House of Commons Hansard #55 of the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was farm.

Topics

Fisheries and OceansCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:35 p.m.

Conservative

Cathy McLeod Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC

Mr. Speaker, I stood today to talk in support of the seal hunt but I am actually from the interior of British Columbia where we certainly do not have oceans.

However, in response to my colleague's question, it becomes important as parliamentarians to look at all of Canada and do what is right.

I will go back to the seal hunt. I was at an event this weekend where we had students from across Canada preparing proposals on the significance of the seal hunt and what our culture and heritage mean in terms of moving forward as Canadians.

Fisheries and OceansCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:35 p.m.

Conservative

John Weston Conservative West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC

Mr. Speaker, I am particularly intrigued by the member as she and I come from the same province and, as she has just identified, there are no seals in her riding. What has caused her to enter into this debate and cover the issues in such grand style?

Fisheries and OceansCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:35 p.m.

Conservative

Cathy McLeod Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC

Mr. Speaker, I am not close to the sea. I grew up in an urban centre and moved as a young adult to rural remote British Columbia. What is very obvious to me is that what is normal in an urban environment is not the way of life for our rural communities.

Let me take the fur trade. Next door to me lived an 85-year-old gentleman who still did his trap lines. We had hunters who protected their game. Rural communities have a way of life that urban people often do not understand.

In the same sense that I hope all members of Parliament will eventually look at the long gun registry in terms of their respect for all Canadians and that very important rural way of life, this was important to me in terms of something that was important for our friends from Newfoundland and Labrador and Nunavut.

Fisheries and OceansCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:35 p.m.

Liberal

Todd Russell Liberal Labrador, NL

Mr. Speaker, I would just say that the horse is out of the barn, although it is not a good analogy for seals. In Labrador we would probably say that the seals have taken to the water. When they take to the water, they are much more difficult to hunt and harvest.

The ban is there. What does the hon. member suggest we do now? What action should the government take now in terms of fighting this ban and helping our sealers?

Fisheries and OceansCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:35 p.m.

Conservative

Cathy McLeod Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC

Mr. Speaker, it is always very fortunate to be preceded by the minister. I thought he talked very eloquently and clearly in terms of our government's next step. I really appreciate his earlier comments regarding where our government is going.

Fisheries and OceansCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:40 p.m.

Liberal

Siobhan Coady Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL

Mr. Speaker, I am certainly honoured to stand this evening to speak to this very important issue.

I want to thank my colleague from Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo for adding to the discussion and bringing a different perspective, from the interior of British Columbia, on behalf of the sealers of Newfoundland and Labrador, and Quebec and other sealers across the country. I thank her for her encouragement and support and for her continued deliberation on this very important issue.

Mr. Speaker, I will be sharing my time with the hon. member for Labrador.

Tonight I would like to talk a bit about the 250-year-long tradition of Newfoundlanders and Labradorians utilizing the seal hunt to sustain their families. Coming from a very cold and harsh winter, they take to the ice floes in the late winter and early spring, to sustain their families, to catch seals for money, food and clothing after a very tough winter. They use the money to sustain their families for food. They use the money to repair their boats and nets to get ready for the summer fishery.

Today I am standing to discuss the seal hunt that has been severely challenged by this ban on seal products by the European Union. We took part in a debate in this very chamber last week on the seal hunt. We talked about how misinformation has been brought to the European Union, brought to the world, if I may say so, on behalf of the anti-seal hunt protesters. It is misinformation on the humaneness and conservation issues around this very hunt.

I know a lot of sealers. I know a lot of families who have sealed. There are 6,000 sealers in Newfoundland and Labrador alone, who raise between 25% and 35% of their annual income from this very fishery.

We have heard from the government. We know that there are approximately seven million seals around the shores of Newfoundland and Labrador. Certainly this is not a conservation issue. Certainly this is not a concern that there are too few seals. In fact, there are too many seals. We now know that about 700,000 tonnes of fish a year are consumed by these seals. An unbelievable amount of fish is being taken from the waters off the coast of Newfoundland and Labrador by this overabundance of seals.

