House of Commons Hansard #222 of the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was youth.

Topics

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

11:55 a.m.

Conservative

David Wilks Conservative Kootenay—Columbia, BC

Mr. Speaker, the member opposite brings up a very good point. It was his government that changed the rules in 1995. I would encourage the member to go back and look at what the Attorney General of Canada did in 1995 to change the laws with regard to simple possession. That is the problem today with police officers having a lot of difficulty with regard to enforcement for small amounts. When I say “small amounts”, it is under subsection 4(5) of the Controlled Drugs and Substances Act. He should read it.

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

11:55 a.m.

Conservative

Terence Young Conservative Oakville, ON

Mr. Speaker, since 2010, 5,000 Ontario youth, 18 years old and under, have ended up in emergency rooms of hospitals desperate for care after smoking or ingesting marijuana. Some of them were treated, some were addicted and had been there before, and some were there due to automobile accidents. I think there is great value for the House in hearing from the member who I think was an RCMP officer for over 20 years.

I wonder if he could please tell the House what he witnessed, as a police officer on the front line on the streets, roads, and hospital emergency rooms, of the harms and risks of marijuana.

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

11:55 a.m.

Conservative

David Wilks Conservative Kootenay—Columbia, BC

Mr. Speaker, the fact of the matter is that children have become normalized to using marijuana at younger and younger ages. The challenge we have as a government is ensuring that children do not have access to marijuana at young ages because their cognitive activities, especially in school, become affected. As a police officer, I saw time and again that youth who were smoking marijuana on a daily basis were making poor judgments that they normally would not make under other circumstances. If they had not been smoking, they would have not made the same decisions.

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

11:55 a.m.

NDP

Murray Rankin NDP Victoria, BC

Mr. Speaker, I am very pleased to rise and contribute to this important debate today.

The government has sought concurrence in a report from October 2014 from the Standing Committee on Health, entitled “Marijuana's Health Risks and Harms”.

I start by noting the title because, as members will note from my remarks to follow, it seems to be the theme of the government to emphasize one part of this complex public policy debate involving marijuana. I was not the deputy chair of the health committee, as I am proud to be now. At the time, it was my colleague from Vancouver East, who has been leading the charge on this debate for the official opposition. I salute her work on the dissenting report. I would like to focus my remarks upon this dissenting report and then talk more generally about the war on drugs and what has led us to this state today.

The report that the government wishes us to concur in is a report that focuses, as its title would suggest, on health risks and harm, which are of course not to be minimized. However, there is another side to the story, and that is why the New Democratic Party produced three recommendations in a dissenting report, the subject of which I would like to address today.

The dissenting report starts by saying what I did: that the current study was unbalanced and designed to focus on the harms of marijuana policy and use in Canada. It then says that significant testimony was dismissed, so the committee was not allowed to hear and address points of view that were different from the government's preconceived notions about marijuana. The dissenting report also says that so-called opinions are what were at stake, rather than evidence-based decisions, which everyone in health policy says is the important way to do business. As a result, there were more witnesses focused on harms and risks than on the other side of the debate.

The point I want to make by way of introduction, which the dissenting report clearly addresses, is that a war on drugs is simply not working. To that end, I would like to refer to last month's issue of The Economist magazine, a very right-wing publication from the U.K., which starts a full discussion on illegal drugs with the following:

In 1971 Richard Nixon fired the first shot in what became known as “the war on drugs” by declaring them “public enemy number one”. In America and the other rich countries that fought by its side, the campaign meant strict laws and harsh sentences for small-time dealers and addicts. ... Billions of wasted dollars and many destroyed lives later, illegal drugs are still available, and the anti-drug warriors are wearying.

The article concludes by saying:

Those preparing to prosecute the next drug war need only look west to see what lies ahead of them: more violence and corruption; more HIV/AIDS; fuller jails—and still the same, unending supply of drugs.

Prohibition, which seems to be the only solution offered by the government, is simply not working. Billions of dollars later, even The Economist magazine has acknowledged that reality. That is why the NDP has sought a more balanced approach, focusing on health promotion, public education, and safety. To that end, three recommendations were made. I would like to address each of them in turn.

The first was that we “pursue a public health approach to marijuana focused on education, and where necessary, treatment and harm reduction.”

Let me be very clear. No one is suggesting that somehow there are no risks or harms associated with this activity, and I hope I am not misunderstood. Particularly for youth, there are issues that need to be addressed, without a doubt. However, to avoid a public health approach and to simply revert to a war-on-drugs approach is not going to work in addressing those harms.

For example, many people came forward—including a constituent of mine, Dr. Philippe Lucas—to advocate a public health approach to the non-medical use of marijuana and other drugs in order to minimize risks and harms. Public awareness campaigns aimed at youth have to focus on accurate information. I am old enough—and I believe you are too, Mr. Speaker—to remember the reefer madness ads that used to be around in my day. It was a joke. They did not work, and they were dismissed by most of the young people whose marijuana consumption the ads were trying to change.

