House of Commons Hansard #14 of the 43rd Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament's site.) The word of the day was case.

Topics

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:15 a.m.

Bloc

Kristina Michaud Bloc Avignon—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, QC

Madam Speaker, as I said, one must always be careful when commenting on this kind of situation, but sometimes we have no choice.

The fact that this man was allowed to see prostitutes and access such services is unacceptable. This means that the system knew what was going on. The first time I heard about this case, I thought his visits must have been happening in secret and that the officials must not have been aware of the situation. On the contrary, it had been approved. There is something wrong with the system.

We absolutely must look into this, and it begins with an external investigation and hearings to understand how that organization operates internally and determine how the system failed.

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:15 a.m.

Bloc

Rhéal Fortin Bloc Rivière-du-Nord, QC

Madam Speaker, I will not reiterate what others have said, but I can confirm that Bloc Québécois members are shocked by these events.

This was not an isolated incident for this individual. In 1988, he assaulted the mother of his children, Joanne Lafrance. In 2004, he killed his partner, Chantal Deschênes. There is a well-established history of such behaviour. He was sentenced to life in prison without the possibility of parole for 15 years. In the fall of 2019, he was let out on day parole. According to his parole officer, he was granted day parole so he could meet women to satisfy his sexual needs.

What kind of society lets a notorious repeat sexual offender out on parole so he can meet his sexual needs? Apparently that is a social reintegration strategy. I can hardly believe it. That kind of approach just does not compute.

Clearly, the motion before us is an important one. The process needs to be reviewed. We need to start by condemning the Parole Board's decision. I think that goes without saying; no need to belabour the point. Next, we have to hold hearings to find out if any changes need to be made.

I would point out that the union president and the president of the Association des services de réhabilitation sociale du Québec say that this is an unusual decision. They must not have seen this very often to describe it as unusual. The Parole Board of Canada itself is asking for a review of the analysis grid. I think we need to take this seriously. As a society, we cannot accept situations like this.

We offer our condolences to the victim's family and to the families of all the other victims. However, at some point we have to assume our responsibilities. I think it is time to review this process.

If Parole Board of Canada board members need more training then let's provide that training. If we need to appoint new members, then let's do that. If we need to change the selection criteria for members of the Parole Board of Canada, then let's do that. We have to start with an inquiry to determine what happened and ensure that it does not happen again because this situation is unacceptable.

For all these reasons and those raised by my colleague from Avignon—La Mitis—Matane—Matapédia, the Bloc Québécois will vote in favour of this motion and offers its deepest condolences to the families of this individual's victims.

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:15 a.m.

Conservative

Rosemarie Falk Conservative Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK

Madam Speaker, sitting in this place listening to debate today, I think the biggest travesty of all is that two lives have been lost. It is unfortunate and devastating that a second person had to lose her life for this issue to be looked at.

I know, and I have heard and agree, that the process needs to be changed. Something needs to be changed. It is a great idea for the committee to study this and look at it to see, somewhat from an external point of view, what could be changed.

I have heard that the Parole Board should have an external review. I understand it is having an internal review, but I do not really understand how it can investigate itself without bias and make appropriate, real, hard, tangible suggestions for change.

Could the member comment on an external review of the Parole Board, but also on what type of processes could be suggested so that this does not happen again?

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:20 a.m.

Bloc

Rhéal Fortin Bloc Rivière-du-Nord, QC

Madam Speaker, there should be an external review of the nomination process. In fact, perhaps the review should extend to the entire structure of the Parole Board. In my opinion, it is a good idea to have the review led by an external body. Sometimes, an internal committee may have a bias based on its experience and ways of doing things in past years. It is a good idea for people from outside the organization to study the situation in order to shake things up, as we say.

However, for the time being, I am not in a position to say what proposals might come out of this review. I cannot presume what conclusions the auditors will arrive at. I know that, in 2018, the Auditor General of Canada stated that the situation at the Parole Board was untenable, which certainly suggests this is nothing new.

