Evidence of meeting #2 for Subcommittee on the Automotive Industry in Canada in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was industry.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

David Mondragon  President and Chief Executive Officer, Ford Canada
Caroline Hughes  Director Government Relations, Ford Canada
Ken Lewenza  National President, Canadian Auto Workers Union
Jim Stanford  Chief Economist, Canadian Auto Workers Union
Mark Nantais  President, Canadian Vehicle Manufacturers' Association
David Adams  President, Association of International Automobile Manufacturers of Canada
Don Romano  Vice-Chair, President and Chief Executive Officer of Mazda Canada Inc, Association of International Automobile Manufacturers of Canada
David Worts  Executive Director, Japan Automobile Manufacturers Association of Canada
Angelo Carnevale  Vice-President, Canadian Association of Moldmakers

6:30 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Michael Chong

Good evening, everyone.

This is our subcommittee on the auto sector. We're studying the challenges facing the auto sector in Canada, and we'll report our findings and recommendations back to the House of Commons by the end of this month of March.

Our first panel today will be from the Ford Motor Company of Canada. We have Mr. David Mondragon, president and chief executive officer; Madame Caroline Hughes, director, government relations; and Mr. James Rowland, manager, government relations.

Thank you very much for appearing, and welcome to our committee.

Without further ado, we'll have the panellists begin with about a 10-minute introduction and then we'll proceed to comments and questions from our members.

Go ahead.

6:30 p.m.

David Mondragon President and Chief Executive Officer, Ford Canada

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Good evening, everyone. My name is David Mondragon. I'm the president and chief executive officer of the Ford Motor Company in Canada.

Ford Canada is pleased to have this opportunity to address the subcommittee on the automotive industry in Canada.

With me tonight is Caroline Hughes, our director of government relations, and James Rowland, an executive with us in government relations. Together we'll be happy to answer your questions regarding the automotive industry in Canada from Ford's perspective.

First, though, I'd like to start with a brief overview of Ford's history and restructuring actions. Ford's position has not changed. We do not expect to access government loans for automotive business. At Ford, we are well on our way to transforming our company. In fact, few companies have restructured more aggressively than Ford. As Canada's longest established automaker, Ford Motor Company of Canada is proud of its 104-year history of contributing to the Canadian economy. Together with our 47,000 employees, retirees, and dealership personnel, Ford has demonstrated a legacy of hard work, innovation, and commitment to communities all across Canada.

Long before the current global economic crisis, Ford recognized its business model needed to be changed. During the past several years, Ford has taken steps to put the company on a path to long-term viability.

We have adjusted our automotive operations to meet demand at lower market volumes in North America, and these actions have resulted in difficult decisions to downsize our Canadian operations over the past few years. We took early action to restructure our business, focusing on product innovation, fuel economy, industry-leading quality, and unsurpassed safety. We'll introduce seven new vehicles in the first six months of this year; that's more than any other manufacturer.

And when it comes to product, everything we do at Ford is focused on excelling in four key areas: fuel economy, quality, safety, and smart technology.

When it comes to alternative fuels, Ford was one of the first automotive manufacturers to put fuel-cell vehicles on Canadian roads. We are the first automaker in the world to be operating hydrogen internal combustion engine vehicles, and those hydrogen vehicles are being used as shuttlebuses right here on Parliament HIll.

Ford is bringing affordable fuel economy to millions of drivers by delivering best in class or among the best in class fuel economy with every new vehicle we'll introduce. For example, this year we'll introduce the new Ford Fusion Hybrid, which is the most fuel-efficient mid-size sedan in the world.

Also this year, Ford will introduce industry-leading EcoBoost engines, delivering 20% better fuel economy and up to 15% lower CO2 emissions.

Ford will be selling a new battery electric commercial vehicle this year as well, the Transit Connect, a 2010 model we'll introduce later this year.

And we've introduced a joint venture with Canadian-based Magna International to develop a battery electric small car by 2011.

By 2012, Ford is bringing to market a family of next-generation hybrids, plug-in hybrids, and battery electric vehicles.

Now let's turn to quality for a moment. Ford quality is now on a par with Honda and Toyota, and that is consistently being recognized by important third parties like J.D. Power and Associates and Consumer Reports.

Ford is also leading in safety with more five-star safety ratings than any auto company, and recently moved past Honda with more top safety picks awarded by the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety.

Clearly, 2009 presents many challenges. Companies and consumers everywhere are feeling the impact of the global economic crisis, and we do not expect the Canadian auto industry sales to grow. In fact, we expect them to shrink by about 13% this year.

In February, industry sales were down 28%. So far this year, sales are down 26% compared to the same time last year. When you consider that 20% of all retail sales in Canada are automotive-related, this downturn will have a severe ripple-through effect. This decline in auto sales translates to about 250,000 fewer vehicles being sold, with an estimated impact of $20 billion in lost sales and nearly $3 billion in lost taxes in 2009. If we see even sharper declines like those the U.S. is experiencing, those losses will double.

By far the most important way the Canadian government can support the auto industry is through direct consumer stimulus to get people into our showrooms, willing and able to buy new vehicles. To do this, consumers need access to credit and incentives to purchase new vehicles during this difficult economic time.

