House of Commons Hansard #357 of the 42nd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was post.

Topics

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:15 a.m.

Some hon. members

On division.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:15 a.m.

Liberal

The Assistant Deputy Speaker Liberal Anthony Rota

(Motion agreed to)

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:15 a.m.

Liberal

Patty Hajdu Liberal Thunder Bay—Superior North, ON

moved that Bill C-89, An Act to provide for the resumption and continuation of postal services, be read the third time and passed.

Madam Speaker, let me be clear. Our government is using back-to-work legislation as a last resort. I have said many times that the best deals are reached at the table and that I will always have faith in the collective bargaining process. Having said that, it is clear that in this situation the government had to act, which is a decision I do not take lightly.

For a year, the government has been doing everything possible to support and encourage both sides to reach a deal at the table. We provided conciliation officers, appointed mediators and offered voluntary arbitration. We re-appointed the special mediator in a last-ditch effort to reach a deal, and now we have exhausted all of our options.

Over the last five weeks, Canadians in over 200 communities have seen delays. Small businesses are paying more for shipping, consumers are less and less confident that their packages will arrive, and vulnerable Canadians are worried they will not get their cheques on time. This is a very busy time of year. Businesses are relying on Canada Post in order to have a profitable holiday season, and Canadians need to see as quickly as possible that mail and packages are moving and that they can depend on a reliable and predictable service.

These work stoppages are having a serious impact on Canadians businesses as well, especially during the busiest time of year for e-commerce. For many Canadian businesses, their busiest time of year is from now until the end of the holiday season. With a parcel backlog that may well go into 2019, Canadians are losing confidence. They are cancelling orders, or they are not ordering at all. It will not be long before we start hearing of small businesses that cannot survive. We can do something to help and we must.

I will tell members about Maureen Lyons, owner of Mo McQueen and Sons. She said:

If by the end of the week, by some miracle, things could resume or at least the shopping public's faith in the system of delivery could be restored, I think it would help a great deal. We are as grassroots as it gets. I don't make a ton of money as it is. It is so frustrating. We 're the little guys. And I'm not just a seller ... I'm also trying to find things for my own children for Christmas that I can't get.

How can we expect Canadians to place orders when they cannot be assured they will receive their packages on time? At the same time, Canada Post has asked its international partners to stop shipments to Canada. What kind of message does it send to Canadian businesses? The holiday season starts this week, and package loads are about to double. We are at a critical moment when inaction on our part would be irresponsible.

The Retail Council of Canada, believes this situation can be fixed if the strikes are brought to an end without delay. Karl Littler, spokesman for the Retail Council of Canada, says that “It's a matter of averting the crisis before it becomes full-blown”. We need to avert this crisis.

Most of us in the House know someone in our communities who has opened a business selling locally sourced or even handmade products. We do what we can to support these businesses. We want to see them thrive. In fact, I have many such businesses in my riding. Often they are young entrepreneurs with investments from family, and sometimes the only money they have, invested in these businesses and are trying to grow them to support themselves and the local economy while also hiring people in their new businesses.

Many of these businesses rely on online sales to survive, especially at this time. In fact, the fourth quarter is when many local and family-owned businesses make the majority of their sales. If the strikes are left to continue through the holiday season and sales continue to decline, some of these smaller businesses could close.

Entrepreneurs who sell through the eBay, Etsy and Amazon platforms already have razor-thin margins. With the higher cost of shipping through courier companies, how can they turn a profit? For rural businesses where Canada Post is typically the only parcel delivery service available, there is no alternative. They are in a very tough spot, one that I would say is precarious.

According to the Canadian Federation of Independent Business, two-thirds of the small and medium-sized enterprises surveyed have said they are being affected by the rotating strikes at Canada Post. This is costing them on average almost $3,000 in additional costs. Is it any wonder that the negative effects of these ongoing strikes are also jeopardizing Canada's reputation as a reliable market for commerce and trade?