We know it is not a humane issue. We have heard from the World Wildlife Fund. We have heard from an international array of veterinarians that they are not concerned in any way, shape or form about the way the seal hunt is executed. They know it is done humanely. Therefore, those two issues can be put aside.

This is a humane hunt. There are no conservation concerns, so what is the concern here? It seems that there is a lot of marketing and a lot of hype. We have heard the minister talk about the pictures of the beautiful baby seals. Perhaps because we have a challenge with cod, we need to make cod prettier to ensure we get the attention that is needed to rebuild those stocks.

We have a serious problem of foreign overfishing off the nose and tail of the Grand Banks of Newfoundland and Labrador. Fish such as turbot and American plaice, which my hon. colleague mentioned earlier, are in serious jeopardy. Certainly the seals are in jeopardy, but there are a lot of fish stocks that are in serious trouble.

The seal hunt is valued at up to $60 million annually. In 2006, about $30 million was contributed to the income of the sealers. That is a tremendous amount of money.

We have talked again and again about the trade issues with Europe. We have to stress with our government, with the Minister of International Trade and with the Prime Minister how important it is that in talks on trade with the European Union they reiterate that the seal hunt is humane, that it is not an issue of conservation. Stocks are plentiful; they are almost overabundant.

It is a shame we keep talking about the fact that we may have to have a cull and the European Union is completely okay with having a cull of the seals.

We have heard that when the Newfoundland and Labrador sealers go to the hunt, they are utilizing the entire animal. They utilize the fur. The seal protein is exceptionally good. They utilize the oils of the seal for lifesaving nutraceutical products. Now we are even hearing that there are uses of the animal for other potential medical opportunities.

However, we have to move the debate. We have to start the action that is required. The Pateys, the Heddersons, the Doyles and the Murphys, who take to the ice pans in March of every year, are looking to this House today. They are looking at their parliamentarians and they are asking how we are going to help them and whether we are going to do anything in this regard. That is why I am pleading with the Prime Minister and with the minister to make sure that when they are talking trade with the European Union that this is first and foremost on their minds.

We also have to continue to pursue every avenue possible under the World Trade Organization. This is an illegal ban. This is counter to the World Trade Organization. We should continue to pursue that, and I look forward to our doing so.

The sealers of Newfoundland and Labrador, the sealers of Quebec and the sealers of the Magdalen Islands are watching this debate. They are listening, and they are asking for our support, our help.

We also have to aggressively deal with the misinformation and promote new potential markets for the seal hunt. The fur and the leather of the seal are of utmost quality. We should be promoting those products, and again, promoting nutraceuticals. Here is an opportunity for science and technology to utilize the products of the seal for the goodness of mankind.

We also need to support the sealers. This is their time of need. They need to sustain their income. They need to turn to government. There has to be some assistance for the sealers who have lost income.

They are getting ready to do different types of fishing around the coasts of Newfoundland and Labrador. The crab fishery has already started. Some are about to go out for the shrimp, when the ice goes. But they have lost income. They have lost the income of the seal hunt. We have to assist them. We have to implore government to offer some assistance. While we are exploring new products, more opportunities and new markets, we have to assist the sealers.

We also have to make sure we are getting out there globally, that we are telling people that Canada has a very humane seal hunt, that we have an overabundance of seals and that there is no concern on the sustainability of the hunt.

I rise to say that the efforts of the Standing Committee on Fisheries and Oceans are very important, to thank the members for the opportunity to again rise in this House in support of the seal hunt and to implore government to continue the actions that are needed to make this hunt successful.

Fisheries and OceansCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:45 p.m.

Pitt Meadows—Maple Ridge—Mission B.C.

