House of Commons Hansard #142 of the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was young.

Topics

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

4:40 p.m.

Conservative

Scott Armstrong Conservative Cumberland—Colchester—Musquodoboit Valley, NS

Mr. Speaker, far be it from me to do an end run. The finance minister has not put forward the budget yet for next year. We will have to wait and see what is contained in that budget. However, I can say that the focus of this government is jobs, growth, and prosperity for this nation.

I am sure that the Minister of Finance and the Prime Minister, when they were putting together this budget, consulted with people all across this country, and I know MPs from our party are doing constant budget consultations. When I do budget consultations, I am hearing from employers in my riding that they need to have a more highly skilled and developed workforce, a youth workforce that can take the jobs that they are offering.

I am sure that in the upcoming budget there will be continued support for the youth employment strategy and continued support for the programs that are in that strategy: the career focus program, the skills link program and the Canada summer jobs program. However, I think we will also see a continued support for what we have done since the economic action plan in 2008, whereby a greater focus will be put on ensuring that the focus for the summer jobs program is on the skills that are going to be needed to fill the jobs of the future.

There are 300,000 jobs in the construction trades and 150,000 jobs in mining, and many other of the skilled trades are going to be needing literally hundreds of thousands of young Canadians who are trained. I think we will see this government continuing to support that. I hope the opposition, when the time comes to vote for the budget, will support those measures. They are for the good futures of our young people in Canada.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

4:45 p.m.

Conservative

Larry Maguire Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

Mr. Speaker, it is a privilege to be here today and to speak to this issue.

Our government is committed to helping young people participate in the labour market. In fact, we agree with the recommendations of the finance committee's recent report on youth employment.

Canada's future success is very much dependent on the academic and economic success of our young people. Our government is keenly focused on creating jobs, growth and economic prosperity.

That said, we are very aware of the fact that it is not the government's job to create jobs. We need to help young Canadians actually get the jobs that are available.

From helping youth access education to encouraging entrepreneurship, we offer a wide range of supports to youth. Since 2006, our government has helped over six million youth obtain skills, training, and jobs, and there is still more to do. Today I am going to focus on the programs we offer to apprentices in the skilled trades.

First let me say a few words about the growing labour market demand for skilled trade workers. BuildForce Canada tells us that the construction sector will need 300,000 new workers in the next 10 years, that the mining sector will need 145,000 more workers over the next 10 years, and that the petroleum sector will need up to 150,000 workers by 2022.

The Canadian Chamber of Commerce cites estimates that there will be 550,000 unskilled workers who will not be able to find work by 2016. By 2021, the chamber says that the number of unemployed unskilled workers could be well over a million.

At the same time, the Department of Employment and Social Development estimates that there will be 5.8 million job openings over the next decade, of which two-thirds will be in high-skilled occupations requiring a post-secondary education or management skills.

The Canadian Council of Chief Executives, the Canadian Chamber of Commerce, and the Canadian Federation of Independent Business all say that skills shortages are the greatest obstacle they face right now.

The problem is further complicated because workers of the baby boom generation are beginning to retire, taking their skills with them. Over the next decade, the Department of Employment and Social Development estimates that 4.3 million existing positions will be freed up, mainly as a result of workers retiring. The largest number of retirements will be in occupations requiring college education or skilled trades training.

In certain sectors and regions of our country the demand for skilled trade workers is growing, yet at the same time, 13.7% of young Canadians were unemployed in 2013. There is obviously a disconnect here, and I spoke of it during my byelection last fall. The question is, how do we address it?

We need to give young Canadians the right kind of labour market information. They need to know the real value of a job in the skilled trades. Somehow we have come to see getting a university degree as the only way to get a good job. While earning a bachelor's degree can lead to a well-paying job, it will not prepare people for many of the jobs available in the trades. We need to start giving jobs in the trades the same respect that we give to other occupations. I always have, but this respect is being heightened nationally at this time, and we need to send that message to young people. The youth unemployment rate is too high. It is unacceptable.

The good news is that we can bring that rate down, because job opportunities do exist for Canadians with the right skills. Therefore, to encourage more participation in the trades, we included support for apprenticeship training in all our federal budgets, including the most recent one.

Currently we have a number of financial supports available to apprentices. First, we offer the apprenticeship incentive grant, which is a $1,000 taxable cash grant for apprentices who complete the first and/or second level of their apprenticeship program in a designated Red Seal trade. Through this grant, apprentices can receive up to $2,000.

Second, we offer the apprenticeship completion grant. This is a $2,000 taxable cash grant for apprentices who successfully complete their apprenticeship training and receive their journeyperson certification in a designated Red Seal trade.

By combining these two grants, apprentices who complete their apprenticeship training in a designated Red Seal trade and become certified journeypersons may be eligible to receive up to $4,000.

To date the government has issued more than 500,000 apprenticeship grants and has provided nearly $700 million in support to apprentices to help them pursue and complete their training programs. In Brandon—Souris alone we have had 477 apprentices receive these apprenticeship completion grants since 2009. It is very effective.

Apart from the grants, the government also offers tax credits and deductions to apprentices and their employers. These include the apprenticeship job creation tax credit for employers who hire apprentices; the tradesperson's tools deduction tax credit, which allows apprentices and tradespeople to deduct the cost of their tools; and the tuition tax credit for certification and examination fees, which allows apprentices to recover some of the cost of their examination fees.

In addition to these existing incentives, we expanded the Canada apprentice loan. When the apprentices are doing their formal block training, they will be able to apply for up to $4,000 in interest-free loans. At least 26,000 apprentices are expected to benefit from the Canada apprentice loan in the first year.

