Debates of May 27th, 2013

The House resumed from April 18 consideration of the motion.

Last Post Fund

[Judy Sgro, Liberal, York West, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I am very pleased to be able to stand today to lend my voice to those of my colleagues, I hope all of us in this House, for Motion No. 422, as put forward by my Liberal colleague from Random—Burin—St. George's.

I should also congratulate the member for Random—Burin—St. George's. Since her election in 2008, she has been a tireless and constant advocate for veterans and their families. Motion No. 422, of course, is no exception. It would simply continue going in the direction that I know very much she cares about and is very committed to. She is very aware of the challengers that are facing so many of these families.

For too long, this matter has been relegated to the back burner; that is, until my colleague stepped up and put Motion No. 422 right on the table where it clearly belongs. Motion No. 422 is designed to support the Last Post Fund in ways that would ensure that it is properly funded and adequately positioned to help the families of veterans who have given us all so much.

Any effective National Defence strategy must include appropriate supports for soldiers after they return from combat. I am sad to say that this is an area that the government has clearly failed in. We continually hear, on a week-to-week basis, about the number of our soldiers and their families who are struggling with PTSD and other pressures as a result of going abroad and serving for all of us.

Unfortunately, the Last Post Fund is woefully underfunded and the result is poverty, stress and worry for the spouses and the families of our fallen veterans. This is clearly not acceptable in a country as rich as Canada. We can, and must, ensure that each and every veteran has a proper and fitting burial while also ensuring that the burial would not financially break their spouses and their families. Canada has a responsibility to veterans that cannot end with the battle. Properly funding the Last Post Fund is part of that responsibility.

Before I continue, I need to underscore that this is not just my belief. Successive veterans ombudsmen have called upon the government to revamp this program for years. Similarly, the Department of Veterans Affairs has even acknowledged the need for many of these changes.

The Royal Canadian Legion formalized its call for change in 2008, 2010 and again in 2012. Yet the government has remained idle, ignoring the need for changes to the Last Post Fund, other than the right words and the right spin. However, the action always counts when we know it is in the budget. That is when we know that someone is really listening.

Most important, veterans and their families have told us for years that the change is needed. The government has been able to ignore this for years but, today, as a result of the work of my Liberal colleague, the member for Random—Burin—St. George's, these calls are finally being heard in this House. I ask all of the members in the House to please listen to the calls for putting some proper funding in the Last Post Fund and act accordingly.

Private members' bills are supposed to be something that we can all act freely upon in the House and vote as we wish. I would hope that all members in the House would support Motion No. 422. Let us stand together to recognize the needs of many of the families of our lost soldiers.

So often the solutions we search for are complex. However, this one, Motion No. 422, is simple. It is comprehensive in its approach. It accepts the recommendations of numerous veterans ombudsmen and expands funding for the Last Post Fund. It similarly accepts the calls made by the Royal Canadian Legion in 2008, 2010 and 2012 and by the Department of Veterans Affairs. It reviews the provisions of the program to ensure uniformity and it proposes to review the means testing provisions of the plan.

According to the Department of Veterans Affairs, the Last Post Fund is an important program, with a goal to ensure that no eligible veteran is denied a dignified funeral and burial, as well as a military gravestone, due to insufficient funds at time of death. Unfortunately, the Last Post Fund is far from ensuring that all veterans in need receive a dignified funeral and burial because the program is forced to apply outdated eligibility criteria. Motion No. 422 calls upon the government to take the steps necessary to ensure that no veteran, including those who have served post-Korean War, is denied a proper funeral and burial.

The government had a chance to put this in budget 2013, but missed its opportunity to bring equality and fairness to all veterans. Motion No. 422 means that it is not too late to do the right thing. Motion No. 422 has been endorsed by the Royal Canadian Legion. Together all of us in the House on a non-partisan issue can support Motion No. 422 and see that it goes forward to rectify some of the faults of the past.

Doing the right thing by our veterans is not a partisan issue. Some have argued that it is a matter of duty of all of us as Canadians and as parliamentarians. There is no clearer message that we can send to our veterans than to stand behind our them, many of whom spent their military careers standing up for us. On the other hand, there is no clearer message to veterans that we do not support them than by voting no on this important support measure.

The Last Post Fund is a non-profit organization that administers the funeral and burial program on behalf of Veterans Affairs Canada. The primary objective of the Last Post Fund is to ensure that no veteran is denied a dignified funeral and burial due to lack of sufficient funds. This has been its mission for more than a century, but time has taken a toll on what it can do. Supporting Motion No. 422 would ensure that the Last Post Fund has the tools and the resources it needs to show Canadian veterans that their sacrifices will never be forgotten.

