House of Commons Hansard #38 of the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was service.

Topics

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

10:50 a.m.

NDP

Peter Stoffer NDP Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS

Mr. Speaker, the minister said two things that I would like to challenge.

He said that those who have a problem should come forward. That is exactly what he should be saying, so that when men and women who serve their country have a severe problem, they can come forward.

The problem is that when they are serving in the military, the minute they do come forward, the clock starts ticking on their removal from the military. We have had over 200 people last year and again this year who are being removed from the military before their tenth year, which means they will lose out on hundreds of thousands of dollars of future benefits. If these men and women are not deployable, they are not employable.

The minister said that veterans will still continue to get the services they require when they need them. Kim and Blair Davis of Eastern Passage, Nova Scotia, are not getting that service. To the minister, they would like to say they have received an email, and want the minister call them and then provide the service they have been asking for.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

10:50 a.m.

Conservative

Julian Fantino Conservative Vaughan, ON

Mr. Speaker, I do want to sincerely thank the member who has, over many years, been not only attentive to this file but has also demonstrated a very caring, conscientious regard for the service, contribution, and sacrifices made by our veterans.

I will gladly take that information and personally deal with it.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

10:50 a.m.

Liberal

Jim Karygiannis Liberal Scarborough—Agincourt, ON

Mr. Speaker, I have heard the minister say repeatedly we are going to shovel their snow, cut their grass, and clean their windows. I am sure the minister is aware that it takes more than just cutting their grass, cleaning their snow, and cleaning their windows for veterans suffering with post-traumatic stress disorder.

If a veteran suffering post-traumatic stress disorder goes to one of the 600 centres that the minister is elaborating on and tooting about, the veteran will find they are Service Canada centres that already exist and that veterans have to stand in line for an hour and two to come before a clerk who says they cannot help them, but hands them a form and tells them to dial a 1-800 number.

I am wondering if the minister truly believes in what he says. Maybe the minister should tender his resignation and become a veteran, and then we can cut his grass, clean his snow, and clean his windows. Maybe he should do that, and do it now.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

10:50 a.m.

Conservative

Julian Fantino Conservative Vaughan, ON

Mr. Speaker, I can certainly give the member assurances that we will do everything in our power to look after veterans. There is a very concerted effort to upscale the training and so forth at Service Canada offices, and in the areas where the eight offices, or nine offices now, are being closed, there will be dedicated Veterans Affairs Canada personnel at those offices.

I cannot imagine how negative that statement is. In the context of the member's comments referring to veterans and their inability or lack of due diligence in managing their financial affairs, it is so disparaging of people who are trying to help veterans and who are helping veterans. The member referred to his view of that when said it is like hanging a case of beer in front of a drunk, who would go and spend it either on trying to buy a house or a fast car or on booze and addiction.

It is quite hypocritical for people to be speaking out of both sides of their mouths, and the member seems to be doing that.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

10:55 a.m.

Brampton—Springdale Ontario

Conservative

Parm Gill ConservativeParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Veterans Affairs

Mr. Speaker, let me start by thanking the hon. minister for his very passionate speech and his dedication and commitment toward helping Canada's veterans every single day.

I have the opportunity to work alongside him and I can assure everyone that the minister puts his heart in every single day in terms of looking at ways to better the benefits and services we provide to Canada's veterans.

One of the things the minister mentioned in his speech was the initiative brought forward by him and by our government in the fall, which is priority hiring for injured veterans. I am wondering if the hon. minister could highlight some of the benefits of that initiative that our injured veterans will benefit from.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

10:55 a.m.

Conservative

Julian Fantino Conservative Vaughan, ON

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank the hon. member for his question. I am pleased to provide some clarity.

We have endeavoured to take into account the tremendous assets of the training, leadership skills, organizational skills, and background that our retiring military people bring to another career. We see a great movement in the private sector to embrace the skill sets and the value of military personnel by hiring them into their organizations.

We see the same benefit within the public service. That has been the drive and the intent, and we intend to make that a success. We have had all kinds of encouragement from veterans and stakeholders internal to the government, and of course we also are partners with the private sector in this regard.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

10:55 a.m.

Niagara Falls Ontario

Conservative

Rob Nicholson ConservativeMinister of National Defence

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to join my colleague to take part in the debate today on what is a critical issue: the welfare of Canada's brave men and women in uniform who serve our country and who have served our country.

First I would like to again extend my deepest and most heartfelt condolences to all those who have been affected by recent tragedies. My thoughts and prayers are with those individuals' families and friends and with the entire Canadian military family. The government, and indeed all Canadians, appreciates and recognizes the important service that the members of the Canadian Armed Forces provide to all of us. We also recognize the responsibility to care for their physical and mental health and we are committed to providing them with the care they need and deserve.

I think it is important to take a few minutes today to highlight the incredible work of the members of the Canadian Armed Forces and the vital service that they provide our country. Being a member of the Canadian Armed Forces is more than a job; it is a way of life. Every single day, our men and women in uniform willingly put service before self to serve our country, having made the commitment to protect the security of Canada and of Canadians.

