Red Cross has the right to visit detainees at any time while they are in the custody of the Canadian Forces or Afghanistan.

Once detainees are transferred to them, the Afghan authorities are responsible for maintaining and safeguarding detainees transferred to them and for ensuring the detainees are provided the protections of the humane treatment standards set out in the third Geneva convention. We fully expect the government of Afghanistan to live up to these expectations.

After being made aware of the allegations of abuse, the Canadian Forces launched a criminal investigation and a board of inquiry. Since then, two other investigations by the Military Police Complaints Commission have been opened. Therefore, there are three investigations and one inquiry into the treatment of detainees in Afghanistan ongoing at this time.

Of the three investigations, one is an independent police investigation being conducted by the National Investigation Service, and two investigations are being conducted by the Military Police Complaints Commission, an independent oversight body. There is also an internal Canadian Forces board of inquiry. In addition, the matter is before the federal court.

The investigations and the inquiry are progressing. The Department of National Defence and Canadian Forces are fully cooperating with those conducting these investigations.

Consistent with Canadian law, the results of these investigations and the inquiry will be made public when they are complete.

In addition to the December 2005 arrangement, which recognizes the legitimate role of the Afghan Independent Human Rights Commission, in February 2007 this government formalized the relationship between Canada and the commission with regard to the transfer and monitoring of detainees.

Under this latter arrangement with the commission, the Canadian Forces notify the commission of any detainee transfers, and the commission undertakes to provide immediate notice to Canada should it learn that a transferred detainee has been mistreated.

5:35 p.m.

Liberal

Marlene Jennings Liberal Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC

Mr. Speaker, I am simply astonished. In March 2007 the head of the Afghan Independent Human Rights Commission, the organization with which the Canadian Armed Forces signed a deal so that it would do the tracking of Afghan detainees that are handed over to the Afghan authorities and detained, said that it would do the actual surveillance and monitoring to ensure that detainees are not being tortured and they are not being abused.

That head, Abdul Quadar Noorzai, told reporters that his commission is not in a position to do a whole lot since it has next to no staff, one of the provinces in Afghanistan is too dangerous to enter, and that his people have been denied access to prisons. So how can the Minister of National Defence stand in this House, as he has done repeatedly, to say that the Afghan detainees, people who were captured by our armed forces and then handed over to--

5:35 p.m.

Conservative

The Acting Speaker Conservative Royal Galipeau

The hon. parliamentary secretary.

5:35 p.m.

Conservative

Dave MacKenzie Conservative Oxford, ON

Mr. Speaker, Canada can do more to foster the sustainable development of democratic institutions by helping Afghans to improve their own prison system, rather than by operating detention facilities.

Like our NATO allies, we believe that the best approach is to recognize the responsibility of the Afghan authorities regarding the treatment of detainees and to help them build that capacity in that regard.

That is why Canada is contributing to efforts to strengthen the rule of law in Afghanistan, including the support for comprehensive justice and security sector reform.

Canada has fielded corrections and police advisors to the UN assistance mission in Afghanistan since 2003 and we have engaged in a number of initiatives to support the judicial sector.

The Minister of Public Safety recently announced the deployment of 12 Canadian civilian police officers to help train and assist the Afghanistan national police. The recent deployment of these officers now brings the total number of Canadian civilian and military police in Afghanistan to 36.

5:40 p.m.

Liberal

Jean-Claude D'Amours Liberal Madawaska—Restigouche, NB

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to take part in this adjournment debate and to express my concerns regarding the lack of funding provided by the Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency for the SEED capital program.

This programs serves to help Atlantic Canadians acquire the business skills and capital they need to start, modernize and expand their businesses.

Entrepreneurs are vital engines of growth in the Atlantic area. In addition to creating job opportunities in all sectors, local entrepreneurs further stimulate the economic performance of all Atlantic regions. However, we know that the ACOA continues to cut funding to these programs.

Operating one's own business certainly has its rewards, but also has its challenges. For a business to reach its full potential, a certain number of elements must be mastered, including planning, finances and marketing.

Entrepreneurs in rural areas in the Atlantic region face the considerable challenge of funding.

Through ACOA programs, these people can get the funding they need for successful start-up. Many of them depend on ACOA's SEED capital program, which provides loans to start or improve a small business, as well as acquire business skills training.

In 2005-06, the SEED capital program was a real success. It provided $6.3 million in loans— not grants, but repayable loans, and more than 469 of them—to New Brunswick entrepreneurs. Thanks to these loans and this funding, more than 663 jobs were created or maintained in New Brunswick. That is 663 jobs created or maintained in only one year.

However, ACOA recently reduced funding for this program and will only provide $1.5 million in loans for 2006-07. This amount represents less than 25% of the total loans for the preceding year under this same program.

Since this government was elected, several projects have been refused or delayed simply because of funding.

For the second year in a row, the Conservatives did not even mention ACOA in their budget.

The previous Liberal government had invested hundreds of millions of dollars in the Atlantic region through ACOA programs. In the 2005 budget, my Liberal government devoted a complete section to the Atlantic region.