Using a zero tolerance approach has not worked either. Something more nuanced is required. We should listen to the experts like Dr. Lucas and others to that end, so I will come back to that first recommendation, the public health approach.

The second recommendation by the NDP in its dissenting report is to “fund research to examine the potential effectiveness of medical marijuana.”

Medical marijuana has become a large industry. Dr. Perry Kendall, from my part of the world, claims that approximately 50% of the people who use medical marijuana do so to relieve chronic pain. There are a number of illnesses, such as HIV-AIDS and multiple sclerosis, for which it has been proven to be an important contributor to treatment. Indeed, Veterans Affairs Canada pays for the cost of medical marijuana to treat veterans with post-traumatic stress disorder.

However, research on medical marijuana, which could provide benefits in many areas, is limited because of the prohibition approach that the government takes to this issue. We need more research. I am the first to acknowledge that. Funding research on clinical effectiveness and, yes, on risks to youth and others is critically important.

The expansion of the use of medical marijuana in Canada has been absolutely remarkable. In an article in the National Post back in March 2014 that examined the marijuana medical access regulations program, I was shocked to see that in 2001 there were 88 Canadians authorized to possess marijuana under those regulations. As of 2013, that number had gone up to almost 37,000 Canadians. There were 85 marijuana production licences in 2001; in 2013, there were almost 30,000.

We can see that this is an enormous issue and a challenge, but it seems to be beyond dispute that medical marijuana has certain benefits.

The third recommendation that I would like to focus on is the one that is the most salient in this discussion: that we “establish an independent commission with a broad mandate, including safety and public health, to consult Canadians on all aspects of the non-medical use of marijuana and to”—here is the punchline—“provide guidance to Parliament on the institution of an appropriate regulatory regime to govern such use.”

We believe there needs to be this kind of independent commission to hear from people from different communities, including the law enforcement community, the medical community, the legal community, and others, to figure out how we can provide guidance to Parliament on instituting an appropriate regulatory regime, because prohibition has failed. All it has produced is violence, stigma, and control by organized crime. Simply continuing with the criminalization model is not going to work. We need to use evidence-based solutions to figure out an answer to this problem together.

Dr. Lucas is now with Tilray, a licensed producer of marijuana on Vancouver Island near Nanaimo. He has pointed out that cannabis prohibition creates more harms than cannabis use itself and that prohibition has failed to control the use and domestic production of marijuana. He points to higher and higher arrest rates in certain parts of the country, and one of my colleagues made reference to the very uneven enforcement across the country with respect to marijuana.

He says cannabis is our top cash crop in Canada and claims it has been used by approximately 50% of the population. He says prohibition ensures that young Canadians can access unregulated cannabis of unknown potency and quality and points out that it is a well-known fact that the potency of this drug has changed dramatically since the 1970s and that the drug is often cut with other products that are either very addictive or cause great harm to those people who take them. There is no quality control. People do not know what they are getting.

Youth cannabis rates have been going up. They have gone down in the last little while, but they have generally gone up. So much for the war on drugs. So much for saying, “Thou shalt not, young people.” It has not worked. We know that. Certainly in my part of the world, it is self-evident.

Cannabis enforcement is highly disproportionate across the country. That much we know. Young men, visible minorities, and first nations are greatly overrepresented in cannabis arrest statistics. That is a fact as well. Gangs, organized crime, and so forth are part of the picture, as we all know.

There are other ways to address the problem. The country I am most interested in at the moment is Portugal. In 1997, opinion polls in Portugal said that drug use was the country's biggest social problem. Now, 12 years since Portugal decriminalized personal use of small amounts of marijuana and other drugs, meaning less than 10 days' worth, what has happened is that drug use now ranks 13th in concerns. All parties in that country—left, right, and centre—support the policy of treating drug use as a health issue, and that is the first thing that was said in the dissenting report of the NDP: that this issue needs to be understood as a public health challenge and that we have to address it as such.

In Portugal, all parties support the policy of treating drug use as a health issue, not a crime. HIV rates have plummeted as well. However, decriminalization is not the same as legalization. Portugal uses what they term “dissuasion boards”, made up of doctors, psychologists, and other specialists, which aim to get addicts into treatment and prevent recreational users from falling into addiction. When necessary, they can impose fines and community work. However, removing the fear and stigma of criminal punishment has encouraged drug users to seek the help they need.

There are different approaches around the world that need to be studied if we are going to come to terms with this issue. That is why the fundamental recommendation of the NDP in its dissenting report, again, is to create an independent commission to guide Parliament on instituting an appropriate regulatory regime for the non-medical use of marijuana.

The law of unintended consequences is with us in so many areas. We now know that states such as Colorado and Washington have essentially legalized marijuana. After a year, have there been increased rates of driving under the influence? Has there been an impact, positive or negative, on youth who consume this drug? What is the reality of that? We need an evidence base.

We have the benefit of seeing whether there have been any unintended consequences. We could now check out that experience, as well as see what has been done in Uruguay or Portugal and other parts of the world. We could see whether or not there are lessons for Canada.