They can be deployed at a moment's notice to serve on operations either at home or abroad, leaving their families and friends and the comforts of home behind. They can be called to serve in hostile environments and austere conditions, sometimes risking their safety and lives to protect others.

At home they safeguard our land, skies, and oceans. They stand on guard to help Canadians in need of life-saving help. Last year alone, Canadian Armed Forces assets were deployed to more than 1,000 search and rescue incidents, providing critical capabilities and expertise.

They also stand on guard to support civil authorities in times of natural disasters, as they did in June of last year when southern Alberta suffered crippling floods. At their peak, 2,300 regular and reserve force personnel were deployed in support of Operation Lentus, as the mission was named. They assisted with the evacuation of civilians. They removed debris to ease the flow of water. They assisted in remediation efforts. They sandbagged areas and buildings. They repaired critical infrastructure. They also assisted provincial and local authorities in the assessment and monitoring of the floods.

The Canadian Armed Forces also assist in preventing disasters. Every year they contribute to Parks Canada Agency's avalanche control program in Rogers Pass, British Columbia, along the Trans-Canada Highway and the Canadian Pacific Railway, helping to prevent potential loss of life through unexpected avalanches.

Our men and women in uniform also do exceptional work overseas. For example, since 2006, through Operation Caribbe, the Canadian Armed Forces have been supporting the multinational-led campaign against illicit trafficking by international organized crime in the western hemisphere. Trafficking of drugs, weapons, money, and people is a major source of revenue for transnational organized crime groups and poses a threat to international, regional, and Canadian security.

Half a world away, our military has also been detecting and disrupting terrorist activity in the Arabian Sea region since 2004 through Operation Artemis.

Further afield, after more than 12 years of involvement in Afghanistan, Canadian Armed Forces operations in that country will end on March 31, 2014. More than 40,000 Canadian military members have served in Afghanistan, some of them deploying more than once. Our activities have included combat, security, development, support, and training operations in varying capacities in regions in Afghanistan. Over the past decade, the Canadian mission has seen great leaps, great heroism, yet great tragedy. We will never forget the Canadians who gave their lives so that the people of Afghanistan may have a more peaceful and prosperous future.

The Canadian Armed Forces also stand ready to provide, on behalf of the Government of Canada, aid to other countries devastated by natural disasters. Last fall the Disaster Assistance Response Team, DART, was employed to provide humanitarian support to the Philippines following Typhoon Haiyan.

At its peak, DART included more than 300 members, with a range of tasks, such as clearing debris to reopen vital transportation links, re-establishing power supplies, purifying water, and providing medical care to over 6,500 patients. DART made a difference in the lives of so many citizens of the Philippines dealing with this tragedy.

We can be proud of our Canadian Forces members that they give so much to the citizens of this country and others around the globe, but their service unfortunately comes with sacrifice and risks, risks to their physical health and to their mental health. While we do everything we can to mitigate these risks, injuries, either physical or mental, do happen. When they do, our men and women in uniform deserve to receive the best possible health care. The Government of Canada is committed to providing it to them. In fact, our government has done more than any other before it when it comes to the care of our ill and injured men and women in uniform.

As I pointed out yesterday in the House, we have increased our annual health care expenditures by over $100 million, for a total of over $420 million per year. We have created the Joint Personnel Support Units to allow our ill and injured members to work with medical personnel, social workers, occupational therapists, and others in order to help them return to work.

The Canadian Armed Forces has a solid mental health program, one that was recognized as a model by the Public Health Agency of Canada and the Mental Health Commission of Canada. We provide mental health care through 29 clinics across Canada, from Esquimalt to Halifax, and support is provided throughout the entire career and deployment cycle of a Canadian Armed Forces member.

The Canadian Armed Forces mental health strategy, released in 2013, was praised by some of Canada's top mental health authorities, including the Mental Health Commission of Canada, the Canadian Psychiatric Association, the Mood Disorders Society of Canada, and the Royal Ottawa Mental Health Group.

The mental health care program is supported by over 400 full-time mental health professionals working for the Canadian Armed Forces, and the government expects there to be even more as we continue to hire.

The Government of Canada, the Department of National Defence, and the Canadian Armed Forces take mental health care very seriously. The forces continue to work with their allies and partners in civilian health care to determine the best treatment, awareness, and prevention approaches for our military men and women and to combat the stigma and barriers around mental health care.

As I stated in December, we must continue to do all we can as a team to support our personnel, to encourage people in crisis to access our health care system, and to reinforce and promote the mental health care system we have in the Canadian Armed Forces.

This is an important message for all Canadians in all walks of life. All of us, including everyone in this room, have a role to play in eliminating the stigma around mental health issues and in encouraging those in need to seek help. Our men and women in uniform can rest assured that this government will continue to make the well-being of our men and women in uniform a priority and will ensure that those who have served and fought for our freedom receive the care they require and deserve.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:05 a.m.