In November 2018, the Auditor General of Canada stated that there was a problem at the Parole Board. In May 2019, a survey conducted by the board indicated that 70% of parole officers stated that they were unable to do their job. That is what the parole officers said in May 2019 and the Auditor General, in November 2018—

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:20 a.m.

NDP

The Assistant Deputy Speaker NDP Carol Hughes

I must interrupt the member because his time has expired.

The hon. member for Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon.

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:20 a.m.

Conservative

Brad Vis Conservative Mission—Matsqui—Fraser Canyon, BC

Madam Speaker, this question relates to public safety and the people housed in our correctional facilities in Canada.

Does the Bloc Québécois have a position on the ill-advised prison needle exchange put forward by the Liberal government? Is the Bloc Québécois in support of giving inmates needles to do illegal drugs in our federal institutions?

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:20 a.m.

Bloc

Rhéal Fortin Bloc Rivière-du-Nord, QC

Madam Speaker, there is a clear need to tighten the parole assessment processes.

We in the Bloc Québécois support any measure that would assist in the reintegration of offenders. If we can help inmates to reintegrate into society, we are not against that.

In all areas, we must be vigilant and try to reintegrate people who have gone off the beaten path or broken the rules that we have set for ourselves in society. Today, I would like to focus my attention on the specific issue of releasing offenders on parole before the end of their sentence in the clear absence of due diligence.

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:20 a.m.

NDP

Randall Garrison NDP Esquimalt—Saanich—Sooke, BC

Madam Speaker, as I begin, I would like to beg the indulgence of the House for one moment to mention the tragic loss of life in my riding Friday night in the community of Sooke, where flooding appears to have taken the lives of Cory Mills, Eric Blackmore and A.J. Jensen. We will learn more about the details of this incident as time goes on, but I believe we also need to look into the larger context of climate change, more severe storms, clear-cut logging and all of these things contributing to more severe flooding in my riding. We want to see if there was a connection to that loss of life.

Many volunteers came out to search when these young men went missing on Friday night, which is a tribute to the strength of volunteerism in the community of Sooke, and I thank all of those volunteers who helped in the search.

Turning to the question before us this morning, I will begin by expressing my condolences to the family and friends of Marylène Levesque for this loss, which is a loss not only to them but to all Canadians.

The NDP will be supporting the motion put forward by the Conservatives today, because obviously we need an investigation as to how something like this could happen in Canada. This tragic incident raises questions about the specific decisions of the Parole Board and parole officers in this case. These are important questions, because our parole system, by and large, serves the public well and helps to guarantee public safety in this country. However, when something clearly goes so far off the rails as to result in a tragic incident such as this, we have to have answers about what happened in our system.

How could this have been allowed to happen when the perpetrator had a previous conviction for the murder of his wife and was under supervision? How in the world did we get to a situation of another young woman losing her life at the hands of the same person for whom Canadians had taken responsibility, through our parole system, and who had been guaranteed to the public would be safe from committing further violence and further actions? These are indeed important questions.

However, the motion perhaps does not go far enough in that it does not really tackle those larger questions about the role of gender-based violence in Canadian society, about how we value women's lives and how we sometimes do not value women's lives to the extent that we should. In particular, when it comes to incidents of intimate partner violence, somehow this is seen as a lesser form of violence and the perpetrator of violence on their partner is somehow seen as less of a threat to Canadian society as a whole than are other violent criminals. This simply makes no sense to me, but it is clearly a factor involved in this case.

We also have to ask ourselves how much we value all women's lives, including the lives of sex workers.

The Parole Board and the parole officers clearly played a role in perpetuating these problematic attitudes about women and about violence toward women in our society, so yes, I support this motion, because we need to look closely at who is being appointed to those parole boards.

Do we have a sufficient number of women on the parole boards to help evaluate risk and set policies to evaluate risk? Are those people being appointed to parole boards for the right reasons? The Conservatives have raised this question. Parole Board appointments should not be a question of patronage, but a question of appointing people who represent the community and the community's values, people who can help set the very important policies that prevent innocent lives from being lost.