That is why this independent commission has to look at what is going on in other countries and see how we can address this issue. There is no doubt that issues with respect to youth have to be addressed first and foremost, so what lessons do we have in that regard?

One thing is clear: the Conservatives' “Let's just say no” is not going to work. Zero tolerance and the war on drugs have been an unmitigated disaster. We can just look at any of the streets of any city in Canada.

The question is, what we can do if we are serious about addressing the situation with respect to youth? What are the lessons we learned? That is why this commission ought to be taken very seriously.

I remember when Mr. Justice Le Dain led the Le Dain Commission back in the 1970s. We have many insights from that experience, but all that data needs to be updated. One thing that is clear is that this is not a black and white, yes-or-no issue.

Somebody who is often a witness in British Columbia cases involving drug use and addictions is Professor Mark Kleiman, a drug policy expert at the University of California, Los Angeles. As a scientist, he says that, as with any social initiative, there could be negative effects. He advocates close monitoring of excessive use among adolescents. As I said, driving under the influence certainly has to be addressed. With respect to politicians, he says that we need to inform them that they have underestimated the complexity of this problem.

It is a complex problem. That is why these yes-no, on-off solutions, the “thou shalt nots”, just simply do not cut it. We need to hear from experts like Dr. Kleiman going forward.

That is why we talk, in the second recommendation, about the need to fund research. We need to know whether this product that is so prevalent can have benefits. We need to know what those benefits are and what the risks are. Everything in life is risk versus benefit.

We can say that alcohol is a drug, which it is, that is causing harm to many families, has a staggering impact on the workplace, et cetera, but I do not think anybody is recommending a prohibition on that substance, yet we have to figure out ways to address it more effectively. I suggest that marijuana is no different in that regard and requires the kind of multi-faceted solution. As I mentioned, the commission could address it.

The NDP has talked for many years about the idea of decriminalizing and ticketing for small amounts of marijuana, and investing in additional education and programs to reduce marijuana use by young people. I was pleased to hear the Canadian Association of Chiefs of Police say that it was open to that suggestion. It wanted an expanded range of enforcement options and so forth.

This is a problem among our young people. According to the United Nations Children's Fund, in August 2013, Canadian youth were the top users of marijuana in the developed world. In fact, 28% of our youth were considered in that category. However, apparently marijuana use among Canadian youth has declined to 20.3% in 2012, according to the Canadian Centre on Substance Abuse.

Why has that happened? If that statistic is accurate, does it apply across the board to all demographics, all communities, aboriginal, non-aboriginal, visible minority, non-visible minority? What part of the country more or less? I would think that if we had a serious public health problem, we would want to grapple with that very type of question.

Maybe a one-size-fits-all regulatory solution does not make sense. In which case, how will we deal with it in different parts of the country if we do not assume that it is simply a criminal law issue that needs to be addressed through a simple prohibition model?

Those are exactly the kinds of things that the independent commission advocated by the New Democratic Party would address to provide guidance on implementing an appropriate regulatory approach, a modernized marijuana legal regime based on evidence and public health principles, seeking to balance prevention, public health and well-being, harm reduction, community safety and public education. Those are the hallmarks of good public policy.

I suggest that addressing the marijuana issue, both recreational and medical, is no different than any other challenge in the sphere, and that evidence-based policies need to be understood on the basis of comparative research and other countries, assessing best practices made available to Canadian legislators so we can come up with a made-in-Canada solution to address it to meet the unique needs of our country and our population.

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:15 p.m.

Conservative

David Wilks Conservative Kootenay—Columbia, BC

Mr. Speaker, I listened to the member's speech intently. He kept flopping between a regulatory regime versus decriminalization. They are completely different. There is not one iota where one is the same as the other.

Could the member explain to me what his definition of decriminalization is? I know what it is. However, I would like to hear from members on the other side what their definition of decriminalization is.

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:15 p.m.

NDP

Murray Rankin NDP Victoria, BC

Mr. Speaker, the definition of decriminalization, I guess, is relevant and not relevant to the debate before us. We have talked about an appropriate regulatory regime and in the context of that, I talked about decriminalization. My focus in my remarks was that third recommendation about an appropriate regulatory regime, but decriminalization would allow for a range of options, such as ticketing for small amounts and that sort of thing, as opposed to simply throwing people in jail for small amounts.

We want to take away the sanctions that are in the Criminal Code in the controlled drug substance legislation, move that to a different place, and deal with it in an entirely different way, as a first step in dealing with an appropriate regulatory regime, which would be much more comprehensive in nature.

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:15 p.m.

Liberal

Scott Brison Liberal Kings—Hants, NS

Mr. Speaker, I listened with great interest to my colleague from Victoria. He made some very good points. I hate to say it, but he makes good points in the House quite frequently on a range of issues. He is a pretty smart fellow.

On any criminal justice issue, it is really important to look at examples from other countries. For instance, if we want to talk about things like mandatory minimums, we could look at the U.S. and say that if putting more people in jail for longer periods of time created safer communities, then American cities would be the safest in the world.