NDP

Peter Stoffer NDP Sackville—Eastern Shore, NS

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank the hon. minister and the previous minister for their kind words of sympathy for the families who have suffered tragic losses as a result of suicide. I want to thank them as well for recognizing what our men and women in uniform do on a regular basis, not just at home but around the world.

I would make one recommendation to the defence minister, which he could do right now, that would change the lives of hundreds of military personnel who serve under his watch. The minute they come forward and admit they have a mental or physical problem, the clock starts ticking on their removal from the military. Many men and women in the service will not come forward, knowing full well that it means the loss of their jobs in the military. A recommendation is to either eliminate the 10-year rule for benefits, or allow the men and women who come forward to stay in the military until they have another proper full-time job, or allow them to get all the proper services and benefits and pensionable amounts they could have for the rest of their natural lives. If the minister did that, he would improve the lives of many who serve under his watch.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:05 a.m.

Conservative

Rob Nicholson Conservative Niagara Falls, ON

Mr. Speaker, we make every effort to support these individuals, to support their continuation in the Canadian Armed Forces, and to support them during their transition outside of the armed forces when that time comes and when that time is appropriate.

Our job is to work with these individuals to make sure that they get the care and the treatment they deserve and need at any given time during their careers. Again, it does not stop while they are in the Canadian Armed Forces, as my colleague, the Minister of Veterans Affairs, has pointed out. This will continue throughout the lives of these individuals. This is important. This country has had a good record with that, this government in particular, and we are going to continue to work with these individuals to give them every possible assistance.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:05 a.m.

Liberal

Joyce Murray Liberal Vancouver Quadra, BC

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank the minister for his words and the expression of the pride Canadians have in the service the men and women in uniform provide to us and to our country.

In his remarks, the minister mentioned, with respect to armed forces members who experience operational stress injuries, that the first step is for them to come forward and ask for help. I think it has been clearly identified that there are barriers. These barriers are real and are in the way of people coming forward, so they struggle with these injuries alone and with their families, sometimes for years, before they come forward.

The Minister of Veterans Affairs put his finger on one of those barriers, and that is the stigma that remains in the armed forces with respect to mental injuries.

There was a study done by the committee in 2009 on PTSD. It made an extensive series of recommendations that touched on actions the government itself could take to reduce and eliminate stigma in National Defence. I would like to ask the minister if he could tell Parliament what he and his ministry have done to address recommendations 15, 16, 17, and 18 in the 2009 report—

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:05 a.m.

Conservative

The Acting Speaker Conservative Bruce Stanton

The hon. Minister of National Defence.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:10 a.m.

Conservative

Rob Nicholson Conservative Niagara Falls, ON

Mr. Speaker, I think the member may have been cut off near the end, but I thank her for the question.

Again, removing the stigma attached to those suffering from mental health is an ongoing process and is one that, quite frankly, I am pleased there is so much more awareness of among the public. We had the Bell call campaign in the last couple of days for people to come forward. It reached out to all of society.

Yes, we have to remove any stigma within the military. Again, the Chief of the Defence Staff and those working with him are actively working to make sure that there is no stigma for someone to come forward in the military, just as there should be no stigma for anybody outside of the military.

These are changes we have to bring about in society. There has been progress, but we want to continue to see progress in this society, in the armed forces, and among our veterans so that they come forward and ask for and get the help they need. We all have a stake in that.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:10 a.m.

Conservative

Cheryl Gallant Conservative Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON

Mr. Speaker, I have to provide the correct information to the member for Sackville—Eastern Shore.

When members come forward and ask for help for operational stress injuries, that does not mark day one of the beginning of the end of their careers. Any treatment they receive, be it through the military itself or through operational stress injury social support, OSISS, is kept completely confidential. The chain of command does not have access to their medical records, and the stigma that has to be overcome is a stigma within themselves.

Getting back to the motion of the day, the opposition motion refers to “outstanding boards of inquiry”. I would like the minister to comment on that aspect of the motion and share his views with the House.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:10 a.m.

Conservative

Rob Nicholson Conservative Niagara Falls, ON

Mr. Speaker, with respect to the outstanding boards of inquiry, I have expressed my serious concerns to the chain of command with respect to the delay of these reports. I have asked the Canadian Armed Forces to make their completion a priority. I want to see the result of those, as do all the families who are affected by this.

As a result, I can say that the Chief of the Defence Staff has recently directed a dedicated team to be convened to close outstanding boards of inquiry as quickly as possible. This makes sense. This is for the benefit of everyone concerned.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:10 a.m.

Liberal

Joyce Murray Liberal Vancouver Quadra, BC

Mr. Speaker, I rise to today to speak on behalf of the Liberal caucus, along with other colleagues, on this opposition motion put forward today by the hon. member for Châteauguay—Saint-Constant.

There is a crisis emerging in the support for injured soldiers and veterans alike. This is a crisis that has led to a number of tragedies and recent suicides. I want add my words of sympathy and compassion for the families and friends of those members and veterans.

However, like so many crises, this one did not appear overnight. Over a decade of engagement in Afghanistan has created an entire new generation of veterans as well as a generation of current serving members, some of whom are now suffering as a result of their service.