I think I have demonstrated that our government provides a full range of supports to apprentices. However, financial support is not enough. There is also the issue of labour mobility.

Because skilled trades shortages are restricted to certain sectors and regions, it is vital that workers are able to move to where they are needed and have their qualifications recognized. Harmonizing apprenticeship requirements across the country will help create new opportunities in skilled trades across all of Canada. We have to coordinate our efforts in the provinces and territories to facilitate labour mobility, not restrict it, and our government is doing just that.

The Atlantic provinces are currently leading the way on this front. In January 2014, New Brunswick, Nova Scotia, Prince Edward Island, and Newfoundland and Labrador agreed to remove the barriers created by different training and certification requirements for apprentices in that region. So far they have harmonized requirements for 10 trades, including bricklayers, instrumentation and control technicians, and construction electricians. This is a great step forward.

The provinces have agreed to recognize each other's requirements or otherwise reconcile any unnecessary differences in their standards and regulations. This will help more Canadians get the training they need for in-demand, well-paying jobs in the skilled trades. Hopefully it will encourage more young people to pursue this career path as well.

In addition to problems with labour mobility and harmonization, there are other barriers to pursuing a career in the skilled trades. At the end of 2012, there were 360,000 people enrolled in more than 300 apprenticeship training programs, but typically only half of them complete their training and move on to get their journeyman's certificate. This may be because it is costly for young people to leave their good-paying jobs as apprentices to go do their formal technical training. That is why we will soon launch a research pilot project to support flexibility in apprenticeship training. The idea is that instead of obliging apprentices to leave the workplace and move to a college for two months of technical training, we could find innovative ways to deliver this training in a more convenient way by putting it online, for example.

Young people are the future of our country.

We have new mining projects opening up in Quebec, offshore oil in Newfoundland and Labrador, and potash oil and gas in Saskatchewan, just to name a few. We are going to need skilled, qualified workers to support those projects in the natural resources industry. That is why our programs are increasingly focused on apprenticeship in the skilled trades. The skilled trades are where the jobs of the future will be, and those are the kinds of jobs we need more young people to pursue.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

4:55 p.m.

NDP

Mike Sullivan NDP York South—Weston, ON

Mr. Speaker, I am going to ask my colleague basically the same question I asked his colleague. Two budgets ago, in 2013, the then finance minister stated that this government would introduce the concept of attaching apprenticeships to infrastructure spending. In other words, they would put their money where their mouth was with regard to creating jobs for young people. To date, that has been an empty promise, because nothing has been done.

We have tried to get the provincial government in Ontario to do the same thing, but it has failed.

More concerning here is that the finance minister actually put in a budget that infrastructure spending would include the ability to create apprenticeships as part of the requirement for the infrastructure spending.

I wonder if the member would comment on why his government has failed to follow up on that budgetary promise made by the previous finance minister.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

4:55 p.m.

Conservative

Larry Maguire Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

Mr. Speaker, the assumption is that the infrastructure is not being built in Canada, but it is. We have tremendous infrastructure projects going on in Canada. Exactly the types of programs I outlined in my presentation today are the reason young people are able to access the trades, whether it is welding or electronics. The pipeline industry in western Canada comes to mind. Right now, all across Canada, particularly in that area, there are a great many of the apprenticeship programs I just spoke about, where the government is giving $1,000 for the apprenticeship programming incentive for each of the first two years of those courses and another $2,000 upon completion of those courses.

The premise of the individual's question is suspect. There is tremendous growth in the job market in Canada. We have had over 1.1 million new jobs, virtually full-time. As we can see from the type of work that is available, there are thousands to come, too.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

4:55 p.m.

Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux Liberal Winnipeg North, MB

Mr. Speaker, my colleague and I share the same home province. One of the big issues in Manitoba, when it comes to youth unemployment, is our first nations and aboriginal people. There is a huge need there. Many complicated areas need to be discussed in consultation with different individuals, particularly first nations leaders, to come up with apprenticeship programming, even at the high school level. We need to get more engaged so that our youth can have better opportunities for employment.

I wonder if my colleague could comment on how important apprenticeships and high school education are.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

4:55 p.m.

Conservative

Larry Maguire Conservative Brandon—Souris, MB

Mr. Speaker, the member for Winnipeg North is correct with regard to the importance of the aboriginal community in our society, particularly in Manitoba, which has the second-highest rate of aboriginal growth in Canada. That is why the very programs I have outlined are so important. Everyone is eligible to access these programs.

We have a situation where there is a lot of growth in those areas, but there is a lot of growth in job opportunities as well. A number of first nations youth in the area I represent have gone into those areas. My colleague has experience in that area as well as a result of his days in the Manitoba legislature.

These apprenticeship courses are designed to help feed into the need of those individuals to get jobs in our society, not just in Manitoba but across Canada.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5 p.m.

NDP

Jinny Sims NDP Newton—North Delta, BC

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to have the opportunity to stand today and speak to the sixth report of the Standing Committee on Finance.

I would like to thank my colleagues for their work on this. I would like to thank the member for Skeena—Bulkley Valley, a hard-working MP, full of energy and passion, who is very devoted to this file and really does an amazing job back in his riding as well. I would also like to thank the member for Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques and the member for Victoria.

I would also like to thank the witnesses who participated in this study. It has led to some important recommendations. Although we are pleased to support the report as a whole, we would be remiss if we did not focus on some of the major challenges youth in Canada are facing in today's labour market, points to which I worry my colleagues across the way are not paying enough mind. We have the words; we need the action.

