House of Commons Hansard #268 of the 41st Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was goods.

Topics

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:25 p.m.

Conservative

The Speaker Conservative Andrew Scheer

Pursuant to Standing Order 67.1 there will now be a 30-minute question period.

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:30 p.m.

NDP

Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC

Mr. Speaker, sadly, it is not a surprise that the Conservatives have, yet again, moved to shut down debate in the House of Commons, even before the debate has started.

What is of mild surprise to me is that the Government House Leader has not memorized this Standing Order. He uses it so often, on so many pieces of legislation, that he should have it by rote now.

What is unfortunately at the heart of this is that we as the official opposition have a couple essential jobs that we must do on behalf of Canadians, and that is to hold the government to account and to check that the government's spending, which is done on behalf of Canadians, is done properly and accurately.

On spending, clearly the government has run roughshod over its original principles of actually minding the taxpayer dollar, from the F-35 to the scandals in the Senate.

On the aspect of legislation, which is the process before us yet again, the government is breaking, even further, all records in Canadian history for shutting down debate in Parliament. We attempted to work with the government on this legislation. We offered up certainty as to how many speakers and when so the bill could move forward with some progress. In that offer, the government has refused all reasonable requests, moves time allocation, shutting down debate again, which ironically enough takes longer than the offer we gave to the government, suggesting that the New Democrats are stonewalling or that the House cannot proceed.

What part of “yes” does the government not understand? What part of “Let's work together on legislation” does the government not understand?

My friend says that we should take their word. He should be careful about what he is suggesting. He is suggesting somehow that when the New Democrats make an offer, a public offer or a private offer, to the government on behalf of the legislative body in this place, it is presented in a dishonourable or dishonest manner. I am sure my friend across the way did not mean to insinuate that because it would certainly be unparliamentary.

However, at what point does the government want to be reasonable and be a government of competence rather than a government of arrogance and ideology, ramming legislation through with no consideration at all for the purpose of this place, which is to have debate, have discussion and make this a better country?

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:30 p.m.

Mégantic—L'Érable Québec

Conservative

Christian Paradis ConservativeMinister of Industry and Minister of State (Agriculture)

Mr. Speaker, I am very pleased to rise in the House to once again extol the virtues of Bill C-56.

As we know, in recent years, evidence has suggested an upward trend in global trade in goods. Two House of Commons committees have published detailed reports confirming the growing threat posed by these goods, not only to the Canadian economy but also to health and safety.

Furthermore, counterfeiting has become a priority for Canada's key trading partners and other G8 countries, many of which have taken steps to strengthen their respective intellectual property rights enforcement regimes. That demonstrates how important this bill is.

There are some very concerning numbers in terms of this problem. Just let me quote the fact that the RCMP has identified the value of counterfeit products has increased about five times from what it was back in 2005. Back in 2005, it was about $7.6 million and in 2012 it was about $30 million. We cannot close our eyes to this problem. This is a serious threat.

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:30 p.m.

Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux Liberal Winnipeg North, MB

Mr. Speaker, the Prime Minister's attitude toward democracy has really come up short. Every day it seems the government is trying to bring in time allocation, limiting a member's ability to contribute to debate. No prime minister in the history of Canada has used that tool as often as the current Prime Minister has.

We have noticed a huge difference since the government acquired that majority attitude. It is really most unfortunate and it does not matter whether it is time allocation in regard to our wheat board, which offended 20,000-plus Prairie farmers, or the budget, which has had a profound negative impact on Canada's middle class. Time after time, the Prime Minister has denied members of Parliament the opportunity to stand in their place, represent their constituents and provide due diligence on legislation.

My question is for the Government House Leader who refuses to stand and answer this question time after time. Why has the Prime Minister taken such a negative attitude toward democracy in the House of Commons in the last two years?

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:35 p.m.

Conservative

Christian Paradis Conservative Mégantic—L'Érable, QC

Mr. Speaker, on the contrary, the bill that we are talking about is very crucial. Under the leadership of the Prime Minister , we want to tackle this issue. We are addressing concerns about the health and safety of Canadians. We are talking about combatting organized crime. We are putting in place a prohibition of counterfeit labels.

