House of Commons Hansard #30 of the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was obesity.

Topics

Northwest Territories Devolution ActGovernment Orders

4:15 p.m.

Chilliwack—Fraser Canyon B.C.

Conservative

Mark Strahl ConservativeParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Aboriginal Affairs and Northern Development

Mr. Speaker, I can certainly appreciate the passion of the member for Western Arctic, this being his home territory.

I think there would probably be strong disagreement, however, from the Government of the Northwest Territories that what it is signing on for is third-stage colonialism. That is not what it is signing on for. It knows, as it has agreed to this historic bill, that authorities will actually be transferred to the territories that it has asked for, as other governments have tried to do but failed to deliver on. Conservatives support devolution, the Government of the Northwest Territories certainly does, and I think it would reject that characterization.

The member mentioned resource development, which is interesting, given his recent comments that resource development hasn't reduced poverty in the Northwest Territories. We know that jobs in the resource sector create long-term prosperity and wealth in communities. I want to ask the hon. member how he can say that resource development in the Northwest Territories, which involves key industries such as mining, is actually not having a positive effect on the economy. Why does he not want to work with the Government of the Northwest Territories to improve the regulatory regime so that more economic development, more certainty, and more resource development will come to the territories to improve the economic outcomes for the people who live there?

Northwest Territories Devolution ActGovernment Orders

4:20 p.m.

NDP

Dennis Bevington NDP Western Arctic, NT

Mr. Speaker, my colleague actually gave me a chance to respond to what the minister said about me.

We did a study recently in which we looked at income tax returns over the last 10 years across the north as one part of the study. In that study, we noticed that in communities like Lutselk'e, which has been virtually surrounded by new diamond mines in the last 10 years, when we picked a $30,000 cap for family income, the rate of poverty among families went from 30% to 40%. This is during a time when our GDP per capita, averaged over 10 years, had the highest growth rate of any jurisdiction in the country.

We saw that even in close proximity, communities that have economic benefit agreements with the diamond mines still had a high degree of poverty. In fact, it was increasing. Economic development is very good for those who are working for mining companies and have jobs in those fields, but it raises the cost of living enormously and leaves many people behind. That is why we need a very broad approach to resource development, one that comes from the people of the Northwest Territories who have seen the results over the last 10 years and want to improve on them.

With this type of legislation, with these changes to the MVRMA, the minister in Ottawa will be determining the terms and conditions of development, and we will not have the chance to try to make a difference so that resource developments actually work for us.

Northwest Territories Devolution ActGovernment Orders

4:20 p.m.

Liberal

Yvonne Jones Liberal Labrador, NL

Mr. Speaker, I listened very attentively to my colleague from the Northwest Territories as he spoke to this bill. Being a northerner myself, I know there are often issues around resource development and balancing the levels of governance within aboriginal communities, the territories, and the provinces that sometimes pose challenges. However, I have seen a lot of major issues resolved simply because of the players, the strength of both the aboriginal entities and the governments that are in power to be able to do this.

I know this bill has been presented in two particular parts, but we also know that on June 25, 2013, the agreement was signed by the Government of Canada and the Government of the Northwest Territories, as well as the Inuvialuit, the Gwich'in, the Tlicho, and the Sahtu. They had agreed to sign on at that particular time to ensure that there was greater management and control within the NWT.

I would ask the hon. member today for his opinion. Does he feel that they have now withdrawn their support because of the changes that are happening within the management of the water board, or is it that the concerns being raised by these groups should just be addressed by the government?

Northwest Territories Devolution ActGovernment Orders

4:20 p.m.

NDP

Dennis Bevington NDP Western Arctic, NT

Mr. Speaker, I want to answer the question quite honestly, because I think that is important in the House.

In September, I wrote to the minister and asked him to bring these two bills forward as separate bills, because there is a great disagreement in the Northwest Territories between the two bills.

With the devolution implementation bill, I think there is a great deal of support. I commended the premier on getting that support from first nations. That is how we work together. That is excellent. However, with the Mackenzie Valley Resource Management Act, that is something that causes a great deal of concern for aboriginal groups across the north.