We also need to look at the question of the training that we provide to Parole Board members. Are we making sure that they are adequately trained in gender-based violence? Are we making sure that they are adequately trained in the rights and responsibilities that they have as Parole Board members and will not perpetuate these attitudes that sometimes value certain women's lives less than other lives in our society?

Let me talk a little more about the specifics of this incident.

There is the question we need to ask about how risk was evaluated. I will take a moment to read what was said by a UBC law professor, Isabel Grant, who I think raises some very important questions. She said:

I think that [the case] really shows the degree to which we do privilege male entitlement to women's bodies over the safety of women. I think it reflects, too, this idea that men who killed their girlfriends or wives or intimate partners don't present as much of a threat to the public as other men.

Professor Grant went on to say, “And I think that’s problematic, and it also shows how we see the safety of women, particularly the most marginalized women, and how little priority we give it,” meaning how little priority we give their safety.

We need to have this inquiry to ask those questions about risk evaluation and, in particular, how we evaluate the risk of men who have perpetrated violence on women in the past.

Then there is this whole concept that seems to have invaded this case, where the perpetrator had sexual needs that needed to be satisfied. I cannot imagine what this discussion is doing in a question of parole and risk. There is no right of men to have their sexual needs satisfied by women. No such thing exists. I cannot imagine how this became a subject of discussion on a perpetrator about whom the Parole Board had already said was not ready for relationships with women. However, it was suggesting that this person should visit sex workers for sex, as if this were not some kind of a relationship with a woman, for which he would obviously and clearly also not be ready. We have to look at specific cases and ask those tough questions of what attitudes lie behind these kinds of decisions.

Then there is the very problematic question to ask parole officers and parole boards. Since, under our current law, seeking sexual services from sex workers and paying for those services is illegal, are we really talking about a parole system that has suggested a perpetrator on parole should commit an illegal act? By its nature, the commission of that illegal act, should have cancelled his parole and returned him to custody. Are we really talking about the situation where somebody was, from within the system, advising a perpetrator to commit an illegal act? I would like an answer to that. I think all Canadians would like an answer to that very specific question.

That is why the NDP will support the Conservative motion. On those narrow questions, we have some very important answers to get and when we get those answers, we have to look very seriously at changes in policies that allowed these kinds of things to happen.

When we come to the broader context, we have to ask ourselves about a corrections system that had a perpetrator in custody for 15 years and failed to rehabilitate him. We all know there are challenges in our corrections system with lack of resources. We all know there are challenges raised by a very large number of people in our corrections system about offenders who have mental health and addiction problems. These are real challenges that our system has to face.

However, I would submit there are some cases where rehabilitation will fail and when that rehabilitation fails, we have a responsibility in our corrections system to keep the person in custody or to carefully supervise the individual's release. That broader question is raised again about how successful we are at rehabilitation and in the cases of violence against women especially, how seriously do we take the failure to rehabilitate men.

In the broader context of the safety of sex workers, there is what I call a very interesting twist, and I do not really like the tone of that word, in this case. Clearly the perpetrator had visited this massage parlour before, which we know from many reports. He had been banned because of his violence toward the women who worked in the that parlour. If this were a normal place of work at which violence occurred, it would have been reported to the police and would have resulted in the revocation of his parole. However, under the current legislation, a massage parlour is illegal. Therefore, it is illegal to provide a safe place for sex work to take place. We therefore have the cruel irony that the massage parlour could not report this person to the police without the risk of shutting down the safe place that had been established for sex work to take place.

Therefore, now we are into the broader question of our laws on sex work in Canada. Members in the House will know, as I have spoken on this many times, that I have worked with sex workers in my riding on a harm reduction strategy, not a judgment strategy, and a rights-based strategy, not a rescue-based strategy. It is very important that we look at this case as an example of what is wrong with our current restrictive laws on sex work. Many people say that we only criminalize the johns. That is not actually true. This is not what happened in the legislation.