Let me just quote some supportive groups.

The Food and Consumer Products of Canada said, “Counterfeit products pose a danger to Canadians. Congrats to the government on taking this positive step”.

The Canadian Chamber of Commerce said, “We welcome new legislation aimed at tackling counterfeit and pirated products”.

This is what the stakeholders think. This is what Canadians think. They expect their government to take care of their health and safety.

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:35 p.m.

NDP

Glenn Thibeault NDP Sudbury, ON

Mr. Speaker, like many on this side of the House, I am appalled at once again having to go through time allocation and having our time limited on such an important subject. I do agree with the minister that Bill C-56 is an important bill that we need to address.

In 2009, recommendations were made by the industry committee to do exactly what the minister talked about. Why is it taking so long for the government to act when we can protect consumers and Canadians a lot sooner?

At the industry committee, we heard from businesses that said cuts to the CBSA would impact and harm Canadian consumers.

Here we are again, having an opportunity to debate a bill, but time is being cut. We can bring forward good amendments to make the bill stronger, to protect Canadians, but we cannot do it when the Conservatives keep pulling the rug from underneath us.

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:35 p.m.

Conservative

Christian Paradis Conservative Mégantic—L'Érable, QC

Mr. Speaker, on the contrary, we have to act on this issue. There are stakeholders supporting this. They have put a lot of pressure on the House of Commons to get this through. It is ironic. On one hand, the opposition says we are going too fast. On the other hand, it says that we are dragging our feet.

I think we all agree on the principle, and the numbers are there. The value of these counterfeit goods was $7.6 million in 2005 compared to $38 million in 2012. We cannot afford to just close our eyes and say that everything is good.

There were two House of Commons committees that worked on this matter. It is time for us to move on. We are ready to go with sound and solid legislation, taking care of the health and safety of Canadians, combatting organized crime and prohibiting fake labels.

This is also good for the economy. We have innovators who struggle to invent new products, but when there are people who trick Canadians like that, it just jeopardizes all of their work, their time, their energy and the resources and the capital they put into their projects.

We have to demonstrate leadership and say enough is enough, that this kind of practice is no longer tolerated in our country. No one will argue against that. This is just good common sense.

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:35 p.m.

Conservative

Royal Galipeau Conservative Ottawa—Orléans, ON

Mr. Speaker, since we are all aware that time in the House is precious, I will not spend too much time on a preamble. I have two quick questions for the minister.

First, what does he think of the member for Winnipeg North who is always complaining about not having enough time to debate, and yet he takes up so much time that 55 other MPs could have spoken?

Second, what the government is talking about today, is it a surprise or is this something that we have already debated in the past?

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:40 p.m.

Conservative

Christian Paradis Conservative Mégantic—L'Érable, QC

Mr. Speaker, I thank my colleague from Ottawa—Orléans for his very good question.

As far as the member for Winnipeg North is concerned, he is grandstanding, saying that basic principles are being undermined, when this bill is very important and has been thoroughly debated.

Hon. members know what Canadians think about this. I hope no one will have the audacity to say that it is no big deal if the amount of counterfeit goods has jumped from $7 million worth in 2005 to $38 million worth in 2012. We must do something about this. There is pressure to do so and we must keep that in mind.

As far as my colleague's second question is concerned, this is far from being a surprise. Two House committees have studied this in the past. Members of the House have spoken to this issue and they are well aware of the scope of the bill.

We should be pleased today. This is about Canadians' health and safety. It is about fighting organized crime and clamping down on cheaters who put fake labels on products. Canadian innovators are working hard, investing all their energy, resources, capital and time in order to contribute to the economy, and they have to deal with cheaters.

The primary duty of a responsible government is to put an end to all this because this situation is absurd. It is time to say enough is enough. Many groups in Canada support this measure regarding the economy.

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:40 p.m.

Liberal

Wayne Easter Liberal Malpeque, PE

Mr. Speaker, is this the 46th time allocation, is it the 47th, is it the 45th? It almost sounds like a farm auction. Will it be 47? Will it be 48? Will it be 50? When are the Conservatives going to hit 50?