I call on all members of the House, when Motion No. 422 comes up for a vote, to do the right thing. We cannot ask people to go abroad, ask their families to be supportive, then lose those members and have them returned without even the right to a decent funeral and proper burial. Therefore, I ask that my colleagues in the House support Motion No. 422 and recognize the great work that my colleague from Random—Burin—St. George's has done in bringing forward this very important issue.

[Erin O'Toole, Conservative, Durham, ON]

Mr. Speaker, I am proud to rise today to reaffirm our government's full support for a program that is so important to Canadian veterans and their families.

I am proud to rise today to reiterate our government's support for this program, which is so important to veterans and their families.

I am also rising in the House today with some serious concerns about the use of the last post burial fund and, ultimately, the motion brought to the House by the member for Random—Burin—St. George's.

On one level, as a veteran, I am very happy whenever parliamentarians express pride and support for our veterans and current-serving Canadian Forces. Part of me believes that the hon. member has that intent with this motion. She has served on the Standing Committee on Veterans Affairs and I believe that she has respect for our veterans. However, I also have some serious concerns about the circumstances giving rise to the raising of this issue by the member. This has led me to believe that her intentions have not been quite as noble as she likes to represent.

To explain my concern, some important context is needed. I had the honour of joining the House after a by-election six months ago yesterday. By-elections for three vacant seats were called on October 21, 2012, which resulted in the fact that the campaigns would be taking place during remembrance week. I see my friend, the member for Parliament for Victoria, in the House and I congratulate him on his six-month milestone.

On November 6, the member called for an independent task force on the Last Post Fund and sent out a press release on this issue that she claimed she was promoting along with her Liberal colleagues. I have consulted Hansard and the member for Random—Burin—St. George's had not raised this issue previously in the House, nor had she raised it during her time in committee, from what I could find in my research.

The very next day, on November 7, the Liberal Party candidate in Durham, my by-election riding, raised the same issue as the member for Random—Burin—St. George's and launched a website under the banner Durham4Vets.org. This website had the appearance of being a grassroots third-party website in Durham at first glance, but closer examination showed that it was actually a misleading website used by the Liberal Party to raise funds for its political campaign in Durham.

The same day, just one day after the member issued her release on this subject, the Liberal Party rolled out election signs in Durham that featured an image of a soldier and further promoted the Durham4Vets website that was actually a front for raising money for that campaign. The Liberal Veterans Affairs critic, the member for Charlottetown, travelled to Durham to support this Liberal campaign strategy.

Worse still, a few days later, on Remembrance Day, the Liberal campaign laid political wreaths at cenotaphs in the small towns across my riding of Durham. These wreaths featured a slogan from the Liberal Party's website and its political campaign. In between the Brownies, Cub Scouts, schools and community groups from Durham showing their respect for veterans by laying a wreath at the local cenotaph, there was the Liberal Party of Canada and its shameful campaign.

Needless to say, veterans in Durham and, indeed, across southern Ontario were outraged by this conduct and the shameful use of remembrance week as a political tool by the Liberals. Not only were veterans disgusted by this campaign, but the Durham Liberal riding president himself actually removed the Liberal sign from his lawn. People in my riding saw this campaign for what it was: the politicization of a solemn week in our country.

Accordingly, I can never be sure whether the issue the member for Random—Burin—St. George's first raised on November 6, which ultimately led to this motion before the House, was brought out of genuine concern or part of a disconcerting political campaign orchestrated by the Liberal Party.

It is also important to note that the shameful campaign in Durham was run by Quito Maggi, a paid Liberal organizer, who is now advising the new Liberal leader. That leader, the member for Papineau, came to Durham as part of this deceitful campaign. While there, he did not disavow the tactics being used by his party, even in the face of heavy criticism from my community.

With my concerns about the underlying motive for the motion on the table, in my remaining minutes I would like to address the key issues related to the Last Post Fund, particularly because the entire funeral and burial issue being discussed is just one aspect of the fund and because it is either not well understood by many in the Liberal Party or is purposely glossed over when people are discussing this fund.

To begin with, Canadians need to be reassured that all veterans who pass away as a result of a service injury will have their funeral and burial costs covered by their country, full stop. That is an obligation Canada owes to the men and women we place in harm's way. It is an obligation that transcends politics and one that has been met by our government and, indeed, by previous governments.

The motion on the Last Post Fund then boils down to two things: first, the cost of the funeral and burial services covered by the program; and second, the means test applied to determine which veterans are in need of assistance from the fund.

Economic action plan 2013 increased the coverage of funerals from $3,600 to $7,376. This is being done at the same time that we are covering the actual cost of the burial. This level had not been adjusted in many years. The minister listened to veterans groups on this issue, it was examined by the department and the amount was doubled in the budget.