We criminalize all kinds of things around sex work that makes sex work more dangerous. We criminalize the safe places for it to take place, such as brothels or massage parlours. Those really are safe places for women to perform sex work. We criminalize hiring security to provide safety, as that would be under the provision that someone is somehow profiting from sex work. while being hired to provide security.

I could go on with a list of things that we criminalize all the way around sex work. Each and every one of those provisions makes sex work more dangerous for the women involved.

I have the privilege of having the PEERS sex worker drop-in centre in my riding. Also, when I was on council, it was in my municipality. I learned from meeting with sex workers in my riding and from the staff at the PEERS centre what sex workers' organizations can do when they are empowered to provide safety to their members.

Rather than criminalizing sex work, I would like to see us take a harm reduction strategy that empowers sex worker organizations. What do I mean by that? It is more than just a nice phrase. It means, who provides “bad date lists”, as they are called? Who keeps track of the men who are violent toward sex workers? Sex worker organizations have that information. One of the functions they perform in every local venue is to make women who are involved in sex work aware of those men who are violent and dangerous. We need to support sex workers in providing the service. Unfortunately, we cannot involve the police in that at this time, because of the criminalization of all these pieces around sex work.

The PEERS drop-in centre in my riding provides many social services for women in the sex trade who are faced with housing and child care crises and who face all the same challenges that other workers face in our society. Once again, the key to all those services is not judgment about why women are in sex work, not judgment about whether sex work is a good or a bad thing, but how we can make lives better and safer for those who are already involved in sex work.

We have a charity based in Victoria called “HeroWork”. HeroWork provides volunteers to help renovate the premises of community social service organizations. Most members of Parliament will be quite aware that one of the problems our charities have is that their infrastructure is quite old and decrepit. Their workplaces are not very good places to work. Many of them are mould infested and have other real health challenges.

HeroWork selected as one of its projects the renovation of the PEERS drop-in centre. It mobilized literally hundreds of volunteers around the community to go in and makeover the drop-in centre and to make it a more welcoming and supportive place, including creating a community kitchen so it could provide meals, showers and other services to those who were involved in sex work in my community.

The interesting thing we found was that the project of renovating the drop-in centre brought volunteers from all over the community, who may not have otherwise gotten to know sex workers. This played a large role in changing their attitudes toward what happens in sex work in my community.

In this debate, it is important that we extend our thinking to whether we have taken the right approach to harm reduction in sex work and how that connects directly to the incident we have in front of us, which caused the loss of life. Many hundreds of sex workers have lost their lives in the country.

It beggars belief that those involved in our parole and corrections system could think that sending a person, who has a record of violence with women, to the most vulnerable women in our society and not expect a bad and tragic outcome, like the one that occurred in Quebec City.

First, we need to look at the specific decisions that were taken by the Parole Board in its review of the actions of the parole officer. Again, after teaching criminal justice for 20 years and having a a federal prison in my riding, I know that most of the time this system does very good work on behalf of all Canadians. Let us look at the specific decision and figure out what went wrong.

Second, I am supporting the motion, but I would like to see us expand the terms of reference, so we think about those larger issues in our society of gender-based violence, intimate partner violence and the safety of sex workers. When we have taken a look at those issues, then we will have a responsibility to act, as legislators in the House, to make this a better and safer Canada for all women, including sex workers.

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:40 a.m.

Conservative

Glen Motz Conservative Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner, AB

Madam Speaker, I am impressed with the context with which you approached some of these issues. From your background and your perspective—

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:40 a.m.

NDP

The Assistant Deputy Speaker NDP Carol Hughes

I remind members to address the questions and comments to the Chair.

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:40 a.m.

Conservative

Glen Motz Conservative Medicine Hat—Cardston—Warner, AB

Madam Speaker, does the member believe the Liberals' internal review will actually accomplish what this motion sets out to do, and what he has suggested could maybe be accomplished, or does it need a more comprehensive look at the details that have more of a long-term impact on what Canadians really expect from a justice system?