This the most secretive, debate-reluctant government that the country has ever seen. We could have a little contest here. We could all make offers and bets on what day and what hour they hit 50. It is getting pretty close. Yesterday was 44 and 45, I believe. This one is 46.

This is not only about what is happening in this chamber. Because of the votes on time allocation, the committee that I sit on, which is the international trade committee, has had its meetings cancelled five or six times, so it is shutting down. There are other issues that need to be dealt with, and the way the current government operates prevents us from dealing with real issues at committee. That is a serious issue, because the Conservatives are such an undemocratic bunch.

I had a motion today that I wanted to give notice on at committee. It was to ask the government to table the human rights report under the Canada-Colombia trade agreement, which is an obligation on the government and which it has not tabled as yet, and now I cannot debate that motion at committee. No doubt the committee would have gone in camera anyway, into more secrecy, and an open debate would not have been allowed.

My point is this: the government is not only preventing business and debate in this chamber, but its actions and the way it is handling closure are hurting the ability of committees to do their work.

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:40 p.m.

Conservative

Christian Paradis Conservative Mégantic—L'Érable, QC

Mr. Speaker, the answer is quite simple. I must remind the House that in 2007 the draft of the bill received all-party support at committee. These are the facts of the matter. I have to remind the member that since our government came to office, we took steps to create an effective and balanced enforcement regime for intellectual properties.

Let us remember the corporate law situation. This has been stalled for years, especially under the previous government. We had to update this law. We finally did that, and this is the logical consequence. We want to go further to make sure that down the road Canadians will know we are talking about real things. We do not play any games here.

In 2007, all of the parties agreed, so I do not know why my colleague is complaining. He should be happy. We are now putting forward a law that will protect Canadians' health and safety, combat organized crime and prohibit people from putting fake labels on products. These people jeopardize our economy at the same time that innovators are making efforts to make sure they can drive the economy and increase their exports to create wealth here in this country.

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:45 p.m.

NDP

Dan Harris NDP Scarborough Southwest, ON

Mr. Speaker, it is nice to finally see the minister up on his feet on this bill, even though it did not actually happen until after time allocation was introduced.

I would think the minister would have cared enough about the bill to be the one to introduce it, but so far we have only had about 10 minutes of debate on the bill. As well, the speech given by the member for Simcoe—Grey was, frankly, disgraceful. She could not stop laughing during her speech, and it happened after midnight. We did not get very much information, and the minister has yet to actually give a proper speech in the House of Commons defending this bill and explaining why it is important for the government to pass it.

Several parts of the bill deal with the anti-counterfeiting trade agreement, which raises serious concerns. Europe has said no to that, but the government is implementing some of those measures in this bill. The numbers the minister mentioned in terms of going from $7 billion to $38 billion are, of course, anecdotal. We have been calling for years for stronger reporting measures to accurately capture how much is being lost to counterfeiting; the government has not yet taken any action on that issue, nor has it put anything into the bill to strengthen the data that we are going to receive.

Why did the minister not feel the bill was important enough to merit a full speech on it before time allocation was brought in?

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:45 p.m.

Conservative

Christian Paradis Conservative Mégantic—L'Érable, QC

Mr. Speaker, first of all, I must remind my colleague that our government's bill is a made-in-Canada solution that draws from international best practices. What he raises from Europe is just not relevant here. We addressed the issue here; he knows the concerns that were raised in Europe are not part of this bill.

As I said, all of the parties supported the bill at committee in 2007. I do not know why the member tries to slow things down when we know that this measure is desperately needed.

I am very happy that the member for Simcoe—Grey stood in the House, given her knowledge and her skills, and said that we have to take care of the health and safety of Canadians. It is shameful that the member tries to disqualify the member. She had a good speech, and the words that he used are just shameful.

We have to make sure that we take care of the health and safety of Canadians, and we will not make excuses for that.

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:45 p.m.

Conservative

Erin O'Toole Conservative Durham, ON

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank the minister for his remarks here today.