Therefore, the central thrust of the member's motion has been addressed. The issue of the means test is one the Liberals try to gloss over, as it was their government that established the present means test. In fairness to the member for Random—Burin—St. George's, she was not part of that Liberal government, nor was their current veterans affairs critic. It is critical to note, however, that many members of their caucus were part of the team that put this in place. This must be remembered amid the feigned outrage from their caucus.

The Last Post Fund was established decades ago to help the families of indigent veterans with the costs associated with the funeral and burial. That is exactly what the program does. Veterans of all conflicts are proud Canadians, and in so many ways our World War II and Korean veterans built the tremendous Canada we have today. They want their impoverished comrades and their brothers in arms who died from their injuries to be taken care of, but they do not expect this special fund to apply to all veterans. This was not the objective of the Last Post Fund funeral and burial program.

It is also important to remind Canadians that the Last Post Fund also directs other important initiatives to honour our fallen and our veterans. I would like to thank them in the House for all the work the Last Post Fund does for Canada. It manages the National Field of Honour in Pointe-Claire, Québec, a national historic site. This cemetery opened in 1930 and is a sombre reminder of the cost of war and Canada's commitment to the world.

The Last Post Fund also runs the unmarked grave program to mark the place where some of our fallen have been laid to rest. This is important work, particularly as we approach the centennial of World War I.

As someone who served in uniform, I am proud to be part of a government that supports the men and women of the Canadian Forces and our veterans. Amid very challenging economic times, our government has identified veterans as a key priority.

In the coming year alone, as outlined in our latest main estimates, the Government of Canada is planning to spend almost $785 million more in veterans affairs compared to when we took office, which was the last year before the new veterans charter was implemented.

In closing, I would like to thank the legion branches in my riding that have steadfastly worked to support our veterans and that raise constructive input on funerals and burials, much like they do on a range of issues.

I also hope that my concerns about the origin of the motion are incorrect and that the member for Random—Burin—St. George's was not part of a shameful Liberal Party campaign strategy from last fall. Maybe she did not know about the campaign signs. Maybe she did not know about the misleading website. Maybe she did not know about the political wreaths at cenotaphs in Durham and the timing of raising this issue in that campaign. There is a lot of maybes there.

If that was the case, I would ask her to work with her colleague, the member for Charlottetown, to urge their new leader to abandon such tactics in the future. All of us in the House need to support our veterans. We do not need to use remembrance week as a tool to further political interests on either side of the House.

[Manon Perreault, NDP, Montcalm, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to rise today to speak to Motion No. 422, regarding improvements to the Last Post Fund.

This motion addresses a matter that is of critical importance to veterans and their families. Every veteran deserves a dignified funeral and burial. If we want to properly recognize the significant contribution they have made to our country, then we need to ensure that happens. We will be supporting Motion No. 422, which raises an issue that is very important to veterans and their families.

The Last Post Fund was mandated by Veterans Affairs Canada to provide financial assistance to veterans and their families for funerals, burial, cremation and grave markings.

I would like to provide some more background information. The Last Post Fund is a non-profit organization that, since 1909, has been providing financial assistance for funeral and burial expenses to veterans in financial difficulty at the time of their death. It has been administering the Veterans Affairs Canada funeral and burial program since 1998.

The Last Post Fund is also a charitable organization that collects private donations in order to provide financially disadvantaged veterans with dignified funerals.

Clearly, this program is crucial to our veterans. However, a number of problems have been undermining the program's mandate for several years. Some such problems include program eligibility, which is a serious issue, and the chronic underfunding of the Last Post Fund. The funeral and burial program for veterans has been cut back repeatedly over the past few years. In 1995, the Liberals decreased the estate exemption from $24,000 to $12,015.

For years now, the NDP has been denouncing the fact that the Last Post Fund is clearly underfunded and that many families in need do not qualify for this assistance because the eligibility criteria are too rigid. We are not the only ones calling on this government to increase funding for these programs and broaden the eligibility criteria. Many other stakeholders have also done so, including the Royal Canadian Legion, the Veterans Ombudsman, the Funeral Service Association of Canada, the Army, Navy and Air Force Veterans in Canada, Canadian Veterans Advocacy, and the National Council of Veteran Associations.

In his 2009 report, the Veterans Ombudsman called for improvements to the funeral and burial program. The Funeral Service Association of Canada echoed those calls. In 2012, that association even took the time to write to every government member, asking them to ensure that all Canadian veterans could be given a dignified funeral. Members of the association were afraid that the amounts reimbursed through the program did not reflect the real cost of planning a funeral.