However, on the decriminalization side of marijuana and some other drugs, if we look at the Portugal example, 12 years ago Portugal decriminalized marijuana and some other drugs. Since then, the rate of drug abuse and addiction has declined because the government redirected money that it was spending in the past on interdiction, jail and the whole police and judicial system on health promotion. It treated drugs as a medical issue and invested in mental health, addiction treatment and health promotion, telling people the dangers of it.

Does the hon. member agree that perhaps things could lead to less drug abuse and addiction if we redirected resources to health promotion, mental health treatment and addiction treatment?

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:20 p.m.

NDP

Murray Rankin NDP Victoria, BC

Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank my friend from Kings—Hants for his very supportive comments.

I absolutely concur that that is what has happened in Portugal. There has been a reduction in the use of drugs, including marijuana, since the regime was changed 12 years ago. As I said, it was not just legalization in that context, but it also tried to dissuade people using a harm reduction type of approach. I think health promotion would be at the centre of that particular regulatory approach, an approach which we need to study in Canada to come up with the best possible solution.

It is like the anti-tobacco regime. The government has taxed cigarettes very aggressively, but those monies are not necessarily made directly available for prevention programs, as the Canadian Cancer Society reminded me of this morning. We need to take that kind of an approach to deal with the anti-tobacco regime and apply it to marijuana in a comprehensive new regulatory program.

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:20 p.m.

NDP

Tyrone Benskin NDP Jeanne-Le Ber, QC

Mr. Speaker, I would like to go back to what my colleague spoke about with respect to the need for continued research into medical marijuana. There is an operation in my riding that supplies medical marijuana and it has helped many people with issues such as cancer and glaucoma. I have heard members on the other side sort of allude to the apparent safety of standardized drugs. I am sure members have heard the ads that list a litany of harmful side effects that some prescription drugs have, including death, as well as the growing problem among young people about using prescription drugs illegally.

I have a two-part question. Would my colleague like to comment on the importance of research into medical marijuana and the irony of the government's support of prescription drugs but not the medical use of marijuana?

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:20 p.m.

NDP

Murray Rankin NDP Victoria, BC

Mr. Speaker, the key reason we have such difficulty doing research on medical marijuana is because of the government's prohibition approach. The second recommendation in the dissenting report addresses that. It says that more in-depth research to examine the potential benefits of medical marijuana is needed, but is difficult to undertake due to current Canadian government policies on marijuana. It recommended that the government fund research on the clinical effectiveness of marijuana, as well as the long term effects on vulnerable populations, such as youth and those who suffer from mental illness.

Smoking anything cannot be good for people and I know ingesting it in other ways is an option as well, and that is before the courts right now. That is the first thing. The emphasis on prescription drugs versus marijuana actually needs to be addressed as we find more and more people producing medical marijuana in the market, as I described in my remarks.

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:20 p.m.

Conservative

Terence Young Conservative Oakville, ON

Mr. Speaker, the member opposite was paraphrasing something that apparently came out of the Canadian Association of Chiefs of Police. I want to ensure that the House has no misapprehension that the Canadian Association of Chiefs of Police supports legalizing marijuana.

In fact, I will quote from a resolution it made at its August 2013 annual conference. It states:

We believe that decriminalization or legalization is not the direction we should be moving toward from a public safety perspective....

The illicit use of cannabis can have a negative impact on public safety and the health of young persons in particular.

Cannabis is a drug that impairs cognitive function, can cause delusional thoughts or hallucinations, and negatively impacts the ability to operate a motor vehicle or machinery.

There are other comments as well.

I wanted to ensure that the House does not think somehow the chiefs of police from across Canada want to make marijuana legal or decriminalize it.

Would the member care to comment?

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:20 p.m.

NDP

Murray Rankin NDP Victoria, BC

Mr. Speaker, if I gave that impression, it certainly was not my intent. My friend from Oakville is absolutely right. There was never anything specifically to that effect in the comments made by the association. However, in its resolution of 2013, to which he referred, it did emphasize the need “to expand the range of enforcement options [for] law enforcement”. That is what I was getting at.

It is just not right in a country like Canada where in Vancouver one would basically have to do something outrageous to be charged with possession of small quantities of marijuana whereas in other parts of the country one could go to jail. That is wrong. The fact that the Canadian Association of Chiefs of Police recognizes that we need to have a different array of enforcement options is very telling.

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:25 p.m.

Liberal

Sean Casey Liberal Charlottetown, PE

Mr. Speaker, I certainly agreed very much with what the member for Victoria had to say. He talked about one of the key planks in the position of the NDP with respect to establishing an independent commission to look at a legislative regime. To me, that sounds like the door is open to the New Democrats supporting legalization. I thought all along their position was one of decriminalization. Could the member clarify that?

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:25 p.m.