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:40 a.m.

NDP

Randall Garrison NDP Esquimalt—Saanich—Sooke, BC

Madam Speaker, there is no doubt about the fact that an incident like this certainly should cause an internal review. When things go this wrong, there must be an internal review. Is that internal review enough? No. For that reason, the New Democrats are supporting the motion before the House today.

As I said, it raises those narrow questions of how these decisions, which have driven the system off course so badly in this case, were made and whether there are systematic things we can do to change those. Those may involve better appointments to the Parole Board. They may involve better education of Parole Board members. They may involve specific decisions made by individuals within the system. We need to look at those.

Then we need to look at the larger questions of how we deal with violence against women, gender-based violence ,in our society; how we deal with intimate partner violence; and how we ensure that all women, including sex workers, are safe in Canada.

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:40 a.m.

Liberal

Brenda Shanahan Liberal Châteauguay—Lacolle, QC

Madam Speaker, I thank my hon. colleague for enlarging this debate. My hon. colleague in the Bloc Québécois did the same thing in her speech. We have had the opportunity today to really talk about gender-based violence, and I welcome that.

We have an organization in my riding of Châteauguay—Lacolle that does wonderful work. It is called Action sur la Violence et Intervention Familiale. Its members really work on anger management. They work with adolescent boys and men in managing behaviour. As well, they often work with people who are mandated by the courts.

Would the hon. member agree that this is an avenue worth exploring and supporting?

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:40 a.m.

NDP

Randall Garrison NDP Esquimalt—Saanich—Sooke, BC

Madam Speaker, I congratulate the member for pointing out the very important work that is often done at the community level, with very few resources, to try to address gender-based violence. There are those organizations in my riding as well. We need to see the federal government get behind the leadership that is already being provided at the community level in addressing gender-based violence.

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:40 a.m.

Conservative

Rosemarie Falk Conservative Battlefords—Lloydminster, SK

Madam Speaker, that was very thoughtful and I enjoyed quite a bit of what was said.

The question I have is this. Do we value women? I have heard over and over in the House, regarding this specific case, that sexual needs were put over the value of women. Why is this happening in society? Why was it suggested, for somebody who has a history of violence against women, that he should go to a sex worker and have his needs met? It is just absolutely appalling to me that this would be a suggestion.

The member acknowledged that sometimes rehabilitation failed. Why was this not caught by the Parole Board? Why was there a suggestion to put the accused in a situation which could tempt him for violence against women? Besides training, as the member had mentioned on gender-based violence, what else could be done to fix the process or have women be valued in society?

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:45 a.m.

NDP

Randall Garrison NDP Esquimalt—Saanich—Sooke, BC

Madam Speaker, if the reports that the perpetrator's sexual needs were prioritized are in fact true, we need to have the internal investigation to find out how that could happen in this system. It is a very important and specific question that we need to get to the bottom of.

On the broader question of attitudes toward women, I want to emphasize that in this case we are dealing with one of the most marginalized groups of women, a woman who was a sex worker. However, whether we are talking about indigenous women and the missing and murdered indigenous women's inquiry or about injection drug users, who are also very marginalized, we often do not see the value of those Canadians in the same way we do for what the government likes to call the middle class.

For those who are not in that very straight and narrow category, we need to look very seriously at our attitudes toward them and consider re-evaluating our assignment of worth to individuals in our society. All Canadians have worth. All Canadians have value. All Canadians have families who are devastated by their losses.

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:45 a.m.

NDP

Laurel Collins NDP Victoria, BC

Madam Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague for standing up for women's rights and sex worker rights.

Sex workers warned the government that the current sex work laws would result in more violence and put sex workers at risk. This tragic case could have been avoided if we did not allow discrimination and stigma to shape our policies.

Sex workers' rights are human rights. We criminalize the environments and the very things that would keep the workers safe, but then disregard their safety when a perpetrator's ongoing violence against women is not a reason to ensure the safety of women, all women.