Despite the many appeals to the government, it has done nothing to resolve this crucial problem once and for all for veterans and their families. Last fall, the Canadian media reported that some 20,147 applications had been rejected, which equals about two-thirds of all applications received since 2006. Only about 10,000 families have benefited from the program since 2006.

So why is it that so many veterans' families are being denied access to compensation for their funeral and burial?

Our veterans deserve a dignified burial. It is not enough simply to thank them for their service and the contribution they have made to our country, which this government does so well. The best way to thank them is by ensuring that all veterans and their families have access to the program so that veterans can receive the funeral and burial they deserve.

Low-income World War II and Korean War veterans are eligible if the financial needs of their estate can be established. The exemption applicable to the estate of a veteran with a spouse or dependent children, or both, amounts to $12,015. The couple's combined assets are considered, except for the family home, one vehicle and any income received during the month of death.

All liabilities, including funeral and burial costs, are then deducted. For the estate to be eligible, the value of the combined net assets must not exceed $12,015. This amount is well below the poverty line. Veterans living alone are deemed eligible for assistance if the net value of the estate is not sufficient to pay all outstanding debts, including funeral and burial costs.

As for modern-day veterans, they are eligible for assistance only if they died as a result of a service-related disability or if they received a disability benefit. This sadly means that many of today's veterans who are in financial need are not eligible for the dignified funeral and burial offered by the Last Post Fund. This is totally unacceptable.

This is why we want the government to expand the program's eligibility criteria to today's veterans and raise the estate exemption so that more families of veterans are eligible for assistance. Prior to tabling its 2013 budget, the government made no changes to the program, which provided only $3,600 to cover funeral and burial costs.

Given current funeral and burial costs, it goes without saying that the $3,600 reimbursement was completely insufficient, especially since it has not changed since 2001 and we know perfectly well that, these days, a burial in Canada costs between $7,000 and $10,000.

We know that budget 2013 proposes simplifying the program and doubling the reimbursement rate from $3,600 to $7,376, an expenditure of $65 million over two years. However, although the government has increased the reimbursement level, it has not changed the estate exemption criteria or improved access for modern-day veterans.

Veterans' advocacy groups have been arguing for changes for over 20 years now. As a result, no changes will be made to the eligibility criteria so that more veterans' families will be eligible for assistance with respect to estate exemption, for example.

What is more, the government will not modify the eligibility criteria for the modern Canadian Forces, which are more restrictive than for veterans of World War II or the Korean War. We feel that it is not enough. The government's approach does not go far enough. We are not the only ones who feel that way.

The Canadian Veterans Advocacy is pleased that this year's budget addresses the financial issue but remains greatly concerned about the restrictive criteria for the Last Post Fund, particularly the exclusion of deceased veterans who did not serve in World War II or the Korean War but whose families need financial assistance for a dignified burial.

The group is also greatly concerned about the income verification criteria and the current formula under which two-thirds of applications are rejected. The group maintains that it will continue to address the problem until it has been resolved through dialogue and engagement because it wants equality for all veterans.

Even though the government says it is our veterans' advocate, the reality is quite the opposite. Just look at its record and the $246 million in cuts to the Veterans Affairs Canada budget. It will eliminate 2,100 jobs and close nine district offices across Canada in 2014. I would like to remind the government that all veterans and their families deserve a dignified funeral and burial. It is time to put an end to this injustice once and for all. The NDP and I will continue to put pressure on the government to improve Veterans Affairs' funeral and burial program.

[LaVar Payne, Conservative, Medicine Hat, AB]

Mr. Speaker, I am proud to rise today to reaffirm our government's full support for a program that is so important to Canadian veterans and their families.

I am also pleased to say that the federal burial fund program is working, that every year it is helping the families of veterans through a profoundly difficult and emotional time in their lives. In the past year, the funeral and burial program assisted more than 1,300 families. We were there for them, and they laid their loved ones to rest with the dignity and respect Canadian veterans deserve. Such numbers reflect a program that is achieving what it was designed to do, a program that is honouring veterans, who have done so much for our country, and assisting their families.

This debate on Motion No. 422 will also provide our government with an opportunity to demonstrate the many different and significant ways we are supporting Canada's veterans and their families, including the funeral and burial program.

A lot has been said about the funeral and burial program, but these are the facts. The funeral and burial program helps to provide a dignified funeral and burial for all veterans who die as a result of an injury suffered in service to our country. It is also there for the families of those veterans who were in financial need when they passed away. Motion No. 422 can propose all the changes it wants, but it cannot change the facts.