Conservative

Randy Kamp ConservativeParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Fisheries and Oceans

Mr. Speaker, I can see that my colleague opposite is well versed on this issue and that she feels strongly about it. She obviously knows sealing families; in fact, she might be related to some, but she certainly knows others.

Based on that personal experience, I wonder how she would respond to those who say, “the seal hunt is appalling and has become more trouble than it is worth”. That is an actual quote from a Liberal strategist's blog. I am not meaning to be partisan here, because I think there are many Canadians who might be thinking in those terms.

Having known these sealers, how would the hon. member respond to that?

Fisheries and OceansCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:45 p.m.

Liberal

Siobhan Coady Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL

Mr. Speaker, I certainly appreciate the question, because there are detractors. There are people who are misinformed about the seal hunt. As many colleagues around this chamber have said, any time an animal is killed in an open abattoir, when there is blood on the ice, and when there are scenes shown on television of baby seals being killed, it is difficult for people to understand that it is done humanely.

However, that is part of what we need to do in this country. We have to make sure people understand that it is a humane hunt.

Yes, I do know many, many sealers. I know many families of sealers. This is not done, in any way, in malice. This is done very humanely. They have a deep care and concern for the ecology of the oceans, for the safety of their families and for the animals as well.

I think it is important that this House, as well as all of us, as Canadians, tell people that the hunt is humane.

Fisheries and OceansCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:50 p.m.

Liberal

Judy Foote Liberal Random—Burin—St. George's, NL

Mr. Speaker, first let me congratulate my colleague on an incredible presentation today in this House on behalf of those we know in Newfoundland and Labrador who seal as a way of making a living. She has made some very valid points.

I am so pleased she was able to make the presentation today. We are all feeling the pain of those who are trying to make a living from the sealing industry but find themselves in a very difficult situation as a result of the ban on seal products by the European Union.

I would like to ask her about one point she made. She made the valid point that while the Prime Minister is in negotiations with the EU with respect to trade between our countries it is important that the Prime Minister make the point that this is a wrong decision by the parliamentarians in the EU.

When the Prime Minister is on record as saying he will not contaminate the negotiations with the EU by bringing up the seal industry as a prerequisite for not moving forward, how should we deal with that? How do we get the Prime Minister to acknowledge that it should be something he raises as a very important point before proceeding with the trade negotiations with the EU?

Fisheries and OceansCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:50 p.m.

Liberal

Siobhan Coady Liberal St. John's South—Mount Pearl, NL

Mr. Speaker, my hon. colleague raises an issue that is very well known. The Prime Minister has been in Prague, and he has had discussions on setting up the framework and parameters around the EU talks. We heard earlier from the Minister of International Trade that it has been raised with the EU.

I think we have to go further. How can we have an open discussion with the European Union on open and fair trade when they are moving counter to what the WTO has done? This is an illegal ban.

We have to implore the Prime Minister and the Minister of International Trade to intervene now to tell them it is not acceptable to move in this direction of protectionism for these animals without knowing the full impact they are having in the European Union.

We have to implore the Prime Minister to make this a most serious issue with regard to the talks with the European Union. I think it is incredibly essential that they make this their number one priority. I think it is essential for the sealers of Newfoundland and Labrador, indeed all hunters in this province, and all of us in this country, that he take this important step.

Fisheries and OceansCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:50 p.m.

Liberal

Todd Russell Liberal Labrador, NL

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the words and the actions of my colleague, the member for St. John's South—Mount Pearl and thank her as well for sharing her time on this very important issue.

I come from a little island community called Williams Harbour. It is a sealing community like so many along the coast of Labrador and around the coast of the island of Newfoundland, and on the north shore of Quebec.

I come from a sealing family who has participated in the hunt for generations like so many other families within our province. The hunt is a part of our livelihood, yes, and just as important, a part of our tradition. There is something about the seal hunt, like so many other practices or traditions in our country, that makes us what we are. It is a part of our identity and without it we do not feel the same. We do not feel as complete.