My colleague mentioned that the perpetrator had been violent before at the massage parlour. However, because of the laws that criminalize the security and establishments that could keep sex workers safe, this was not able to be reported. Sex workers have said that they are the experts but that no one listens to them.

How would this event be different if we listened to sex workers, if we supported sex workers and their workplaces in reporting violence without repercussions? How would this event be different if we had a government that took violence against women seriously?

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:45 a.m.

NDP

Randall Garrison NDP Esquimalt—Saanich—Sooke, BC

Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. member for Victoria for her impassioned question, to which I think there is no easy or simple answer.

When we were passing the legislation to, what I call recriminalize sex work since the Supreme Court decriminalized it, if we had listened to sex workers and allowed them to have safe places to conduct their work, then it appears quite clear that this specific incident would not have happened. The violence that had been perpetrated against other sex workers would have been reported to the police, as it should be able to be reported, without repercussions on the sex workers or the place at which they carry on their work.

Therefore, because we did not listen and because we recriminalized sex work after the court decisions, we are placed in a situation where we are confronted with violence against women on a very regular basis, usually against those most marginalized, either by sex work as their primary occupation or by engaging in sex work in support of addictions or because they have no other alternatives. There is a whole variety of reasons that women end up in these situations, but we failed to listen to any of their voices and failed to keep them safe.

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:45 a.m.

Conservative

Kelly McCauley Conservative Edmonton West, AB

Madam Speaker, I will be sharing my time with the iconic member for Cariboo—Prince George.

This is my first time rising in debate in the 43rd Parliament, so I would like to take a couple of moments to thank the residents of Edmonton West for honouring me with re-election. I am very proud to say that, according to the Library of Parliament, last election we received the most votes ever cast in a federal or provincial election within the city of Edmonton going back to Confederation. I want to thank the constituents of Edmonton West for putting their faith in me.

One of the issues we have in Alberta right now is the alienation caused by the government and also the fact that Liberals will not recognize or give proper representation to Alberta. Even though the Liberal in my riding, and I have to congratulate Kerrie Johnston who ran a fantastic campaign, received barely 20%, she actually received more votes than any single Liberal MP from Prince Edward Island. Here we have a Liberal who received very few votes in Alberta but who would have been elected in any one of the ridings in P.E.I. I hope along those lines we will address electorate representation or the lack thereof in Alberta in the coming years.

I want to thank my family, of course, for helping me out. I would not be here without them. My oldest son, Jensen, door knocked with me and helped out in Edmonton Centre, Edmonton Strathcona and Edmonton Mill Woods as well. My younger son, Parker, door knocked with me throughout the summer and helped out Edmonton Centre and also door knocked in Edmonton Strathcona. We have heard that cats have nine lives, but politicians who do not thank their spouses only have one life, so I am going to hang onto that and thank my wife, Sasha, for her support. I could not do anything, even get dressed, without her, so I thank her for all her support and love over the years.

Victory has a thousand fathers and defeat has one orphan, so I want to thank some of the fathers who helped me out. There are too many to mention, but I want to highlight my friend, Tom, and of course, Bob and his wife, Bev, whose car I ran into during the election. Bev I called Barb for all these years by mistake. Kids from Parkland Immanuel Christian School, about 20 of them, came out and door knocked. I thank Frank and Margaret as well. These are just some of the people who helped me get here again.

We knocked on over 50,000 doors from the end of June right up to election day. We heard loud and clear from my constituents that they want us to work at getting our pipelines built, getting our energy workers back to work and making Alberta and the country strong again. I will continue to do that. Again, I thank the people of Edmonton West.

We are here to discuss the opposition motion regarding the Parole Board. First, I want to quickly go over the Gallese case and look at the history of what happened. Gallese, of course, was the gentleman who was a murderer and was allowed out to kill again by the Parole Board. In 1997, this gentleman was convicted of violence against a spouse, so this was not the first time. In 2004, he was convicted of killing his wife, first beating her with a hammer before stabbing her repeatedly. This is not a simple act of perhaps second-degree murder that could have been by accident. This man beat her with a hammer and then repeatedly stabbed her to death.