There are two important actions the government can take to help in this regard. While the Canadian secured credit facility announced in the 2009 budget will help provide auto financing companies with the funds they need to provide consumer loans and leases, and to finance dealer inventories, the $12 billion announced is likely much less than what is needed. The Canadian Finance and Leasing Association estimates that annual auto loans and leases are worth about $60 billion.

The credit markets have been frozen for more than a year for the auto financing companies. As a matter of fact, not since 2006 has Ford Motor Credit been able to securitize any loans in the open market in Canada. These funds are needed to underwrite new loans and leases, and this lack of credit is reflected in the reduced industry sales and the pullback in leasing activities that have occurred over the last year.

With additional credit, auto finance companies will be able to underwrite more loans and leases for consumers. Investment-grade ABS securities offer the government and taxpayers a high-quality investment that will provide significant returns. These can be set up as low risk and will provide the industry with the flexibility it needs to raise funds in this challenging credit market. The funds should apply to automotive loans, leases, and dealer inventories, and the funding needs to be implemented urgently.

Canada appears to be three to six months behind the U.S. downturn in sales. Providing this access to credit will help us mitigate further declines. We need to establish an anchor in the sea, and right now there's no anchor in the sea for our ship.

The second action the government can take is to offer consumer stimulus, which would be provided in a program that would offer a $3,500 incentive to purchase a new car or light truck. In January, Germany introduced an incentive that provides consumers with 2,500 euros, or the equivalent of about $4,000 Canadian, to purchase a new car or light truck when they turn in a vehicle that's nine years old or older. Remarkably, new vehicle sales in Germany rose by 22% in February with the introduction of this program.

The federal scrappage program introduced by Environment Canada is not working, and no one appears to be using it. It's likely because a 10-year-old vehicle has a value of about $3,500 and the incentive offered is only $300. The Canadian government should introduce an immediate $3,500 consumer stimulus incentive for any new car or light truck purchased from now through to the end of the year.

To qualify for this incentive, consumers would be asked to turn in a vehicle that's 10 years old or older to be scrapped. This will ensure that the sales are truly incremental and the money is not being paid to consumers who would have purchased a vehicle otherwise. This program would also benefit the environment, because a 10-year-old vehicle produces 12 to 18 times more air pollutants than do new cars and trucks, and the average fuel economy of a vehicle purchased today is much better than the fuel economy of a vehicle purchased 10 years ago.

The consumer incentive is urgently needed to spur automotive sales, which will help drive economic activity and factory production for all manufacturers in Canada. With the livelihood of one in seven Canadians dependent on the auto industry, I don't have to tell you how critical it is that we take steps to stimulate the industry.

We look forward to working with this committee and helping to stabilize our economy here in Canada.

Thank you for the opportunity to meet with you.

Now, Caroline, J.R., and I will take questions.

6:40 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Michael Chong

Thank you, Mr. Mondragon.

We'll have about 50 minutes of questions and comments from members of this committee, beginning with Mr. Valeriote.

6:40 p.m.

Liberal

Frank Valeriote Liberal Guelph, ON

Thank you, Mr. Mondragon, Ms. Hughes, and Mr. Rowland for coming in this evening. I appreciate it.

You spoke of the scrappage program, and you made a comparison between that in Germany and that in Canada, and you said our scrappage program is not working. I think our scrappage program offers $300 for a vehicle over 10 years old. I notice that the scrappage program was talked about in a document that the Canadian Vehicle Manufacturers' Association had submitted to the government in October of 2007. I understand that this scrappage issue has been on the horizon for quite some time now; it has been the subject of irritation and has been identified as a program that would stimulate sales. Can you confirm that for me?

6:40 p.m.

Caroline Hughes Director Government Relations, Ford Canada

First of all, I can confirm that the program was in fact discussed by the CVMA. We've been a member of the CVMA since 2007.

In fact, we as industry participants talked about scrappage for probably many more years than that. It's seen as a very beneficial way to help consumers turn over the fleet and get into the newer, cleaner, safer vehicles quicker.

6:40 p.m.

Liberal

Frank Valeriote Liberal Guelph, ON

Were you given a reason by this government as to why they weren't embracing a more fortified scrappage program?

6:40 p.m.

Director Government Relations, Ford Canada

Caroline Hughes

We've had a number of consultations with government and with Environment Canada.

One of the challenges that even we have, as industry, is agreeing on a very complicated scrappage program. That's the beauty of the German program. It's very simple to understand. It's very simple for consumers to take part in. Essentially, the program allows the market to work.

The biggest problem we have today is the fact that there is not enough consumer demand. If a consumer is offered an amount that is more than the value of the vehicle, they might choose to turn in the car that they might otherwise have hung onto.

6:40 p.m.

Liberal

Frank Valeriote Liberal Guelph, ON

But did you introduce that program, or some similar model, to this government and ask them to introduce it in the industry?

6:40 p.m.

Director Government Relations, Ford Canada

Caroline Hughes

We did not introduce a program of that magnitude back in 2007.