I can speak in that way as a Labradorian, as a person from the province of Newfoundland and Labrador. I can speak in that respect as a northerner who lives in the northern part of our country. I can speak in that respect as an aboriginal person whose traditions go back hundreds and indeed thousands of years.

When it comes to the seal hunt itself, and we look at this particular ban, we can say categorically that the members of the European Union were duped, that they have bought into a lie, and that they have bought into a campaign of misinformation. That is a dangerous precedent if a sham can somehow become law, that affects our livelihoods and affects our way of life.

When we look at some of the particulars in the ban itself, like the exemption for Inuit, that is a farce. It was just a face-saving measure on the part of the European parliamentarians. They talk about it in the global context that somehow this comes out of the UN Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples. It is a fallacy. That particular exemption has been condemned by Inuit leaders and aboriginal leaders throughout the country. It means absolutely nothing. This ban is still an attack on a way of life, on our traditions, our practices and our culture.

The ban also talks about allowing certain countries to carry out a cull on the basis of ecological integrity or trying to maintain some balance in the ecosystem.

I do not know of another country that has a seal population of approximately seven million animals. I will repeat what was said before by a former premier of the province of Newfoundland and Labrador. He said, “They're in the water. They're not eating turnips. They are eating fish. They're eating caplin. They're eating cod. They're eating salmon. All of these species, the salmon, the caplin and the cod face challenges in terms of sustainability”.

So, it is ironic and hypocritical that we have the European Union countries saying we can cull the animals for ecological integrity in certain countries, but we cannot have a sustainable, humane hunt that also carries, as a part of its integrity, the ecology, the balance that we require in our own ecological systems. They are hypocritical in terms of what they have put in this particular ban and they are also playing into a false argument and using an exemption that means nothing when it comes to the Inuit.

I will use myself as an example. I am a quarter blood Inuk, but I would not necessarily be able to participate in the hunt under this particular ban even though I have participated in the seal hunt the last two to three years and I hold a commercial sealing licence. We also harvest seals for food and for crafts or household use. We have that balance within our own culture already.

I appreciate the fact that all parties in this chamber are on the same page, that we are all trying to work through this issue. I appreciate the fact that there is some unanimity among all colleagues in the House, but we have to ask some questions.

We have to ask questions about the government's strategy, or if it even has a strategy to protect the seal hunt. We have to ask what type of tactics were used in terms of the Conservative government's approach. We have to ask what type of action was taken, or was there a lack of action. I ask these questions in all seriousness.

Was the Conservative government's approach co-ordinated? Did it involve the provinces and the territories in a meaningful way? Did the government involve aboriginal groups? Did it involve organizations like the Canadian Sealers Association or the Fur Institute of Canada? How co-ordinated was the response? What elements made up the so-called campaign? Was there publicity?

I have not seen any pro-sealing ads from our government to be quite honest. Maybe the parliamentary secretary could produce one for me. I have not seen an information campaign from the government educating the public within the European Union as well as parliamentarians over there because a lot of what is happening is a result of public pressure on those parliamentarians.

How aggressive were the diplomatic efforts? I am not questioning the personal integrity of Ambassador Sullivan, but how effective was he? How much support did he have in terms of doing his particular work? If there was a co-ordinated, technically driven campaign, how much money was actually expended?

These are legitimate questions to lay on the floor of this chamber. We deserve some answers, sealers deserve some answers, and those in our communities deserve some answers to these particular questions.

It is also incumbent upon the government to review its strategy, if it had a strategy, to see where it failed. Where were the weaknesses? Where were some of the potential strengths? These are all crucial questions.

Our sealers are in need. Our sealers are hurting and their families are hurting. Our communities need help.

The Minister of International Trade said that sealing was crucial to the livelihood of sealers and their families. What are we going to do now since the seals have taken to the water? Are we going to provide income support? Are we going to extend EI benefits? Are we going to launch a campaign? Are we going to have a WTO challenge? What are we going to do now?