What we have ended up with is an omnibus bill. I am conflicted about the support I am giving to the bill because it does not represent what I feel is adequate on the Mackenzie Valley resource management side. I can live with the changes encompassed in the devolution implementation bill, because generally, they add a little to what is going on in the north.

That is the conflict that we have. We want progress. We will take the progress we can get in the north. First nations, in many cases, do not view this as progress, with respect to the Mackenzie Valley Resource Management Act.

Northwest Territories Devolution ActGovernment Orders

4:25 p.m.

NDP

Hélène LeBlanc NDP LaSalle—Émard, QC

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for his speech and especially for being the eyes and ears of the vast northern region for us in Parliament. I also want to congratulate him on his convictions and his commitment to doing what is best for the people in the north.

He raised a very interesting point in his answer to a question. How can this government still be introducing bills that, on one hand, include positive aspects and, on the other hand, raise concerns?

I would like him to speak to this problem and how, by extension, it stifles any ongoing progress we might make, especially when it comes to ensuring that the people in the north can move ahead.

Northwest Territories Devolution ActGovernment Orders

4:25 p.m.

NDP

Dennis Bevington NDP Western Arctic, NT

Mr. Speaker, I look on the debate in the House of Commons as extremely important for the people of the Northwest Territories, because as with my private member's bill on the borrowing limit, I did influence other people and other parties to support the north.

There may be another government here in a couple of years. What I would really love for people to understand is that we are not finished with devolution or evolution in the Northwest Territories towards political status comparable to other Canadians.

We have not finished with that yet. There is more work to be done. Although the bill comes now, we hope that in the years to come other sensitive and thoughtful people in Canada will recognize that we have a right to full political status, and that they will support everything that is needed to make the Northwest Territories a unique, strong, democratic place.

We do not want to lose sight of that. We do not want to lose sight for our first nations, who we have worked together with for many years to build this territory, this place where all first nations can feel at home, in charge, empowered and strengthened in their communities, in their regions. That is so vital to what we do in the Northwest Territories. This is unlike many places in Canada. I do not want to see that change.

We can debate this for some time, see some amendments come forward and see some understanding about how the north should move ahead. This would all be valuable to us. I appeal to all members to take a look at what is going on here. This is an important issue. As a Canadian, stand up for northerners. Even if you do not want to see too much progress right now, understand what the issues are and why, in the end, we in the north should have equal status to all of you around this room.

Northwest Territories Devolution ActGovernment Orders

4:25 p.m.

Conservative

The Acting Speaker Conservative Bruce Stanton

I would remind hon. members to direct their comments to the Chair.

It is my duty, pursuant to Standing Order 38, to inform the House that the questions to be raised tonight at the time of adjournment are as follows: the hon. member for Laurier—Sainte-Marie, International Cooperation; the hon. member for Haute-Gaspésie—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, Sealing Industry.

Resuming debate, the hon. member for Labrador.

Northwest Territories Devolution ActGovernment Orders

4:30 p.m.

Liberal

Yvonne Jones Liberal Labrador, NL

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the opportunity to rise today and speak to this important bill, Bill C-15, an act to replace the Northwest Territories Act to implement certain provisions of the Northwest Territories Lands and Resources Devolution Agreement and to repeal or make amendments to the Territorial Lands Act, the Northwest Territories Waters Act, the Mackenzie Valley Resource Management Act, other Acts and certain orders and regulations. I am proud to rise as a northerner of Inuit descent and as my party's critic for northern development, the Canadian Northern Economic Development Agency and the Arctic Council to address the bill on this occasion of importance to the people of the Northwest Territories.

The devolution of responsibilities in the Northwest Territories is a cause for celebration, not just for the people of NWT but for all of us as Canadians. Any time that we can give greater control and a greater say in the future of the people who live in certain lands and manage certain resources, we can ensure that we will have good and solid management.

The work that is happening with regard to the devolution agreement is obviously work that was started decades ago to give the people of the Northwest Territories the governance that they deserve. We can all think back to the work of Liberal Prime Minister Lester B. Pearson and his government, which established the Advisory Commission on the Development of Government in the Northwest Territories, otherwise known as the Carrothers commission.