Before I take a closer look at the motion, I would like to place this debate within a much wider context. I would like to begin my remarks by reminding all members of something we have learned very early in life: actions speak louder and words. Canadians remind us of this every day. They do not want the rhetoric and empty promises. What they want and expect is that we will deliver results on things that matter most to them.

I am proud to say that the Government of Canada is delivering. If actions truly matter more than words, then the actions of our government are loud and clear. We are here for the Canadian veterans and their families. We are here for them in ways that, arguably, match or much surpass anything Canada has done during any other time in our country's 146-year history. This is not boasting, but by almost any measure, we have set new standards in veterans' care.

Members do not have to take my word for it. All they have to do is look at the federal budgets, because they lay it all out in black and white, year after year. In the coming year alone, as outlined in our latest main estimates, the Government of Canada is planning to spend almost $785 million more than in 2005-2006, which was the last year before the new Veterans Charter was implemented.

I could list the many things that this extra funding has supported: the creation of an Office of the Veterans Ombudsman, the establishment of a veterans bill of rights, the expansion of our veterans independence program and the restoration of benefits for Canada's allied veterans.

Still, those tell only part of our story. Our record spending on veterans benefits, programs and services is only one side of our dual approach, because we are also spending smarter. That is what the minister's cutting red tape for veterans initiative is all about. By streamlining the way we do things, simplifying our policies and introducing new technology, we are reducing the cost, actually serving veterans better and faster in more modern and convenient ways.

We are constantly reviewing every program, every service and every benefit to make sure we are meeting the needs of Canada's veterans and their families.

The funeral and burial program is a perfect example. We took the time to conduct a thorough review of the program. We took the time to listen to veterans and their families, and with budget 2013, we have taken action.

Our government is proud to be making the funeral and burial program even better. We are proud to be more than doubling the maximum reimbursement for funerals from $3,600 to $7,376. At the same time, we are covering the actual cost of burials. We are proud to be simplifying the program for veterans' estates.

We are doing all of this at a time when the funeral and burial program is already one of the most comprehensive programs of its kind in the world, because it casts a wider net to help more families in many more ways.

I believe all Canadians can and should be proud of what we are doing as a country to support and honour our veterans, proud that we are demonstrating our nation's gratitude and respect in very meaningful ways. Canada's veterans have earned that. They deserve it, and our government is proud to be delivering it for them, our nation's heroes. I want to thank all of the Veterans Affairs staff and the Canadian Legion across the great riding of Medicine Hat, for they have supported our veterans. They are working for veterans and helping us to deliver what those veterans need.

[Isabelle Morin, NDP, Notre-Dame-de-Grâce—Lachine, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I am very pleased to rise today to speak to Motion No. 422, which would improve the Last Post Fund.

My colleague from Random—Burin—St. George's moved this motion on behalf of our veterans. This proves that we are true to our slogan for the last election: we can work together with other parties.

We will support this motion, which has three major components that are important to the lives of our veterans: increase funding for the program so that benefits are in line with the current cost of funerals and burials, broaden program eligibility criteria, and help families in need who lose a loved one.

First, I would like to take this opportunity to recognize the three branches of the Royal Canadian Legion in my riding: Dorval Air Services, Lachine and Notre-Dame-de-Grâce. They do incredible work. I have met with the people from these legions often, and I have had a number of discussions with them. I thank them for a job well done.

,As I was saying, there are three major aspects to this motion. The first focuses on increasing program funding. I must concede that the last budget did take care of that. The Conservatives decided to increase the funeral service reimbursement under the funeral and burial program from $3,600 to $7,376, but only after a massive campaign mounted by the Royal Canadian Legion on this subject. In January, I received letters from veterans in my riding who were urging me to support this motion because it is something that they have been waiting for for a very long time.

I want to thank my colleague for moving this motion. However, let us not forget that, when the Liberals were in power, they reduced funding for Veterans Affairs Canada for five years in a row. In 1995, they made cuts to the funeral and burial program. The Chrétien Liberals reduced the estate exemption from $24,000 to $12,015. In other words, if a veteran's estate is estimated to be worth more than $12,015, the surviving spouse is not entitled to any assistance under the Last Post Fund for funeral and burial costs, which is odd, considering that that is exactly what my colleague seems to be asking for in her motion. I think that it is strange, but of course, people can change.

The letters received pertained to this aspect in particular and prompted the Legion to launch this national campaign. I received roughly 50 letters at my office. It is nice to see that, when people band together, they can push the government to get things moving. I therefore encourage anyone who wants to mount a campaign to use this same method—to send letters to ministers or to their MPs—because that is how to get things done.