NDP

Murray Rankin NDP Victoria, BC

Mr. Speaker, I thank my friend from Charlottetown for the opportunity to restate what is so clear on page 42 of the report before us today. The position of the NDP is that we need to establish an independent commission to consult on the non-medical use of marijuana and “to provide guidance to Parliament on the institution of an appropriate regulatory regime to govern such use”. In other words, we need to get it right, we need to study it, and we need all of those voices, as I mentioned, at the table. Then we need guidance on how we would implement an appropriate regulatory regime. That is where we stand. We think a made-in-Canada solution to this complex issue is necessary.

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:25 p.m.

Simcoe—Grey Ontario

Conservative

Kellie Leitch ConservativeMinister of Labour and Minister of Status of Women

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to have the opportunity to rise in the House today to speak about the serious health risks of marijuana. I will be splitting my time with the member for Mississauga East—Cooksville.

The health committee's report largely confirmed what members of the House already know. The health risks of smoking marijuana are simply irrefutable. Whether that be schizophrenia, psychosis, challenges with respect to impact on blood pressure or, quite frankly, even blood sugar, members of this House should know that Canadians kids who smoke marijuana far too frequently experience these risks.

Compare this reality with what the Liberal leader plans to do in legalizing marijuana that would see marijuana sold in stores, just like cigarettes or alcohol or, quite frankly, even candy. This approach is simply irresponsible, and I can tell the House about the risks in which it puts children. Unlike members of the opposition, I stand in emergency departments and see these children as they come in first hand. I see the impacts on these children and how terribly disturbed they are when they hit the emergency department.

No matter what the opposition says, no parent in my riding or no parent, I would think, in this country, wants their child to experience the severe experiences of psychosis or schizophrenia, things we would never want to see our children experience.

The Liberal members, as I said earlier, actually think that aspirin is just like marijuana. If we asked anyone in the area of the world I come from, they really think an aspirin is helpful when they need it, but they would never use marijuana in the same way.

This Conservative government wants to stop kids from smoking marijuana, and I just want to highlight a few of the initiatives that our government is undertaking.

In 2007, our government announced the national anti-drug strategy. The strategy contributes to making communities safer and healthier by coordinating to prevent the use of illicit drugs and the abuse of prescription drugs. It is helping with efforts to treat dependency for those who have serious addiction problems, and by working toward reducing the production and distribution of illicit drugs, some of which have already been mentioned in the House already. We are doing that. We have taken action on it. We started in 2007.

Research shows that marijuana is the most commonly used illicit drug by young people. Almost one in five students in grades 7 to 12 have used marijuana in the past year. The average age at which teens first try marijuana is 14 years old.

These statistics are alarming and confirm that the Liberal plan to legalize marijuana and their leader's insistence on normalizing the practice is, quite frankly, irresponsible and will make it even easier for kids to buy and smoke marijuana.

If the Liberal leader had his way, he would make marijuana more accessible, and has even called this Conservative government's action to shut down home grow ops, “hyper-controlled”. I would rather have that “hyper-control” and make sure children in my riding are protected rather than what the opposition is suggesting. Home group ops are dangerous and are found throughout Canadian neighbourhoods already because the courts are standing in the way of our action to shut them down to make sure children cannot access marijuana. This Conservative government will not tolerate home grow ops and we will continue to fight the courts on this issue.

We do not support making access to illegal drugs easier for kids or any Canadian. Under the national anti-drug strategy, we are undertaking specific action to address marijuana use by our young people, and we are seeing results. According to the Canadian drug use monitoring survey, marijuana use by youth has dropped by almost 30% since 2008 and 45% since 2004. The Liberal plan to legalize marijuana can only have one effect: increasing access and use.

Health Canada monitors and assesses emerging scientific evidence of the harms of marijuana use, and conducts ongoing monitoring of changes in the prevalence of youth and adult use of marijuana.

Through significant funding, Health Canada helps raise awareness through various projects and research initiatives. These projects help raise awareness of the health risks of marijuana as well as support health professionals, like myself, in their efforts to prevent marijuana and drug abuse. The effects of marijuana use, as I said, are serious, lasting and cannot be ignored.

The opposition would try to lead people to believe that the literature does not exist, but it does. As this report and scientific literature detail, the short-term effects of marijuana use include anxiety, fear or psychosis, among other things. lt can also lead to problems with concentration and the ability to think and make decisions, which can impede a child's ability to learn and succeed long term.

Long-term use can lead to an increased risk of triggering or aggravating psychiatric or mood disorders such as schizophrenia or bipolar disorder. I am not sure how many opposition members have met someone who is suffering from schizophrenia, has met someone suffering from bipolar disorder, but those people really suffer. They cannot function to the level of their true potential because of those impacts. These effects can cause lifelong problems for the individuals and their families. This Conservative government recognizes the need to keep marijuana out of the hands of kids. We do not support making access to illegal drugs possible, like the Liberals.