The men and women who enlist in the Canadian Forces to serve their country are called on to risk their lives and often go through traumatic events.

The government and the people of Canada are duty-bound to provide our soldiers, sailors and veterans with the best mental and physical health services, as well as access to government services that they can count on. The Conservative government has not been able to fulfill this solemn responsibility.

This is a debate I think we all wish was unnecessary. Unfortunately, the government, time and time again, has put its own economic and political self-interest ahead of the well-being of Canadian Armed Forces members and veterans alike, and sadly, the years of government neglect contribute to the tragic consequences of which we have spoken.

The hopelessness and despair that leads people to consider ending their lives is a hopelessness and despair that is added to when budgets are cut and services are worsened even when a crisis, and some of the steps that need to be taken to address that crisis, is identified.

Far from a complete solution to the complex issues facing our service men and women and our veterans, the motion represents a step forward, and that is why the Liberal Party will be supporting the motion.

The mental health crisis affecting both current Canadian service members and veterans did not arise overnight. Countless independent experts, armed forces medical officials, the National Defence and Veterans Affairs Ombudsmen, and even a parliamentary committee have sounded the alarm bells and offered solutions.

I would suggest that while the Conservatives have had a lot of words about how much they care for our men and women in uniform, but when it comes right down to the actions that have been identified that need to be taken, they have performed poorly. In fact, I would say that there have been eight wasted years. The Conservatives have simply chosen not to listen.

In 2009, the Standing Committee on National Defence issued a report that provided both an assessment of the government's CF mental health strategy and 36 concrete recommendations to address the issues and gaps they found. Recommendations included everything from prevention to early identification to addressing stigma to providing support to integrating resources and finding ways to make sure that medical professionals are hired and available. The committee recommended that the assessments continue over the course of years and that the military reservists be included.

Four and a half years later, this report gathers dust on a shelf in the minister's office. Many of the recommendations, I would say most of the recommendations, have not been implemented, and there has not been a single follow-up report from the government.

In 2012, the Canadian Forces Ombudsman recommended that the Canadian Forces evaluate its capacity to respond to the PTSD/OSI challenge and to address the “palpable and growing tension between commander and clinician...relative to OSI medical treatment and administrative support”. Yet the government seems to be caught by surprise, rushing forward to claim that now it will provide solutions while remarkably still ignoring the fundamental issues that created these problems in the first place.

There is not only a lack of resources, there is a lack of care and a lack of intention to make this a priority. More than just ignoring the issue, the Conservative government has actively made it more difficult to provide adequate care to Canadian Armed Forces service members and veterans alike.

The ombudsman made recommendations to enable “…more decisive leadership of the mental health system's capacity to meet the OSI imperative”, yet we found out that in 2010, there was a hiring freeze. Therefore, the efforts made by the Surgeon General and military medical personnel to fill the gaps in medical professional care have been consistently and routinely blocked by that hiring freeze, which the government and the minister responsible chose to do absolutely nothing about.

Of the 12 recommendations made by the ombudsman to improve the treatment of injured reservists, only 4 were judged to have been fully implemented in his follow-up. That is 4 out of 12. That is a failing grade.

Contrary to its claims of unprecedented support—and more than one photo op, I might add—the government has failed to reach even the benchmarks for mental health professionals set in 2003 under a previous Liberal government, to say nothing of the new levels now needed after over a decade of engagement in Afghanistan, including in some of the most dangerous terrain.

The Canadian Forces ombudsman's report in the fall of 2012 warned the government then that it had never reached the 2003 goal of 447 mental health workers. We knew what was needed to support injured armed forces members. We knew that back in 2003, and the level of support needed has only gone up. However, the Vice Chief of the Defence Staff, when questioned at the House of Commons committee on national defence, recently admitted that he is “very concerned about the capacity we have” to treat injured soldiers, given the government's Canadian Armed Forces budget cuts.

In September 2012, a national defence press release boasted about how funds earmarked for additional mental health workers were “identified personally by Minister MacKay”. At the time of the press release, 378 mental health professionals were employed. Remember, the goal set in 2003, before the primary operational period in Afghanistan, was 447. We had 378 of those positions filled, and now 18 months later, what has happened? The government has hired a measly 10 more. As of last month, 388 positions were filled. It is far short of what is needed, and the gap is costing lives.

The Conservative government may be earmarking the funds; it claims that it has the funds and that it has added funds, but it is making it impossible for the Department of National Defence to spend them. In their frustration, defence sources have gone to the media to share their frustration and alarm. According to a recent report in the Canadian press:

Even though the positions were identified and money earmarked, every potential hire—both contract and public service—has been subject to an increasing level of scrutiny....

Rather than being able to hire the staff they know they need, they are instead forced to justify every application in writing, put it up several chains in the department's bureaucracy and put it before a committee of assistant deputy ministers at national defence, by which time either most of those applications have been denied or the person being recruited had moved on to another position.