The Royal Canadian Legion asked for three major changes, which are included in my colleague's motion: an increase in the actual amount the fund pays out to cover funeral expenses; an audit of the eligibility of low-income CF veterans; and an increase in the estate exemption to ensure that more surviving spouses are eligible for assistance.

Last fall, I had a visit at my office from a woman whose spouse, a veteran, had unfortunately passed away. She said that she did not know what to do because she was not entitled to assistance. Her assets were around $14,000, which is below the poverty line. This woman was not rich. She lived in an apartment in Lachine. She had a car and a little money set aside. She told me it was unfortunate that the Last Post Fund could not help her. Her late husband had left her around $12,000 or $13,000.

It is curious that, before the Liberals and before 1995, the exemption to be eligible for the Last Post Fund was $24,000, compared to the $12,000 it is now. That is half, which is what my colleague told me.

This woman was desperate, since she had just lost her husband. Her situation was very difficult. She came to see me to ask for help. Of course, I cannot give money to everyone who comes to see me. Nevertheless, I found it very difficult to deal with this. These Canadians are being told that it is too bad for them and that that is just the way it is. I find that very unfortunate. I feel very strongly about this. The grieving process is never easy.

Veterans have represented Canada, our nation, in peacekeeping missions abroad. They have given their time to help others in war-torn countries and places where there have been natural disasters. Some have even given their lives.

When they were young, they decided that they wanted to proudly represent their country in national or international missions, in order to help others.

I also want to say that they do not receive enough money to have an adequate funeral. I am pleased that the Conservatives' budget doubles the funding for the Veterans Affairs Canada funeral and burial program. However, I think that we need to do more.

I feel it is very important to broaden the program's eligibility criteria. As it now stands, today's veterans can access the program only if their death is the result of a service injury. As I was saying earlier, if veterans are financially disadvantaged but there is no proof that they died of an injury, too bad for them.

I would like to give an example. Last fall, 20,147 applications were rejected. The member for Medicine Hat boasted about the fund, saying that it has helped approximately 13,000 people. However, last year, 14,000 applications—approximately two-thirds—were rejected. Let me reiterate that these people are in genuine need.

It makes sense that if a person is rich, the Canadian government should not be obliged to help pay for that person's funeral or burial. However, when a low-income individual is dealing with the death of his or her spouse, partner or father, for example, it is upsetting that Veterans Affairs Canada cannot help out because the person did not die as a result of an injury.

I am quickly running out of time, so I would like to conclude by saying that, during their campaign, Canadian army, navy and air force veterans told us what they want. For 15 years now, Canadian army, navy and air force veterans have been putting pressure on the Government of Canada, both the Conservatives and the Liberals, to resolve these shortcomings.

At every national biennial convention since 1998, they have passed resolutions urging the government to address inadequacies in the Veterans Burial Regulations. Veterans advocacy groups have collectively applied pressure year after year, yet the gap between the necessary costs and the costs covered continues to grow. Frustrated by and disappointed in the lack of action on this issue by successive governments, members of the Royal Canadian Legion launched a letter writing campaign. That is the campaign I was talking about earlier.

I am quickly running out of time, so I would like to conclude by saying that we will support the motion. I feel it is very worthwhile. However, I must repeat that we feel that the program has been underfunded for many years. Changes were made in March, but they were too long in coming. I am not sure that the government's approach will actually resolve the problem.

The problems with regard to program eligibility need to be fixed; the program needs to include modern-day veterans. The estate exemption needs to be increased so that more families of veterans are eligible for help.

[Christine Moore, NDP, Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC]

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to speak today to Motion No. 422, which calls on the House to recognize that the Last Post Fund is underfunded and calls on the government to accept the recommendations of successive veterans ombudsmen who have spoken on the issue. The goal is to expand the Last Post Fund and review the assistance cap for funerals to bring it in line with the assistance given to active Canadian Forces members.

For anyone unfamiliar with the Last Post Fund, the fund ensures that no veteran is denied a dignified funeral and burial because of insufficient funds at the time of their death. Therefore, the fund provides financial assistance for the funeral and burial of eligible veterans, as well as for a gravestone. The Last Post Fund is financially supported by Veterans Affairs Canada and private donations.

This motion is legitimate because the number of modern-day veterans needing assistance when they die is only increasing. However, many of these veterans do not have access to proper funerals or burials because of a lack of means and because the Last Post Fund eligibility criteria are too restrictive and do not reflect the true cost of a funeral.

The eligibility criteria for modern-day Canadian Forces veterans are more restrictive than for veterans of World War II and the Korean War. Does the government think there are two classes of soldiers and two classes of veterans? All veterans deserve a dignified burial.