We are talking in the House, but people want answers. They want to know what went wrong. They want to know what is going to happen to help them now. I ask these questions with a sense of sincerity and with a sense of integrity because I am thinking about the people back home. I am thinking about the many families who are hurting.

I get calls every single day, as do other members from my province, from people asking what we are going to do for them now. They want to know how we are going to help them out now. They need help. There has been a promise of some help, and rightly so, for lobster fishermen because they are going through a difficult time. Our sealers are no less important, our fishermen are no less important, in the province of Newfoundland and Labrador, in Quebec, or in the north.

Where is the help for our sealers and for our fishermen when they need it most?

Fisheries and OceansCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

6 p.m.

NDP

Jim Maloway NDP Elmwood—Transcona, MB

Mr. Speaker, the last two speakers really hit the nail on the head. Over the last couple of debates we have dealt with the issues involved here, but only the last two speakers have really dealt with solutions.

Is the solution to conduct an advertising campaign? Where have we been all these years? We should be looking at the possibilities more aggressively. What are we doing in terms of a plan of action involving an all-party committee? This sounds reasonable as well. We all seem to be in agreement here in the House and we are all making speeches, but beyond that who really hears us at this point.

We should probably have an all-party committee that could aggressively put out the arguments to dispel the myths that are being propagated over there in Europe. It is absolutely unbelievable that we are just going to sit back and let the EU get away with what it is doing. I applaud the last two speakers. I would like to hear some further comments from the member.

Fisheries and OceansCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

6 p.m.

Liberal

Todd Russell Liberal Labrador, NL

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the sentiments and words of my colleague. Indeed, yes, sometimes we all take a lot of comfort in speaking with and listening to each other, and hopefully carrying a message of hope and optimism back to our communities, provinces and the families who are most affected.

The questions I asked were: What was the strategy? How was it laid out? Were there pro-sealing ads? How much money was expended? The government has a responsibility to lay out exactly what it undertook in this particular regard.

One of the greater responsibilities now is how do we respond? How do we respond in a way that overturns this ban? Do we undertake a marketing campaign? I asked the minister, do we undertake a WTO challenge? I did not get a direct answer on that particular question. What do we do now to help the families that are hurting? They need immediate action on the part of the government.

Fisheries and OceansCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

6:05 p.m.

Liberal

Gerry Byrne Liberal Humber—St. Barbe—Baie Verte, NL

Mr. Speaker, one of the ways we could indeed help sealers from the northeast coast of Newfoundland, the Northern Peninsula and the coast of Labrador, is for the government to actually do what it committed to do in the House, which is to provide some income support for fishermen who could not earn an income this past year because of very difficult ice conditions.

Would it be of any assistance to those fishermen, who happen to be the seal fishers of this country from Newfoundland and Labrador, if the government made good on its promise and provided the ice compensation that it committed to?

Fisheries and OceansCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

6:05 p.m.

Liberal

Todd Russell Liberal Labrador, NL

Mr. Speaker, the issue of ice compensation and providing some income relief for sealers affected by ice conditions, low markets and low seal pelt prices was committed to in the House by a couple of ministers, but we have yet to see anything delivered in terms of assistance or aid for our sealers.

I am sure there are many colleagues who can attest to the fact that there are many families that make between $15,000 and $25,000 in net family income. Providing the seal fishermen with $3,000 or $4,000 might not sound like a lot of money to many Canadians but that is 15%, sometimes 20%, of a sealer's income. It is essential that they have that income. It is not there this spring and we are asking the government to help the sealers.

If the government is going to talk about supporting the sealers and doing all these things, it should put it into action. It is no good to talk about it if it is not put into action. I say to the government to put it into action and do not just talk about it.

Fisheries and OceansCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

6:05 p.m.

Conservative

The Acting Speaker Conservative Barry Devolin

It is my duty to interrupt the proceedings at this time and put forthwith the question on the motion now before the House.