The commission at that time consulted with people across the north and concluded in its report that they of course deserved to have the seat of their government established not in Ottawa, as it had been until then, but in the north, where people could play a much more vital role in their government and its ability to represent the people of the Northwest Territories. This established Yellowknife as the capital and moved the territorial seat of government there.

Decades later, Yellowknife has continued to blossom as the seat of government in the Northwest Territories. It is thanks in part to this important step that we can be proud today that business in the Northwest Territories is booming as well.

On the important subject of devolution, I want to point out and acknowledge before Parliament that it was the governments of Prime Ministers Jean Chrétien and Paul Martin that worked tirelessly for the devolution of the Yukon and Nunavut, and started the process of devolution for the Northwest Territories. It is a legacy that we are proud of. I am eager to continue working hard to ensure that people across northern Canada have the type of government that they want and deserve, in order to make important decisions that will affect their future.

There is a new generation of young Canadians who live in the north and who are ready to be the leaders of today. We must do everything that we can to ensure that our territories have the tools and governance that they need to empower our young Canadians and our citizens to continue to be a part of the economic driver of this country, which the north has become.

In my role as the critic for northern development, and of course as the MP for Labrador, sometimes I have to say that when I speak to the bill, I am almost a little bit envious. In my previous role as a provincial member and minister in the Government of Newfoundland and Labrador, I had the opportunity to travel to the northern regions of our country and visit people across the territories. I know that they are great people, who work hard in a very challenging climate. I can tell the House that despite all these odds and challenges, they are thriving.

The culture and entrepreneurship are such an inspiration to see first-hand. I want to encourage my hon. colleagues in the House to visit the north and see for themselves how this is such an awe-inspiring part of our country. The devolution agreement and the continued transfer of responsibility will allow the people of the Northwest Territories to take the driver's seat on the huge amounts of economic development that we are seeing.

In my own district of Labrador, we have seen the rich cultural heritage and contributions of our aboriginal people, like the Innu, NunatuKavut and Nunatsiavut. It is vital that all aboriginal peoples in Canada have a strong voice to represent them. I hope that those in the north will play a larger role in determining the future of their people as part of the bill and of the work of both the federal and territorial governments.

We all want to see aboriginal communities in the north succeed economically, socially and culturally. This agreement would hopefully empower these communities to come closer to achieving greater success in all of these areas.

As someone who was born and raised in the north, and who represents a northern district, I can certainly understand the need for autonomy in the north and the right to establish strong local government that can engage in government to government to government dialogue that would produce meaningful results. I know the frustration and reality of trying to govern without having real power and the ability to make full decisions and have full accountability. We need decision-makers to understand these realities of living in the north and that they are best served by granting the responsibilities necessary to the Government of the Northwest Territories.

We want to make it easier to conduct business in our northern regions to encourage business investment, create jobs and generate greater revenues. I want devolution to give more of these things to the Government of the Northwest Territories as well as the participating aboriginal governments. With this, they could work together to improve their social programs and social safety net. They could make decisions to invest in their local culture to attract tourism or trade and to draw new people into the area.

I am very optimistic about the future of the Northwest Territories and its devolution agreement. I am optimistic about all northern regions of Canada.

I believe that northern regions thrive when they have the guidance of good leadership. Today we have with us the Premier of the Northwest Territories, Mr. Bob McLeod, along with officials and other leaders within his government. I understand that we also have support and have been joined by some aboriginal governments from NWT.

We have to recognize that these individuals have spent years working to gain a very concrete devolution agreement to ensure that it meets the needs of the people they represent, the people they advocate and care for. I want to congratulate them on the work they have done.

I hope that despite the interference that one often sees from government that they will accomplish what they set out to do; that is, to give greater autonomy, greater powers of decision-making to the people of the Northwest Territories. I think that is what we all want to see accomplished through this particular agreement.

Northwest Territories Devolution ActGovernment Orders

4:35 p.m.

Chilliwack—Fraser Canyon B.C.

Conservative

Mark Strahl ConservativeParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Aboriginal Affairs and Northern Development

Mr. Speaker, I appreciated the member's speech. As she said, as a northerner, I appreciated her enthusiasm for the north. I certainly look forward to working with her on the aboriginal affairs committee as we study the bill.