According to the ombudsman, Mr. Daigle, as of today there are currently 76 qualified professionals that could be hired immediately, but they have remained in the candidate pool because of a “cumbersome” and slow-moving hiring process. The government's own hiring freezes blocked the provision of necessary medical support positions. The support is not there. Over half of the military bases in Canada do not have a psychiatrist.

These shortages are not going unnoticed. They are affecting access and quality of care, but they are also affecting morale. When I talk about hopelessness and despair, imagine the plight of a serving forces member injured in Afghanistan who has to wait up to two years to get a medical diagnosis and before that medical diagnosis is made, that person cannot access the support and services that are needed. That is the situation that our men and women are facing.

While the government tells us one story with a lot of nice-sounding words about what it is doing, the service men and women I spoke to in Petawawa certainly told another story. There appears to be a gap between what their experience is and what is said by the government and higher ranks in the armed forces, and that is contributing to the sense of hopelessness and despair.

I will draw the House's attention to recommendation 2 in the standing committee's report that I referred to, which is entitled, “Pour de meilleurs soins: services de santé offerts au personnel des forces canadiennes, en particulier dans le cas des troubles de stress post-traumatique”.

Recommendation 2: The Department of National Defence should cause an independent audit to be conducted of military patient case management practices to determine the extent to which a gap exists between expressed Canadian Forces policy and the actual practices applied to the continuing treatment and care of injured Canadian Forces personnel. Once defined, appropriate measures should be taken, throughout the chain of command, to eliminate the gap and improve patient care.

Four years ago, it was already clear that there was a disconnect between what was being said and what was being experienced. The committee said, address that and take care of it in all levels of the chain of command. What has the government done on that level? It has done nothing.

This was echoed when I met with executives at the Alberta NWT Command Legion. They told me about mentally injured service members waiting months and months for diagnosis, without which they have no access to the operational stress injury clinics that would otherwise be available. I heard how the Legion itself was paying, from its scarce funds, rent for injured service members who were being discharged from the forces, and who were not receiving the retirement benefits due to them in a timely manner and unable to pay their rent. The Legion was providing support to fill the very gaps created by the government because of a lack of intention to correct the situation.

Retired General Rick Hillier, former Chief of the Defence Staff, neatly summed up the issue when he said:

I think that now this is beyond the medical issue. I think that many of our young men and women have lost confidence in our country to support them.

How sad is that statement? How sad are Canadians to know that there is that lack of support for the men and women in uniform who serve us so well? The government is balancing its budget on the backs of veterans and Canadian Armed Forces members. General Hillier is right: this is beyond a medical issue. This is a case of the government abandoning those who have served it.

When the Canadian Armed Forces cannot spend the money it is given, that money flows back into federal coffers as lapsed funds. In 2011 alone, the Department of National Defence gave back $1.5 billion of unspent funds to the federal treasury. There are announcements of funds, but those funds lapse and are given back. There are announcements of correcting problems, but those problems do not get corrected.

To date, up to $7 billion of funds have lapsed from the Department of National Defence. What kinds of supports could have been provided with those funds?

Why does the government say it is correcting these problems and filling these gaps and, meanwhile, not spend the funds available, but turn them back into general revenues, and not hire the medical professionals needed? This is not only with regard to mental health care or veterans' offices closing down.

I would ask how many dollars are being saved by closing down these nine offices that are so critical to injured veterans who depend on that kind of one-on-one care that they have been receiving. How much is being saved? What percentage is that of the $7 billion that have been allowed to lapse from the National Defence’s budget?

Clearly, aside from the commitment to the members of the armed forces and veterans for photo opportunities, there is no commitment by the government to provide these men and women who have served, and do serve, with the resources they need. As well as the lapse in funding, the government is now cutting funding outright, across the Canadian Armed Forces.

In shocking testimony in late 2012, before a Senate committee, Lieutenant-General Peter Devlin, the commander of the army, told the committee that the land forces operating budget had been shrunk by an eye-popping 22%, a figure that does not show up anywhere in publicly available defence documents.

Training has been hit particularly hard. According to Lieutenant-General Devlin, the training budgets for the formation are probably 45% plus lower than they have been. By 2014–15, the army will have only 75% of the budget it had three years prior. Between the strategic review and the deficit reduction action plan, the Canadian Armed Forces is dealing with $2.7 billion less than planned,and less than promised, because this is a government that made a huge show of its defence strategy. It calls it the Canada first defence strategy. I call it the Conservatives failed defence strategy.

The fundamental underpinning of the strategy was stable and increased funding for 20 years. However, that has simply not happened. By 2010, the budget freezes meant that statutory salary increases were coming out of the department's own budget and forcing them to shrink spending on other things. Since then, there have been billions in budget cuts. This is a Conservative failed defence strategy that impacts the men and women in uniform and our veterans every day.

These cuts have specific consequences. The Veterans Transition Network, founded by Dr. Marvin Westwood and Dr. David Kuhl of UBC in my riding of Vancouver Quadra, has been providing valuable support to returning service members since 1999. To date, the Department of National Defence has yet to fund a single participant. Of the countless veterans who could benefit from this program, Veterans Affairs has funded participation for a mere eight. It then used this program to celebrate the government's branding and to claim credit, but in fact, eight people have been funded; not eight events, not eight workshops, but eight veterans.