He was sentenced to 15 years with no parole. He was deemed a high risk to recommit violence against women. In 1997, he was convicted of beating a spouse, murdering a spouse and deemed a high risk to recommit. Somehow, a few years in, under the Liberal government, the risk assessment was reduced. The risk that he was going to repeat was reduced.

I have to ask why the Liberals are fighting our look into the circumstances that would allow this to happen. He was out on day parole and in September 2019 in his twice a year annual Parole Board review, the Parole Board heard that he had been visiting prostitutes in violation of his parole. The Parole Board was aware. Visiting prostitutes, according to the law, demonstrates elevated risk. He should have been thrown back in jail when the Parole Board found out.

Doing the right thing and putting him back in jail would have saved a life. Instead, the Parole Board merely said to him not to do it again. That was it. The Parole Board let him go and told him not to do it again. Two months later, he murdered Marylène Levesque, a young woman who died because of the Parole Board's incompetence.

I have to ask why the government is fighting this motion to look into the circumstances and the Parole Board's actions. We need to ensure this does not happen again. I do not blame the Liberal MPs for this happening, but the Parole Board needs a review.

What is stopping Parliament from reviewing the Parole Board process that led directly to this murder? If a man is unable to form a violence-free relationship with a woman, why in the world would it be okay for him to go out and have a relationship with a prostitute? Why do we value that lady's life less than someone else's life? Why is it okay to put the sexual needs of a violent criminal ahead of innocent women?

Fourteen of the Liberal-appointed Parole Board members have less than three years' experience. Why are the patronage appointments more important than the safety of Canadians, the safety of women, the safety of marginalized women in the sex trade?

I am sure the Liberals just want a simple, quiet, internal review to cover up their patronage errors. Perhaps they want to throw the parole officer under the bus and put all the blame on that officer. Let us be clear that the Parole Board knew about this gentleman visiting prostitutes, the elevated risk and did nothing. Liberals want to ignore the problems existing within the Parole Board system.

My riding has the largest women's prison in western Canada, the Edmonton Institution for Women. I meet with the corrections officers and parole officers very often. We deal with problems that have not been addressed, safety with drug injections inside the prison and the segregation policy.

I also hear about the problems that parole officers and program officers are struggling with the caseload. They are pressured to get offenders out of the prison and onto the streets. The program to monitor and maintain progress with offenders has been weakened. There is weakened oversight to hold prisoners accountable. There is a push to get these offenders into halfway houses. The halfway houses have their uses, but we have to remember oversight and supervision of these prisoners in halfway houses is not 24 hours a day. It is severely reduced.

No speech I make in this House would ever occur without me referring to the departmental plan. I notice in the departmental plan for public safety under correctional services, over the next four years the government is planning to cut 4% of funding to the Parole Board.

Community supervision for the parole officers, without taking into account inflation, raises and cost increases, is soon to be cut by $1 million. The workers are saying there is too much of a workload and the Liberals are still cutting it a further $1 million.

Overall, corrections services is getting a 1% cut over a five-year period from the year the Liberals took over. If we read the departmental report, it is very fitting that the head of the Parole Board mentions in a report the dignity of offenders and better serving offender groups, but she mentions victims just once.

As I go further into the departmental plan, there is another great one. The plan mentions the percentage of offenders on parole who are not convicted of an offence prior to their supervision period ending. I would think it would be 100%. The Liberals' goal is 4%, which is an increase in the amount of reoffending over the last four years.

The plan also mentions the percentage of offenders on parole who are not convicted of a violent offence during their supervision period. I would think 100% would be their goal, but it is not. The Liberals have shown a lower goal over the coming years of the number of people who are reoffending for violent crimes than past years.

It is very clear the Liberal program and the Parole Board need to be reviewed. The Parole Board needs to have an external and public review, and the review has to be transparent. An internal review the Liberals are pushing for will serve no one.

