Evidence of meeting #26 for Finance in the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was youth.
A recording is available from Parliament.
4:35 p.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Association of Canadian Community Colleges
Yes.
I want to add something with respect to the statistics—
4:35 p.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Association of Canadian Community Colleges
—that Frank talked about. One thing that has not been said is that there are more students with disabilities who are coming into colleges and universities. But it's also creating a lot of financial pressure on those educational institutions because they used to have one disability for example and now the students have way more than one disability and this needs to be accommodated. So I thought I should mention that.
4:40 p.m.
Conservative
4:40 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
I have a question for Ms. Watts-Rynard. I come from British Columbia and we had a very successful apprenticeship program that went on for generations. It was cancelled in the early 2000s. It then seemed to have led to a bit of a manufactured crisis in not having enough ticketed and tradespeople. Aside from a general bias in the school system or where some parents are turning young people away from the trades, does your association have any understanding as to why not just B.C. but many other provinces turned away from what was a good apprenticeship program?
I have a second follow-up if you can answer that one relatively briefly.
4:40 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Apprenticeship Forum
I think there was a real movement away from thinking that working with your hands had value. We really saw it in earlier education, in primary school and secondary school. There was an emphasis away from hands-on training and trying to connect the people who learn with their hands and those who learn by doing with those opportunities. That also undermined apprenticeship as a post-secondary pathway because we weren't giving people access anymore.
4:40 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
I've talked to a number of large resource sector employers, companies looking for 500 carpenters at a time, 300 welders. Are there any thoughts from your association on the relative ease to acquire temporary foreign workers rather than going through what is somewhat more cumbersome to bring on apprentices who will take a number of years? Then the fear is that once trained they will be drawn away to even more lucrative resource industries.
Does your association have any thoughts on that? Is there any pressure from the temporary foreign worker program? The government has admitted that it got too big and the controls were gone. Did that affect the viability of apprentices actually being able to find those spots and locations with employers that were willing to invest the time and money that's required to get them fully ticketed?
4:40 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Apprenticeship Forum
I think that it has made an impact but when we actually look at the percentage of skills vacancies that are actually filled with temporary foreign workers, it's such a small percentage of the overall demand that we're seeing. I think there's just a sense from employers that I'm going to have somebody who's had no exposure. Unless they have been from a family where they had opportunities, they have had no exposure and they are coming in fresh.
4:40 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
Whereas you may pick up a temporary foreign worker who has had lots of exposure in 20 years as a skilled carpenter....
4:40 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
Mr. Farrington, I have a larger analysis question. There are two cohorts in our economy that have not at all recovered since before the recession. One as you talked about is young people. The second is the value added, the manufacturing side. Those two sections of our economy have not picked back up at all.
You talked about 1,000% increase in tuition over 15 years, you said?
4:40 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
That's dramatic. Is not the trade that if you go and get a post-secondary degree your lifelong earnings will be such that it will always compensate back for whatever you invested in your education? Is that social contract not still viable for young people seeking post-secondary education?
4:40 p.m.
Internal Coordinator, Canadian Federation of Students
Absolutely not; in fact, studies have shown that many industries' fields have stagnated or reduced, particularly in metro areas like Montreal and Vancouver.
4:40 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
Has your group done any assessments? I was catching on a bit when you talked about a child born in 2011. My kids were born in 2010. You estimate nearly $140,000 at current trajectories for tuition?
4:40 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
I better start saving more than we've set aside for $140,000.
Can I not make an argument, though, that the recent spike is just a spike and that tuitions are going to level off? Does your group have any sense that this pattern is in fact an instituted pattern?
I'd be looking for some comments from the colleges as well.
4:40 p.m.
Internal Coordinator, Canadian Federation of Students
No, absolutely not.
In fact, the inverse is true. We are seeing a continuing trend in a negative direction, particularly in the largest provinces in the country, that is resulting in fees going up at higher rates than we've ever experienced. Those rates are constant. We saw some spikes and arguments from governments in the early 2000s and then we saw some levelling off. But now we're seeing across-the-board increases in many places.
4:40 p.m.
NDP
Nathan Cullen NDP Skeena—Bulkley Valley, BC
Let me tack on a question as you answer, Ms. Amyot. We've talked a bit about the Canada job grant. Would it be favourable to you or anyone else in the group—just by a show of nodding—if the government hived off a portion of that program directed specifically at youth employment as one of those categories of Canadians that have not seen benefits since the beginning of the recession?
4:45 p.m.
President and Chief Executive Officer, Association of Canadian Community Colleges
I think this would be a definite and positive move on that.
I also want to answer one of your questions with respect to B.C. and trades. The B.C. college associations organized a very successful campaign last year, both on TV as well as in social media, and they have seen an increase in students interested in trades. This is something that we would like to do at the national level also, so I thought I should mention that.
4:45 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Rajotte
Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Cullen.
We'll go to Mr. Van Kesteren, please.
4:45 p.m.
Conservative
Dave Van Kesteren Conservative Chatham-Kent—Essex, ON
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you all for coming.
Brent, what did students pay 15 years ago for tuition?
4:45 p.m.
Internal Coordinator, Canadian Federation of Students
In which province? Across the board? About $1,700.