The member mentioned the previous agreements with the Yukon and Nunavut, and I want to concentrate a bit on the Yukon.

The previous speaker, the member for Western Arctic, complained that the commissioner would have to act on the written orders of the Governor in Council for a period of 10 years in this new Northwest Territories devolution act. He complained that was not what happened in the Yukon. However, that actually is what happened in the Yukon. For 10 years, it was written into the agreement that the commissioner of the Yukon would report through the cabinet.

Does the member see a problem with a transition plan such as was undertaken by members of her government, a 10-year transition plan? Does she see it as a positive thing if there is a long-term transition plan, or like the member for Western Arctic, does she somehow think that is unacceptable?

Northwest Territories Devolution ActGovernment Orders

4:40 p.m.

Liberal

Yvonne Jones Liberal Labrador, NL

Mr. Speaker, most of us expected to see the issues around Mackenzie Valley resource management done in a separate bill, and it has not evolved that way. It is not uncommon for that to happen with the government opposite. We see that with a lot of bills that come to the House of Commons.

When the Northwest Territories and the aboriginal people signed on, they were signing on to an agreement that was agreed upon.

As the bill goes through committee, I would like to examine the consultation on part two of the bill to ensure that there was proper consultation and that there was proper inclusion.

Whether this agreement is acceptable or not really comes down to the decisions to be made by the people of the Northwest Territories. Our job is to ensure that the bill is strengthened and fair and meets their desired intentions.

Northwest Territories Devolution ActGovernment Orders

4:40 p.m.

NDP

Dennis Bevington NDP Western Arctic, NT

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the comments of the member for Labrador. I know how much her territory in her province resembles the Northwest Territories with isolated communities and communities that are, in many cases, put under decisions that are not really coming from the people around them but from St. John's or some other area.

Could the hon. member comment on how she thinks the people of Labrador, who already have to deal with an extension to St. John's, would feel about having all the decisions regarding resource development finally approved by a minister in Ottawa?

Northwest Territories Devolution ActGovernment Orders

4:40 p.m.

Liberal

Yvonne Jones Liberal Labrador, NL

Mr. Speaker, that is dangerous ground for me to be treading right now, because if I were to make a speech on governance in Labrador, I would probably have a lot of media coverage for a few days.

It is very frustrating when people cannot govern themselves. That is the situation we have in Labrador, because we are at the mercy of the Government of Newfoundland and Labrador and the Government of Canada, and we work in co-operation with our aboriginal governments: the Nunatsiavut, Nunatukavut, and the Innu Nation. That is a discussion we can have another time. That is why I say I am almost envious as I stand to speak to this devolution agreement today and what is transpiring in northern regions across the country.

We cannot ignore the fact that governments have achieved consensus with the territorial government and the aboriginal population under devolution.

There is a section of the bill, about which concerns are being raised, with regard to the water management board and how that would operate. I look forward to seeing the amendments that I am sure the hon. member will bring forward. I understand that there may even be some amendments on the government side, but we will wait and see how that evolves as we go through committee.

Northwest Territories Devolution ActGovernment Orders

4:40 p.m.

Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux Liberal Winnipeg North, MB

Mr. Speaker, I have learned that the member for Labrador is a very strong advocate not only for Labrador but also for our northern regions. I very much appreciate her contributions to the Liberal Party.

She made reference to the idea of consensus and how important it is that we work with the different stakeholders. There are a number of stakeholders that need to be taken into consideration. Whether it is North American Indian, the Inuit, or the Métis, there is a good, strong, multicultural flavour in the northwest. We have to work with the people of the community to go forward.

Given her comments on the bill, to what degree does she believe it is important that once it goes to committee the government will be open to having amendments brought forward to make it a stronger piece of legislation?

Northwest Territories Devolution ActGovernment Orders

4:45 p.m.

Liberal

Yvonne Jones Liberal Labrador, NL

Mr. Speaker, I think the desire of the Government of Canada, the Government of the Northwest Territories, the aboriginal government, all the members of the House, and the Liberal caucus is to ensure that we have the strongest legislation possible and that we meet the expectations of devolution for the people of the Northwest Territories. We want to ensure that we put in their hands the real control and power they need to control resource development, to deal with the social issues they face, and to ensure that their territory continues to grow and prosper in the north.