Innocent women have to be protected. Canadians have to be protected. The government should do the right thing and vote with the opposition on this motion.

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

11:55 a.m.

Oakville North—Burlington Ontario

Liberal

Pam Damoff LiberalParliamentary Secretary to the Minister of Indigenous Services

Madam Speaker, I enjoyed the member's comment about thanking his spouse.

If we are going to talk about statistics, then let us be realistic. There are 7,000 to 8,000 people on conditional release every year. Under the Conservative government, in 2013-14, 17 were convicted of violent crimes. In 2017-18, there were five. Let us be realistic.

I think we would agree that the number should be zero on this. However, the fact is that the number was actually higher under the Conservative government than it was under our government in 2017-18.

I wonder if the hon. member could clarify those comments to reflect the fact that overall, communities are safe with parolees living in them and parole officers do a tremendous job in keeping communities safe.

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

Noon

Conservative

Kelly McCauley Conservative Edmonton West, AB

Mr. Speaker, I want to read right from the government's departmental report, signed off by former public safety minister Ralph Goodale.

In 2015-16, the overlap year between the Conservatives and the Liberals, the rate of convictions on prisoners out on supervision for offences resulting in death, so people out on parole who murder someone, for every thousand it was 0.48. When the Liberals took over government that number doubled. Their goal has actually increased to 0.64. I would be happy to table this for the member across the way to see what her own government has put in writing and tabled in the House.

The truth is that under the Liberals, the number of deaths by people convicted of murder but out on parole has increased. It has gone from 0.48 for every thousand to double that the first full year they were in power, and their goal has increased. I do not know what the member is quoting, but the papers tabled in the House by her own government show otherwise.

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

Noon

NDP

Randall Garrison NDP Esquimalt—Saanich—Sooke, BC

Mr. Speaker, I have to point out once again that I always perversely enjoy it when the Liberals and Conservatives argue about who does the worst job, but that is not what we are talking about here. We are talking about a very tragic incident that resulted in a loss of life that none of us want to see repeated.

I know the hon. member well and I respect him. Does he think the fact that the victim in this case was a sex worker is as important as the questions his party is raising around the conditional release system? I happen to believe the safety of sex workers and the operations of the Parole Board are equally important questions for us to look at. Does he share that opinion?

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

Noon

Conservative

Kelly McCauley Conservative Edmonton West, AB

Mr. Speaker, I will address the member's first comment. We can never criticize how the NDP does in power, because it has never been in power and never will be in power.

I agree with the member 100%. I am sure the member across the way does not see the victim as a sex worker. I am sure, like me, he sees that person as an innocent woman who did nothing wrong except be killed because of the failures of the Parole Board.

It does not matter what people do in their life. A sex worker is just as valued as any human being in our society. Whether she is a mother, a sister or a daughter, she is valued. They are all valued and they all must be protected equally.

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

Noon

Conservative

Dave Epp Conservative Chatham-Kent—Leamington, ON

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank my colleague for the reminder to thank my spouse and I will do that more appropriately in an upcoming speech. As a new member, I take that advice seriously.

I have also heard the government's call to continue to campaign as a transparent government. As a new member to this chamber, I would ask my colleague to help me understand how an internal review would fulfill that goal of transparency. Is our motion not far more appropriate toward encouraging transparency?

Opposition Motion — Instruction to the Standing Committee on Public Safety and National SecurityBusiness of SupplyGovernment Orders

Noon

Conservative

Kelly McCauley Conservative Edmonton West, AB

Mr. Speaker, I agree with my colleague's sentiment. This has to be an open and transparent review. We know full well that in an internal review the government is going to scapegoat the parole officer who was dealing with this, throw him under the bus and give a free pass to its patronage appointments to the Parole Board.

This has to be a fulsome, open and transparent review to ensure that we never again lose a sister, a mother, a daughter, a brother or anyone due to the incompetence of the Parole Board.