Debates of May 16th, 2016

National Defence—Main Estimates, 2016-17

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Mr. Chair, the main estimates for defence services and contributions to government are shown as $58.7 million lower than last year, yet the recent Fort McMurray wildfire is projected to cost in the billions. Together with citizens throughout Canada, we thank the heroic efforts of the 427 Griffon and 450 Chinook squadrons.

From which defence category will the minister be taking funds to cover any shortfall?

[Harjit S. Sajjan, Liberal, Vancouver South, BC]

Mr. Chair, when it comes to disasters like this, our first responsibility is to always make sure that we respond. We have done that. We are not at the stage of talking about how much money it will cost. At that time, my deputy minister will take a look at where it needs to come from. If we need to do cost capturing, we can take a look at that. However, having said this, our first responsibility will always be to respond. The Canadian Armed Forces is well suited for it. If we need additional funds, we will request it.

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Mr. Chair, is the minister saying that the funds will come from somewhere other than from another category within Defence?

[Harjit S. Sajjan, Liberal, Vancouver South, BC]

Mr. Chair, we are not at that stage of discussions. Right now, I think the Chinook helicopter might still be there, so we have not come to that stage. I want to make sure that we have enough resources for Fort McMurray. If there is any potential follow-up resources that are required, when we get to that stage, we will look at the costing of it and have a discussion on that.

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Mr. Chair, Bangladesh, at 9,432 uniformed personnel, followed by Ethiopia, India, Pakistan and Rwanda, contribute the highest number of any nation to UN peacekeeping operations. The announcement by the Prime Minister that Canada should replace Bangladesh as the largest contributor to UN peacekeeping missions sets the goal of committing over 9,400 Department of National Defence Canadian Armed Forces personnel. Where in the estimates is this cost accounted for?

[Harjit S. Sajjan, Liberal, Vancouver South, BC]

Mr. Chair, the metric for involvement with the United Nations is not about the number of troops. We will actually be elevating the conversation much higher than just the number of people that we send. We want to look at how we can do new capacity-building, preventing conflict from going to the tipping point, whether we can we do capacity-building and policing early. It is not just looking at it from a military perspective. We need to look at where there is lack of governance as well. We need to understand conflict better. Therefore, the metric of how we participate with the UN, or any other multilateral organization, will be much more than just the number of people we provide. It is how we provide it, how we integrate some of our assets, and how we integrate with some of the other organizations that are already involved.

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Mr. Chair, the drop in Canadian peacekeepers happened during the Chrétien decade of darkness years of military cutbacks, starting in 1994 during the UN mission to Rwanda. Canada's UN troop contributions dropped from 2,585 in January 1995, to 254 by December of 1997.

Exchanging places with countries such as Bangladesh, Ethiopia, India, Pakistan, and Rwanda represents a need to aggressively recruit new personnel. Where is this additional cost in the estimates, or will the minister be seeking new appropriations from Parliament once his department presents the options for the so-called renewal of Canada's commitment to UN peacekeeping operations?

[Harjit S. Sajjan, Liberal, Vancouver South, BC]

Mr. Chair, I would like to talk about what we will be doing now in terms of our involvement in the world. We have announced and have started to implement our renewed mission in Iraq and Syria. We have troops right now doing training, as part of operation reassurance in Poland and other parts of Europe. We have a company in Ukraine right now. When it comes to any new type of mission, we will do it with a thorough analysis like we did with Iraq and Syria. When we come to any decisions, there will be a cost to it, just like the cost for Operation Impact, which was $306 million, and which we had to come to cabinet for approval and debate in the House. Therefore, for any new initiative, we will do a thorough analysis, and if additional resources are required, it will be a government decision.

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Mr. Chair, the minister was quick to criticize our Conservative government by saying that anti-armour defences were not provided when they should have been, in addition to air cover. How, then, can the minister justify pulling air defences so we can call in a mission redirect if necessary, when the anti-armour capability he had identified as being necessary is not in place now that we are putting even more boots on the ground in Iraq?

[Harjit S. Sajjan, Liberal, Vancouver South, BC]

Mr. Chair, some anti-armour capability is going in. I am not going to discuss exactly which one and give this information to ISIL. We are addressing that immediately. We are looking at even newer systems as well.