In testimony before the National Defence committee, the executive director said:

They're talking about supporting our program in principle, and I'm sure, with budget cuts as they are, that everyone is starting to ask where the money is going to come from.

That is one more example of the government's inability to follow through.

Even the most basic services, such as offices for veterans to interact with and housing for military families who support those who serve, have fallen victim to Conservative cuts.

The Conservatives are cutting 781 employees from Veterans Affairs workforce by 2014–15, some 22%, as well as closing the nine veterans service centres. How is that going to improve services to veterans? Of course it is not. It is going to make things worse. Instead of supporting veterans, the government has decided to nickel-and-dime their pensions. It is more willing to spend scarce resources on lawyers defending the government when veterans have to go to court to get served than it is to spend it on the veterans. It does not take much to figure out where its priorities are: in its own interest and not in the interests of veterans and the men and women in uniform.

I want to conclude with this. The issue of supporting our armed forces members and our veterans is not a Liberal, Conservative, or NDP issue.

It is a human issue. It is a Canadian issue. It is an issue of right and wrong. It is an issue of will, intention, and action, not words. The men and women in uniform stand up for Canada every day. Why is the government not standing up for them?

The government appears willing to spend time, money, and political capital on commemorating battles of yesterday. We want the government to spend that time, money, political capital, and will on supporting our armed forces members and our veterans with the resources they need and deserve today.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:30 a.m.

NDP

Peggy Nash NDP Parkdale—High Park, ON

Mr. Speaker, in my riding of Parkdale—High Park, we have two branches of the Legion. They are both very active, especially around Remembrance Day. They are active throughout the year and are a home for veterans in our community, both young and old.

My dad served on a minesweeper in the North Atlantic. He signed up at one of those branches, in fact, way back when. Fortunately he came back from the war and lived a long and productive life. He remained active in the Legion and was always immensely proud of the service he had given and indeed the service of all Canadian veterans.

I know that, were he still alive today, he would be absolutely heartbroken that the federal government would sacrifice benefits to veterans, those who have sacrificed so much for this country, especially for a political deadline to balance the books before the next election.

I have no doubt about the sincerity of the member who just spoke. She spoke very eloquently. I do note that both in 1995 and in 2005, the Liberals also cut veterans' services. I ask the member if that is still the approach of the Liberal Party today, or would it maintain funding for veterans' services?

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:35 a.m.

Liberal

Joyce Murray Liberal Vancouver Quadra, BC

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague from Parkdale—High Park for her comments.

I am a little disappointed that the member used this time to describe a situation dating back 20 years.

We have ample ways in which the situation today can be improved, and some of those are expressed in this motion. Many are in the reports that I have referred to over the course of my remarks. In fact the key thing that is missing is that this support for our veterans and our injured armed forces members be made a real priority.

It is a priority of the Liberal Party and will be a priority should we form government.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:35 a.m.

Vaughan Ontario

Conservative

Julian Fantino ConservativeMinister of Veterans Affairs

Mr. Speaker, I am somewhat disheartened by all the negativity that the hon. member has spoken about here. It is hardly encouraging those who may be in need of mental health assistance or who may be sufferers to come forward, because the picture painted there is absolutely untrue.

I just want to ask the hon. member if she is aware that there are 38 primary care clinics available, 26 special mental health clinics, 7 world-class operational trauma stress support centres, a network of more than 2,000 civilian health care providers, and on and on.

I am just wondering how informed the member is. At the same time, I note that the Liberal record on voting for enhancements to both the Department of National Defence and Veterans Affairs Canada has been absolutely abominable. In fact, I have scores of issues here where the Liberals were not supportive. That is the party that was labelled as the authors of the decade of darkness by the very same retired chief of defence staff, Rick Hillier.

I do not get it. The negativity really should fall on the Liberals, not on the government.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:35 a.m.

Liberal

Joyce Murray Liberal Vancouver Quadra, BC

Mr. Speaker, in my remarks, I was attempting to show, by portraying the budget cuts and the petty fights with the veterans over the benefits they are entitled to, that the government has continually engaged in a climate that is not conducive to a sense of hope that is needed for our armed forces members and our veterans.

In fact, veterans have said that they are experiencing being betrayed by the government. After the minister's unfortunate events of two days ago, veterans are expressing that they are not just being betrayed but being insulted by the government. That is what the minister should be paying attention to, how to correct that fundamental negative attitude that underpins all of the government responses on these issues.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:35 a.m.

Liberal

Mark Eyking Liberal Sydney—Victoria, NS

Mr. Speaker, I guess the truth hurts, and the minister is carrying a very detailed report that our critic from Quadra has given. The truth is there and I am very ashamed of the Minister of National Defence who has roots in Cape Breton. For him not to talk at the cabinet table with the minister and to keep the offices closed, I think has been a disaster this week, and it shows.