The hon. member of Parliament for Vancouver Centre has even stated, “...we have known all along that the long-term effects of cognitive problems coming from the smoking of marijuana over long periods amongst young people, under about 40, are high”

The Liberal leader has seen these facts and decided to completely ignore these harms and risks to Canadian youth. Preventing youth from smoking marijuana is particularly important for our most vulnerable communities. Research indicates that the typical age of onset of most substance abuse is between grade 7 and grade 9. Vulnerable communities can be at a higher risk of drug use for a variety of reasons. There may be reduced access to youth programming and limited access to safe drug-free environments.

The Liberal leader will not help deter youth from using marijuana, but instead, would rather normalize it and make it even more accessible. I guess we are supposed to then have even more programming to make sure that we can treat these children who have been impacted by becoming addicts to this terrible drug. This will not help vulnerable communities that struggle day in, day out with drug abuse.

While the Liberal Party focuses on the legalization of marijuana, our Conservative government is helping Canadian families with multiple projects to greater help youth at risk. Research shows that there is a wide range of reasons why youth begin using marijuana. Through using these data, more finely tuned prevention and educational materials have been developed, tested and distributed to children and their families.

The Liberal leader's plan to legalize marijuana and normalize smoking marijuana trivializes its risks and quite frankly sends the wrong message to our young people. Telling kids it is okay to smoke marijuana, telling kids it is okay to use marijuana every day is not a message Canadian parents want to convey to their kids.

Making marijuana available on store shelves like alcohol and cigarettes will reverse the progress that has already been made in educating young people and their parents of why this is a dangerous substance.

In addition to other projects through the Canadian Centre on Substance Abuse, our government is also providing $11.9 million over five years extending until 2018 for activities that help reduce drug abuse among youth. These activities include reviewing and synthesising research evidence on the effects of marijuana during adolescence and examining the effectiveness of brief interventions for reducing the use of marijuana.

These activities look at the effects of cannabis and strive to educate young people with up-to-date information about the serious and lasting harms of marijuana.

The former president of the CMA also stated very firmly the position against this, “...especially in youth, the evidence is irrefutable—marijuana is dangerous”. This is a statement that should be taken very seriously, a statement from a well educated physician. This Conservative government takes this issue very seriously and we will continue to fight to prevent kids from smoking marijuana.

In conclusion, I offer yet another quote from Dr. Meldon Kahan who is the medical director of the substance use service at the Women's College Hospital in Toronto. He said during the study by the committee, “...public health organizations need to conduct public health campaigns to counter the prevailing myth that cannabis is harmless and therapeutic”.

As the current president of the Canadian Medical Association has said, “Any effort to highlight the dangers, harm and potential side effects of consuming marijuana is welcome.”

I can say irrefutably having met children who have been under the influence in the emergency department with their parents in exceptional distress, whether it be because they are experiencing a psychosis, or because they have become bipolar, we need to do everything we can to make sure that this is not a legalized drug so that we protect Canadian children, unlike the approach of the Liberal leader who wants to normalize this for every Canadian kid.

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:35 p.m.

NDP

Raymond Côté NDP Beauport—Limoilou, QC

Mr. Speaker, I thank the minister for her speech.

Since this debate began, we have unfortunately seen a very clear show of political power by the Conservatives, who want to strong-arm certain members of the House. It is disappointing to see the Conservatives' hard-line attitude. This attitude has also been evident at the Standing Committee on Finance regarding the budget implementation bill. There too, we know very well that the Conservatives will not accept any of the proposals brought forward by the opposition.

At the Standing Committee on Health, the other parties came up with some very reasonable, very sensible proposals, but unfortunately, the government refuses them and remains blinded by its singular truth, the only reality that it will accept.

I want to ask the minister why she has decided to latch on to a few of the witnesses' statements, the answers that she wanted to hear, instead of looking at the big picture and finding a solution, a more comprehensive proposal for all Canadians.

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:35 p.m.

Conservative

Kellie Leitch Conservative Simcoe—Grey, ON

Mr. Speaker, I want to be very clear. Marijuana is bad for kids, and that is why I am standing here making sure that children are protected.

We know what the medical effects are when, as I mentioned in my speech, children have short-term or long-term exposure to this drug. We know the health effects can be long lasting, impacting their concentration or developing terrible mental health diseases that impact the rest of their lives.

This is actually not about political posturing, like the opposition. This is about making sure Canadian children are protected.

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:35 p.m.

Liberal

Kevin Lamoureux Liberal Winnipeg North, MB

Mr. Speaker, I believe the minister is quite wrong in her assessment when she directs personal attacks toward the leader of the Liberal Party. The Liberal Party has taken the responsible position of dealing with our young people in Canada. To try to portray that someone could go into a corner store and purchase marijuana like one can purchase candy is just utter nonsense and absolute garbage. However, the minister will stand in her place and that is what she will espouse.

My question for the minister is, why does she feel that she and her government have the right to waste Canadian tax dollars on bogus one-sided reports and spend millions of tax dollars on Conservative partisan ads promoting its political agenda?

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:40 p.m.

