House of Commons Hansard #110 of the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was workers.

Topics

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

10:40 p.m.

Liberal

Marc Garneau Liberal Westmount—Ville-Marie, QC

It is all I could do.

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

10:40 p.m.

NDP

Randall Garrison NDP Esquimalt—Juan de Fuca, BC

Mr. Speaker, I am glad he did. I am glad that we had the opportunity to stand here and talk about this as much as we have, but it does not substitute for the government taking up its responsibilities to provide, not just us in the House but Canadians, with a clear picture of what we are committing Canada to, in this case in Iraq.

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

10:40 p.m.

NDP

Paul Dewar NDP Ottawa Centre, ON

Mr. Speaker, I would like to take this back to who is affected. My colleague did a very good job of outlining the concerns we have and gave the example of what happened in Afghanistan and why it is important to clearly delineate what we are doing and how we can help.

I would like to know why he thinks it is so important for us as a country to immediately respond to what I heard personally, along with my colleague from the Liberal Party and the Minister of Foreign Affairs, to help those minorities that are right now needing basic needs met. We need to be supporting them as well as the huge number of people who still do not have their basic needs met, in places like Duhak, for water, sewage, and basic housing. Should that not be the first priority we have in front of us and the first priority that should be met before we talk about missions that are ill-defined?

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

10:40 p.m.

NDP

Randall Garrison NDP Esquimalt—Juan de Fuca, BC

Mr. Speaker, I am going to refer back to another piece of my own experience. I was in East Timor at the time of the vote on independence, and the Indonesian military reacted with extreme violence. There were 1,500 people killed. The entire infrastructure of the country was destroyed. What Canada did then was send the Canadian Forces immediately to help rebuild housing, rebuild water systems, and meet those immediate needs. The need there was not to intervene militarily between Indonesia and the newly independent East Timor. It is an example of where we were very effective in meeting the real needs.

I guess I would like to see perhaps a good justification for the military mission and for actually providing more military materials that will contribute to the conflict. We certainly know that the need for humanitarian assistance is great.

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

10:40 p.m.

Calgary Southeast Alberta

Conservative

Jason Kenney ConservativeMinister of Employment and Social Development and Minister for Multiculturalism

Mr. Speaker, I cannot say I am not pleased to rise in debate on this matter, but I am moved to do so given my own personal long-standing connection with many of the minority communities in Iraq that are now facing what can only, in my view, be described as a genocide by a form of unbridled evil being manifest by the so-called Islamic State in Iraq and the Levant in Iraq and Syria.

I find it peculiar that in this debate there has been such an obsession over a process in this place and so little discussion about the nature of the evil that the civilized world seeks to confront and diminish in the Middle East, an evil that is claiming the lives of tens of thousands of innocent civilians.

Let me offer some reflections on what I mean because in our post-modern cynical world of moral relatives and sometimes to speak in the stark moral language of categories such as evil is considered politically incorrect. I recall just yesterday a member of Parliament suggesting that those involved in beheading innocent civilians had sweetness and light in them, which is merely unrecognized by us.

We need to speak plainly when we see evil being manifest as we do through the spread of violent terror through this organization that is combining a kind of apocalyptic theology, a kind of extreme distortion of the Islamic doctrine of armed jihad with the political efforts to reconstitute a caliphate. Essentially this is an eighth century political religious ideology which this organization is seeking to impose through literally the violence of the sword on innocent human beings.

In March 2013, I visited Baghdad in order to attend the installation of the new patriarch off the Chaldean Catholic Church, the major Christian denomination of Iraq, the ancient Christian Aramaic people who have been present there in Mesopotamia for over 1,800 years and who are in the words of today's political parlox indigenous people who were, quite frankly, there long before there was the presence of Islam in Iraq. I was the first Canadian minister there in 34 years.

I will be splitting my time, Mr. Speaker, with the hon. member for Don Valley West.

I was in Baghdad on behalf of Canadians to express our solidarity with the Christian minority community of Iraq and with the other minority confessions whose leaders I met. I was there for the installation of His Beatitude Cardinal Archbishop Louis Sako.

Last month when I was in the Middle East I spoke by phone with Patriarch Sako. He had just returned to Baghdad from Erbil where he had been greeting the displaced persons fleeing the Islamic State monsters who had just cleared them from their ancient homes in Mosul and Karakush along the Nineveh Plain, their ancient ancestral indigenous homeland.

We have all heard the stories about when Da'esh, also known as the Islamic state, arrived in Mosul, they issued a fatwa to all so-called infidels, also called non-believers, that they were to convert to Islam within three days or be executed or become dhimmis, essentially to become de facto slaves.