E-commerce is a significant source of economic growth in Canada. In 2018, Canadians are doing much more of their shopping online compared with the 2011 strike.

According to Statistics Canada, Internet-based sales from all retailers rose 31% to $15.7 billion in 2017, and up to 40% of these sales took place in the fourth quarter, which the strike is currently impacting. These negative impacts on this business to date will only continue to worsen. We did not want it to come to this, but in light of these consequences, we see no alternative.

While our government is aware of the serious negative impacts these strikes are having across the country for businesses and everyday Canadians, we must take into account as well Canada's vulnerable and remote populations. Older Canadians, persons with disabilities, low-income earners, as well as Canadians living in rural, remote and northern areas, all of these groups rely on physical mail delivery and are disproportionately negatively impacted by extended work stoppages.

Thirty per cent of our population, almost nine million Canadians, live in rural and remote areas, often with unreliable Internet. What does a disruption mean to them? Not only does it mean no parcels, it means no access to bills, statements, government services, personal communications and any other mail they require and depend on. For them, the costs of alternatives to Canada Post are very high and for many, out of reach.

In some remote northern areas, where residents rely on mail and parcel delivery more than anywhere else in Canada, there are simply no alternatives to Canada Post.

Jim Danahy, CEO of CustomerLAB, said:

Canada is the second biggest land mass in the world and while most of our population is in the southern portions of the country, we have people in every corner, in very remote locations.

We have Indigenous population is very small and sometimes isolated communities that you can only reach by water or by air. So, in those cases, the local economies can be hit quite significantly

Beverley Mitchell wrote to the Toronto Star. She said:

While mail disruption is an inconvenience to many of us living in Canada, it is an impossible situation for those in remote fly-in communities in Northern Canada.

Unlike other Canadians who have options of private courier services, those living in these regions must rely on Canada Post for all of their deliveries.

Through a newly formed non-profit organization...I am personally involved in sending much-needed food to shelters and soup kitchens; warm clothing to the homeless, poor and elderly; school supplies and food to daycares...

We need to take action now. It is not just our small businesses that are suffering. Our e-commerce business and in fact many community members who rely on Canada Post are suffering as well.

These vulnerable Canadians are not worrying about their online shopping; they are worrying about covering their basics, like food and clothing. We must act on their behalf.

This is absolutely a last resort, but we know we must act in the best interests of Canadians and Canadian businesses. Having exhausted all other possibilities, we believe this is the best and the only course of action.

I ask my hon. colleagues to join me in supporting Bill C-89.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:25 a.m.

NDP

Karine Trudel NDP Jonquière, QC

Madam Speaker, it is with indignation that I rise to speak to Bill C-89 for the resumption and continuation of postal services.

The Minister of Employment, Workforce Development and Labour claims that the government exhausted all options, but let us not forget that the government did this knowing full well that special legislation would be ready if postal workers did not bend to their employer's demands. The Minister of Labour presents this dispute as a long list of proposals by Canada Post and its employees. That is inaccurate. The one thing Canada Post did was to allow the negotiations to go on for a long time without proposing any real solutions for its employees. Thanks to the Liberals, Canada Post got what it wanted, namely back-to-work legislation under the same conditions. Incentive for negotiation and the balance of power have evaporated since employees know that they will be forced to go back to work sooner or later.

In 2011, the Harper Conservatives imposed this same measure, which was ruled unconstitutional by the Supreme Court. At the time, the Liberals condemned the very same back-to-work legislation they are now about to use. Ultimately, there is very little difference between a Liberal government and a Conservative one. Workers know that the NDP will fight for their rights every time, not just when it suits us.

There is one important point I want to raise: postal workers are not happy about going on strike. For thousands of middle-class families, striking is they only way they can maintain a position of strength vis-à-vis Canada Post. The Liberals and the Conservatives are spreading a false message when they say the strike is completely blocking mail delivery. The union chose to do rotating strikes specifically because it does not want to block mail delivery and wants to minimize the impact of strike action on small businesses.