If we all come to the table with that philosophy, we will indeed achieve that goal, and we will do it by consensus.

Northwest Territories Devolution ActGovernment Orders

4:45 p.m.

Conservative

Mark Strahl Conservative Chilliwack—Fraser Canyon, BC

Mr. Speaker, responding again to the member for Western Arctic, he does not seem to want to talk about the fact that Bill C-15 will provide the NWT with legislative authority to exercise new responsibilities over public lands, inland waters, and non-renewable resources. It will repeal or render inapplicable various federal laws that relate to the administration of lands, waters, and natural resources in the Northwest Territories.

I assume from the member's speech that the Liberal Party of Canada will be supporting this. It was unclear from the member for Western Arctic what position his party would be taking.

Does the member not agree that this is a significant nation-building exercise and one that we should celebrate along with the Government of the Northwest Territories? Does he realize that what we are proposing is exactly the same as what has been proposed in the Yukon, for instance, which is celebrating 10 years of successful devolution?

Northwest Territories Devolution ActGovernment Orders

4:45 p.m.

Liberal

Yvonne Jones Liberal Labrador, NL

Mr. Speaker, I have had an opportunity to travel in the Yukon and also in the Nunavut territory. It is no secret that we have a lot of challenges in the north when it comes to social issues and to the cost of living. These are very important factors, but we also cannot ignore, as Canadians, that some of our greatest wealth is coming from the north.

When we look at resource development and at the contributions they are making to Canada as a whole, the very least we could do in giving back to these northern regions is give them the opportunity to govern themselves, make decisions for themselves, and ensure that there is good strong growth and prosperity for generations to come.

Northwest Territories Devolution ActGovernment Orders

4:45 p.m.

NDP

Romeo Saganash NDP Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC

Mr. Speaker, I am clearly pleased to rise to speak to Bill C-15 today. This bill gives the Government of the Northwest Territories more powers and makes other changes, which I will speak to later.

I am also pleased to bring a different viewpoint to the debate, one that we rarely have in the House, and that is the viewpoint of an aboriginal person who has negotiated agreements with the federal and provincial governments on behalf of his people.

When I read the bill, I could not help but look at it in the context of the work I did for the Cree of Eeyou Istchee and the people of northern Quebec.

The people of the Northwest Territories have been working for years toward gaining more province-like powers to have greater control over their own communities, their own resources, and their own destinies. This is very similar to what we did in northern Quebec, going back to the signing of the James Bay and Northern Quebec Agreement in 1975 and the Paix de Braves, and to the new regional governance agreement we signed not too long ago, which has created a new regional government that will be fully operational next month.

In these agreements, we worked with our neighbours and various levels of government to find common ground to protect our rights and interests and to create a common path forward. This is very difficult work that is full of complexities, but when done right, it creates a stable, prosperous environment that benefits everyone.

In the NDP, we talk a lot about restoring the relationship of equality between the Government of Canada and our country's aboriginal people from coast to coast to coast. The approach we took in northern Quebec has proven to be a success story for all involved. Everyone feels respected in that kind of environment.

That is what I had in mind when I read the government's bill. However, I have to say that although it proposes some worthwhile measures and is a step in the right direction, we do not feel that it goes far enough, unfortunately. An NDP government would have done more and would have given more power to the Government of the Northwest Territories.

The bill, as proposed, would make some changes that are of concern to the people of the region. In drafting this bill, the Conservatives seem to have completely ignored the strong concerns first nations have about the changes to the Mackenzie Valley Resource Management Act, which is also very disturbing. This will be the focus of my comments today.

This bill includes amendments to the Mackenzie Valley Resource Management Act that would replace the current structure of regional land and water boards, created through the land claims final agreement with Northwest Territory aboriginal governments, with a single board. The Government of the Northwest Territories has also expressed concern about these changes.

In May 2011, Michael Miltenberger, NWT environment minister, said, “this process is driven by the federal government. They've, for the most part, treated the [Government of the Northwest Territories] as just another stakeholder”.