When Conservatives are not taking care of veterans, how is it going to hinder young men and women from getting into the military, seeing how they are not going to be taken care of? Is this going to have a major impact on people signing up to put on a uniform for this country?

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:35 a.m.

Liberal

Joyce Murray Liberal Vancouver Quadra, BC

Mr. Speaker, my colleague's insight is absolutely correct. When recruits are considering the Canadian armed forces as a career, of course they want to have a sense for how they will be treated. Will they be valued and will their service and sacrifice be honoured within the forces once they complete their operational service and are veterans? It must be very discouraging.

Beyond that, the serving members themselves notice how the veterans are treated. When veterans have to go to court to get pensions, when the compensation for a severed limb is less than if they went to a workers' compensation board, it is demoralizing for the armed forces members. They do an absolutely magnificent job for us, and it is our job to provide the best possible support for them. The government is not doing so.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:40 a.m.

Green

Elizabeth May Green Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC

Mr. Speaker, I can barely believe what I am going to share with all members here today, and it is from a veteran I met with last weekend in my riding. He said the problem is not just post-traumatic stress disorder. He is on a medical leave and he said he is being harassed by Veterans Affairs staff, that they call all the time and follow him. One actually said on the phone more than once, “Oh, I've seen people like you. We wouldn't want you to commit suicide now, would we?”

He actually believes officials are encouraging people to commit suicide. I know it is an appalling thing to say, but this is what a veteran said to me. The department needs to be reviewed from the bottom up and top down, to take care of our veterans. These are the words of a veteran. Members can yell at me from across the aisle if they want. A veteran in my riding told me to try to get this story out.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:40 a.m.

Liberal

Joyce Murray Liberal Vancouver Quadra, BC

Mr. Speaker, I just want to respond to the member and the leader of the Green Party. I am disturbed to hear her account. I have heard very different accounts. I have heard that the people who serve at Veterans Affairs Canada are caring, capable, and dedicated individuals, and that is the case with the armed forces members themselves.

In Vancouver Quadra we had a veteran who was waiting six months for service and told us personally that the service that is provided and the individuals were caring and dedicated, but the capacity had been so much weakened and cut by the Conservative government that this gentleman in his nineties—who was not able to be mobile without some assistance from Veterans Affairs—was housebound for six months. It is because he simply could not get down the stairs, and the elevator that had already been signed off on was not installed, through lack of funds and lack of capacity in Veterans Affairs Canada.

It is not the individuals. It is the government and the lack of capacity, support, and funding, which it is withholding from Veterans Affairs individuals.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:40 a.m.

NDP

Linda Duncan NDP Edmonton Strathcona, AB

Mr. Speaker, I wish to clarify at the outset that I have the pleasure of sharing my time with the member for Saint-Lambert.

Mr. Speaker, it is my honour to rise in support of the motion moved by the member for Châteauguay—Saint-Constant. I think it is very important to reiterate what the motion says, because we will be voting on the motion and it is important for Canadians to be watching and seeing the very specific measures that we are simply asking all the members of this House to support, so that, in fact, we can provide the best possible support to our veterans who have served in honour.

That motion simply calls for the House to ensure that the men and women who bravely served Canada in the Armed Forces be able to count on the government for support in their time of need and that the government should demonstrate this support by immediately addressing the mental health crisis facing Canadian soldiers and veterans, by hiring appropriate mental health professions; second, to reverse the decisions to close the veterans offices, which it has decided to close; and third, to prioritize and conclude the over 50 outstanding boards of inquiry on the military suicides, so that grieving families may have answers and closure.

I think these are very reasonable requests. These requests come from those who have served and their families.

I also wish to add my condolences to the families who have recently suffered through these suicides.

On behalf of their families and our veterans, I request all members to support this motion.

We send our armed forces into conflict and dire circumstances. They witness the atrocities of war. Any ordinary person would probably suffer some kind of mental trauma from this. It is important that we, the members of Parliament, be here to stand up for them and ensure that the appropriate medical services are there when they return, whether those are minor concerns or whether they may lead to post-traumatic stress disorder or other problems. Many who suffer mental problems also may suffer physical disabilities because of the impact they have on their health and on their families.

We are imploring all the members of this House to carefully consider this motion and its reasonable requests. This is the least we can do for our veterans.

Many of those recently deployed to Afghanistan have served not just one but numerous deployments, and so they have been subjected to considerable stress. I, my constituents, and all Edmontonians recognize and are extremely grateful and proud of their contribution, and in particular, the Edmonton Garrison for their service continuously in the mission to Afghanistan. I had the privilege of participating in the recent memorial to their service: the installation at city hall.

I have had the honour, as well, of attending with the former minister of defence one of the repatriation ceremonies at Petawawa. I can share with members that it is an extremely emotional experience. It brings home, very clearly, the sacrifice made, not just by our soldiers but also by their families who are left behind.

It is absolutely critical that we provide the best possible first-rate health services to our armed forces.