A few days ago, Canada Post announced that it was the last chance to process the mail backlog before the avalanche of holiday packages hits. That is not true. Canada Post invented a false crisis over the mail backlog to get the government to intervene, and the government took the bait. Canada Post said that there were hundreds of mail trucks, which has since been proven to be untrue. Canada Post convinced the government that there would be no Christmas without back-to-work legislation.

People are receiving their mail and their online orders, in spite of what the Minister of Labour said. Nancy Beauchamp, a member of the CUPW bargaining committee, confirmed that at the Léo-Blanchette processing centre in Montreal, for example, there are currently no delays and no backlog of mail.

The minister also said that low-income Canadians waiting for their cheques were penalized by postal workers' rotating strikes. This is not true. The mail delivery process will not allow for the cheques to be delayed. The union chose to hold rotating strikes so as not to impact the public.

Now, the Liberals and the Conservatives are walking hand-in-hand toward a law that will undermine the constitutional right to free bargaining. The alarm that Canada Post is sounding is only as legitimate as the Liberals and Conservatives make it. The Canadian Union of Postal Workers has acted in good faith in this dispute. It proposed ideas for improvement, but Canada Post turned a deaf ear. Management refused to implement any lasting solutions to the problems pertaining to pay equity between men and women, the job insecurity of some of its employees, or the health, safety, and unpaid overtime of rural mail carriers. This was an opportunity for the Liberals to clearly show whose side they are really on.

Rather than standing with workers and supporting free and fair bargaining, the Liberal government chose to support Canada Post management to the detriment of employees. Are the Liberals aware that forcing employees to go back to work will cause them to lose all of their leverage? The government knows that Canada Post employees have always been willing to negotiate in good faith and to quickly reach collective agreements. The Liberals could very well have ordered Canada Post to do the same by trying to negotiate in good faith with the union, but instead, the Liberals are hastening to Canada Post's rescue.

Now that Canada Post is concerned about profits and companies like eBay and Amazon are concerned about the delivery of their packages, the Liberals are imposing a return to work that would wipe out the efforts of the Canadian Union of Postal Workers. This legislation would reintroduce the same working conditions. We need to reach an agreement, not vote on back-to-work legislation that will scrap all the negotiation efforts.

The government keeps saying it is in favour of negotiations, but it introduces a back-to-work bill. What is the logic behind that?

Yesterday, the Minister of Employment, Workforce Development and Labour said she was confident “that we have used every tool in our tool box to get a negotiated agreement.” Is she confident? Have they really used every tool in their tool box?

Let them call the employer and tell it to sit down at the negotiating table. If Canada Post management had truly wanted to avoid a strike, then all it had to do was show up on time at the negotiating table and stop asking the government to bail it out of its bad management decisions.

That is what is happening today. What is worse is that the Liberals believe it. Does the government believe postal workers who want better protection and better working conditions? We must let negotiations continue. Rotating strikes will let the mail be delivered, which is what the union always wanted.

Now, the Liberals, including the member for Gatineau, want to convince us that we cannot wait any longer and that arbitration is the route to take. I may be naive, but I still hope that this arbitration will be transparent and fair, and that it will put employer and employees on an equal footing. However, when we take a closer look at how arbitration works, we quickly understand the government's decisions. Under arbitration, the decision-making process and the final decision are completely confidential. The union will not be able to rely on the means currently at its disposal to achieve a balance of power with Canada Post because all employees will be forced to go back to work under the deplorable conditions that I described earlier.

Things were the same for Canada Post in 2011. The union was afraid of being forced to accept a collective agreement despite arbitration and special legislation. That is why it pursued a negotiated settlement. The Harper government's back-to-work legislation imposed regressive collective agreements on postal workers. Today's back-to-work legislation is clearly infringing on workers' rights under the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms. If the Liberals think that has changed, they have a short memory. Need I remind them that, in 2015, the Prime Minister made it a priority to improve labour relations at Canada Post and uphold the principle of freedom to negotiate?