Since the Conservative government came to power, and over time, it has become apparent that youth employment is not a priority for the government.

I door-knock in my riding almost every weekend. Let me tell members that our youth are hurting. Young people in Surrey and their parents and grandparents all tell the same story. I am sure that MPs from coast to coast are hearing similar stories. It is our youth looking for work and parents and grandparents wanting them to have decent paying jobs so they are not helping to subsidize them. They want to see their children on their feet.

As the official opposition critic for employment and social development, I am deeply troubled when I meet youth who have good grades, who have studied hard, and who are passing out resumes left, right, and centre yet cannot get jobs at all, or at least cannot get decent hours or decent pay.

To this day, as stated in the committee's main report, Canadian youth still suffer from the effects of the economic crisis. While employment growth for Canadians as a whole was not sufficient to recover lost jobs during the crisis, young people have been particularly affected. More than 455,000 jobs for people under 25 have been lost since before the recession, and the youth unemployment rate is now double that of the population aged 25 years and older.

As Amy Huziak, from the Canadian Labour Congress, said:

Recessions are always harder on young workers, but we are nearly five years past the end of the last recession and there's still no recovery in sight for young workers.

There has not been any pick-up with respect to jobs for the cohort aged15 to 25 in this country. It does not seem right that we have missed an opportunity to get youth back into the labour market. This is where we need to focus right now.

My New Democrat colleagues and I are deeply concerned about the current labour market situation for young Canadians, and we refuse to accept soaring levels of youth unemployment as normal. It is not enough to say to our youth to just go volunteer more and work for nothing. The federal government has a responsibility to help create jobs for young people. It requires collaborating with the provinces on training, apprenticeships, and education. Why is the government not showing leadership and doing just that?

Of course, education is a major factor in social mobility. About five hours ago, I met with students from Kwantlen Polytechnic University and Vancouver Island University in my beautiful home province of British Columbia. They are very concerned. Youth are accepting unpaid internships in the hopes of eventually securing employment with that employer. However, unpaid internships do not pay off student debt, and they do not allow young people to move forward out of their parents' homes into homes of their own to live modestly but independently.

The pursuit of post-secondary education means that young people are able to increase their opportunities in the labour market as well as their conditions of employment. However, an increasing number of students have trouble repaying their loans, and so many are deterred from furthering their education for fear that it may result in insurmountable debt.

We have all heard stories of the growing debt students have after graduating from post-secondary institutions, in many cases, much higher than the price of the first house I bought when I graduated. Too many young workers are unemployed. The unemployment rate for youth was estimated at 27.7% last year.

There are also troubling gaps between the graduation rates of aboriginal and non-aboriginal students, so we need to establish some programs to address these issues. The post-secondary graduation rate on reserves is about 14.4% compared to 39.1% for the non-aboriginal population. Even more troubling is the fact that high school graduation rates are just 36.8% on reserves compared with 66.8% for the broader population.

The first nations population is young and growing fast. Fully half of the population of 930,000 is under the age of 25 and, as it stands, the majority of first nations youth have not graduated high school. Unfortunately, the government consistently underfunds first nations education and schools. In my previous life, I had the privilege to visit some of the schools in these communities and I was outraged at the standards of the buildings, which appeared to me more like what one would expect in third world countries rather than in a developed wealthy nation like Canada.

Youth face competition in the labour market with the growth of the temporary foreign worker program. As we know, the government opened up the floodgates without too much regulation and when it got caught, it tried to do a bit of damage control. Temporary foreign workers admitted under the low-skilled occupation stream are actually competing directly with young people. All year long, case upon case has been highlighted in the media from coast to coast to coast. We are all familiar with the infamous example of the McDonald's in Victoria ignoring local students, not hiring them and giving them reduced hours in favour of paying lower wages to foreign workers. Heartbreakingly, this was one example of a countrywide crisis.

One of the issues brought forward in the material provided by the students who came to see me earlier this afternoon was that of data or, rather, the lack of it. There is a serious data shortage in Canada right now. As I have said tongue in cheek many times in the House, it is as if the government is allergic to data and evidence-based decision making. It does not seem to want to have that kind of information get in the way of its own agenda.

I want to spend a bit of time expressing my particular support for recommendation 9 of this report, which states:

That the federal government collect data on unpaid internships in Canada and work with the provinces and territories to ensure the appropriate protections under relevant labour codes. Moreover, the government should study the impacts of unpaid internships.

I grew up in England and in school we were encouraged to volunteer and get involved in the community. I was involved with Meals on Wheels. I would read at a local hospital. I got involved with the Duke of Edinburgh program. I did a variety of volunteer work, but that was on the side. Surely we should not tell young people, who have finished their university and have huge debt loads, that they need about a year's worth of experience and they should work for nothing for a year somewhere. We really have to pay attention. I do not think we have enough data to even begin to understand how serious this situation is, so data collection becomes important.

Logic alone suggests that if people are doing jobs and not being paid for them, they are not going to have money. If they are devoting their time to unpaid internships in the hopes of gaining experience that would lead to eventual employment, they do not also have time to work interim jobs to earn meagre salaries, even enough to pay the interest on their student loans. This is the conundrum for many young people right now.

However, without data, we are unable to assess just how bad the situation is. We can merely speculate and go to the stories we hear, but speculation does not good policy make. Nor does guesswork. Furthermore, we need to find out what is actually resulting from unpaid internships. Are youth ultimately gaining? Are our youth being exploited? Do they work the year and then the employer looks for another freebie for a year? All that information needs to be gathered.

