Evidence of meeting #16 for Access to Information, Privacy and Ethics in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was complaints.
A recording is available from Parliament.
4:15 p.m.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
But can RCMP officers come to you, unobstructed, with disclosures of wrongdoing?
4:15 p.m.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
For disclosures of reprisals, can they come to you, again unobstructed?
4:15 p.m.
Commissioner, Office of the Public Sector Integrity Commissioner
For reprisals, they have to go through the internal process, as you're well aware.
4:15 p.m.
Commissioner, Office of the Public Sector Integrity Commissioner
I've had exchanges with the Commissioner of the RCMP, in fact, with respect to some of the processes. He was aiming, as well, at simplifying the process for accessibility. So that was very much what he had in mind.
4:15 p.m.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
Right. Okay.
How many disclosures have you received from RCMP personnel?
4:15 p.m.
Commissioner, Office of the Public Sector Integrity Commissioner
We've received some. I don't have the exact number. We have to look at the confidentiality of that aspect, but Mr. Chair, we could write to you.
4:15 p.m.
Conservative
4:15 p.m.
Commissioner, Office of the Public Sector Integrity Commissioner
I appreciate that.
We have received a few, yes.
4:15 p.m.
Conservative
Pierre Poilievre Conservative Nepean—Carleton, ON
Have you been able to receive them and review them, or have you been forced to consider them outside your mandate, right from the beginning?
4:15 p.m.
Commissioner, Office of the Public Sector Integrity Commissioner
No. In the disclosure area they were, to use your terminology, unobstructed.
4:15 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Paul Szabo
I allowed Mr. Poilievre to move a little longer than normal, only because he has a lot of experience with, certainly, the RCMP. I think the military was another that we got extensively into.
Your commission actually reports to another standing committee, which is the Standing Committee on Government Operations and Estimates, so we're not going to tread into their area too far. But it's good to know that there is some linkage to the access to information and privacy area. I think that's how we justified allowing you to come before us.
4:15 p.m.
Commissioner, Office of the Public Sector Integrity Commissioner
I'm very happy to be here.
4:15 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Paul Szabo
I think it's important for us to know that this is working reasonably well, given the timeframe.
We'll go to Mr. Wrzesnewskyj, please.
4:15 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Paul Szabo
We're down to five minutes per member, so if he has ten questions, you're going to have to be quick.
4:15 p.m.
Liberal
Borys Wrzesnewskyj Liberal Etobicoke Centre, ON
I'm back to the $1,500 limit. Do you know what the logic was for placing that as an upper limit for legal services?
4:15 p.m.
Commissioner, Office of the Public Sector Integrity Commissioner
No, I don't know, Mr. Chair.
4:15 p.m.
Liberal
Borys Wrzesnewskyj Liberal Etobicoke Centre, ON
Okay. Perhaps that could be provided to us. I'm sure that a number isn't pulled out of thin air, you would hope. That will be provided to us.
You had also said that we might assume, perhaps, that it was considered a bridge legal service until, as you said, public service unions begin to cover costs if things get a little more involved. What about cases like the RCMP, which doesn't have a union?
4:15 p.m.
Commissioner, Office of the Public Sector Integrity Commissioner
Let me clarify. I apologize if I created any confusion. I'm not suggesting that the union would necessarily pay additional costs. I'm suggesting that many sources of information would be available to the discloser, including the unions and some associations as well. In the meantime, our experience so far is that we can offer the choice to the discloser.
4:20 p.m.
Commissioner, Office of the Public Sector Integrity Commissioner
Certainly.
4:20 p.m.
Liberal
Borys Wrzesnewskyj Liberal Etobicoke Centre, ON
Unions do at times provide some protection, but as I've already made clear, I'm not quite sure that what is provided is adequate. As I said, the RCMP doesn't have that option for its membership.
Has it been made clear to the RCMP rank and file that the rules of the game have changed? Previously it was drilled into the RCMP that if there's a complaint, you take that complaint to the officer in charge. You work within the hierarchy. The RCMP has a very different structure from other government departments. It has the culture of a paramilitary force. That particular aspect of keeping things in-house was drilled into generations of RCMP officers. How are you overcoming that?