House of Commons Hansard #14 of the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was post.

Topics

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:15 a.m.

Nepean—Carleton Ontario

Conservative

Pierre Poilievre ConservativeParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Transport

I would like to thank my constituents for re-electing me in Nepean—Carleton. I know they are all watching me right now, at 4:20 in the morning, as we debate this important subject.

The member talked about the importance of pensions for Canada Post workers. I have here the portfolio of the Canada Post pension fund. The top 10 holdings of that pension fund are Toronto-Dominion Bank, Royal Bank of Canada, Bank of Nova Scotia, Suncor, Canadian Natural Resources, Potash Corporation of Saskatchewan, Canadian National Railway, and Talisman Energy. All of these companies' profits belong to the shareholders of those companies, in this case the employees of Canada Post.

Now when the NDP talks about raising taxes on these very businesses, they take a bite out of the money that flows from those businesses directly into the pension fund of the workers. Why is it that the NDP wants to raise taxes on the pension fund of the workers at Canada Post?

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:15 a.m.

NDP

Marie-Claude Morin NDP Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC

Mr. Speaker, that question was asked earlier this evening. We have never called for higher taxes on pension funds, either during the campaign or at any other time. So the member's question is not pertinent.

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:20 a.m.

Bloc

Maria Mourani Bloc Ahuntsic, QC

Mr. Speaker, I have a question for the hon. member.

Two days ago, I was in Montreal with union members on the picket line. A number of people were there, and they told me that Canada Post management wanted to impose orphan clauses. Could the hon. member tell us what an orphan clause is and what she thinks about such a clause being imposed?

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:20 a.m.

NDP

Marie-Claude Morin NDP Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC

Mr. Speaker, I am not an expert when it comes to strikes or lockouts. I have no idea about the question the hon. member just asked. I apologize, but I am not able to answer the hon. member's question.

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:20 a.m.

Conservative

David Wilks Conservative Kootenay—Columbia, BC

Mr. Speaker, I have a question for the opposition.

The union voted 94% in favour of a strike vote, which it has every right to do, and I applaud it for that. My question is this. Would the member and her party support the union on a free vote on the offer put before it, rather than following what it is being told to do by the bargaining committee?

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:20 a.m.

NDP

Marie-Claude Morin NDP Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, QC

Mr. Speaker, all I have to say in response to the hon. member is that going on strike is a right and that workers have the right to negotiate their collective agreement. That is all I have to say in response to the hon. member's question.

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:20 a.m.

NDP

Niki Ashton NDP Churchill, MB

Mr. Speaker, it is an honour to stand in the House, along with our NDP team, and bring forward the voices of the people in northern Manitoba, to stand up for the workers who build our communities and who have built our country. Standing in the House I also feel, in a way, that I am living history.

As a 28-year-old young woman who was born and grew up in Canada, I am seeing the Canada that I grew up to believe in fade away. It was a Canada where people enjoyed one of the best qualities of life, the best health care, some of the best education, some of the safest workplaces, and some of the most stable futures. Yet with this kind of legislation, that Canada is being chipped away.

Canada is being chipped away because the people who have built it, the working people of Canada, are having their rights rolled back. Number one is the right to collective bargaining, which is all that the Canadian Union of Postal Workers has asked for. It has asked to go through an enshrined right, a process that working Canadians go through in many workplaces, to say, “This isn't fair”, or, “Times are changing, things are getting more expensive, and there are more challenges up ahead, so let us find ways to keep wages, benefits, and pensions in line with a Canada that is moving forward.

Instead of having a partner with whom they could negotiate, they were locked out. When that partner locked them out, just a few days later, the government, which has control over crown corporations, came around and did not just agree with what was presented by Canada Post, it went even further. The government proposed wages that were lower than what Canada Post, the employer, proposed to their employees. With this legislation in front of us today, the government has gone further and silenced the very people who hold up our communities, the very people who are asking for nothing less than dignity and fairness.

But that Canada is also fading away because of the specific attack on my generation. It is my generation that will have a double standard in the kinds of pensions that are proposed as a result of the Canada Post program. These are the kinds of pensions that have already been largely taken away in the private sector.

I come from a proud mining community. Vale, a foreign-owned company, has put out the workers, our brothers and sisters in Sudbury, for over a year because they were asking for a proper pension, a defined benefit pension, so that they would know that their money--their deferred wages--was not going into a black hole to be played with by the markets, which we have seen cause great havoc with people's savings, but that it was locked up somewhere secure, because that is their money, that is our money.