In order to work effectively at the federal level and with the provinces to remedy this problem, we need to know the exact size of the problem so we can deduce the size of the solution needed. Make no mistake that I and my NDP colleagues agree that there are good internship programs associated with academic institutions and that help young Canadians benefit from a first work experience. We have many co-op programs and ones that will be relevant to and even improve their career prospect as another part of their learning package. However, the increasingly frequent use of unpaid internships by employers also poses a particular challenge for young Canadians, and it is the data associated with that challenge that we desperately need to analyze.

Unfortunately, some employers do not use unpaid internships as a prerequisite to employment and as a way to fill positions that would otherwise be paid, so for them it is just a revolving door. Unpaid internships do not necessarily lead to the acquisition of relevant experience for the career of a young worker. Sometimes what interns end up doing has very little to do with their expertise or with their background. Amendments to the Canada Labour Code could ensure better working conditions for our young people and protect them from exploitation.

Next I want to emphasize the importance of recommendation 16 of the report, which states, “That the federal government explore ways to promote youth hiring in Canada, such as”, and the NDP has been suggesting this, “tax credits for businesses that hire Canadians aged 18 to 30”. That is a positive step the government could take tomorrow. The Conservatives are really fond of making announcements in all kinds of locations. Here is one they should make, and they should stand here and make it today or make it tomorrow. This would actually benefit our youth.

A youth hiring tax credit is a practical step to creating new jobs for young people. I have spoken to business people in Surrey and to the Surrey Board of Trade, and they agree that kind of policy is a win-win. The New Democrats have proposed a $1,000 incentive that would be available to businesses that hire young Canadians aged 18 to 25. That credit would double in areas of dire unemployment. Businesses would also be able to access matching federal funds to help train newly hired employees.

The time is now. Let us do this and show today's young people that we are paying attention and that we are not leaving them behind. By ignoring youth unemployment, or only paying lip service to it, the government is actually threatening Canada's long-term economic prosperity.

Members may be aware that Germany just announced a few months ago that all post-secondary education fees in Germany would now be waived. No matter what post-secondary program people take, there are no fees in Germany. The Germans are not just doing it because they woke up one day and said they needed a new announcement. They did their research. They looked at how much common sense it made to do that, and how investment in their youth was really about the future and that their country was willing to make those sacrifices. They like it and they can see the economic and social benefits.

If the Canadian government does not act now, we risk becoming the first generation in history to leave less to our children than we inherited from our parents. As a mother and a grandmother, I cannot say how much that breaks my heart. I always tell people that I do what I do because I want a better world for my grandchildren, the students I have taught over the years and all young people in our country. I want to give them that promise of hope and of engagement, but right now many youth are feeling disenchantment.

Canadians deserve better. Canadians deserve smart investment in today's youth and tomorrow's economy. The New Democrats recognize that smaller enterprises are the job creating backbone of Canada's economy. In that vein, we launched a Canada-wide campaign to engage small businesses. We are talking to business owners about practical ideas to help them expand, and the feedback we are getting is very positive.

I would be remiss not to discuss the fact that youth with disabilities face particular challenges in the labour market. They face a more difficult transition from school to work, reduced support services to meet their individual needs, job opportunities and ignorance of their actual capabilities. Youth with disabilities are more educated than ever. However, as indicated by one witness, the employment rate of youth with disabilities in Canada was 45.7% in 2011.

When I learned that, I was shocked. The government must take action immediately to enable young people with disabilities to benefit from better opportunities to enter the labour market permanently.

Last and very dear to my heart, is that I recently have learned that 60% of students will postpone buying a house because of their debt and 40% will postpone their plan to start a family. This highlights another issue of pressing importance for young professionals, the work-family balance.

With that, I will state again in the House, and as many times I am able, that a national child care system is vital for women to enter the labour force when their children are younger. When a woman first starts out in the labour force, in the 25 to 29 year old range, the gap is not very large. It is after a few years when they have had to take leave to care for young children that the gap grows. Women hit that glass ceiling, but they also hit many other barriers and end up having to make very difficult choices, choices that not only impact their career aspirations but also impact the economic base for families.

Improving our child care system is fundamental to improving employment opportunities for both men and women. If we are to tackle poverty in a serious way and tackle the growing gap between the rich and poor, one of the key pillars in that platform to do that is a universal, accessible, affordable, regulated child care system. That is what the NDP stands for.

We are talking about youth unemployment. Recently, when I was at Kwantlen Polytechnic University, I met with a group of students. They told me that their challenges were the high costs. Education is incredibly expensive these days, but they are willing to take on that burden. The difficulty is that once they leave those institutions, it is going to be between one to seven years before they can get a full-time job in the field in which they have qualified. That just does not seem right. This is the kind of thing we need to address.

I talk to my constituents in Newton—North Delta all the time. Of the three top issues, education and young unemployment are an integral part. Honestly, the lack of a national child care system in Canada right now is a marked failure. We need affordable, accessible, safe child care in our country, and we need it now.

The Leader of the Opposition has said that we are only one election away from having child care that will be no more than $15 a day per child. That is music to the ears of people from coast to coast to coast.

I am happy to have had the opportunity to speak to this report today. I thank my colleagues for their good work and I look forward to seeing these recommendations come to fruition.

I would like to end with an appeal. Words on paper are meaningless. Let us have action.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:20 p.m.

NDP

Brian Masse NDP Windsor West, ON

Mr. Speaker, prior to politics I worked as a youth counsellor for persons with disabilities and youth at risk.

I would ask the member how important it is for there to be a federal plan for creating child care spaces and making sure they are accessible and available to all women and families.