Let me say that back-to-work legislation for postal workers will be a very tough sell. That is why I move, seconded by the member for London—Fanshawe:

That the motion be amended by deleting all the words after the word “That” and substituting the following: “this House decline to give third reading to Bill C-89, An Act to provide for the resumption and continuation of postal services, because it:

(a) prevents the use of the constitutional right to strike, an essential part of the collective bargaining process; and

(b) clearly violates the rights workers have under the Charter.”.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:35 a.m.

NDP

The Assistant Deputy Speaker NDP Carol Hughes

The amendment is in order.

The hon. member for Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques on a point of order.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:35 a.m.

NDP

Guy Caron NDP Rimouski-Neigette—Témiscouata—Les Basques, QC

Madam Speaker, pursuant to Standing Order 62, I move, seconded by the hon. member for Berthier—Maskinongé, that the member for Elmwood—Transcona be now heard, since he rose first.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:35 a.m.

NDP

The Assistant Deputy Speaker NDP Carol Hughes

The question is on the motion. Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the motion?

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:35 a.m.

Some hon. members

Agreed.

No.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:35 a.m.

NDP

The Assistant Deputy Speaker NDP Carol Hughes

All those in favour of the motion will please say yea.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:35 a.m.

Some hon. members

Yea.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:35 a.m.

NDP

The Assistant Deputy Speaker NDP Carol Hughes

All those opposed will please say nay.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:35 a.m.

Some hon. members

Nay.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:35 a.m.

NDP

The Assistant Deputy Speaker NDP Carol Hughes

In my opinion the yeas have it. I declare the motion carried.

(Motion agreed to)

Resuming debate, the hon. member for Elmwood—Transcona.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:40 a.m.

NDP

Daniel Blaikie NDP Elmwood—Transcona, MB

Madam Speaker, I thank my colleagues in the House for the opportunity to close the debate. I wish we were not closing the debate at this time, but considering that the time was allocated so severely in the motion that set the context for this debate, it is an honour to close it.

I will close it by addressing what I think was one of the principal arguments that we heard from the Liberals throughout the debate today, which is that they really had no choice and this crisis is beyond their control. What we have heard consistently throughout the debate today is that is not the case. Postal workers have been on rotating strikes, but the mail is getting delivered. In fact, in some parts of the country, there has only been a disturbance for one day out of the five weeks that Canada Post has had rotating strikes. I am sorry but that does not a crisis make.

I know there are small businesses and Canadians who want to receive their packages and the fact is that postal workers want to deliver those packages, but they do not want a circumstance where one in four of them can expect to get hurt doing it and not be able to enjoy Christmas with his or her family because he or she was injured working in unreasonable conditions that have persisted at Canada Post for a very long time now. That is what the government is asking those workers to do: to go into a workplace with the highest rate of injuries in the federal sector. We just think that is completely unacceptable and we do not believe we had to be here.

We have heard the labour minister defend this all day, and that is a shame. The person who should have been on her feet all day is the minister responsible for Canada Post, who has failed to put in management that is willing to address the real workplace issues and causing workers to get hurt, who has failed to address the mandatory overtime that is disrupting the family life of workers at Canada Post and contributing to the injury rate, and who has failed to put management in place at Canada Post that would address the real pay equity issues that exist between rural and suburban carriers and urban carriers. If we had real leadership from the minister who is actually responsible for the corporation, we could have avoided this situation.

To hear the Minister of Employment, Workforce Development and Labour talk about a crisis as if the government has no control over it is a little rich. Frankly, Liberals are asking too much of postal workers who were legislated back to work under bad terms and conditions in 2011 and have been doing their utmost to make sure that people continue to receive their mail reliably at a great cost to either themselves or their colleagues. This was an opportunity to do something about that.