I am in the fortunate position that some years ago I worked as a lawyer on anti-counterfeiting operations for a company that was experiencing millions of dollars of losses from counterfeiting of branded products, some of those products made in Canada. Those products lead to jobs, and if the member for Scarborough Southwest is looking for a good speech on this, he can come and join me at 10 o'clock this evening and I will entertain him with private sector anecdotes about how important the bill is for our economy.

Reports from the Retail Council of Canada and the Chamber of Commerce have shown that organized crime is generally behind a large portion of counterfeiting operations in North America and around the world. Not only is this a public safety issue, but it could represent a reduction in the proceeds going to organized crime. I wonder if the minister would like to comment on that positive aspect of the bill.

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:45 p.m.

Conservative

Christian Paradis Conservative Mégantic—L'Érable, QC

Mr. Speaker, absolutely, and I thank my colleague for his good question, because indeed this is what we are talking about here. We are talking about people tricking Canadians, and organized crime is behind it, big time.

It is harmful for Canadians. It jeopardizes health and safety. It also jeopardizes the economy when honest people try to innovate, create new products, find export markets and create wealth, and then have to fight against cheaters like that. It is simply not acceptable.

I am a lawyer by training, and I know exactly what my colleague is talking about. When customers come to the office and they are trying to compete against cheaters, of course we have to ensure that the law can address these issues.

That is what this bill would do. It would give border officers the authority to detain suspected commercial shipments and contact the rights holders. It would allow Canadian businesses to fill a request for assistance with the Canada Border Service Agency, in turn enabling border officers to share information with rights holders regarding suspicious shipments; provide new criminal offences for the commercial possession, manufacture or trafficking of counterfeit trademark goods; provide legitimate owners with new tools to protect their rights and take civil action against infringers; create new offences for trademark counterfeiting; and provide better tools to investigate commercial counterfeiting.

This is what Canadians expect. These are real tools. We will be able to address this problem better and hopefully combat organized crime more efficiently.

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:50 p.m.

NDP

Alain Giguère NDP Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC

Mr. Speaker, this bill is very interesting. This is obviously a critical issue for Canada. Just imagine the horrible impact that counterfeit drugs can have on the health of many Canadians. Imagine if thermostats caused fires. We need a law to address this problem.

The problem is that this bill is like so many others. It is not merely an act; it is an act of faith. People seem to think it was divinely inspired and therefore cannot be changed. That attitude makes it hard to debate the issue. The problem is that the minister seems to be saying that this bill is important and we have to pass it quickly.

If this bill is so important and so pressing, why on earth did they wait three months to introduce it in the House? They are introducing it at the end of June, and they expect us to vote on it right away.

Did it not occur to them to introduce it two or three months ago so that we could have had a positive, useful debate on it?

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:50 p.m.

Conservative

Christian Paradis Conservative Mégantic—L'Érable, QC

Mr. Speaker, how nice to hear a New Democratic colleague acknowledge the virtues of this bill. This bill is good, and other bills are good too. We implemented an economic action plan in 2008-09 to tackle the global recession, and we continued that work in 2010-11. Now we have to curb spending and continue to implement positive economic measures.

I would like to remind my colleague that all parties supported the first version of this bill in 2007. There is nothing new here. Things progress; things happen. We were not trying to surprise anyone with this bill. On the contrary, the time has come to take a look at this problem.

According to the RCMP, the value of counterfeit goods rose from $7.6 million in 2005 to $38 million in 2012. What more does the member want? We cannot afford to wait and keep saying that we will debate this issue eventually.

The parties all supported the first version of this bill, so now it is time to move forward. We must be able to tell Canadians that they finally have the tools to take aim at cheaters. These tools will protect Canadians' health and safety.

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:50 p.m.

Liberal

Marc Garneau Liberal Westmount—Ville-Marie, QC

Mr. President, we want to clarify something on this side of the House, as we have done for several other bills in recent weeks. What we want to tell this government is that some bills introduced many years ago have been delayed for reasons that are quite clear.

For example, in September 2008, the Prime Minister decided to call an election. At that time, no one was expecting an election. Obviously when this happened, everything slowed down and we were forced to start from scratch.

I will use the example of Bill S-2, which was first introduced as Bill C-47. The Conservatives were forced to reintroduce it as Bill C-8. What happened to Bill C-8? In December 2009, Parliament was prorogued, so we had to start again.