Conservative

Kellie Leitch Conservative Simcoe—Grey, ON

Mr. Speaker, I recognize the member in the opposition side wants to change the dialogue here, but let us be really clear. Marijuana is an illegal drug and it has long-lasting, severe health effects on children.

The Liberal leader would want to legalize marijuana, making it easier for kids to buy. That is the simple truth. That is what he said he wants to do. This side of the House believes it should be illegal, that children should not have access because of the huge impacts it has on their long-term potential. Our government is going to protect kids. They obviously want to put them at risk.

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:40 p.m.

Conservative

Terence Young Conservative Oakville, ON

Mr. Speaker, something has happened during this debate. I think what has happened is someone is calling down from the Liberal leader's office because we are starting to get this message. We have heard twice now from the other side that, given the chance and they legalize marijuana, one could not just go into a store and buy it. Therefore, my question would be, had I the opportunity, where would I buy it? Would someone have to show ID? That is a tough condition, having to show ID. We know that a huge number of our teens suffer from binge drinking and the regulatory regime for alcohol and cigarettes does not prevent teens from getting alcohol and cigarettes.

One of the members across was talking about how marijuana is used based on the patient's claim that it kills pain. No one can refute that per se, but there is no research that proves it does kill pain, certainly not better than the other 200 painkillers on the market. However, we do not give powerful narcotics to people who do not have serious pain. Why is that? It is because they are risky. They can damage organs. They can cause addiction, et cetera. Why would we want to put another powerful narcotic on the market and make it available young people to endanger their health?

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:40 p.m.

Conservative

Kellie Leitch Conservative Simcoe—Grey, ON

Mr. Speaker, similar to my colleague from Oakville, I completely agree. Why would we want to legalize another drug that could just put children at risk?

Our government has been very clear. We do not support making access to illegal drugs easier. This Conservative government will focus on making sure children do not have access to smoking marijuana, unlike the opposition members who seem to want to put children at risk through this process.

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:40 p.m.

Conservative

Wladyslaw Lizon Conservative Mississauga East—Cooksville, ON

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to rise in the House today to speak to the health committee's report, “Marijuana's Health Risks and Harms”, and how this Conservative government is addressing the problem of youth smoking marijuana.

I would first like to thank the committee for its excellent work on this issue, and especially for the detail that the report offers regarding the lasting and serious harms that come from smoking marijuana. This report makes it clear for all to see that the Liberal leader's plan to make marijuana more available to kids is irresponsible and disturbing.

The Liberal Party wants to legalize marijuana, making it even more accessible to young Canadians. This is irresponsible and completely ignores the scientific evidence regarding its health risks and harms. The serious and lasting health risks of smoking marijuana are irrefutable. The rate of marijuana use among youth in Canada is already twice the rate of use among adults. The committee also found that Canadian youth age 11 to 15 are among the highest users of marijuana compared to their peers in other countries. Evidence suggests that Canadians are also not as well informed about the risks of smoking marijuana as they are about other illicit drugs. These statistics are alarming, and this Conservative government is concerned about the harmful effects of marijuana on youth.

Unlike the Liberal leader, we do not support making access to illegal drugs easier. Marijuana is dangerous, and it is irresponsible for governments to communicate that it is somehow safe and normal for kids to smoke it. Research has already shown that marijuana is harmful to the lungs and brain. The Liberal leader wants to make smoking marijuana a normal, everyday activity for kids and have it sold in stores just like cigarettes and alcohol. The Liberal leader has chosen to ignore the serious and lasting health effects of smoking marijuana, which the health committee has painstakingly detailed in the report before the House today. Marijuana is illegal and is so for a reason. Its lasting and serious health effects cannot be understated.

That is why our government's anti-drug approach through the national anti-drug strategy is working to stop Canadians of all ages, especially kids, from smoking marijuana. Since the launch of the strategy, its drug treatment funding program has provided funding for 29 projects across Canada. Concerning problems related to smoking marijuana, we are also helping with efforts to treat dependency for those people who have serious addiction problems.

We are also providing $1.2 million to the Nova Scotia government for a project entitled “Nova Scotia's strengthening treatment systems project” to increase the uptake of treatment practices by addictions workers. A key target group for these projects are those suffering from concurrent mental health and substance use disorders. This client group suffers from two serious health problems: illicit drug use, like marijuana; and ongoing mental health concerns. The Liberal leader ignores these vulnerable individuals when he attempts to normalize the smoking of marijuana and its lasting and serious health risks.

Our government is also providing $1.2 million to the Saskatchewan Ministry of Health to undertake its project implementing evidence-informed practice in Saskatchewan's addiction treatment program. This project is working toward improving its standardized treatment practices across addiction and mental health sectors. When addiction is coupled with problems such as anxiety and depression, the related challenges are compounded for clients as well as the professionals in charge of their care.

The good news for my colleagues is that the rate of kids smoking marijuana in Canada is actually trending down, thanks to this good work. According to a Canadian drug-use monitoring survey's most recent report, marijuana use by youth has dropped by almost 30% since 2008 and by 45% since 2004. The same report noted that, while 20% of youth smoked marijuana in 2012, 70% of youth drank alcohol.