Now we are seeing a new page. We are seeing a crown corporation, which is controlled by government, take that very same approach and say that because you are young and new, you do not deserve the wages and pensions of those who have gone before you. What will result from that? It will result in a generation, my generation, being less well off than our parents. That is not just in an individual sense; it is in the kinds of communities we live in.

I think of my community of Thompson, one of the youngest regions in Canada. Rhonda, who delivers my mail, and Jen and Ian, good friends of mine, are people just like the rest of us. They want to buy a home, build a family, maybe buy a vehicle, and maybe once in a while take a holiday from one of the coldest parts in Canada. But they know they will not be able to make the same plans as their co-workers who are nearing retirement or their parents who have retired.

That double standard also applies to people who live in rural areas of the country like the one I live in. Much has been said about the challenges people face in rural areas.

I really wonder how so many of the members opposite, elected from the same region of Canada in which I was elected, representing rural areas like the one I was elected from, can stand here and say that what Canada Post has been doing is okay. Not only has there been an attack on working people in general, but the kinds of allocations and terms of funding that Canada Post has made have far prioritized urban centres rather than investing in rural areas. The postal service in rural areas is not a luxury. It is absolutely integral, integral in not only communications and entrepreneurship but communication between people.

Most recently Canada Post took care of the food mail program that serviced some of the poorest people in our country, aboriginal people in the regions like the one I live in and represent. These are regions that are isolated, and this program allowed them to access healthy foods. Now that has been taken away.

Much was said about the $2 billion Canada Post committed to the modernization projects. I saw a fancy PowerPoint presentation about the new vehicles people would get. Those vehicles do not work in places like the one I come from. But I do know from people like Barb and Lorna and Bertha, who I talked to in Flin Flon today, that the permanent workers who are retiring are leaving empty spots that are not being filled up. There is increasing hiring of casual workers. When they bring forward challenges they are facing with rural postal delivery, Canada Post is reticent to respond to those concerns.

The hypocrisy in having a government that claims to stand for rural Canada or western Canada, that claims to stand for the future, leaves behind not just rural areas with this legislation but also begins the chipping away of the foundations that would help hold up my generation.

This type of approach is not singular here with Canada Post. We have heard that very question: Who is going to be next? What about those institutions where we all belong and come together to find ways for all of us to be better off?

The Canadian Wheat Board is another one, the single desk marketer of a very important product that comes out of my part of Canada.

What about our other crown corporations? Which one will be attacked next? We already know their funding has been challenged and cut. But how about the workers who work for these crown corporations?

It doesn't have to be this way. Our leader of the official opposition put forward the statement that it does not have to be this way. What we ask from the government is to get Canada Post to take that lock off the door and allow the two parties to come to the table and find a resolution in terms of the challenges that workers are facing on the ground and to recognize that these workers are the people who hold up our communities. These workers are raising children who are going to grow up in a world that is going to be increasingly more challenging.

The role of government, if nothing else, is to stand up for its people. That is why our fight today is not just for the workers of Canada Post but for every worker in Canada and every Canadian who deserves dignity in a country as wealthy as ours.

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:30 a.m.

Conservative

Kyle Seeback Conservative Brampton West, ON

Mr. Speaker, we have heard today over and over again from members of the opposition talking about the rights of the union. It is the only thing we seem to hear about.

What we have here is that postal delivery and postal services are not happening. That is not what we are talking about. Strike or lockout does not matter as there is no postal delivery. The refusal to support our back to work legislation is causing real harm.

Here is one example. A constituent emailed me yesterday that she has lost her key to her postal mailbox. Her CPP cheque is in that mailbox. Canada Post told her it would take three to four weeks to get her a new key. Her rent is due on June 28th. Why is the opposition choosing to support its union friends instead of supporting a Canadian senior like this lady? I want an answer.

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:30 a.m.

NDP

Niki Ashton NDP Churchill, MB

Mr. Speaker, I will respond with another question. Why is the government not standing up for Canadian working people who are asking for nothing more than a fair wage, a fair pension and dignity in the workplace? That dignity is something that will contribute to the communities in which seniors live with such great challenges ahead of them and in which young people are growing up. These are the fights of not just Canada Post workers but all of us, and we ask to see leadership from the government in standing up for a brighter future for Canadian people, instead of rolling back their rights and making their futures a lot more uncertain.