These are the kinds of delays caused by this government. This bill was then replaced by Bill S-4, and the Conservatives sat on their hands for seven months. In May 2011 it was reintroduced as Bill S-2. Two years went by while the Conservatives did nothing. Suddenly, in June 2013 it became absolutely urgent to pass this bill because it had been on the order paper for so long.

The fact is that this situation is a direct result of their delays—

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:55 p.m.

Conservative

The Acting Speaker Conservative Bruce Stanton

The hon. Minister of Industry.

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:55 p.m.

Conservative

Christian Paradis Conservative Mégantic—L'Érable, QC

Mr. Speaker, it is incongruous to hear my colleague complaining about the delays. I would also add that, in 2007, the draft bill received the consent of all parties and should have been passed.

With regard to 2008, it is obvious that Parliament was dysfunctional. The Liberal Party was not talking at all about the economy, and the NDP was talking about hurting the economy, as we know, when we were facing a potential major economic crisis. We took measures to get through the crisis. We launched the economic action plan. Fortunately, there was a prorogation because the opposition parties were talking about forming an undemocratic coalition in order to implement measures that would have been disastrous for the economy.

We were the last country to go into the recession and the first to come out of it. We have created one million net jobs since the recession. That is a real economic record.

I believe that the principle has not changed. My understanding is that the opposition parties still approve of the draft bill. Then why not adopt it right now? We would finally be able to tell Canadians that health and safety are protected, that we are fighting organized crime, that we are prohibiting fake labels and that we are providing the tools to fight traffickers. What more could we ask for?

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:55 p.m.

NDP

Glenn Thibeault NDP Sudbury, ON

Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask the minister a question.

In 2007, which he has been talking about, yes, there was first-party support for this bill. Things have changed in six years. Technology has changed. The industry committee has been studying this bill and hearing from witnesses. To all of a sudden bring this bill forward without any debate makes one start questioning whether the minister has even spoken to the other minister about public safety.

They have cut the budget of the border security agency. There are fewer border guards to do the things the minister is saying they are able to do. There are fewer people looking at this stuff, but the government wants to increase their workload. How are they going to be able to do this? We need to come up with a conclusion that works for Canadians.

This bill has been long awaited on this side of the House. We have been talking about it. The government is saying that something happened in 2007, but the BlackBerry has even changed since that time.

We needed time to debate this in the House, but once again, the Conservatives are blind. It is about ideology rather than about making this a good bill to protect Canadians. It is again Conservative hypocrisy and mismanagement on a file that has been going on for too long.

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

4:55 p.m.

Conservative

Christian Paradis Conservative Mégantic—L'Érable, QC

Mr. Speaker, first of all, in 2007, this bill's draft received the support of the party, so I do not know where my colleague is trying to go. It is a technical change.

If we follow this logic for copyright, for example, this is exactly what he tried to say. Copyright was not changed. It was stalled. It was harmful for the economy. It was harmful for the creators. We took the leadership to get this thing ahead. The principles are there. We have a balanced approach in terms of intellectual property.

Let us talk about hypocrisy. On the copyright law, they proposed an iPod tax. This is totally irresponsible. They continued after that with their carbon tax of $21 billion on the backs of Canadians, but they do not care about that.

They are anti-trade. They are anti-commerce. They are anti-economy. We have here a sound and solid bill that would take care of Canadians. The big stakeholders, such as the Chamber of Commerce and the Canadian food producers, all agree with it.

We have to combat organized crime. We have to take care of Canadians' health and safety, and we will not apologize for that.

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

5 p.m.

Conservative

The Acting Speaker Conservative Bruce Stanton

Mr. Speaker, we will bring the 30-minute period of debate to a close.

It is my duty to interrupt the proceedings and put forthwith the question necessary to dispose of the motion now before the House.

The question is on the motion. Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

5 p.m.

Some hon. members

Agreed.

No.

Bill C-56—Time Allocation MotionCombatting Counterfeit Products ActGovernment Orders

5 p.m.

Conservative

The Acting Speaker Conservative Bruce Stanton

All those in favour of the motion will please say yea.