As a veteran myself, I believe it is important to recognize people's service, regardless of when they served. Holding dignified funerals is essential to acknowledging the service these people rendered to our country. Generally speaking, the population is aging, and more and more seniors are finding themselves in a precarious financial situation. When they die, it is important to recognize all the work they did for our country.

The office of the ombudsman made a number of recommendations in that regard. The most recent report is from 2009. It outlines many of the problems and concerns with the administration and funding of the funeral and burial assistance program.

The report indicates that the level of funding for veterans' funerals has not kept pace with the rising costs of funerals and should be increased to reflect industry standards. The report suggests that the administration of funeral and burial expenses is unduly bureaucratic and that the process should be changed.

It says that the program should be extended to all veterans. The estate exemption for the means test is not in line with present-day income and cost levels and should be increased to reflect reality. According to the report, many veterans' families are unaware of the program and it should be afforded greater exposure and visibility. Finally, the report finds that the timeframe for making application to the program is too restrictive and should be extended to allow consideration for special circumstances affecting grieving families.

Veterans must meet certain service-related criteria to qualify for the program. Not every veteran qualifies. Veterans of the First World War, the Second World War and the Korean War qualify. Other veterans qualify if the cause of death is directly attributable to service-related injuries or if they are in receipt of earning loss benefits under the new veterans charter. Their eligibility is much more restrictive, and according to veterans' rights groups, does not reflect reality.

The Last Post Fund, the Royal Canadian Legion, the former Veterans Affairs Canada-Canadian Forces Advisory Council, and the Funeral Service Association of Canada have all called on Veterans Affairs Canada repeatedly to have the rules changed in order to offer the funeral and burial assistance program to modern-day veterans instead of providing it only to veterans who are eligible under certain programs.

The eligibility criteria exclude some modern-day veterans. That is not fair. We have heard stories of funeral directors who pay the balance of funeral costs when the family cannot afford to pay.

Although the Conservatives have announced an increase in the amount for funerals, they have made no other changes. The Conservatives have not changed the estate exemption criteria, nor have they improved access to the program for modern-day veterans. All veterans' rights groups have been calling for these changes for almost 20 years.

Canadian Veterans Advocacy said:

The Canadian Veterans Advocacy, however, continues to bear serious concerns about the Last Post Fund’s restrictive criteria, particularly in the sense of exclusion of deceased veterans who did not serve in WW2 and Korea yet who’s [sic] families require financial assistance for a dignified internment. We are gravely concerned about the current Means Test and the formula responsible for the denial of two thirds of applicants...

Two-thirds of applicants. That is really sad because we are talking about veterans. This means that two-thirds of veterans are denied a decent funeral.

As a country and as parliamentarians, we have to ask ourselves if this is the kind of service we want to provide to our veterans. Do we want only one-third of veterans to have decent funerals? I think we really need to look at this issue and also at eligibility for the program.

Jeff Rose-Martland, president of the organization Our Duty, also said that the measures implemented to date have not fixed the bulk of the problem. He said, “The major problem with the funeral and burial program is the rejection rate. They reject over two-thirds of applicants. There is nothing in the budget about fixing that. The Last Post Fund doesn’t cover so-called “modern” veterans—those from Afghanistan and peacekeeping and the Cold War. Budget 2013 doesn’t remedy that either.”

He also said, “Changes in the 2013 budget are just smoke and mirrors. The government put more money into a fund that cannot be accessed anyway. It is a distraction so they do not have to make the changes needed. That way the Conservatives appear to be doing something when, in reality, they are ignoring the litany of complaints about the program.”

This motion calls on the government to commit to addressing this situation, which all veterans have decried for years. I think it is really important to do this.

I hope that most of my hon. colleagues have had the opportunity to participate in ceremonies attended by veterans side by side with personnel on active duty.

A close look at our retired veterans tells us they were awarded a large number of medals. Knowing the meaning of these medals makes us realize they served in many places. However, the Korean War and World War II are not necessarily represented in the medals. Is this what should happen to modern-day veterans as well? There have been several military tours for missions in the current Bosnia-Herzegovina or the former Yugoslavia. In addition, some veterans also served in Egypt, while others participated in several overseas missions.

In my view it is important that these veterans be entitled to a decent funeral if they pass away within 20 or 30 years of service. Indeed, we hope it is as late as possible.

I feel it is crucial to keep modern-day veterans in mind, like those who served in Afghanistan for example, so that they know that regardless of when death comes, in either a few or many years, they are entitled to a proper funeral.

This is the least a country like Canada can do for its veterans.

[Judy Foote, Liberal, Random—Burin—St. George's, NL]

Mr. Speaker, I welcome this opportunity to conclude the debate on my private member's Motion No. 422, which is meant to improve on the Last Post Fund.