In 2005, the Liberals increased funding for regional economic development organizations such as ACOA by $800 million.

I am asking the government to ensure that communities in Atlantic Canada will not be penalized owing to a lack of leadership by this government.

We know that small and medium-sized businesses are the lifeblood of Atlantic Canada. I am asking ACOA to take action in order to help Atlantic communities and business people whose development relies on funding programs.

Why did the minister abandon entrepreneurs and job creation in New Brunswick?

Will the minister continue to do so or will he restore the funding required for the seed capital program to continue providing assistance?

Entrepreneurs are not asking for charity. Entrepreneurs in Atlantic Canada and New Brunswick are demanding their fair share. They are not asking for grants. They are simply asking for loans to develop their businesses. But this government, this Conservative government, has completely destroyed this program.

This is a disastrous situation and we need to restore the program. I hope the government will listen to the Liberals.

5:40 p.m.

Fundy Royal New Brunswick

Conservative

Rob Moore ConservativeParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada

Mr. Speaker, I thank the hon. member for Madawaska—Restigouche for raising this issue and allowing me the opportunity to respond on behalf of the Government of Canada.

It will no doubt interest the member that the Government of Canada, through ACOA, continues to focus on helping New Brunswickers succeed in business and in fact none of ACOA's programs have been cut.

Our government has recently approved $2.7 million in additional funding for the seed capital program in New Brunswick. As a result, this important initiative will continue to be delivered by community business development corporations and community economic development agencies across the province including, the hon. member will be interested to know, the CBDC Madawaska and CBDC Victoria-Madawaska-South.

It might also interest the hon. member to know that funding under the seed capital is renewable. As funds are repaid, they return to the program allowing the community business development corporations and community economic development agencies to reinvest them in new and expanding businesses in their respective communities.

Coupled with the $2.7 million in additional funding recently approved by our government, the seed capital program portfolio in New Brunswick today totals more than $14 million. What we are talking about here is clearly not a cut in seed capital funding, but rather sound financial management.

Canada's new government is committed to accountability, and to getting things done for New Brunswickers and for all Canadians. We recognize clearly that small businesses have a major impact on our economy. In fact, small business has been responsible for 20% of all job gains in New Brunswick.

Our government understands that for these businesses to not only survive, but to thrive, they need an environment that encourages investment and innovation. Our government is committed to the creation of such an environment that will benefit generations of New Brunswickers to come.

Just last month the Minister of Finance tabled our government's second budget. The budget is focused on creating a stronger, safer and better Canada. Budget 2007 takes concrete action to improve our quality of life and ensure a strong, vibrant economy in New Brunswick and across Canada.

Budget 2007 focuses on creating five key advantages which include: a fiscal advantage, by eliminating Canada's total government net debt in less than a generation; an infrastructure advantage, by building the modern infrastructure we need, and I am sure the hon. member supports that for New Brunswick; a knowledge advantage, by creating the best educated and most skilled workforce in the world; a tax advantage, by reducing taxes for all Canadians and establishing the lowest tax rate on new business investment in the G-7; and as the hon. member alluded to, an entrepreneurial advantage, by reducing unnecessary regulation and red tape, and increasing competition across the country.

This budget continues our work to restore the confidence of taxpayers by ensuring responsible financial management and most important of all, by keeping the economy strong.

5:45 p.m.

Liberal

Jean-Claude D'Amours Liberal Madawaska—Restigouche, NB

Mr. Speaker, it is clear that the Conservative government does not understand the situation at all. The parliamentary secretary says that there was an announcement that $2.7 million may be allocated over the coming year. However, he forgot to mention that during the Liberal government's last year—2005-06—nearly $6.4 million was lent through the seed capital program. Now they are talking about $2.7 million.

It is unacceptable for the government to provide so little money to Atlantic Canada entrepreneurs, to entrepreneurs in New Brunswick. They are not asking for handouts; they are asking for fair treatment. Cutting the program from $6.4 million to $2.7 million will certainly not help entrepreneurs in New Brunswick.

This is unacceptable for entrepreneurs and it is unacceptable for workers. This is about creating jobs and work for our people, but this government has completely failed to understand that.

5:45 p.m.

Conservative

Rob Moore Conservative Fundy Royal, NB

Mr. Speaker, it may not make the hon. member happy, but this new government is actually delivering for New Brunswickers in ways the old Liberal government never did and never would.

Canada's new government, through ACOA, and the member should listen carefully to this figure, has approved investments across New Brunswick of more than $105 million. These investments have leveraged more than $116 million in additional public and private sector funding, strengthening economic infrastructure and quality of life in communities across New Brunswick, including communities in his own riding of Madawaska—Restigouche and my riding of Fundy—Royal.

As a New Brunswicker, I am certainly proud of the record of this new government for restoring confidence in our communities and supporting innovation and investment in New Brunswick as well as all of Canada.

5:45 p.m.

Conservative

The Acting Speaker Conservative Royal Galipeau

A motion to adjourn the House is now deemed to have been adopted. Accordingly this House stands adjourned until tomorrow at 10 a.m., pursuant to Standing Order 24(1).

(The House adjourned at 5:49 p.m.)