I would note that our members are well protected. We work in a coalition environment. They have all of the assets necessary. We have mitigated a lot of the safety concerns. The other aspect is that our members are extremely well trained as well, and they have proven this on a number of occasions, which we have talked about in the past.

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Mr. Chair, the wait times for retiring armed forces members are horrendous. The men and women who have proudly served this country have to wait anywhere from between four weeks to thirty-six weeks before they receive a cheque. I would have to agree with the minister, in his own words, that it is unacceptable.

My question is simple. It has been over a month since the minister said that he would fix the problem. Has anything changed?

[Harjit S. Sajjan, Liberal, Vancouver South, BC]

Mr. Chair, this is a problem. We have put more resources on to this issue. A member should not have to wait that long. We are working on this backlog. The chief of the defence staff did brief me on the numbers, but unfortunately I have forgotten the actual percentage that it has been reduced.

Having said that, any priority case that does come up, we action immediately. I have given one example, which was when a member was retiring and wanted to go to school. We were able to make sure that he received his pension cheque and sorted that out within 18 hours.

We are trying to manage this as quickly as possible, and, more importantly, trying to reduce the burden of these files as they come to management level so our members are not waiting for long periods of time.

[Cheryl Gallant, Conservative, Renfrew—Nipissing—Pembroke, ON]

Mr. Chair, the minister's colleague from Vancouver Quadra said on May 16, 2014:

Although there are other jobs in the Canadian Armed Forces that [injured Canadian Armed Forces members] could certainly do, because of the universality of service provisions in the Canadian Armed Forces, unless these members are fully capable of being deployed and doing the most difficult work possible, they are not eligible to stay in the Canadian Armed Forces. That would do far more to satisfy the concerns of these injured members or people with medical conditions than to force them to leave the Canadian Armed Forces and transition into meaningful civilian life.

Last week, it was reported that the chief of the defence staff has said that it is unlikely we will change the universality of service policy. Under our government, National Defence set up a working group to examine universality of services provisions and approve the roles for members who may have to be discharged due to injury.

What progress has been made by that working group?

[Harjit S. Sajjan, Liberal, Vancouver South, BC]

Mr. Chair, in terms of universality of service, there is obviously a set requirement that our members need to be fully operational. However, when there is an injury or any type of circumstance where a member cannot fulfill those duties, there is a process that is taken. There is an opportunity where we look at how we can employ the member, in other trades potentially. They do go through a process. If they cannot go through that, then they go through a two-year to three-year transition period where they can get all the necessary training and the resources so they can transition into civilian life.

[Mark Gerretsen, Liberal, Kingston and the Islands, ON]

Mr. Chair, we have spent a great deal of time tonight discussing the important issue of the main estimates for the Canadian Armed Forces and the Department of National Defence.

I would like to contribute to this debate by saying a few words on what our men and women in uniform do on behalf of Canadians here at home. While the Canadian Armed Forces play an important role on the international stage, their primary responsibility is always to defend Canada and Canadians. They are not alone in this, of course. They work with the security partners at the federal level, as well as the provinces, territories, and municipalities, as they did during the Vancouver Olympics in 2010.

Members of the Canadian Armed Forces are embedded in the provincial response centres across the country, helping to improve coordination. However, the military's role is unique. They must respond when no one else can and have skills and tools that no one else can bring to the table. We are seeing this now. This chamber has been united in its response to the tragic efforts in Fort McMurray. Our thoughts and prayers go out to the victims and their families. I think all hon. members join with me in my admiration and respect for the firefighters and other first responders. These dedicated men and women are leading the fight to contain the fires, protect critical infrastructure, and save lives.

However, when the Province of Alberta called for additional support, the Canadian Armed Forces was ready, as it always is, to provide assistance. To date, they have provided five helicopters and a transport plane, which have been used to evacuate people, deliver essential aid, and move firefighters and their equipment. In fact, this is the first time that a Chinook helicopter was deployed on a domestic operation since becoming fully operational in 2015.