A critical part of our economic engine is to facilitate the ability to work. We cannot do that in our current system because child care is really costly now for many people across our country, including in my own community.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:20 p.m.

NDP

Jinny Sims NDP Newton—North Delta, BC

Mr. Speaker, I thank my hard-working colleague for his very thoughtful question. I am always impressed with how connected he is with the issues in his riding and how articulate he is in bringing those into the House.

When the universal child care program was implemented in Quebec, over 70,000 women re-entered the workforce. When they re-entered the workforce, not only did they pay taxes on what they were making, but they also addressed a labour issue that was out there. Most importantly, it strengthened the family's economic base in order to make progress.

It did something else as well. We know that early childhood education is very important, and once we have quality child care that is universal, accessible, and regulated, we get amazing things happening with kids. I think that option needs to be available for every parent across this country.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:20 p.m.

Conservative

Leon Benoit Conservative Vegreville—Wainwright, AB

Mr. Speaker, I am a little confused by what the member just said. The member said that once there is a universal child care program for all ,parents things would be better. What she is forgetting is that it is in place right now.

There is a cheque that goes to parents with children under school age, which will be increased in the future. The member knows that. Does she want to get rid of that? I simply do not believe that is the way to go.

I think the member should acknowledge that a big bureaucratic daycare program like her party is proposing has been a disaster in Quebec for many families. Only a small percentage of the families can in fact access the program. The money goes to the bureaucrats, the people running the program, instead of actually providing the service to a wide range of parents.

I would like the member to acknowledge that the government has in place the best kind of child care program that goes to all parents for children. It actually allows parents to make the decision on what kind of child care they want to provide for their children.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:20 p.m.

NDP

Jinny Sims NDP Newton—North Delta, BC

Mr. Speaker, I am absolutely flabbergasted by that question.

First of all, I do not know if that member has tried to look for child care, but I can tell him that Surrey, B.C. has among the most expensive child care out there. A report released recently shows it at around $1,200 a month. It is not $100 or $160 a month.

Also, there is nothing in the plan that we have proposed that would force parents to use daycare. If parents opt to stay at home and they have the financial wherewithal to do so, then that option is there. The NDP is saying we need a universal plan that is more inclusive and would allow parents to make real choices based on their circumstances.

It is not a choice for a 23-year old mother working at minimum wage and whose husband is also working at minimum wage. If both of them are working, they still cannot earn enough to pay their bills, including food and rent. They cannot afford that daycare so only one can work. The poverty level increases, and when a child goes hungry or when we have children living in poverty, that demeans every single Canadian in this country because there is no excuse for it.

Sound policy supported by very well-established economists says that if we want to tackle child poverty, if we want to tackle the labour issues, if we want to have good economic and social policy, then universal, accessible, affordable, regulated child care is the only way to go.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:25 p.m.

NDP

Peter Julian NDP Burnaby—New Westminster, BC

Mr. Speaker, I thank the hon. member for Newton—North Delta for her passionate defence of programs that would address chronic and rising youth unemployment and increasing poverty in this country.

I am still flabbergasted by my Conservative colleague across the way who tried to compare the $2 or $3 a day that the Conservative government wants to provide to families to the $1,600 a month it costs the average family in Toronto to pay for child care. The Conservatives are telling Canadians that they are giving them $2 or $3 a day and that they can raise the other $1,400 or $1,500 a month by themselves. This is an appalling and irresponsible attitude toward families. This means that families simply go without child care. There is no other way to put it.

Does my colleague from Newton—North Delta think the Conservatives even understand the pressures that working families are under, if they can say that for $2 or $3 a day they have taken care of child care when thousands of families in this country cannot afford child care because of the Conservative government's negligence?

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:25 p.m.

NDP

Jinny Sims NDP Newton—North Delta, BC

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank the member for Burnaby—New Westminster for his thoughtful and passionate question. He cares deeply about this issue and in his riding specifically he has also been hearing from people about the need for a universal child care program.

Sometimes we get into partisan spats in here, and I have heard a few of them. Child care should not be one of those. We should be paying attention to the science and researchers. Europe has proven models. Quebec has a proven model. Sound research shows that not only is child care good for the economy but it is also good socially. It is good for the family, good for increasing gender equity, and good for raising family income. It is also good for mental health reasons.

Let us start paying attention to this because this is doable. Based on the science and evidence, all parties should be moving toward this. A couple of dollars a day is not going to cut it.

I am talking to more and more parents and grandparents of young people. They are telling me that they did not think they would be raising their great grandchildren so that their grandchildren can pay their bills. They cannot afford to put their children into daycare, so in many cases family members are helping out. There is nothing wrong with that as long as they are healthy, but I have been talking to individuals who are suffering when they have to do that. The Conservative government shut the door on family reunification, so that extended family support system is not even there for many Canadians either.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:25 p.m.

Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux Liberal Winnipeg North, MB

Mr. Speaker, Jack Layton and the NDP had a policy platform in 2011 stating that employers would receive a one year rebate on employer contributions to the Canada pension plan and employment insurance premiums for each new employee hired.

Could the member tell us whether or not her party still believes that Mr. Layton's idea was a good one?

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:25 p.m.

NDP

Jinny Sims NDP Newton—North Delta, BC

Mr. Speaker, it is evident to me that both the government and the party at that end have miserably failed small and medium-size businesses over the years, as they have pandered to big transnational corporations with profits that leave the country. They have ignored the job creating engines of this country, which are small and medium-size businesses.