I would have thought that a territorial government, just like a provincial government or an aboriginal government, would be a partner, not just a stakeholder. We have seen before how the current Conservative government treats its partners in Confederation. When it starts from the point of not seeing or treating its partners as true partners, bad things flow, and a lasting agreement cannot be reached. Believe me, I speak from experience.

The Gwich'in Tribal Council and the Tlicho government, both signatories to the devolution agreement, have voiced opposition to these changes to the Mackenzie Valley Resource Management Act. Other individual first nations have also expressed their opposition.

As someone who has spent most of his professional career negotiating on behalf of my people, it is very concerning for me to see the government unilaterally merge these regional land and water boards.

These boards were created through land claims final agreements with the Northwest Territories and aboriginal governments after years of negotiations done in good faith. These boards have served the regions and peoples well. It is deeply troubling for me to see the government unilaterally undo what years of partnership and goodwill has built to the detriment of the region. If the Government of Canada tried to unilaterally undo part of the James Bay and Northern Quebec agreement, I would be strongly oppose and fight against it. Therefore, I will not expect other aboriginal nations to accept such an intrusion on their agreements and rights by the federal government.

Recently, Robert Alexie Jr., president of the Gwich'in Tribal Council, commented on its opposition to these changes. He was quoted saying, “We have a land use plan. We have the land and water board. We have a claim. People know the process, and it works very well up here”.

In October 2011, Gabrielle Mackenzie-Scott of the Tlicho government was quoted saying, “Our key message to AANDC is that there is nothing wrong with the system, and it needs time to grow and improve”.

I am sure the minister has many reasons why he believes these two leaders are wrong. However, from where I sit, it feels like the government has again not properly consulted those directly affected by these changes and are thumbing its nose at agreements the Crown has signed in good faith.

If the government insists on continuing with its failed approach in this case, I feel safe in saying that it will just invite another lawsuit against itself and add to the hundreds of millions it has spent in courts defending its indefensible approach. This is a waste of money that could be avoided by simply working with all partners, territorial and aboriginal governments alike, and negotiating.

To make matters worse, these amendments would also give the federal minister power over the approval of all land and water usage in the Northwest Territories, essentially circumventing the powers transferred to the Government of the Northwest Territories through the devolution process. Not only is the government ignoring land claims agreements and their provisions, the Conservatives are grabbing more power for themselves. The whole point of devolution is to give power to other levels of government, not take more back in return. Given its track record on protecting water rights and the interests of aboriginal peoples, I am very concerned to see those powers placed in the hands of a minister of the government.

My NDP colleagues and I are concerned about the lack of consultation during the drafting of this bill. That lack of consultation caused justifiable outrage with regard to some of the main parts of this bill. First nation and Métis governments were outraged, as were those who support the transfer of powers. Given that those of us on this side of the House are open to any and all suggestions that could deliver tangible results for the people, we will be supporting this bill so that it is referred to committee, where it can be improved. That is our intention on this side of the House.

When the bill is studied in committee, the NDP will do what the government has yet to do: we will listen to the first nation governments from the north and we will propose amendments based on their testimony and observations.

We are very grateful to the first nations governments of the Northwest Territories for taking a stand, and we will work as equals with our first nations partners to improve the bill. We hope that the Conservatives will do the same.

There is an important aspect of this whole discussion that relates to our notion of consultation in this country. When Canada's aboriginal peoples speak of consultation and accommodation with respect to their rights, they are not indulging in political whims. The Government of Canada and the Crown have a constitutional duty to consult with aboriginal peoples and seriously consider the concerns expressed during that consultation. That is our constitutional obligation towards Canada's aboriginal peoples.

I want to stress this because we too often come up against the failure of this country's governments to meet this obligation. We must take seriously the constitutional obligations of the various levels of government in Canada. I am including the provincial governments in this comment.

We certainly know that in some cases the Supreme Court has ruled on these notions of aboriginal and treaty rights of aboriginal peoples. I would mention, for example, Haida Nation v. British Columbia, in which the Supreme Court addressed this idea of consultation with aboriginal peoples. It stipulated that in some cases, and concerning very serious issues, this consultation may mean “consent”. This is important.