He told me that all of the Christians of Mosul consequently rushed to flee the city. He was very disturbed, I must say, that even some long-time neighbours of these families who had lived side by side for generations, told Da'esh where many of the Christian families were. He said that the Christian families fled, and on their way out of Mosul, the so-called soldiers of Da'esh confiscated all of their worldly belongings, their jewellery, their suitcases, their cars, even their shoes, to go out into the desert in the Nineveh plains barefooted.

However, Patriarch Sako told me that was not the end of the story, because he said that there were certain elderly, infirm Christians left in their hospital beds who had no family and who could physically not leave. This is a dimension of the story that I gather has not received media coverage, but he told me that these members of Da'esh, of the Islamic state, went into these hospitals and threatened these infirm, elderly Christians with execution through beheading in their hospital beds, or conversion. This is the nature of the evil that we are discussing tonight.

To give one other example, Adeba Shaker is a 14-year-old Yazidi girl from the same region of Iraq, and she recalls how the militants arrived in her village and separated old women from the rest of the group, then they took the children. Young women and girls faced terrifying fates. Some girls were raped by the commander, who had the privilege of taking their virginity, before being passed around among the fighters. After the prepubescent girls had been gang raped, they were sold off to the highest bidder. Women and girls were auctioned for as little as $10, according to numerous reports. Others, like Adeba Shaker, were to be married off to the militants.

As we speak, there are hundreds, if not thousands, of girls who are facing serial gang rape in this circumstance in Iraq. Children have been beheaded. Thousands of people have been massacred for no crime other than their faith as Shias, as Yazidis, as Sufis, as Christians and as others.

This place and so many of the politicians here speak in high-minded terms about the responsibility to protect, a notion that we had the United Nations recognize. I submit that if the responsibility to protect means anything, if our moral obligation to defend human dignity means anything, it must mean that we act in this instance.

I am proud that Canada has done so. We have done so through the substantial contribution of humanitarian aid, $28 million, through $50 million in support for operation impact, through the provision of heavy-lift aircraft to bring armaments from Yugoslavia and elsewhere in Europe to the Kurdish regions of Iraq so the Peshmerga militia can defend, yes, the Kurds, but other minorities from the fate similar to that which befell these infirm Christians in their hospital beds in Mosul and these little girls from the Yazidi community.

Canada, yes, has also decided to provide logistical training and advice to Kurdish forces at the invitation of the sovereign government of Iraq and the Kurdish regional authority to provide them with the experience that we have gained and the advice that they can use to defend innocent civilians from such a fate.

I am proud to say that as the immigration minister in 2009, I launched Canada's largest refugee resettlement program since that of the Indo-Chinese Vietnamese boat people in 1979 for Iraqi refugees who had fled similar sectarian violence and terrorism in recent years.

I am pleased to inform the House that we have received, welcomed and protected some 18,200 Iraqi refugees and we will continue to protect more. Through our practical logistical support, humanitarian assistance, our refugee resettlement, the visit of our Minister of Foreign Affairs and our political support, I am pleased to say that Canada is doing what we can within our limited means and ability to protect these people and to give real practical expression to this notion of the responsibility to protect.

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

10:50 p.m.

NDP

Paul Dewar NDP Ottawa Centre, ON

Mr. Speaker, I would point the minister to my comments just to underline his concern about the actual people to whom we need to respond.

I met some of the religious leaders whom he has referred to and they were adamant that we do one thing. In fact, our ambassador said the same thing. That was to immediately increase and support protection for minorities. I have to underline this, and it is really important for the minister to know. They told us that they did not want to leave their country. I think he would agree that we do not want them to leave either because that is the agenda of ISIS. It wants to empty these minority groups who have been there for thousands of years: the Mandaeans, the Yazidis and the Christians.

We have a concern around process. I think he would agree that is important in our democracy. However, my speech and certainly my passion for this is to protect the people from whom we heard. I would hope that he will push our Minister of Foreign Affairs to do what I have asked for, and they have agreed to do: protection of minorities not leaving their country and to immediately build housing for them. They cannot go back to Mosul because of what he just mentioned. Their neighbours have already informed on them. They have told us that they cannot go back.

Where is the commitment that his government said it would provide to ensure that the very people we both talked to will be safe and secure and get the support they need?

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

10:55 p.m.

Conservative

Jason Kenney Conservative Calgary Southeast, AB

Mr. Speaker, as I and all of my colleagues have underscored, this government has been the seventh-largest financial contributor to humanitarian assistance. We are one of the only countries that is providing logistical support to bring arms in to support the Peshmerga military.

The member asks what we are doing to protect the minorities. With respect, we do not protect innocent civilians from these minority communities hiding behind Kurdish lines from the Islamic State militants through pleasant speeches. We do not protect them with tents and humanitarian supplies. There is only one way we can protect them, and that is through the defensive use of force.

That is precisely why we are providing the heavy airlift capacity to arm the Peshmerga, so they can defend those minorities and those innocent civilians. That is precisely why 69 brave men and women of the Canadian Armed Forces are providing tactical advice to the Kurdish militias, so they can protect those people That is precisely what we are doing.

I would invite the New Democratic Party to stand by its humanitarian values in supporting the protection of these people in the only practical way that matters, which is by assisting the military forces on the ground to protect those people.

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

10:55 p.m.

Green

Elizabeth May Green Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC

Mr. Speaker, I was not asked to participate in the multi-party mission in which the hon. member for Ottawa Centre participated. However, my understanding is that we were asked specifically for humanitarian assistance.

Could the government share with all of us in the House what analysis went into deciding that 69 advisers to a military mission was the best and most strategic way that our country could contribute to defeating ISIS? Are there not other means, and are they not potentially mutually inclusive rather than exclusive? Why are we not doing more to ensure that the voice of true Islam is heard in the region?

Could we not assist in reprogramming those who fall into the misunderstanding of religion, falling into an extremist, in fact a distortion of the worst sort, of the religion that is known as “Islam” by allowing people to believe they are experiencing or living up to or exemplifying a religion when they are in fact representing the worst distortion and bastardization of a true religion by executing innocent people through beheading? This is appalling. These people are cowards. Could we not harness more in the way to take on in even social media what it is that is attracting people to this wrong-headed version of what it is to be Islamic?

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

10:55 p.m.

Conservative

Jason Kenney Conservative Calgary Southeast, AB

Mr. Speaker, the 69 military advisers that we have provided to assist Kurdish militia are not the only way in which Canada is seeking to protect the vulnerable minorities of that country by any means. There is humanitarian support. There are projects delivered through our Office of Religious Freedom to promote pluralism more generally in Iraq. There are military armaments that we are bringing into the region to support the Kurdish militias. There are political and diplomatic efforts.

I could get into a very interesting conversation with the hon. member about the theological root causes of this crisis and about the hundreds of madrasas spreading the doctrine of armed jihad, not just in Iraq and Syria but from Nigeria to the southern Philippines. That would be a very interesting subject.

However, if an Islamic State fighter is coming after the 12-year-old daughter of a Yazidi or Christian mom or dad, those parents do not have time for a debate on root causes. They do not have time for rebuttals on social media. They do not care in that moment about soft power. What they need is someone standing between them and their family and the militants who seek to destroy them, to behead them, to crucify them and rape their children.

Sometimes hard power is necessary. In this case, it is being provided, thank God, by the Kurdish militia, and we should be providing some measure of practical support to them. That is precisely what we are doing.

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

11 p.m.

Conservative

John Carmichael Conservative Don Valley West, ON

Mr. Speaker, clearly the debate tonight is carrying a great deal of emotion on all sides, and I applaud the Minister of Employment for his comments.

The Prime Minister has said numerous times that the Islamic State in Iraq and the Levant, ISIL, poses a global threat. If Canada and the U.S. view ISIL as a threat, one can easily imagine how it is viewed among countries in the region. ISIL has made no secret of its expansionist views. For Iraq's neighbours and for Canada's friends in the region, ISIL is not a long-term threat; it is an immediate and very direct one. After standing on the front lines with Kurdish Peshmerga soldiers, our Minister of Foreign Affairs witnessed first-hand what it feels like to be within shooting range of these terrorists.

It comes as no surprise that ISIL's recent advance in Iraq has caused many countries of the region to reframe their priorities. ISIL's extremist violence has resulted in common cause among Saudi Arabia, the United Arab Emirates, Jordan, Turkey, Egypt, and Israel, among others. Like Canada, these states consider terrorism to be the single greatest threat to the region. This includes both Sunni extremists groups like ISIL as well as the state-sponsored terrorism of the Iranian regime and its proxies and allies, including Hezbollah.

Currently ISIL controls significant territory in both Syria and Iraq. ISIL is moving fighters, equipment, and weapons between the two countries without consideration for international borders. In both countries it plays an equally destabilizing role. In both countries it has generated unprecedented humanitarian catastrophes.

However, the situation in Syria is very different from the one in Iraq. There is a government in Baghdad that Canada and its allies can work with, a government whose aim is to protect its people, not to slaughter them. That government has asked for the support of the international community to defeat ISIL. If Iraqi security forces, supported by an international coalition, manage to halt or reverse ISIL's gains in Iraq, ISIL will likely continue to threaten Iraq and other states of the region from its bases in Syria. Canada welcomes intensified U.S. efforts to destroy and degrade ISIL's capabilities in the region.

Iraq also shares a border with Iran, the greatest state sponsor of terrorism. Iran must share the blame for creating this crisis in the first place. Its support for the murderous Assad regime, its constant regional meddling, its arming of Shia militants, and its bankrolling of terror are not exactly contributing to stability and security in that region.

Despite a so-called “charm offensive” by the Iranian leadership over the past year, the toxic reality of Iranian meddling in Iraq remains. Iran continues to run its Iraq policies out of Iran's Revolutionary Guard Corps Quds Force's headquarters. The IRGC Quds Force is a listed terrorist entity responsible for some of the deadliest terrorist attacks of the past decade. This force, which is part of Iran's Revolutionary Guard Corps, can only compromise efforts to bring peace and stability to Iraq and the region. It is arming Shia militias within Iraq, which undermines attempts by the new government to gain the trust of its Sunni population. While the Iraqi government is trying to bring its people together regardless of religion or ethnic group, Iran is promoting discord and violence among Iraqis. Iran is sowing the seeds for a longer-term conflict, one that risks inflaming sectarian tensions throughout the region.

Thankfully, other countries in the region have stepped up to the plate on a constructive and very important role. The gulf countries have roundly condemned and rejected ISIL's disgusting brand of terror.

Last week, Saudi Arabia hosted a meeting in Jeddah, which was attended by 10 Arab foreign ministers and the U.S. Secretary of State, John Kerry. The meeting resulted in a commitment by the group to a coalition to counter ISIL's presence in Iraq and Syria. The group stated that participation would include, “...as appropriate, joining in the many aspects of a coordinated military campaign against ISIL”.

The Arab League also met earlier this month and agreed on the use of all necessary measures to counter ISIL. Indeed, our friends in the Gulf and elsewhere in the region recognize, as we do, that countering ISIL and its despicable brand of terror will require a combined international effort.

Gulf countries have also provided generous assistance to address the humanitarian crisis caused by ISIL. Saudi Arabia, for example, contributed over $500 million of humanitarian assistance to Iraq.

Saudi Arabia's highest religious authority, its Grand Mufti, has unambiguously condemned ISIL and al Qaeda, describing them as the enemy number one of Islam. Last month, it also donated $100 million to the United Nations Counter-Terrorism Centre, or UNCTC, for efforts to combat terrorism.

Another of our close partners affected by ISIL's campaign is Turkey, which represents a beacon of stability in a fracturing region. ISIL is a serious threat to the security of our ally. Iraq is also Turkey's second largest export market, so the economic consequences of the crisis have been severe. Turkey has also been steadfast in condemning the brutality of the Assad regime in Syria and it has, like Jordan and other countries of the region, selflessly hosted millions of Syrian refugees.

As a fellow NATO ally, Canada looks forward to continued co-operation with Turkey in responding to the threats to our collective peace, including the threat represented by ISIL.

ISIL's violence has had tragic consequences in the region. The atrocities it has committed on innocent civilians in Syria and Iraq, including the use of rape as a weapon of war, have resulted in the displacement of religious and ethnic minorities that have occupied this region for thousands of years. However, ISIL does not intend to stop there. It has made the region a magnet for terrorists and aspires to expand its so-called state beyond Iraq and Syria into Jordan and Lebanon.

Such expansion would not only have disastrous humanitarian consequences, but it would destabilize the sectarian, ethnic and political map of the Middle East with consequences that we can hardly imagine. That is why we need to act together with our allies and friends in the region to counter ISIL and support an effective, inclusive and representative federal government in Baghdad, one that will govern for all Iraqis and preserve the rich, centuries-old fabric of this region.

Finally, we will continue to push for an effective, inclusive and representative federal government in Baghdad through our programming and diplomatic actions.

Several members of the international coalition that is forming against ISIL were present at yesterday's Paris conference on the peace and security of Iraq, including 10 countries from the region. Participants committed to support the Iraqi government by any means necessary, including appropriate military assistance.

As we build this coalition, let us not forget that some of the countries in the region, namely Iran and Syria, have different agendas. Although they may currently claim to stand on the right side of history, these regimes only aim to replace one brand of violence with another one just as cruel. They cannot be part of the solution when they are in fact a large part of the problem.

Canada is committed to working with countries that reject all forms of terror.

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

11:05 p.m.

Liberal

Kirsty Duncan Liberal Etobicoke North, ON

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my hon. colleague for his speech. He discussed humanitarian aid, and I would like to raise the plight of children one more time tonight.

UNICEF is extremely concerned about the reports of children and women. Children are being abducted by ISIL in areas under its control. We also have recruitment of child soldiers.

As of September 8, some 195 cases of grave violations have been verified and referred to support. Thousands of children have witnessed abductions, summary executions and torture. These children require immediate attention to support their mental health.

In Dohuk province, there are 1,100 schools, and 700 of these are occupied. UNICEF is calling for these schools to be vacated. Support is urgently needed for innovative approaches to reach Iraqi children with education.

The government has given $28 million in humanitarian aid. The Minister of Foreign Affairs has said it is insufficient. My question is this. Will the government give more, and what form will it take?

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

11:10 p.m.

Conservative

John Carmichael Conservative Don Valley West, ON

Mr. Speaker, tonight we heard the Minister of Employment speaking a few minutes ago to the humanitarian crisis as it exists, as it affects children and families. As we know, and as the Minister of Foreign Affairs stated, our commitment to this point in humanitarian aid is insufficient, and I am quite confident it will be topped up with hundreds of millions of dollars pouring in from other corners of the globe with friends and allies in the region.

However, my concern goes deeper than that. While I worry for the children and I understand exactly what the member is articulating, this issue will have far worse consequences as it unfolds unless we react more strongly. We have heard support from members of the Liberal Party tonight on its support of this direction, for which I applaud them. I also applaud those members of this House who went to Iraq last week and witnessed first-hand the atrocities and the evil that is permeating that region.

We have to do more. We have to react. Our government is doing just that. I think that as time progresses, we will see that we are on the right side of this argument and we must assist our friends.

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

11:10 p.m.

NDP

Carol Hughes NDP Algoma—Manitoulin—Kapuskasing, ON

Mr. Speaker, it is important to reiterate that our leader, the NDP leader, was the only leader who took the time to come and speak on this issue tonight, in contrast to the Prime Minister and the leader of the Liberal Party, who did not bother showing up on this important issue, so the question—

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

11:10 p.m.

Conservative

The Speaker Conservative Andrew Scheer

Order, please. We had this point of order raised a short while ago, so I will just take this opportunity to remind the hon. member that it is not parliamentary to point out the absence—

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

11:10 p.m.

NDP

Carol Hughes NDP Algoma—Manitoulin—Kapuskasing, ON

Mr. Speaker, I am sorry. I did not point out any absence. I said they did not—

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

11:10 p.m.

Conservative

The Speaker Conservative Andrew Scheer

I did hear the hon. member refer to a specific member. I hear her apologizing so I will trust that she will not do it again.

There is another point of order. The hon. member for Saanich—Gulf Islands is rising on a point of order.

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

11:10 p.m.

Green

Elizabeth May Green Saanich—Gulf Islands, BC

Mr. Speaker, I am also the leader of a federal political party. I was not given the opportunity to have a speaking slot tonight, but I would like to have had such an opportunity.

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

11:10 p.m.

Conservative

The Speaker Conservative Andrew Scheer

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

11:10 p.m.

NDP

Carol Hughes NDP Algoma—Manitoulin—Kapuskasing, ON

Mr. Speaker, we need to reiterate that the whole issue here is that the Prime Minister and his government had indicated that they would ensure that Parliament would have a say, that this would be debated, and that we would be able to have a vote on whether or not troops would be sent out in the future on missions such as this one.

I want to bring to your attention as well the fact that the Rideau Institute also called this move reckless. It states, “Without a comprehensive strategy it is a reckless step, and it is a step that I don’t believe that Canadians want.” It has the same opinion that we do, which is that we need to have a strategy and we need to have the details in order to make an informed decision and in order for Canadians to be well informed about why we are sending our troops there.

This is a government that has cut funding up to 61% in some of the departments. This is a government that takes pieces or parts from museums to offset our equipment. We need to make sure that we are prepared and we need to make sure that we are doing it right.

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

11:10 p.m.

Conservative

John Carmichael Conservative Don Valley West, ON

Mr. Speaker, having not heard a question in that series of comments, I just want to acknowledge that as Canada contributes to this crisis, we do so on behalf of the many minorities, the Christians, Yazidis, Sufis, Shiites, Ahmadis, and so many others who are being traumatized and attacked mercilessly by this evil of ISIL. I applaud those nations who have become involved in this crisis to ensure that, to quote the President of the United States, we “degrade and destroy ISIL” so that the region can return to a normal balance of long-standing peace.

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

11:15 p.m.

Liberal

Irwin Cotler Liberal Mount Royal, QC

Mr. Speaker, I rise tonight to join in this important debate on Canada's military role in Iraq.

We are engaging in this discussion as our military is being deployed to help counter ISIS, the Islamic State, which has taken control of large swaths of territory in Iraq and Syria, killing and terrorizing civilian populations, targeting Shia Muslims and various minorities, including Kurds, Christians and Yazidis, and engaging in a whole gamut of international criminality, be it ethnic cleansing, genocidal acts, plundering ancient and protected sites, or executing journalists in a gruesome fashion, the beheadings videotaped and posted online for all to see.

Of course, we are all disgusted and enraged by such barbarism. The Islamic State must be stopped, and Canada should join our allies in order to do so. It is encouraging to see that many countries have declared their support and have committed resources to help defeat the Islamic State and restore peace and stability to Iraq and the Middle East. I am sure we will offer our full support and recognition to those who contribute to this important international mission.

As has been mentioned this evening several times, I hope that the government will provide more information about the role the Canadian military will be playing in Iraq, notably the timeline for deployment.

As we examine and debate Canada's role in combatting ISIS, it is critical that we take the time to review our role in Iraq through a wide-angle lens, indeed through an international prism. ISIS is really metaphor and message of a larger evil. Indeed, even if we were to defeat ISIS tomorrow, the global radical jihadist threat would remain. As such, we must consider how ISIS came to be and recognize the nature of the multiple threats it poses, understand the broader global context of the Islamic terrorist threat, and appreciate the radical ideology underpinning it, as I said, of which ISIS is only one part.

For example, in the spring of 2011 in the Syrian city of Daraa, 20 young Syrians, at the time, painted graffiti, expressing their desire for freedom and reform, what came to be known as a peace and dignity revolution.

When they were arrested and tortured, thousands of demonstrators took to the streets in protest, chanting “peaceful, peaceful”. In response, President Bashar al-Assad's regime fired into demonstrators. This was followed by artillery and tank assaults against civilian neighbourhoods; the rape, torture and murder of their inhabitants; the bombing of schools and hospitals; and the use of cluster munitions, thermobaric weapons and chemical weapons against civilian populations.

At the time, those of us who argued that what was needed was the implementation of the responsibility to protect principle, which was not only a matter of engaging, and not even necessarily military action, but which included expanding and enhancing global sanctions, establishing humanitarian quarters and civilian protection zones, holding the Syrian leadership accountable for their crimes under international law, and providing defensive weapons to the moderate opposition at the time.

Regrettably, those of us who recommended that kind of protective intervention were told that any intervention would lead to more sectarian violence, the likelihood of civil war, the jihadization of the conflict, and the like.

Regrettably, what happened as a result of all this was that jihadization and the beginnings of ISIS took place, not because we intervened but because we did not intervene. Indeed, one of the consequences of allowing the Syrian conflict to fester, of not assisting at that time what was in effect a peaceful protest, was not only that ISIS was able to take root but to develop and strengthen and spread out.

Three years ago, the world did not engage in the protective humanitarian measures that were required in Syria. Today we find ourselves sending personnel to confront a violent terrorist jihadist group that grew in part out of our own inaction and has gone beyond Syria. Moreover, ISIS represents a composite of threats, not only to Iraq and Syria but to the broader Middle East, a clear and present danger to the stability of the Middle East and indeed the international community.

It has, of course, been violently taking control of Syrian and Iraqi territory, threatening and brutalizing civilian populations as it advances, but ISIS has also been a destabilizing force in the Middle East as a whole, particularly in countries bordering Syria and Iraq. Not only do countries such as Jordan and Lebanon continue to deal with an influx of refugees from neighbouring conflicts, but some support for ISIS has even been found to exist in these countries themselves.

Indeed, The New York Times has reported that shops in Lebanon sell ISIS paraphernalia, and ISIS flags can be seen flying on the streets in the Lebanese city of Tripoli, near the Syrian border. There has been some protest support with regard to ISIS in Jordan. Therefore, as appears to be happening, the effort to combat ISIS must also include support and contributions from Muslim countries in the Middle East to ensure that its ideology and its physical presence do not spread.

As well, ISIS poses a further threat in that it has attracted, by some estimates, as many as 12,000 foreign fighters. Its own force has now increased and is now believed to be triple the size it was originally and is estimated to have over 30,000 people. These foreign fighters include many from the west, including Canada. It is disturbing to learn of Canadian youth from Calgary or Timmins becoming engulfed by the hateful ideology of ISIS and joining the group's murderous campaign.

Moreover, the possibility that some of these individuals could one day return to Canada and seek to put their pernicious ideology into practice on Canadian soil cannot itself be discounted. Importantly, therefore, the Canadian Council of Imams, along with other leaders of Canada's Muslim community, have condemned, in their words, the Islamic state's “narrow, bigoted, dogmatic distortions” and have called for “meaningful discussion, to engage preventative strategies and to find meaningful solutions to this growing threat in our country”. Indeed, such efforts must be an important part of our anti-ISIS campaign, along with the military measures we are discussing tonight.

Thus, ISIS threatens Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, the broader Middle East, and the international community at large and has even succeeded, on occasion, as I mentioned, in recruiting Canadians to join its cause. These threats must be met with the requisite response, military and otherwise. Canada must play its part, and the people of Canada should know what part we have signed up to play.

However, the unfortunate reality is that even if we succeed in defeating ISIS, as I mentioned, the global jihadist terrorist threat will persist. We must view ISIS and our efforts to combat it in that broader context, recognizing the similarities between ISIS and other jihadist groups and understanding that it is but one part of a larger terrorist threat.

I recently returned, for example, from an international conference hosted by the International Institute for Counter-Terrorism at the Interdisciplinary Center near Herzliya. Among the speakers and attendees were Iraqi Christians and Yazidis, moderate members of the Syrian opposition, and numerous international experts on terrorism and counterterrorism. One of the recurring themes of the conference was that we face not only one murderous radical Islamist group and ideology, such as ISIS, but an international network of radical Islamic terrorist ideologies. In the Middle East alone, in addition to ISIS, there are other radical Sunni groups, including al Qaeda, Jabhat al-Nusra in Syria, and Hamas and Islamic Jihad in Gaza, and radical Shiite groups such as Hezbollah in Lebanon, along with the leading state sponsor of terror, Iran, which has notably trained, supported, and financed both Sunni and Shiite radical extremist groups; for example, both Hezbollah and Hamas.

In Africa, groups such as Boko Haram in Nigeria and Al-Shabaab in Somalia are likewise violent and dangerous. Indeed, there are likely more than 40 non-state radical Islamic terrorist groups operating in some two dozen countries. As British Prime Minister David Cameron recently said, these groups espouse “a poisonous and extremist ideology that I believe we'll be fighting for years and probably decades”.

Indeed, another of the recurring themes of the conference was the need not only to fight terrorist groups militarily but to combat this poisonous ideology that underpins and nourishes their totalitarian objectives. This fight, therefore, must occur not only in the theatres of conflict, such as Iraq and Syria, but also here at home, where necessary, where some of our youth may be targeted for recruitment. To this end, as I indicated, co-operation and engagement with Muslim communities and community leaders in the west are essential.

Another important way of combatting such terrorism is cutting off its funding. In addition to Iran, Turkey and Qatar have become significant sponsors of terrorism, notably of ISIS and Hamas, and so diplomatic and financial measures could dovetail with military ones, choking off financial support for terrorist groups.

Perhaps one of the most significant things that could be done to combat terrorism is to ensure that it does not succeed to begin with, that it is not rewarded, validated, and nowhere legitimated while groups that do not adopt terrorist tactics, such as Tibetans, do not receive our attention and support. Every payment of ransom, every prisoner swap, every moral equivalence or offer of legitimacy, every unnecessary concession to a terrorist group encourages still more terror.

Indeed, for example, suggestions that Hamas should be treated as a mere political party or placed on a morally equivalent plane with democracies that fight it is itself part of a pattern of indulgence that only encourages more terrorism. For example, if we are to combat Hamas as a terrorist group, we should engage in what I have elsewhere referred to as a kind of “six D” strategy, which would work as well with regard to other terrorist groups in that regard.

The first step is demilitarization. The second is the disarming of the terrorist militias, including Hamas, Islamic Jihad and the like. The third is the dismantling of the terrorist infrastructure. The fourth is the defunding of its sources. The fifth is the detoxification of its ideology. The sixth is development—in other words, a reciprocal response to these forms of demilitarization and dismantling of the terrorist infrastructure would be a massive program for reconstruction, relief and development.

At the same time, we must ensure that groups that shun terrorist tactics receive our attention and support. For example, while parliaments around the world debate how to approach ISIS, while the subject will undoubtedly receive much attention at the upcoming UN General Assembly, and while it should be the subject of a UN Human Rights Council emergency debate, as I and others have proposed recently, one would be hard pressed to find a parliamentary debate about the plight of the Tibetan people, who have been facing repression for decades, but who, if they engaged in violence, would self-immolate rather than attack Chinese civilians.

All of this is to say that the struggle against terrorism and radical Islamist ideology is a complex, multifaceted fight. As Canadians go to Iraq to support efforts to combat ISIS, let us support them, let us have full information about the nature and scope of their mission, and let us not forget that the fight against ISIS is but one battle in a much larger war in which military, economic, diplomatic and humanitarian measures must all be brought to bear.

To conclude in that regard, first, we need to expose and unmask the critical mass of threat and the critical level of mass atrocity of ISIS and other radical terrorist Islamic groups. For example, we have seen in a poll taken now that 61% of American voters believe that the U.S. taking military action against ISIS is in the national interest, versus 13% who do not. However, when asked last year about the U.S. taking action against Syria after its reported use of chemical weapons, only 21% said that action was in the nation's interest, while 33% said it was not. I believe that it is the exposure of the barbarism of ISIS, including the theatrics of its barbarism, that has helped to mobilize public opinion. We need to really expose and unmask the critical mass, not only of threat but the critical mass of mass atrocity that has been engaged in.

Second, we need to expose and unmask the radical and murderous ideologies that underpin ISIS and the other terrorist groups, such as al Qaeda, al-Nusra, Islamic Jihad and the like, which pose a clear and present danger, as I indicated, not only to the stability of the Middle East but to Europe, North America and the like.