My father served in World War II, in the air force. I never had the chance to speak with my father because, unlike many of his friends, he chose not to discuss the war. I suspect, in his time, in his generation, this was something they kept to themselves, if they were stressed by the experience. I regret now that I did not take that opportunity. However, many of his friends, colleagues who fought, and members of our family circle have often regaled us, as children growing up, with their tales of the war. One of them, particularly, was a hero: a fighter pilot who was shot down and interned. Therefore, I am fully aware of what occurred in those wars. Unfortunately, I did not meet my great uncle who served in World War I, because he gave his life in that war. There has been a lot of contribution by my family.

I grew up being very proud of our armed forces and continue to be honoured that they serve in my city. It is home to 5,000 military personnel and their families, so it is important that I stand up on their behalf and seek the best possible supports for them.

At the start of the Afghan mission, 750 troops from the 3rd Battalion of Princess Patricia's Canadian Light Infantry deployed, and they have continued to serve through that mission. As my colleagues have shared, veterans should not have to return home to fight for the health and financial benefits that they should be awarded. It is critical that as members of this House we stand up and hold the government accountable for ensuring those services are provided, and in a timely fashion.

I have been absolutely appalled at the stance of the current government. These are not the only lawsuits; the government seems to have a propensity for wanting to take Canadians to court instead of delivering on the services it should be delivering. There was the extended lawsuit that was dragged out, costing many millions of dollars. The veterans finally won that case and ended the clawback of their disability benefits. As my colleagues have mentioned, the second lawsuit on the fiduciary responsibility of the government to its military is now proceeding. We highly recommend that the government back off on wasting Canadian dollars on fighting our armed forces in courts and instead simply extend them the benefits they deserve.

The recent suicides are indeed a tragedy that could potentially be avoided. We are not saying absolutely that the lack of services is directly the cause, but any additional health services that can be provided will help to avoid a tragedy. Many in this House have previously spoken in this place about the suicides that have been suffered in their own families. They have implored that all of us stand up for more attention to supports in mental health.

I note that the Library of Parliament just issued a report on the current issues with mental health in Canada. It says that one of the solutions is more funding for mental health promotion and that investment would likely produce long-term savings. That is not just savings in dollars, but savings in lives. Very clearly this is one of those areas where we need to be giving greater attention.

Given the rise in the number of suicides among our veterans, there is an issue. It is not enough simply to say to the veterans that they should be reaching out. My experience with those who are suffering mental distress is that we need to be watching over those people, whether they are in our family or among our neighbours or in the armed forces.

Clearly, we need additional measures. There are a number measures that have been recommended by the Veterans Ombudsman, by parliamentary committees, and certainly in this House today. I encourage all members to give them due consideration.

First of all, we need to reduce the cuts to the veterans offices. I run into this all the time, whether we are asking for health studies or the impact of industrial activities, any kind of activity that is going on in rural areas. We are often told that the concentration of the population is not enough to justify the expenditure or action. We need to ensure that even if they are small offices in a rural area, it is important that these citizens also have equal access to those services. I look forward to assurances that they are not missing those services simply because they are not near a major centre. We have to remember that a lot of our first nations peoples also served in the armed forces and they very often live in rural areas, not close to major centres.

As some of the members have reminded us, the armed forces and our veterans are a unilateral federal responsibility. There is a deep concern, for example, with the hospitals and the long-term care centres, such as the Kipnes Centre for Veterans in Edmonton. I am very proud it exists; it is a fantastic centre. It is very important that we think about the future of those services.

We have a good number of veterans returning home. As we have lost World War I veterans and we are slowly losing the World War II veterans who will not be using those services anymore, it is important that those high-quality services be available to all our veterans. They should all be equal in the way we treat them when they return.

A very dear friend of my father was living at the Kipnes Centre, and I had a chance to visit him there. He was very upset because his wife, who was not a member of the armed forces, could not live with him, and he therefore entered into a deep depression.

There are many policies that merit being looked into again. With a small expenditure of money, we may be able to serve our veterans in a better way. A 1-800 number is not sufficient. I get complaints all the time in my office about 1-800 numbers to other services, such as pensions, immigration and so forth. Let us ensure the veterans are better looked after.

I would like to close with a quote from the member for Sackville—Eastern Shore that he shared with us before the Christmas break. It was on the tombstone of a fallen World War I soldier. It says, “This Canadian soldier left his home so that you can live in yours”.

That is something for us to keep in mind. It is very important that we make sure these services are available to all of our veterans.

Opposition Motion—Canadian ForcesBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:50 a.m.

Liberal

Jim Karygiannis Liberal Scarborough—Agincourt, ON

Mr. Speaker, I want to share this with my colleague and get her comments. I had a situation where I needed to call Veterans Affairs. I called 411 and got the number. After 4:30, the response was “Thank you for calling Veterans Affairs. If this is an emergency dial 911 or go to the closest hospital.” What if a veteran who is suffering from post-traumatic stress disorder and is contemplating suicide, and there are a lot of triggers there, calls that number?

I am wondering if my colleague has any thoughts or anything to share about how this veteran would react.