I will start by acknowledging those colleagues who have spoken in support of this motion and have recognized the importance of it not just for our veterans but for their families and all Canadians from coast to coast to coast.

I will also mention the very partisan remarks made earlier today by the member for Durham. I have no idea where that came from. In fact, I was astounded by some of the remarks.

Let me say that this is far from a partisan issue. This is an issue that impacts on those who have given so much on behalf of all of us. They are the men and women who have given the ultimate sacrifice, who have fought in wars since time immemorial. When it comes to our veterans, this is not the place to debate partisan politics and political issues.

I support the Royal Canadian Legion, and I want to acknowledge all the work its members have done to enhance the Last Post Fund. They had a letter-writing campaign, which happened to coincide with the introduction of my private member's motion. They worked very hard and wrote to everyone they could possibly think of and encouraged others to get involved in their letter-writing campaign. The legions from coast to coast to coast have been writing to all members of Parliament. My motion supports their efforts.

Motion No. 422 is meant to support the efforts of members of the Royal Canadian Legion. It is meant to support our veterans. Any suggestion that there is a partisan issue here or that this is being done for political reasons is totally unfair. I really take exception to that. However, I do not want to waste any more time on that, because it is not what this motion is about.

This motion is about doing what is right. It is about recognizing what our veterans have done. It is about ensuring that when they die, they have a dignified burial and funeral. That is the sole purpose of this motion.

I want to thank the government for what it did in terms of increasing the amount of money available for a veteran's burial from $3,600 to just over $7,000. I applaud the government for doing that. Unfortunately, the government did not consult the Last Post Fund, because if it had, it would have realized that, of course, it is still too little.

Someone serving today who is unfortunately killed in the line of duty would be entitled to about $14,000 for a funeral. Clearly, the $7,000, while accepted and welcome, because it is double the amount that existed, is certainly not enough to cover the total cost of a funeral. What happens is that families who can ill afford to do so end up picking up the additional cost. In some cases, funeral directors have picked up the cost knowing that the families could not incur the additional hardship. Most of these funeral directors have small businesses, and we are asking them to cover the added expenses out of their own pockets.

To those who suggest that the Last Post Fund is working, it is not. I point to the fact that over 66% of applicants were denied. Over 20,000 veterans were denied access to the Last Post Fund.

I will conclude by putting a personal face on this issue. Motion No. 422 is about veterans such as Mr. Hedley Lake, from Fortune, in my riding of Random—Burin—St. George's. He was born in 1918, and after growing up on the family farm, joined the Royal Canadian Navy and served during World War II. When the ship he was on was hit by torpedo in the middle of the night and sank, he found himself in the cold water of the Atlantic Ocean clinging to a lifeboat, which was already filled to capacity, for hours. He soldiered on, and after being rescued, went back overseas to the shores of Normandy. Following Normandy, he volunteered to go to the Pacific, but he was denied, because it was deemed that he had spent enough time on the front lines. Mr. Lake spent the remainder of the war in Raleigh. Following the war, he married and continued to work on the farm. He worked at a fish plant at night. Finally, he was able to build a home for his family.

This motion is about these the types of individuals. These are our veterans. I ask all members of the House of Commons to put aside any political partisanship and vote in support of Motion No. 422 for our veterans and their families.

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Barry Devolin]

The time provided for debate has expired.

The question is on the motion. Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

: No.

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Barry Devolin]

All those in favour of the motion will please say yea.

[Some hon. members]

Yea.

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Barry Devolin]

All those opposed will please say nay.

[Some hon. members]

Nay.

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Barry Devolin]

In my opinion the nays have it.

And five or more members having risen:

Pursuant to an order made Wednesday, May 22, the division stands deferred until Wednesday, May 29 at the expiry of the time provided for oral questions.

The House proceeded to the consideration of Bill S-2, an act respecting family homes situated on First Nation reserves and matrimonial interests or rights in or to structures and lands situated on those reserves, as reported (without amendment) from the committee.

Family Homes on Reserves and Matrimonial Interests or Rights Act

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Barry Devolin]

There being no motions at report stage, the House will now proceed without debate to the putting of the question on the motion to concur in the bill at report stage.

[Julian Fantino, Conservative, Vaughan, ON]

moved that the bill be concurred in.

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Barry Devolin]

The question is on the motion. Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

No.

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Barry Devolin]

All those in favour of the motion will please say yea.

[Some hon. members]

Yea.

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Barry Devolin]

All those opposed will please say nay.

[Some hon. members]

Nay.

[The Acting Speaker, Conservative, Barry Devolin]

In my opinion the yeas have it.

And five or more members having risen: