Debates of May 13th, 2015

Indian Affairs and Northern Development--Main Estimates, 2015-2016

[Mark Strahl, Conservative, Chilliwack—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Mr. Chair, the member is quite correct.

Building on a previous investment of $9 million from economic action plan 2013, economic action plan 2015 invests a further $30.3 million over five years to encourage additional first nations to join the regime.

It is anticipated that this funding will allow an additional 25 communities to become participants in the first nations land management regime which, as the member said, allows first nations to opt out of certain sections of the Indian Act, giving them the ability to operate at the speed of business and make decisions for the benefit of their own communities in their own communities as opposed to the way that it is under the Indian Act where those decisions are often made in Ottawa.

[Kyle Seeback, Conservative, Brampton West, ON]

Mr. Chair, one of the other things that I was talking about, and what we are studying at committee on the access to capital, is the first nations finance authority and how it worked over several years to create a $90 million bond.

On June 14, the first nations finance authority issued that inaugural bond of $90 million, and I can tell members from listening to witness testimony that they are exceptionally proud of the work that was done in order to achieve this.

Could the parliamentary secretary explain the benefits and provide examples of communities that participated in the issuance of that bond and why that process is so important?

[Mark Strahl, Conservative, Chilliwack—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Mr. Chair, 14 first nations across Canada participated in the first nations finance authority inaugural bond of $90 million, as the member referenced. The proceeds of the bond are financing much needed infrastructure on reserve and refinancing existing costly bank loans.

The community of Membertou in Nova Scotia raised $21 million through the bond, and by using the proceeds to refinance existing commercial loans, it is saving $1.7 million in annual interest costs. These savings are being reinvested into the community.

St. Theresa Point First Nation, a fly-in community in northern Manitoba, was certified by the financial management board and was able to get out of third-party management. As a participant of the bond, it reduced its borrowing costs from rates approaching 20% to under 4%, placing them in sound financial shape.

Working with the network of aboriginal financial institutions, AANCD has supported the lending of over $2 billion to more than 38,000 aboriginal entrepreneurs to finance business startups, acquisitions and expansions, and the $2 billion threshold was reached in 2014-15.

[Kyle Seeback, Conservative, Brampton West, ON]

Mr. Chair, access to capital is and continues to be a very significant key in unlocking the economic potential of first nation communities. It is a means by which first nations can take charge of their own opportunities and their own future.

The first nations financial management board and the first nations finance authority have done a great deal to develop the fiscal conditions that make capital available for first nations. As a consequence, as we have seen, there is better infrastructure, greater economic opportunities and stronger investor confidence.

Could the parliamentary secretary comment on how important the study is that we are doing right now to try and find improvements for access to capital?

[Mark Strahl, Conservative, Chilliwack—Fraser Canyon, BC]

Mr. Chair, it is an important study of which the member has been a key part. We have heard from aboriginal stakeholders from across the country and from aboriginal financial institutions, who are all talking about some of the challenges in accessing capital on reserve and some of the success stories.

Certainly, as we proceed with the study, we want to examine and identify the barriers to capital access, so that we can continue to overcome those as we have with the FNMLA and other important investments, such as our Bill C-59 with the first nations financial management authority.

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Mr. Chair, I thank the minister for being here tonight. To move along, I will give headings in terms of where I am going. I do not want to have anyone jumping out and trying to grab papers out from underneath.

I will start with child welfare and child equity issues. How many children, 14 and under, in state care right now are aboriginal?

[Bernard Valcourt, Conservative, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Mr. Chair, as the responsibility is delegated to agencies by the provinces, I cannot give the member the exact figure of the number of children who are in care tonight. These are figures that I am sure we could gather after the fact. However, as the member knows, this responsibility belongs to several agencies and the provinces that administer child and welfare services on reserves where there are no agencies.

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Mr. Chair, actually, I got it from one of the minister's own documents. The number is 30,000 to 40,000. I think the minister does not have his facts right. The obligation to pay under the 1965 agreement is from the federal to the provincial.

Does the minister not keep track of the number of children that are in care that his government is paying for?

[Bernard Valcourt, Conservative, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Mr. Chair, the number of first nations children on reserve who are estimated to be in care is a figure that, of course, I do not check everyday. What we do as a department is transfer funds to the agencies and to the provinces for the costs they incur.

When the member talks about an obligation, I will remind the hon. member that this is a policy matter. This is a policy decision to reimburse the provinces and to fund the agencies, but it is a—

[The Assistant Deputy Chair, Conservative, Bruce Stanton]

Order, please. The hon. member for Timmins--James Bay.

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Mr. Chair, I am not asking him to check everyday. I am asking whether he bothers to keep track of the children that are under his responsibility that his own department says is 30,000 to 40,000. It is not a provincial responsibility; it is his responsibility.

Will the minister confirm that he is initiating discussions to transfer first nations child and family services programs to other groups as a result of the Canadian Human Rights Tribunal ruling on whether the federal government has discriminatory practices against first nations children? Have those discussions been initiated?

[Bernard Valcourt, Conservative, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Mr. Chair, I can assure the hon. member that the only discussions we are having with different stakeholders across the country in regard to child and family services are to improve the services that are being provided to these children. We had discussions with groups in British Columbia and, for that matter, all provinces in order to ensure that we have a system that is more accountable and transparent, and that brings about results.

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Mr. Chair, I will now turn to the issue of education. I will focus mostly on the Ontario region, so we are not jumping around.

Will the minister tell the House what the per student funding is in the Ontario region that is provided by the federal government to local education authorities for first nations students?

[Bernard Valcourt, Conservative, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Mr. Chair, in these estimates, close to $1.8 billion will be invested in education for first nations students on reserve and for post-secondary education. If the member wants to get a detailed breakdown of the amounts for Ontario, I am sure I could provide him with that information.

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Mr. Chair, I am sorry, I think the minister misunderstood the question. I was asking about the per capita student funding. Each child carries a per capita. That is how the minister funds education. I am sure he knows that, so he should be able to give me the number.

What is the per capita funding per student in an aboriginal school on reserve in Ontario?

[Bernard Valcourt, Conservative, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Mr. Chair, I do not have that figure, but I can undertake to assemble the different amounts that are provided for education in Ontario and give the member that information while, of course, looking at the total enrolment in Ontario. However, this is not information I have in front of me right now.

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Mr. Chair, I appreciate that he is going to pass that on. Would he be able to tell me, then, if a child transfers from a community like Attawapiskat to the provincial school board, what the federal government will pay to the provincial school board? These are agreements in place that Aboriginal Affairs has to deal with.

What would be the amount that is transferred from a community in an Ontario region to a provincial school board?

[Bernard Valcourt, Conservative, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Mr. Chair, the amount will vary, depending on which school board we are talking about. Usually the way it is done is that an agreement is entered into between the first nation, the school board in question, and the department, and that would establish the cost.

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Mr. Chair, in James Bay, in Attawapiskat, the per capita student funding is $8,000. The minister might want to write that down. If that child transfers to the provincial system, the federal government will pay $16,000. That means that the children in Attawapiskat are getting 50% less than children who are being transferred into the provincial system.

Will the minister tell me how much of the first nations education funding is being cut this year in the main estimates?

[Bernard Valcourt, Conservative, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Mr. Chair, there are no cuts in the estimates. What appears to be reduced spending by some $18 million, I believe, is because of targeted spending that is sunsetting at the end of March. The hon. member will recall that in economic action plan 2015, there is a commitment to invest another $200 million, which will allow us to bring that back to that program in the supplementary estimates.

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Mr. Chair, I read in the estimates that they are cutting $133.4 million this year. It is written in the main estimates. I could get him the page. It might help him.

I will continue with the Ontario region. Would the minister tell me what the literacy and numeracy rates are for aboriginal children in the schools that are under his authority in the Ontario region?

[Bernard Valcourt, Conservative, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Mr. Chair, I want the record to indicate that the $137 million decrease, which is indeed in the estimates, reflects the sunset of the original $115 million provided in 2014-15, as well as $18.4 million, that was reprofiled from 2013-14 to 2014-15.

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Mr. Chair, they said the money was sunsetted because they had reached their targets for improving first nations education. I asked what, according to this department, the literacy and numeracy rates are for first nations students in Ontario who took the standardized provincial tests.

[Bernard Valcourt, Conservative, Madawaska—Restigouche, NB]

Mr. Chair, this is information that I do not have in front of me, but we could provide it to the hon. member.

[Charlie Angus, NDP, Timmins—James Bay, ON]

Mr. Chair, I read it in the AANDC report. It was the first time that it ever kept those numbers.

Do members know what those numbers are? The literacy score is at 21% for boys. The numeracy rate is 18%. I do not know if the minister can name a country in the world where those rates would be lower.

Will the minister confirm that the internal audit into elementary and secondary schools on reserve has been cancelled?