Third, we must expose and unmask the genocidal anti-Semitism of these groups. This is not a term that I would use lightly or easily, but there is no other term to describe the toxic convergence of the advocacy of the most horrific of crimes, namely genocide—it is a word that we should even shudder to mention. Embedded in the most enduring of radical hatred, namely anti-Semitism, is the propagation of terrorist acts and furtherance of both this genocidal objective and these radical, hateful ideologies.

Fourth, we need the U.S. and allies to step up efforts to choke off, for example, the Islamic State's funding. In particular, we need to focus on steps to choke off the oil sales of the Islamic State, its donations from the Persian Gulf and its extortion rackets. Officials said their strategy is highly dependent on the co-operation of Middle East allies such as Turkey, Qatar and Kuwait in preventing the flow of finances and fighters into the Islamic State's war machinery.

Since the primary source for the Islamic State's fund comes from its sale of oil and refined petroleum, therefore, what needs to be done is to curtail their capacity to engage in such sales and to cut off the capacity of those that assist them financially in that regard. We also need to ensure, and with this I close, that terrorism is not rewarded; that recruitment of Canadians and others is countered, as we have begun to do here in Canada with the engagement and the leadership of the Muslim communities at its helm; that we have a program and policy with respect to protect against the returning jihadist committing terrorist acts in this country. As I said, only a comprehensive approach involving military, diplomatic, political, economic, humanitarian and educational measures will achieve this.

We always have to appreciate that terrorism constitutes an assault on the fundamental security of a democracy, be it Canada, Europe, or otherwise, and that counter-terrorism is really a response in the protection of human security, the security of a democracy and the security of the life of each of its inhabitants. Equally in the Middle East counter-terrorism at this point will be and will serve the protection of the inhabitants of the countries in the Middle East who are in the first line of threat from these radical jihadist groups symbolized by ISIS, but not limited to ISIS.

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

11:30 p.m.

Newmarket—Aurora Ontario

Conservative

Lois Brown ConservativeParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of International Development

Mr. Speaker, my colleague who has always been very informed on these issues has raised some concerns that have not been brought to the House before his speech tonight. He talked about the security of the Middle East. There are significant reports telling us that there are cells of ISIS in Gaza, Lebanon and Syria. I wonder if he would like to comment further on how these are going to impact some of those countries.

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

11:30 p.m.

Liberal

Irwin Cotler Liberal Mount Royal, QC

Mr. Speaker, as I mentioned, I recently returned from a conference on terrorism that was held in Herzliya in Israel and the description there was, for example, of a triangular terrorist threat in the north, which emanates from Hezbollah. We should not forget that while Hamas has 10,000 missiles, it is estimated that Hezbollah at this point has over 100,000 missiles that could reach any point in Israel. Therefore, there is a terrorist threat that emanates from Hezbollah.

We also have al-Qaeda elements in the north. We have al-Nusra elements also in Syria. We have ISIS of course centred in Syria. Therefore, we have even more than a triangular threat in the north. We have a triangular threat in the south coming from Hamas, from Islamic Jihad, from al-Qaeda in Sanaa. We have a triangular threat from the east coming from Iraq, coming possibly from incursions from Jordan and coming, of course, from behind it all, Iran, which as I said finances, trains and arms in this instance both Hamas even though it is Sunni and Hezbollah even though it is Shiite. We have Iran, which is a state sponsor of terrorism, financing, arming, training, encouraging all these non-state radical terrorist actors.

We have to have an appreciation of all that. What I mentioned with regard to Israel is also true, though not in the same scale of threat but nonetheless, for Jordan. Jordan is also threatened in terms of al-Qaeda elements in Jordan, ISIS elements there as well, al-Nusra Front as well. We have to protect the stability of states like Jordan, like Lebanon, like Israel, like Saudi Arabia at this point, which is finding itself under threat. Ironically enough—

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

11:35 p.m.

Conservative

The Speaker Conservative Andrew Scheer

Order, please. I will have to stop the member there because I know there are other members who wish to ask questions or make comments.

The hon. member for St. John's East.

Situation in IraqEmergency Debate

11:35 p.m.

NDP

Jack Harris NDP St. John's East, NL

Mr. Speaker, I listened to the very comprehensive speech of my hon. colleague from Mount Royal. However, I would like to ask him this. He referred to part of this resolution in his speech, the UN Security Council resolution 2170, calling on all members to try to hold accountable any individuals, groups, undertakings and entities associated with al-Qaeda for abuses of human rights and violations of international humanitarian law. Also in section 5, it urges all states, in accordance with their obligations, to co-operate in efforts to find and bring to justice individuals, groups, undertakings and entities associated with al-Qaeda, including ISIL and ANF who perpetrate, organize and sponsor terrorist acts.

This was unanimously agreed to and certainly contemplates holding them to account and bringing them to justice.

Would the member care to comment on how that might be done, and emphasize this co-operation? This seems to require some major effort. Would he have any suggestions as to how the nation should co-operate in bringing this about?