6:40 p.m.

Liberal

Frank Valeriote Liberal Guelph, ON

But you did have a program that you introduced, hoping it would be implemented and deployed?

6:40 p.m.

Director Government Relations, Ford Canada

Caroline Hughes

We didn't have the specific details; we did have suggestions as to how a program could work.

6:40 p.m.

Liberal

Frank Valeriote Liberal Guelph, ON

Would sales in Canada be more fortified now had that program been introduced?

6:40 p.m.

Director Government Relations, Ford Canada

Caroline Hughes

I'm not sure I can answer that.

6:40 p.m.

Liberal

Frank Valeriote Liberal Guelph, ON

Okay.

6:40 p.m.

President and Chief Executive Officer, Ford Canada

David Mondragon

I'm not sure you could run it for that long a duration and still have the same impact in the market. Today approximately 30% of the vehicles in Canada are over 11 years old. That's about 6 million out of the fleet of 20 million in Canada. It's a sizeable number. But as you start to draw those down....

So I don't know about the long-term impact of the program. We think it's a great short-term stimulus.

Also, you used the word “irritation”. It's an opportunity for Canada--to help Canadians, to help our environment, to help our industry, and, because our industry is such a pivotal part of our economy, to truly help our economy stabilize itself and get back on a road to recovery.

6:40 p.m.

Liberal

Frank Valeriote Liberal Guelph, ON

I appreciate that. I'm suggesting that had it been introduced a little sooner, we may not have had this current deterioration or erosion in sales.

I have another question for you. I'm interested in what other irritants might exist in the industry. Are there certain regulatory issues on emissions or safety standards, or issues with regard to thinning the border? Are there issues relating to the industry specifically? And can you comment on how addressing these issues might help the industry?

6:45 p.m.

President and Chief Executive Officer, Ford Canada

David Mondragon

I would say that we have a number of issues we're working on with the government. First and foremost is helping free up the credit market for securitized ABS lending. The actions taking place are very favourable. We're very appreciative of that. Now we need to get the money in the hands of the financiers so that we can move our business forward.

Second is what we're talking about now, the stimulus program. Stimulus could be on many different fronts, such as scrappage or a tax-free holiday--

6:45 p.m.

Liberal

Frank Valeriote Liberal Guelph, ON

Mr. Mondragon, I'm asking you to speak to us specifically about other regulations that might help the industry--emissions, safety, those kinds of things--as well as the border....

6:45 p.m.

President and Chief Executive Officer, Ford Canada

David Mondragon

Free trade, harmonization of fuel economy, border crossing--there are a number of issues on which we're working with government. I wouldn't so much call them...what did you say, “irritants”?

6:45 p.m.

Liberal

Frank Valeriote Liberal Guelph, ON

Yes.

6:45 p.m.

President and Chief Executive Officer, Ford Canada

David Mondragon

I wouldn't say they're irritants; they're hindrances for us. They're an opportunity for us to strengthen our relations and strengthen our business in Canada.

I'll let Caroline add to that.

6:45 p.m.

Director Government Relations, Ford Canada

Caroline Hughes

Sure.

As you and probably all members of the committee are aware, our industry is very integrated on a North American basis. We started that integration back in 1965 with the Auto Pact. To the extent we can, having common vehicle standards for safety and emissions on both sides of the border is extremely helpful for us. Any deviation from a common standard drives additional cost into the product and design process.

In some instances--especially, ironically, with our more advanced technology vehicles--when the volumes are so low, especially as they're being introduced to market, we often see delayed or potentially no introduction to Canada if the standards are such that we can't design to those unique standards and still make the business case for introducing those vehicles in Canada.

We've been happy with the commitment for a harmonized North American fuel economy standard, not fractionalized regional standards or a multiplicity of standards. We've benefited greatly from the harmonized emissions standards that we've had on tailpipe emissions.

On the safety front, there still are a number of standards that are not yet harmonized. We would encourage the government to continue to work to harmonize those as best they can.

6:45 p.m.

Liberal

Frank Valeriote Liberal Guelph, ON

I have a final question, at least for this round.

We heard last week that if General Motors fails, their supply chain will begin to erode, and that will impact on the other automobile assemblers like you, Chrysler, Toyota, and Honda. Can you comment on the accuracy of that?

6:45 p.m.

President and Chief Executive Officer, Ford Canada

David Mondragon

It's widely publicized and widely known that the supply base for not just the big three but for Toyota and Honda is fairly interdependent. We all share suppliers. Basically, about 80% of the suppliers have work that's distributed through all the manufacturers. There is risk if the supply chain goes down or gets in check, but we're hopeful that won't happen.

The suppliers right now are asking for some support in the United States as well. I believe they're asking for support here in Canada as well to stabilize their financial position. A stable supply base is very important to our industry going forward.

6:45 p.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Michael Chong

Thank you very much, Mr. Mondragon.

We work in both official languages. Therefore, some members may be putting their questions in French.

We use both official languages on this committee. There will be some members who will ask you questions in French and in English. If you wish to use the translation, the earpiece is on your desk. The clerk can help you get that set up.