The Liberal leader's plan to make marijuana available in stores, just like alcohol and cigarettes, would mean increasing the rate at which youth smoke marijuana to the same rate at which they consume alcohol, almost tripling its use.

The president of the Canadian Medical Association said:

Any effort to highlight the dangers, harm and potential side effects of consuming marijuana is welcome.

We know that work needs to be done to reduce the rate at which our kids smoke marijuana, but the Liberal leader is choosing to ignore the advice of experts, showing once again that he is just not ready for the job. The Liberal leader's own MPs are even on the record defending illegal marijuana storefronts in B.C. and elsewhere. His refusal to condemn these illegal operations, which are regularly caught peddling marijuana to kids, should not surprise anyone. These storefronts are the Liberal vision of Canada.

Make no mistake, storefronts selling marijuana are illegal under this Conservative government and will remain illegal, and we expect the police to enforce the law. A marijuana store on every street corner fits perfectly with the Liberal leader's on-the-record statements defending the dangerous home grow ops in Canadian neighbourhoods, which this Conservative government is fighting in court to shut down.

The irony of the Liberal plan to legalize marijuana is that it would in no way reduce the rates of youth smoking marijuana or, indeed, the illegal drug trade. Expert witnesses who contributed to this report by the health committee actually spoke to this point at length. I will quote Dr. Harold Kalant, who said:

...I would point out that the hope that legalizing would eliminate the black market would be true only if it were sold legally at a lower price than the black market. If you do that, the use is likely to increase greatly.

However, this expert's testimony conflicts with the Liberal vision of Canada, so its leader will pay it no mind. Dr. Kalant offered further thoughts on the subject, which I will highlight here before I conclude. He said:

...the use of cannabis for pleasure comes at a cost, and society must ponder whether the pleasure is worth the cost. ...society as a whole must give careful thought to changes in policy that could increase the number and severity of health problems caused by use by its more vulnerable members, which, as I have pointed out, means its younger users.

The Liberal leader asserts that our government's work, which actually shows results in stopping kids from smoking marijuana, is a “hyper-controlled” approach. He cannot even agree with the actions being taken against home growers. He wants to make smoking marijuana an everyday activity for Canadians and completely ignore its serious and lasting health risks. He ignores the risks that the home grow ops put on communities.

The Conservative government is making significant progress on the complex issue of drug addiction. We all have a role to play and a contribution to make. Our government believes in collaborating with our key partners in these efforts. We applaud the work being done and support these efforts by our partners in undertaking research and knowledge brokering, by making intelligent policies, crafting important legislation, and providing funding where appropriate.

The Conservatives' approach to stopping kids from smoking marijuana is working. It is the right public health message to send to Canadian families, and above all, it is responsible.

Again, I want to thank the Standing Committee on Health for undertaking this work and for this insightful report on marijuana's health risks and harms. My hope is that the Liberal leader takes this report seriously and takes the time to listen to the medical experts who agree with the former president of the Canadian Medical Association, who said, “especially in youth, the evidence is irrefutable—marijuana is dangerous”.

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:50 p.m.

NDP

Mathieu Ravignat NDP Pontiac, QC

Mr. Speaker, I listened with great interest to my hon. colleague's speech.

There is something we have to take into account in this debate: marijuana has changed a lot over the years. It has been bred in order to increase its hallucinogenic effects and can indeed have a very harmful effect on a child's young brain. Obviously, I am completely against giving marijuana to children. However, it is a question of age, of course.

We need to do more to educate people about the harmful effects of this drug, which has been modified so much that it is a far cry from its natural state.

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:50 p.m.

Conservative

Wladyslaw Lizon Conservative Mississauga East—Cooksville, ON

Mr. Speaker, as the member probably knows, I do serve on the health committee, and I was at the meetings and listened to the witnesses.

What the member did not say was that the marijuana that is available today is from 10 to 30 times stronger than it was in the 1970s. It is stronger and, therefore, it is more dangerous.

When I was growing up, there was no culture of smoking marijuana. I never saw it. I was never offered it. I never tried it. However, I did witness the tragedies of people addicted to alcohol, and I do not think this is any different. This is an addictive substance. It does not do anybody any good.

HealthCommittees of the HouseRoutine Proceedings

12:50 p.m.

Liberal

Hedy Fry Liberal Vancouver Centre, BC

Mr. Speaker, the hon. member did remind everyone that he was on the committee and that he listened to the evidence.

If he listened to the evidence, he would have listened to at least five researchers from the University of Montreal, from British Columbia, and from the University of Toronto, all suggesting that in fact, when there is legalization and regulation, not only is the actual substance regulated but the potency of the substance is regulated.

He is right, of course, that the THC in marijuana today is not the same as it was even 10 or 12 years ago. The problem is that, if it can be regulated, one of the things in regulation would be that it would not be allowed to contain more than X grams of THC. The potency would be changed and that would be regulated as well.

Did the member not hear that from people who presented at the committee?