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:30 a.m.

Liberal

Jim Karygiannis Liberal Scarborough—Agincourt, ON

Mr. Speaker, I cannot help but get into the debate. My colleague from the Conservatives said that Canada Post tells the seniors that they are going to get the key in four weeks. I am failing to see how a postal worker will be part and parcel of ensuring that the lady in his riding will get the key in four weeks. That is management.

We are having difficulty between the management and the postal workers' union. My question to my colleague from Manitoba is: Should the government not order them back to the negotiating table, without interfering, and should the government not allow the two parties to come to a conclusion? That is where our party has put amendments. I just wonder if my colleague will encourage her party to follow our amendments in order to ensure this is concluded, fairly, quickly—

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:30 a.m.

Conservative

The Speaker Conservative Andrew Scheer

Order, please. I will have to stop the hon. member there to allow the member for Churchill a chance to respond.

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:30 a.m.

NDP

Niki Ashton NDP Churchill, MB

Mr. Speaker, what we are saying is that, just as the government has interfered with the process here, it ought to reverse that act, tell Canada Post to remove the lock from the door and allow the parties to come to the table.

Canada Post employees have been saying for quite some time that they want to work, but they want to work with a fair, negotiated agreement.

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:35 a.m.

NDP

Don Davies NDP Vancouver Kingsway, BC

Mr. Speaker, I follow up on a question from my hon. colleague from the Conservative side who referred to us as supporting the union as if the union is some sort of inanimate object divorced from the people who actually make it up. Having worked for a union for 16 years, I know that a union is nothing more than a collective grouping of the men and women who work at a particular place of employment. It is a very democratic organization in which people vote to become certified. They vote whether or not they decide to join a union. They vote on their strike votes. They vote on whether a collective agreement is ratified or not. In my experience, it is one of the most democratic organizations in Canadian society.

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:35 a.m.

Some hon. members

Oh, oh!

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:35 a.m.

NDP

Don Davies NDP Vancouver Kingsway, BC

I hear some jeering from the other side. I do not know that they have spent any time in a union, but I spent 16 years of my life in one.

What does my hon. colleague have to say about the men and women who make up the union? Does she share the opinion that the union is something to be disparaged as the Conservatives are doing?

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:35 a.m.

NDP

Niki Ashton NDP Churchill, MB

Mr. Speaker, I am proud to come from a community that enjoys the quality of life it does because of the hard work of unions like the steelworkers, UFCW, CUPE and CUPW that are out there because they fight for all of us. They ensure our wages are fair and that we have safe workplaces. They ensure we have health benefits and they ensure our communities are better off.

I am concerned by the negative, aggressive attacks on what is a basic right of unionization. This, to me, is language that I hear from the U.S., from the Republican Party, from the Tea Party. This is not the inclusive, tolerant language that—

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:35 a.m.

Conservative

The Speaker Conservative Andrew Scheer

Order, please. The hon. member for Jonquière—Alma.

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:35 a.m.

NDP

Claude Patry NDP Jonquière—Alma, QC

Mr. Speaker, I have spent the day in the House. I spoke this afternoon. This evening, I have two comments to make. I am a new parliamentarian, a new member. I am starting, as everyone has done. My eyes are wide open. I look at these people and I admire them all, because I think we are doing everything we can to pull Canada out of a bad situation and to improve things, both for the workers and for the country as a whole.

This evening, a Conservative member rose on a point of order and made a comment about reading from a prepared text. We are starting out here and we are being told not to work from a prepared text. That is how I understood his comment this evening; it struck a chord with me. So we will put the texts away and proceed differently.

After that, a Liberal member behind me rose to say that we should be talking about real issues. It is true that we should be talking about real issues: the people are suffering, too. I experienced a six-month lockout. People lost their homes; they were unable to buy groceries. The union fixed their appliances and bought them groceries. That is the reality when people are not working and when no paycheque arrives on Thursday. That is what we need to be looking at here in the House.

I am part of the labour movement; I am a factory worker. When we talk about unions in the House, I can feel the contempt people have for workers and unions. That is not normal in a country like ours. It is not normal, and I can feel that contempt.

I have negotiated collective agreements. In 1992, I spent 14 months negotiating. A conciliator was brought in; there was no strike and we signed our agreement and got back to work. In 1976, I was locked out and in 1979 we chose to go on strike.