We are committed to working on a variety of tools and incentives to support small businesses so they can grow the jobs. We have talked about the tax rate. We have talked about hiring credits. We have talked about transaction fees for credit cards. There are many ways to support small business. I would urge my colleague down the way to wait for the rest of our platform. We are not scared to put our platform out. We are putting it out right now because we want Canadians to discuss and debate it, unlike the red door that is keeping it hidden.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:30 p.m.

Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo B.C.

Conservative

Cathy McLeod ConservativeParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Labour and for Western Economic Diversification

Mr. Speaker, I am delighted to stand here and talk to this very important issue of youth unemployment and the important report that was put forward by the Standing Committee on Finance with a number of recommendations.

First of all, we need to put this into a framework of what the government has been doing and the very important work that we have been moving forward with.

I have three children in their twenties, and I remember that back in the nineties when they were quite young I used to think that the baby boomers were all going to retire, so that when my children finished university, finished whatever path they had chosen in their life, the world was going to be their oyster and that they would have many opportunities and, indeed, that there would be a shortage. That has not happened. We know there are some challenges for youth and we know our unemployment rate is higher than we would like it to be.

The government understands that it is important that we create the right environment for the economy to thrive, that we create the right environment for the job creators of this country to be successful and to create those jobs. It is ironic that the NDP members like to talk about their great concern about this issue, but every single measure, everything we do to support the job creators in this country, they tend to vote against.

For example, as we look at lowering the tax rates for our corporations, it is important to recognize that lower tax rates encourage growth. Money is international these days, there is international mobility, and we are encouraging job creators, groups like Tim Hortons, to come back to Canada.

First of all we need to look at the policies that we have in place, including around natural resources. Here again I would have to look at the New Democrats because I do not think there is a natural resource project that I have heard them support yet, especially for our aboriginal peoples. In Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, we have a mine that opened call New Gold, and as part of that mine opening, there were some job agreements created with the local bands that allowed for employment opportunities for their youth.

It is important that we have policies in place that support the job creators, whether regarding corporate tax rates or, more importantly, resource development policies whereby we get to a yes or no, so that companies will not have to spend 6, 8,15, 30 years before they get an answer about what are to be doing. That is one thing that we have focused on.

The government has played a role in terms of some of the more direct supports that we have put in place for aboriginal youth, youth with disabilities, youth in general. Here I would like to spend time talking about the different programs that are in place. Again, this means significant dollars. It is also important to recognize that the provinces and municipalities are our partners in these issues. We work in partnership with provinces and municipalities.

As for some of the important programs in place, we have to start when young. Some of the first work experiences youth have are as high school students. Maybe a first job is supported through our Canada summer student job program. It might be working in a camp, or with an engineering company, or many of those jobs. In the riding I represent, there is over $450,000 that goes into providing that experience for youth, often their first experience in the workforce. We have programs related to paid internships.

Again, we have a company that is thinking of the need to expand the number of people it has. With respect to those entry-level jobs, creating those positions and those paid internship is a hugely successful program that encourages our businesses to hire youth.

Some of the more powerful programs I have seen are through our skills link and opportunities programs. Sometimes we have youth who experience specific challenges in their lives. I will again use Kamloops as an example; however, in the 308 ridings across the country, there are many similar groups in place. In one case we have a program that is giving funding to support a group called ASK Wellness Society. It has people who have perhaps had issues with drug or alcohol addiction and have had a few challenges in their life, but who have decided to turn their life around. We know that part of supporting people in turning their lives around is to provide meaningful support and opportunities for jobs.

I can remember going to a particular announcement where we talked about the ongoing support for some of these programs, and the story of the youth who stood up. He talked about the bad path he had taken in his life, about getting clean in terms of his drug and alcohol addictions, and about the support he had in terms of the basic skills he would need to be successful in his future. He had that support, from federal government funding delivered through an agency in town, and was now gainfully and happily employed. He was pleased and very happy about the change he had made in his life. More importantly, he did not feel he could have done it without the support of the program that was available to him.

We also recognize that our aboriginal youth have an unemployment rate that is of particular concern. There is support for aboriginal youth, and also programs like the ASETS program, which not only provides aboriginal youth with some pre-employment skills but actual skills training.

Our human resources, skills and development committee had the opportunity to not only look at ASETS, but the strategic partnerships fund, which is where industry works with the communities and community groups to create jobs. It is an important opportunity for supporting aboriginal youth and the extraordinarily high unemployment rate there.

The last thing I want to reflect on that has been part of an ongoing dialogue in the House, and although not directly related to youth unemployment there is a link, is support for child care. I have said this before, and I will say it again. I will use the example of someone from a rural community, someone who has to work nights, maybe a young mother who is 17 or 19 and needs someone at home. To be frank, the child care spaces proposed by the NDP would not do her any good if she goes to work for a 7 p.m. to midnight shift. Those spaces are not available, though they might be great for a nine to five shift. I understand that recent research has shown that people with higher incomes tend to take more advantage of those low-cost daycare spots. We would put that money in her pocket, so that if she needs to hire a babysitter or an aunt to come to the house, she would have that flexibility.

The last point I would like to focus on is what we hear about the extraordinarily high costs of child care. However, what the NDP are neglecting to say is that every province in this country provides support for low-income parents. With the supported child care program, sometimes the parents are paying nothing. If they are on a low income or are a single mom, they might be on a program delivered through the provinces where their child care cost is appropriately subsidized.

This conversation has been a little misleading, first in the fact that there is some important support available for those on a low income. More importantly, the jobs that our youth have, and perhaps single mothers, are not necessarily Monday to Friday and nine to five. Our plan is going to provide the parent of a young child with $1,900 a month. In addition to that, we have to remember that they have support from a number of different sources. It will allow them to enter the market more viably.