This kind of help, in the form of personnel and specialized equipment, is something the Canadian Armed Forces is able to provide, and they have done so on many occasions in recent memory. To name a few, in 2010, more than 1,000 personnel helped residents of Newfoundland deal with the storm damage of Hurricane Igor. In 2011, more than 1,800 personnel helped Manitobans deal with flooding, in a region to which they were deployed again in 2014. There were more than 840 soldiers who helped deal with floods near Saint-Jean-sur-Richelieu. Approximately 2,300 troops, including some local reservists, provided support during the floods in southern Alberta in 2013. Last year, more than 850 military members helped the people of Saskatchewan deal with the wildfires that were eerily similar to those now in Alberta. Time and again, our men and women in uniform have been deployed to help preserve the lives and property of their fellow citizens

It is important for us to remember that every tool at the disposal of the Canadian Armed Forces, from the helicopters which can lift people stranded by fire to safety, or transport aircraft that can move supplies to remote areas, or satellites that can map the effects of a flood in near real time, or regular or reserve force members who step forward to protect their communities, is one that can provide assistance to Canadians in real time and in their time of need.

As the effects of climate change make extreme weather events more likely, we can expect more requests of this type in the near future.

However, these sorts of natural disasters are not all that our men and women in uniform do to keep their fellow citizens safe. The work that they do as part of the national search and rescue program is just as impressive, and they do it every day.

As my honourable colleagues know, many agencies at the federal, provincial, territorial, and municipal levels share responsibility for search and rescue. As well as the many volunteer organizations made up of ordinary citizens who will drop whatever they are doing to help their fellow citizens in need, the Canadian Armed Forces primarily provide air and maritime assets to this program, as well as coordinating search and rescue efforts through three national centres.

All three branches of military are involved in this effort. The Royal Canadian Navy keeps ships on the east and west coasts at all times, ready for search-and-rescue missions. The Canadian Rangers regularly conduct and assist ground search and rescue in sparsely settled regions of the country. The Royal Canadian Air Force maintains fleets of Cormorant and Griffon helicopters, as well as Buffalo and Hercules airplanes.

These efforts are all impressive, but special mention goes the Canadian Air Force's specially trained search and rescue technicians. These brave men and women, only 140 in number, respond to more than a 1,000 taskings each and every year. They have saved thousands of lives, sometimes at the risk of their own. They do this because it is their duty, and to be true to the inspirational words of their motto, “That others may live”.

National Defence has requested approximately $75 million in this year's main estimates to support search and rescue operations in coordination, and I think this chamber will agree, it is money well spent.

The last item I will touch on briefly is the military's role defending and guaranteeing Canadian sovereignty. Both in coordination with NORAD and on its own, the Canadian Armed Forces secure all maritime and air approaches to our country. This includes in the Arctic, which is becoming increasingly accessible due to the effects of climate change.

Sovereignty activities include: fighter deployments in response to potential threats and challenges to our sovereignty; air and maritime patrols with Royal Canadian Navy ships and Royal Canadian Air Force aircraft; sovereignty and surveillance patrols by the approximately 5,000 Canadian Rangers and periodic deployment of land forces to foster connections with northern communities; joint and inter-governmental operations in the Arctic that demonstrate our ability to respond to natural disasters and three annual operations involving the regular force, reservists, and other federal and territorial agencies; and finally, wide-area surveillance of Arctic regions using the North Warning System and Canada's RADARSAT-2 satellite.

Our government has committed to continuing investments that will strengthen the ability of the Canadian Armed Forces to project sovereignty into the Arctic. The most notable of these is the procurement of Arctic/offshore patrol ships. These ice-capable ships, the first of which are being built as we speak, will conduct sovereignty and surveillance operations in Canada's coastal regions.

As the effects of climate change make Arctic passageways more accessible, the dangers of smuggling, trafficking and pollution will also increase. This makes it even more essential for the Canadian Armed Forces to be able to operate there, to monitor activity and, if necessary, to defend our shores from any threat that may appear.

While the international operations of our military may attract the most attention, we must not forget that the Canadian Armed Forces plays an ongoing and essential role in protecting Canadians at home. The government has committed to preserving current defence spending levels as well as planned increases, to ensure our men and women in uniform have the resources they need to carry out these important missions.

I am certain that all hon. members will continue to ensure that our Canadian Armed Forces can continue to defend our fellow citizens from both natural disasters and more sinister threats.

My first question for the Minister of National Defence is this. We are fully aware, as I indicated, of the role that our Canadian Armed Forces is playing and the work they are contributing in Fort McMurray in this time of need. Could the minister provide some more input and expand on the role that the Canadian Armed Forces is playing in Fort McMurray as we speak?