In 2006, I was the spokesperson at the bargaining table with Alcan. In one month we managed to negotiate a $1.2 billion contract to build a new factory with new technology. We did that in one month: a team of eight people worked night and day for one month. We had a deadline and we met it. Anything can be done in this world. Anything can happen when both parties are willing.

I urge the Conservative government to bring these two parties together in the same room and force them to find a solution. That is the only way this is going to be resolved.

In any case, I am a bit disappointed. This is my first time and I would have liked to read my speech, but I will not. I have spoken from my heart. It will not be more than five minutes, but I can say one thing: we need to start taking care of people, the people around us. I spoke on behalf of people who are not even unionized. I defended them. I defended people who wanted to have a home. That was not my job; I was the union representative.

The unions helped create progress in both Quebec and Canada. We contributed to Quebec's occupational health and safety legislation. We participated in the arbitration panel and all these things. People in unions are not so bad. We are not all some kind of insect. For example, today we have FTQ and CSN investment funds. We participate in society. Other people must stop holding unions in contempt.

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:40 a.m.

Peterborough Ontario

Conservative

Dean Del Mastro ConservativeParliamentary Secretary to the Prime Minister and to the Minister of Intergovernmental Affairs

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the opportunity to once again engage in some questions with hon. members from across the floor.

A number of members across the floor talked about Canada Post as being an “essential service”. Essential services in Canada often have special rules that apply to them, including—

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:40 a.m.

NDP

Dennis Bevington NDP Western Arctic, NT

No lockout.

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:40 a.m.

Conservative

Dean Del Mastro Conservative Peterborough, ON

And no strikes, Mr. Speaker. The member is right: no lockouts, no strikes.

Would the member be in favour of listing Canada Post as an essential service? If so, does he think it would be a good idea that the workers would not be able to strike or be locked out in the future? Would he support that?

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:40 a.m.

NDP

Claude Patry NDP Jonquière—Alma, QC

Mr. Speaker, I said it this afternoon and I am going to say it again: we can force the parties to sit down and find a solution. It has been done. I have seen it happen. It involves setting deadlines and assigning the right people to the right places. It happens when everyone acts in good faith.

If everyone is not acting in good faith, an agreement will never be reached. The union, management and the government all have to put some water in their wine. I call on the government to ask that the doors be unlocked and that the employees return to work. People are prepared to work under the former collective agreement while finding a solution for the future. That is what is important. That is how I see the situation.

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:40 a.m.

NDP

Jinny Sims NDP Newton—North Delta, BC

Mr. Speaker, l want to tell my honoured colleague how much I appreciated his passion, especially at this time of the morning. He has probably been up for about 23 hours and he still has that passion because it comes from his deep belief system.

What action does he think the government needs to take to put an end to the fiasco that is happening this morning?

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:40 a.m.

NDP

Claude Patry NDP Jonquière—Alma, QC

Mr. Speaker, I do not know; I am not a miracle worker, but I believe it can be done. In fact, I worked in the labour movement with management and with big multinationals. It is not easy dealing with big multinationals either, but we found solutions. Why? I would like to give an example. In the last negotiations, we put five issues on the table, the company added others and then we had to work on them. Of course, we sometimes had to make painful choices, but that is how you get to the end and get something out of it.

Canada Post, as well as the union, will have to compromise. They need to sit down and do it the right way. If they all go back to work and are forced to sit down with either a conciliator or a mediator—it does not matter which one—to reach a solution, they should find common ground. At any rate, we know that if the employees are forced to return to work after a lockout, the work environment will be intolerable for everyone. I have experienced this situation in factories.

Restoring Mail Delivery for Canadians ActGovernment Orders

June 24th, 4:45 a.m.

Conservative

Ryan Leef Conservative Yukon, YT

Mr. Speaker, I am sorry I cannot relate to the member's experiences in 1976, because at that time I was three years old.

My generation are first-time homebuyers. My generation are young parents and owners of small businesses. My generation and constituents are northern, rural, and vast, and my generation is pleading, “I hope this strike ends somehow, soon, because it's killing small businesses like mine”.

The key to ending this strike is not a key held by anybody but the opposition, and it is by supporting this legislation.

I ask the member to stop fighting the legislation and to support it so that Canadians can get their businesses running again and get back to work.