In conclusion, we all agree that the youth unemployment rate is an issue. It is an issue that we need to be concerned about. We need to find important ways to match opportunities to the interests of our youth, and we need to create an environment, both for corporations to be successful and to give youth the skills through the important programs that I have already mentioned. Whether it is the Canada summer student job program, youth opportunities, or disabilities, we have many programs in place, and we will continue to ensure that we have an important focus on this area.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:40 p.m.

NDP

Mike Sullivan NDP York South—Weston, ON

Mr. Speaker, I have asked this question twice before and I have not had a straight answer either time, so I will ask it again and hope for a straight answer.

In the 2013 budget, the finance minister announced that one of the conditions of government spending on infrastructure would be the creation of apprenticeships through the procurement process to create infrastructure in cities, towns, and provinces across the country. However, the new Canada building fund of $14 billion has nary a mention of apprenticeships anywhere in it.

I would like to know why the government will not put its money where its mouth is. It said very clearly that it would be a condition of the creation of infrastructure in this country, yet the provinces and towns that receive this money are under no obligation to create apprenticeships. That would be a tremendous way for the government to create the kinds of jobs that young people need. It would create the kinds of employment that young people need. It would do a tremendous service and give a great example to the provinces and municipalities for how to use government spending to create jobs.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:40 p.m.

Conservative

Cathy McLeod Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC

Mr. Speaker, I do not think there has ever been a government that has done more to support youth in apprenticeship programs. In the last budget, we made loans available for people on apprenticeship programs. We have support for their tools. We have measure after measure in terms of supporting apprentices.

It is also important to reflect on the fact that apprentices are some of the ones in the highest demand. There are very few people who enter an apprenticeship program and do not find work opportunities right away. Every week, when I get on the plane that goes from Kamloops to either Calgary or Vancouver, I would bet that one third of the passengers on the plane are heading up to the oil sands and that they have some sort of apprentice background.

Again, I do not think that there has been another government that has done so much for the apprentices of Canada.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:40 p.m.

NDP

Andrew Cash NDP Davenport, ON

Mr. Speaker, I listened to my colleague's answer with great interest. Right now we can broadly agree that we are in a youth employment crisis in Canada. In fact, it is so significant that we had the Governor of the Bank of Canada recently suggest that young people should work for free to beef up their CVs.

What the member opposite just said was that apprenticeships lead to employment, but the fact is that more and more young people are working several unpaid internships. We can call it payment on a non-payment basis. That is what it is, but those internships are not leading to jobs.

I would like to know what the government is doing about this blight of unpaid internships in Canada.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:45 p.m.

Conservative

Cathy McLeod Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC

Mr. Speaker, I do not have the numbers in front of me, but one of the very important things we have done as a government is to provide funding for paid internships. I suspect in the member's riding a company is available that has been given the contract and is putting out the requests for proposals. I know it has been a very successful program across Canada in terms of paid internships moving people into longer-term jobs with the companies.

Again, I am not diminishing the fact that we are seized with the issue of youth unemployment. I think we are all seized with that particular issue, and one of the measures, of course, is the provision of paid internships.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:45 p.m.

NDP

Alain Giguère NDP Marc-Aurèle-Fortin, QC

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank the hon. member for telling us about the difficulty of accessing daycare services in remote areas.

However, since I am quite familiar with the Quebec system, which we are proposing for all of Canada, I know that there are child care co-operatives in rural areas, and there are services offered outside regular hours to allow young people to work.

We need to address the unemployment rate as well as the participation rate. Young people need to participate in the workforce. Right now, far too many young people stay at home and continue their studies because they cannot find work and would rather study.

My esteemed colleague's solution gives the impression that she does not want to provide jobs for young people. She would rather provide cheap labour to employers who will not be required to pay for child care or contribute to the Canada Pension Plan and who will not need to have a nationally recognized training service. However, all those elements are essential.

Does the hon. member understand how important and how urgent it is to intervene in these areas to ensure that young people who want to work not only have a job but also have a future?

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:45 p.m.

Conservative

Cathy McLeod Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC

Mr. Speaker, as someone who has spent a number of years of my adult life representing rural communities, I have a very good appreciation for both the challenges and the beautiful benefits of living in rural communities. Child care is absolutely an important piece of that. Having licensed child care is important. However, someone may live 30 kilometres up the valley taking care of a farm, and a grandmother takes care of the children. The point is that we need a lot of different options, and we believe that parents are in the best position to decide them.

I also want to connect one other point. The government is setting the environment for success in rural communities. I always like to give examples, and an example is in Lac La Hache. It is is a very rural, very remote area. They have found a niche market in making pepperoni, and 60 to 80 people are employed in that niche market. What we, as a government, are responsible for doing is creating the environment for it to be successful, and that is what we plan to do.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:45 p.m.

NDP

Marc-André Morin NDP Laurentides—Labelle, QC

Mr. Speaker, I am concerned about summer jobs for students. The first thing I did in my official capacity as an MP, practically the day after I was elected in 2011, was to sign the list of summer jobs. Looking at that list, I knew right away that there were not enough resources and that all of the decisions had been made in advance by government employees who had reviewed the applications. I could have made a few minor changes to the list, but all of the choices to be made were tough ones.

This program helps young people go back to their region and gain initial work experience in forestry, the environment and all sorts of specialties. It provides a great deal of assistance to community organizations and small municipalities. As I reviewed the list of organizations and municipalities that had real needs, I was disappointed to see that things looked the same year after year. The young people who did not make the cut could have met those needs and acquired essential work experience. A few times, I was able to achieve a remarkable feat and make tough choices to give jobs to groups that I felt were more essential than others.