[Harjit S. Sajjan, Liberal, Vancouver South, BC]

Mr. Chair, I actually recently visited the operation centre. I was thoroughly impressed with the response. A lot of the contributions we have made have already been outlined. I would like to highlight the relationship that the joint task force west, the commander and some their staff actually had with the province. The relationship resulted in great coordination and effort.

The only direction I gave to Chief of the Defence Staff, when the request came to me from the Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness, was to ensure that all assets were available for this operation. Then the chain of command did its wonderful work.

[Mark Gerretsen, Liberal, Kingston and the Islands, ON]

Mr. Chair, we know that in order to do this work, our Canadian Armed Forces will have to be compatible and work with our other departments throughout our government. Could the minister expand a little on how that works, and how the departments work together in time of need, as we see in this particular natural disaster?

[Harjit S. Sajjan, Liberal, Vancouver South, BC]

Mr. Chair, the department works quite seamlessly with the various agencies. We have members who are actually posted within the provincial emergency units. Each province has that, but we also work within the various departments ensuring we have the right level of response.

It depends on the level of emergency. We may put more resources to it. However, this is something that just does not happen over night. It is planned, trained on, and then we execute. Fortunately, it has turned out very well, but we need to be always vigilant on how we move forward.

[Mark Gerretsen, Liberal, Kingston and the Islands, ON]

Mr. Chair, could the minister also expand on the training that is involved with our Canadian Armed Forces in preparing to assist with natural disasters or emergencies at home?

[Harjit S. Sajjan, Liberal, Vancouver South, BC]

Mr. Chair, there is a considerable amount of training that happens, and I will give an example from B.C. There is an exercise that the province has taken on for emergency preparedness in Port Alberni, in which we will be taking part. We also work very closely with some of the heavier search and rescue teams where they have trained some of our members on light urban search and rescue. Many different aspects of training happen.

We also take proactive measures in ensuring that some of our members are trained up, for example, with the threat of forest fires this season. We are ensuring that some of our immediate response units are already trained up. I believe they get stage 3 training early on so if they are ever needed, rather than waiting to get the training, they can respond immediately to these threats.

[Mark Gerretsen, Liberal, Kingston and the Islands, ON]

Mr. Chair, following up on that, could the minister describe how the defence of Canada will play into the defence policy review?

[Harjit S. Sajjan, Liberal, Vancouver South, BC]

Mr. Chair, when it comes to the defence of Canada, our number one priority is the security of Canadians.

We do now a number of things now, for example, our Canadian Joint Operations Command, our binational relationship with NORAD, and also our Special Operations Command.

As we launch our defence review, we will be looking at ensuring we have the right command structure and the right capabilities that meet the needs of the current threats, but more important, the threats of the future as well.

[Mark Gerretsen, Liberal, Kingston and the Islands, ON]

Mr. Chair, I would like to change gears to our reservists. We rely on many reservists during a time of need at home.

I am from a riding that has if not the oldest then one of the oldest reserve units, which is the PWOR, the Princess of Wales' Own Regiment. Its members have approached me with many different concerns about how reservists are going to be playing into the defence policy review that we are undertaking right now.

I know the minister has already spoken about reservists in answering other questions, but would he like to expand on his thoughts about how we are going to see reservists in the review policy that we are undertaking right now?

[Harjit S. Sajjan, Liberal, Vancouver South, BC]

Mr. Chair, it is one of the questions we have had, especially as we have our consultations across Canada. This is a discussion that we do bring up and there are various experts members who provide their advice.

I also want to point out, which is very important, that the reserve units and leaderships themselves have an opportunity to present their facts through the chain of command. All Canadians, even as reservists as they are a citizen as well, can participate in other ways with the defence review and make their feelings known.

The reserves play a critical role currently, and we need to look at modernizing the process.

[Rachel Blaney, NDP, North Island—Powell River, BC]

Mr. Chair, I will be taking my time today to ask questions of the minister after a very brief statement.

I want to thank the men and women in uniform who serve our country every day, the civilians who support their work, and the families that sacrifice so much to support their loved ones so they can serve us. It is a special honour for me to be here today, as I represent CFB Comox. It is a great honour to work for the people in my riding who serve our country.

I would like to ask the minister this. In 2015, on how many occasions were the Buffalo CC-115 airplanes unavailable for search and rescue?