Agriculture Committee on March 14th, 2012

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

It would seem to me, because I know I hear it at every farm meeting I go to, that it would make sense, just once and for all, to make it open and transparent—say this is what we do, this is why we do it, don't be afraid about it, and put it out there. Just lead with it, so it's out there. I think that would help dispel a lot of the myths and answer a lot of the questions we hear time and time again at committee meetings, and time and time again at our local meetings.

Just on that as well, I'll turn to the front-line workers. This is a complaint I get at every meeting I go to, every time I see a local processor, since even way before I was elected. What are we doing here to ensure consistency? I was at a processor one day, a small processor that had been in business for years, and he said, “Ben, honestly, depending on what inspector and the mood they're in today, they shut me down”, and he says “You don't dare challenge them; you just say yes ma'am, no ma'am, and you start doing what they say”. This was only about a year ago that I was out to see this person. What is the CFIA doing to ensure this kind of stuff doesn't happen?

[Barbara Jordan]

Thank you for that question. I think it's a bit of a multi-part answer.

We certainly hear feedback about inconsistency in our inspection activities.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Okay, so when you hear that, what happens?

[Barbara Jordan]

On a very specific issue, we will go out to the area and we'll find out what happened in that area. We have a group of specialists who I guess consider inspection activities across—

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Okay, so just on that little chunk you just mentioned here, what timeframe are we talking about? Is that six months or six hours? If you shut the line down and the processor disagrees, and what they're asking that processor to do is spend $50,000 to buy some machinery he thinks he shouldn't have to buy, how quickly does he get a response?

[Barbara Jordan]

They tend to be responded to in order of priority. When we have a scenario where a line is shut down or a shipment is held up, the response is very quick.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

So, very quick is...?

[Barbara Jordan]

It can be within 24 hours; it can be shorter than that.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

If we had a range, would it be six hours to six weeks?

[Barbara Jordan]

You've given me a specific example, and I would say it would never go to six weeks if a line has been shut down.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Okay.

With the new service commitment, this is a big issue. The reason they had to put this in is because of all these issues. So specifically, there's a certain number of staff that are set aside to deal with these issues; and it's not hundreds, but it's a few. How will the department react if they're starting to get flooded with calls from transport companies, farmers, processors? In your department, how is this going to work so that we don't hear, “Well, we're overworked, we only have this many people, we have 500 calls, and we'll get to you in three years”?

What do you have, to make sure you are able to meet the challenges as they arise?

[Barbara Jordan]

We are setting up a separate office and structure internally that will deal with that and ensure there are service standards for responding and acknowledging.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

What will that service standard be?

I'm a processor and I've just been shut down. I disagree. I call you. How long will it be until I have somebody on the phone who can come down, take a look, and mediate this issue?

[Barbara Jordan]

We are setting this up for April 1. I don't have those service standards with me now. I don't know if Paul has them. We can certainly get them. We will know them in a couple of weeks.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

Once they come out, I think it would be great if you folks could come back to flesh this out a little more. I think all my colleagues would be very interested to see how this whole process is going to work so they get results for the processors.

The study we're doing is on the supply chain, and this is one of the cornerstones of making sure our supply chain works effectively for small and medium-sized processors.

[Barbara Jordan]

I think the complaints mechanism is a very critical aspect of that. Training is a very critical aspect of consistency in inspectors. Inspection modernization, which my colleague mentioned in his remarks, will also be a very critical piece in improving consistency in inspections.

[Ben Lobb, Conservative, Huron—Bruce, ON]

That's fine, but the key point is that, for a long time, small and medium-sized processors have had to bear the financial burden themselves, to quite a costly amount.

I think of my own riding and the costs, and I hope when the department officials come back in April they will have something really sharp to present to this committee so we can go back into our communities and say, “You know what? CFIA has pulled up their socks, and they're there to serve you instead of giving you a hard time”.

[The Chair, Conservative, Larry Miller]

Thank you.

There's one clarification, Mr. Mayers. One of Ben's questions—and I think it even came up over here earlier—was about the 2%. To me there are people out there like Mr. Kingston and others—and no disrespect to them—who think that every load can realistically be inspected. We all know that isn't practical, necessary, or whatever. You can argue that until the cows come home.

I know that loads going to the United States are not all inspected either. It's kind of a yes or no. Is what we inspect here, coming in from the United States, comparable to what goes from Canada into the United States, inspection-wise on a percentage basis?

[Paul Mayers]

I can't say with identity...but it is very similar.

[The Chair, Conservative, Larry Miller]

That's good enough.

[Paul Mayers]

There's equivalence on both sides.

[The Chair, Conservative, Larry Miller]

I thank you for that.

Mr. Rousseau, you have five minutes.

[Jean Rousseau, NDP, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

In your brief document, you say that you want to modernize and improve the current inspection methods, tools, and especially the capacity. In a context where food is increasingly globalized, consumers want to know where their food is coming from. But the origin of some food imported into Canada isn't always indicated.

Can we presume that all products imported into Canada are consistent with the standards? Do you plan to improve methods or tools for inspecting imported foods? I'm not talking just about percentages and ratios; I mainly want to know if the methods will be improved.

[Paul Mayers]

The agency is very committed to continuing to strengthen the oversight with respect to imports. The complexity I mentioned and globalization mean that Canada sees a much more diverse range of products from an ever-increasing number of countries. The importance of strengthening the import controls was recognized.

Under the Food and Consumer Safety action plan, $223 million was allocated to CFIA to strengthen the overarching approach on import controls. The agency, within the context of that investment, has focused on the regulatory controls. It is our intent to introduce a regulatory approach that will strengthen the awareness of who is importing, what they're importing, and the tools associated with its oversight.

That is certainly an important part of the overall modernization initiative in which the agency is engaged.

[Jean Rousseau, NDP, Compton—Stanstead, QC]

With respect to imports, which come mainly from the United States, I believe that one of the problems has to do primarily with border transportation. Is this the weak link in the chain with respect to imports from the United States?