Will there ever be an end to this? Will the government decide to invest the necessary resources? That is what I would like to ask my colleague.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:50 p.m.

Conservative

Cathy McLeod Conservative Kamloops—Thompson—Cariboo, BC

Mr. Speaker, the Canada summer student job program is a critical piece. The member might not be aware, but in actual fact the budget for that particular program increased during the global economic recession and has stayed at that higher level. It involves many students and, as I indicated earlier, close to half a million dollars goes into many different ridings.

It is one piece of the puzzle, but it is not, by any means, the only piece. For example, all members of Parliament have a budget. I would encourage members to hire summer students for their own offices in the summer when they have the opportunity.

Again, it is an important piece of the puzzle, but it is not the only piece of the puzzle in dealing with the student summer job issue.

FinanceCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

5:50 p.m.

NDP

Laurin Liu NDP Rivière-des-Mille-Îles, QC

Mr. Speaker, I will be sharing my time with the member for Davenport.

I am very pleased to participate in today's debate about the report of the Standing Committee on Finance entitled “Youth Employment in Canada: Challenges and Potential Solutions”.

I am very concerned about youth unemployment, and I will talk later about my bill, Bill C-620. I have worked extremely hard on this file with my colleague from Davenport. We have also considered the issue of unpaid internships and the best ways to protect unpaid interns.

Youth unemployment is a serious concern. We know that the youth unemployment rate in Canada is almost double the national unemployment rate.

According to the committee's report, witnesses said that young Canadians are still feeling the effects of the economic crisis.

Although job growth has been too weak across the board to recover the jobs lost during the crisis, young people have been particularly hard hit. More than 455,000 jobs for people under the age of 25 have been lost since the recession, and the youth unemployment rate remains stuck at double the rate for the population aged 25 and over.

Furthermore, if we look at the figures for young Canadians who are underemployed—meaning that they cannot find full-time jobs in their sector—we can see that one out of three young Canadians is underemployed. I find that figure extremely worrisome.

In light of the current climate, I introduced Bill C-620 to protect unpaid interns in Canada. I worked on this bill with the family of a former intern, Andy Ferguson. He was an intern at a radio station in Edmonton, Alberta. After working 16 hours straight, he unfortunately fell asleep at the wheel while driving home and was involved in a fatal accident.

He did not have the benefit of federal protections. Interns working in areas under federal jurisdiction, including the telecommunications sector, in which Andy Ferguson worked, the transportation sector and the banking sector, have no protection.

There is nothing in Canadian law to protect the health and safety of these interns. That is very disturbing. Andy Ferguson's case sparked a national debate.

We have seen other cases across the country in which unpaid interns have been abused. For example, Jainna Patel was an unpaid intern in Toronto with Bell, a very profitable company that makes a lot of money. This unpaid internship program was shut down a few months ago. However, Jainna Patel says that she did the same kind of work as paid employees, but she did not receive any compensation.

This is part of a disturbing trend in which employers transform paid jobs into unpaid internships. We think that this is an abuse of the concept or the very idea of unpaid internships.

This spring, I introduced Bill C-620, which has two parts. Unpaid interns are in a grey area and get no protection. Bill C-620 would ensure that unpaid interns working for employers under federal jurisdiction get a certain level of protection. For example, my bill will give interns the right to refuse dangerous work and protect them from sexual harassment. Harassment cases have surfaced recently in various workplaces, including in the telecommunications sector. The first part of my bill is designed to protect interns.

The second part is designed to prevent employers from converting paid positions into unpaid internships. Canadian employers need to understand that unpaid internships are not a source of cheap labour. Unpaid interns must not be exploited. If interns are doing the same work as paid employees, employers must pay them. My bill stipulates that internships must benefit interns first and foremost. We have to put a stop to the abuse of unpaid interns in Canada, and I think my bill is a good place to start.

This is also about gender inequality, as several witnesses pointed out in committee. Internships tend to be in female-dominated fields. Witnesses from the Canadian Intern Association and the University of Toronto Students' Union told us that unpaid internships are most popular in journalism, nutrition, social work, marketing, public relations and fashion. We have to improve conditions for all workers in the labour market, but it is important to note that women are affected more than men.

According to recent studies, especially one out of the University of Victoria, unpaid interns are no more likely to get a paid job after their internship. Most unpaid interns did not get a job offer after completing an unpaid internship. The Governor of the Bank of Canada claimed otherwise, but he is quite wrong. It is simply not true that unpaid internships increase young people's chances of getting a paid job. The real problem is that those jobs do not exist. The Conservative government has not managed to create jobs for young people. We should start by taking a closer look at that problem.

At a meeting of the Standing Committee on Finance, I had the great pleasure of asking Claire Seaborn, a representative of the Canadian Intern Association, some questions. Many of her recommendations were quite relevant and very interesting. Since I only have a minute left, I would like to draw the attention of the House to some of the recommendations of that report, specifically recommendation 9, which calls on the federal government to collect data on unpaid internships in Canada. A number of witnesses pointed out that Statistics Canada has no data on the number of unpaid interns in Canada. We need to have this information if we really want to tackle the problem.

Furthermore, recommendation 10 calls on the federal government to continue to invest in internships, especially in areas of science, technology, engineering and mathematics. That is an excellent recommendation.

The final recommendation I would like to highlight is recommendation 16, which calls on the federal government to explore ways to promote youth hiring in Canada, such as tax credits for businesses, for instance, which was an NDP proposal.

I look forward to questions and comments from my colleagues.