The question is on the motion. Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?

Fisheries and OceansCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

6:05 p.m.

Some hon. members

Agreed.

Fisheries and OceansCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

6:05 p.m.

Conservative

The Acting Speaker Conservative Barry Devolin

I declare the motion carried.

(Motion agreed to)

Library MaterialsPetitionsRoutine Proceedings

6:05 p.m.

Conservative

Merv Tweed Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to present seven petitions from seven different provinces in support of the library bill, Bill C-322, An Act to amend the Canada Post Corporation Act (library materials), which will protect and support the library book rate and extend it to include audio-visual materials.

Magdalen IslandsPetitionsRoutine Proceedings

6:05 p.m.

Bloc

Raynald Blais Bloc Gaspésie—Îles-de-la-Madeleine, QC

Mr. Speaker, I have the pleasure and the tremendous honour of presenting a petition signed by almost 2,000 people with respect to an event that occurred in 1970. At that time, the Irving Whale sunk near the Magdalen Islands. Oil was released by the vessel and the coast guard decided to put it in plastic bags and bury them along the coast of the Magdalen Islands.

The inhabitants are asking that the area be cleaned up by removing the bags and making the area fit for the Magdalen Islanders.

Rights of the UnbornPetitionsRoutine Proceedings

6:10 p.m.

Liberal

Paul Szabo Liberal Mississauga South, ON

Mr. Speaker, pursuant to Standing Order 36, I am pleased to present a petition certified by the Clerk of Petitions, concerning the protection of human life from conception until natural death.

Some time ago in the United States, insurance companies were disallowing medical procedures on unborn children. As a consequence, the minister of health and social services amended the definition of “child” to be a person under 19, including the period from conception to birth.

On the week in which the March for Life will take place on Parliament Hill, the petitioners would like to point out that Canada is a country which respects human rights and includes in the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms that everyone has the right to life. Also, it has been 40 years since May 14, 1969 when Parliament changed the law to permit abortion, and since January 28, 1988 Canada has no law to protect the lives of unborn children.

The petitioners therefore call upon Parliament to pass legislation for the protection of human life from the time of conception until natural death.

Questions Passed as Orders for ReturnsRoutine Proceedings

6:10 p.m.

Regina—Lumsden—Lake Centre Saskatchewan

Conservative

Tom Lukiwski ConservativeParliamentary Secretary to the Leader of the Government in the House of Commons

Mr. Speaker, if Question No. 100 could be made an order for return, this return would be tabled immediately.

Questions Passed as Orders for ReturnsRoutine Proceedings

6:10 p.m.

Conservative

The Acting Speaker Conservative Barry Devolin

Is that agreed?

Questions Passed as Orders for ReturnsRoutine Proceedings

6:10 p.m.

Some hon. members

Agreed.

Question No. 100Questions Passed as Orders for ReturnsRoutine Proceedings

6:10 p.m.

NDP

Jack Harris NDP St. John's East, NL

With respect to equipment issued to personnel of Crown corporations, agencies, organizations and departments, on an annual basis over the last four years: (a) how many uniforms, firearms, explosive devices, stun grenades, tasers, and pepper spray canisters have been lost in this period; (b) to which Crown entity did the items belong; (c) when and in which locations did they go missing; (d) what is the estimated cost of these losses, by item; (e) how many vehicles were stolen during this period; (f) to which Crown entity did the vehicles belong; (g) when and in which locations did they go missing; (h) what is the estimated cost of these losses, by incident; (i) how many security passes have gone missing from locations that could pose a threat to national security or public safety; (j) to which facilities did the passes belong; (k) in which month and year were the losses reported; (l) what was the evaluated security threat posed by each loss; (m) how many laptop computers containing information sensitive to national security have gone missing; (n) to which facilities did the computers belong; (o) on which month and year were the losses reported; and (p) what was the evaluated security threat posed by each loss?