When we talk about the rule of law or the code of law in this country, it is important to remember what the Supreme Court had to say on that matter. The government must always act in accordance with the Constitution. That is the rule of law in Canada. This is what the Supreme Court said in Canada (Prime Minister) v. Khadr. The Supreme Court said that the government must act in compliance with the Constitution.

I am telling my colleagues nothing new by saying that section 35 of the Constitution addresses aboriginal and treaty rights of aboriginal peoples in Canada. It is important to be always mindful of our obligations towards aboriginal peoples.

I know people often say that aboriginal issues in this country are too complex or too complicated. However, these issues do not need to be complicated or complex. What we need—and what this government is all too often lacking—is the political will of governments to deal with these issues. With political will comes political imagination.

I will just give you an example. I do not know whether my colleagues have ever had the opportunity to read the James Bay and Northern Quebec Agreement, Canada's first modern treaty. It was signed in 1975 by the Canadian and Quebec governments and mainly the Cree and the Inuit.

Canada's first modern treaty, which is almost 500 pages long, is a very complex legal document. However, it was negotiated in just one year. This goes to show that when there is political will, when there is no choice but to resolve these issues, we are able to use political imagination.

Another important part of this debate is our relationship with aboriginal people.

I want to emphasize that too. As an aboriginal person and a lawyer, I have always insisted that the relationship between peoples and nations has to be top priority. Our relationship with aboriginal peoples here in Canada is broken. We must immediately address this matter, which is becoming increasingly urgent.

It shocks me that a government whose economic plan relies so heavily on the development of Canada's natural resources has not grasped the importance of treating aboriginal peoples as equal partners in this endeavour.

The issues of natural resources, the environment and climate change affect aboriginal people, no matter how we address them. Even in our international relations, the free trade agreements that we sign also affect aboriginal people, since such agreements often address natural resource development.

Our relations with aboriginal peoples are vital. They are the cornerstone of this country. However, the Conservatives are turning those relations into a stumbling block with their attitude, because they do not listen during consultations. It is important to point out that we need to improve our relations with aboriginal peoples because, right now, we are in a position where there is a very high risk of legal and political conflict.

It is troubling for a parliamentarian to consider that almost $300 million is spent every year to block the rights of this country's aboriginal peoples. That is troubling. It is urgent that we take into consideration the aboriginal peoples of this country. This issue is absolutely fundamental in all discussions on almost every subject concerning the development of this country, one of the richest countries on the planet. It is important that we remember this.

Mr. Speaker, you probably know the law as well as I do, and it will be no surprise to you that, according to section 4.1 of the Department of Justice Act, every law passed by Parliament must be consistent with the charter.

However, we have reached a point where the Government of Canada must also adopt provisions to ensure that every law passed by this Parliament respects the aboriginal and treaty rights of Canada's aboriginal peoples. It is important that we start thinking about that.

In closing, we expect the government to be open to the amendments that my very skilled colleagues will propose. As I mentioned, this bill is a step in the right direction and that is a good thing.

However, there are some things missing in this bill, and we hope to fill in the blanks for the government. I hope that the people on the other side of this chamber will be open to the NDP's proposals.

Northwest Territories Devolution ActGovernment Orders

5:05 p.m.

Chilliwack—Fraser Canyon B.C.

Conservative

Mark Strahl ConservativeParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Aboriginal Affairs and Northern Development

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the member's speech. I do not agree with the premise of it, however, because at every major step during negotiations the Government of Canada and the Government of the Northwest Territories undertook section 35 consultations with all aboriginal groups that were affected in the Northwest Territories. Bill C-15 was developed in consultation with those groups, northerners, the territorial government and industry. Certainly, that is reflected here today.

The member talked about complexity. What is not complex is that Gwich'in, Sahtu and Tlicho land claim agreements each provide for a single land and water board in an area larger than the respective settlement areas. The restructured board division in Bill C-15 is in compliance with the settled land claim agreements and will continue with the co-management approach laid out in these agreements. Amendments to the Gwich'in, Sahtu and Tlicho land claims are not necessary. Since 2010, the chief federal negotiator has held over 50 consultation meetings with aboriginal groups and organizations, co-management boards and industry on this very issue.