We have heard a plethora of excuses from the Liberals as to why, even though they are undermining the collective bargaining rights of Canadians with back-to-work legislation, we should accept it because they got rid of Bill C-377, a major objection to which was the fact that it would reveal the contents of union strike funds to employers. The idea of getting rid of that legislation was to support union workers being able to strike and not be undermined by their employers. If the government is going to repeal that legislation with one hand and then legislate them back to work and artificially end the strike on the other hand, it amounts to the same thing: it undermines the right to collective bargaining.

We have heard about hard decisions. The fact of the matter is that governments do have to make hard decisions, but what is not true is that every time a government has to make a hard decision, workers get the short end of the stick.

When Air Canada went to the Liberal government early in its mandate and said it wanted to get rid of the provisions that required it to have its maintenance work done in Canada because it wanted to do the work offshore, the Liberals jumped to the pump and got it done. They made sure the corporate executives at Air Canada got what they wanted.

When big multinational companies went to the Liberals throughout the TPP negotiations—and they had an opportunity to substantially renegotiate the TPP deal—they decided to continue with the temporary worker provisions. Again we heard the Liberals say they were fixing the TFW program and making it better. Then they smuggled the provisions of that program into chapter 12 of the TPP. They could have done something for workers then, but no, they said it was time for hard decisions and sided with the big multinationals.

They did it again with their friends on Bay Street on the CEO stock option loophole. They were lobbied dozens of times to break an election commitment.

When that hard decision came up, what did they do? The Liberals sided with the folks on Bay Street and broke their election commitment. Workers are going to pay the price for that, and are paying the price for that, because then they are told, “I'm sorry, we don't have the money to do what we want to do.”

When it came to Netflix paying its fair share, Netflix came and lobbied. It was time for a hard decision. What decision did the Liberals make? They again sided with the large multinational so that it would not have to pay its share.

On the carbon tax, when the biggest polluters and the biggest moneymakers came to them and said they wanted a break on the carbon tax, unlike for everyone else, the Liberals granted it to them. That is the theme.

Whenever there is a hard decision, workers lose with the Liberal government. That is the problem.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:45 a.m.

NDP

The Assistant Deputy Speaker NDP Carol Hughes

The hon. member for Hochelaga on a point of order.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:45 a.m.

NDP

Marjolaine Boutin-Sweet NDP Hochelaga, QC

Madam Speaker, we have worked hard tonight, but other people have also worked hard, with us and for us. I hope my colleagues will join me in thanking the table officers, the speakership of the House, the security officers, the pages, the people who served us food and the bus drivers. Thank you very much.

Also, I think we can pick up after ourselves and clean up our own glasses and whatnot, here and in the lobbies. It is the least we can do for the people who helped us here tonight.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:45 a.m.

NDP

The Assistant Deputy Speaker NDP Carol Hughes

I thank the member for Hochelaga for her comments.

It being 12:46 a.m., pursuant to an order made earlier today, it is my duty to interrupt the proceedings and put forthwith every question necessary to dispose of the third reading stage of the bill now before the House.

The question is on the amendment. Shall I dispense?

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:45 a.m.

Some hon. members

Agreed.

No.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:45 a.m.

NDP

The Assistant Deputy Speaker NDP Carol Hughes

[Chair read text of amendment to the House]

The question is on the amendment. Is it the pleasure of the House to adopt the amendment?

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:45 a.m.

Some hon. members

Agreed.

No.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:45 a.m.

NDP

The Assistant Deputy Speaker NDP Carol Hughes

All those in favour of the amendment will please say yea.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:45 a.m.

Some hon. members

Yea.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:45 a.m.

NDP

The Assistant Deputy Speaker NDP Carol Hughes

All those opposed will please say nay.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:45 a.m.

Some hon. members

Nay.

Postal Services Resumption and Continuation ActGovernment Orders

November 24th, 12:45 a.m.

NDP

The Assistant Deputy Speaker NDP Carol Hughes

In my opinion the nays have it.

And five or more members having risen:

Call in the members.