Perhaps the member, given this new information, would agree with me that in fact the Government of Canada and the Government of the Northwest Territories has certainly met the constitutional requirement to consult with first nations, our section 35 obligations, and that these land claim agreements specifically allow for the restructured board that is proposed in Bill C-15.

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5:10 p.m.

NDP

Romeo Saganash NDP Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC

Mr. Speaker, one aspect that the parliamentary secretary seems to forget in talking about consultation is the second part, which is equally important constitutionally. The obligation of the government is to consult and accommodate. They go together. That is what we seem to forget all the time when we talk about consultation, the accommodation aspect, which is equally important in this constitutional obligation. Once we have consulted, we have to take into consideration the concerns that were expressed in that consultation and fix them. That is what accommodation means. The parliamentary secretary seems to forget that aspect.

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5:10 p.m.

NDP

Jasbir Sandhu NDP Surrey North, BC

Mr. Speaker, I also would have to disagree with the parliamentary secretary because I have seen the consultation that the government does, not only here but in committee. There are often members, experts, academics and other stakeholders who come to committee and offer very valuable information that can enhance the legislation before us. Time after time, the Conservatives totally reject any sort of testimony from any of the individuals, whether it is from the opposition, the experts or the other stakeholders, the very people who will be affected by legislation. We have not seen even clerical or grammar mistakes being accepted from the opposition. This is the government's record and I hope my colleague will further elaborate on that.

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5:10 p.m.

NDP

Romeo Saganash NDP Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for his question.

The situation in parliament is quite sad. This government has had a majority for over two years, and it still very rarely accepts the amendments proposed by the opposition parties. That is sad.

In the past, other majority governments quite often accepted the amendments that came out of studies in committee and consultations with interest groups. That is not how it works now, and that is the problem.

Even though I think Bill C-15 is a step in the right direction, I am afraid that, unfortunately, this government will not accept the good amendments we suggest.

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5:10 p.m.

NDP

Denis Blanchette NDP Louis-Hébert, QC

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for his speech. I want to acknowledge all he has done by dedicating his professional life to building bridges between communities. I thank him for that.

My colleague said that results are not all that matters. How we achieve them is equally important. I would like to draw on his experience and have him tell us how we can build a better country by having communities work together.

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5:15 p.m.

NDP

Romeo Saganash NDP Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague for his important question. People often wrongly assume that aboriginal issues are of interest only to aboriginal people. That is not the case.

Getting along with aboriginal people is good for the environment. Getting along with aboriginal people is good for the country's economy. That is what the government needs to understand. As my colleague pointed out, I have spent almost my entire career building bridges between aboriginal peoples and other peoples in this country, so that we can all work together.

It is more than just a political slogan for me, as a member of the NDP. My purpose in life has been to build bridges between the peoples of this country. That is the only way this country will be able to move forward. That is something that the late Jack Layton understood.

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5:15 p.m.

NDP

Irene Mathyssen NDP London—Fanshawe, ON

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague because I believe he has important insights that all parliamentarians would do well to appreciate, listen to and respond to.

I have the good fortune of joining my colleague on another committee. It is the committee looking into the deaths and disappearances of 600 aboriginal women. One of the things that has become very clear in that committee work is the frustration and anger we hear from first nations women about the lack of response to their situation. It seems to me that in ignoring the first nations of the Northwest Territories, we are exasperating that frustration and concern.

Would the member care to comment on the fact that we have not done a very good job of listening to the needs of the community that we owe so much to in their treatment and understanding of the land and how we can move forward as a nation?

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5:15 p.m.

NDP

Romeo Saganash NDP Abitibi—Baie-James—Nunavik—Eeyou, QC

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate her mentioning the special committee for missing and murdered aboriginal women. It is one important aspect. In the entire universe, the only people who still refuse a national inquiry into the missing and murdered aboriginal women is the party on the other side. Everyone else agrees to have that national public inquiry. It is important to mention that.

The other aspect is this. I spent 25 years on aboriginal issues, here and abroad. I was part of the negotiations for the UN Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples for 23 years. One thing that is always important to remember is that the stakeholders, the people who are directly concerned with these issues, should always be consulted. They should always be partners in whatever legislative actions we intend to take in the House.