Evidence of meeting #60 for Finance in the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was officer.
A video is available from Parliament.
5 p.m.
Spokesperson, Initiative de vigilance du Port de Québec
I'm here as the spokesperson of l'Initiative citoyenne de vigilance du Port de Québec, but l'Initiative citoyenne du Port de Québec is not chartered. We are just citizens who have gathered together to fight an aggression that we have every day in our community.
November 24th, 2014 / 5 p.m.
Conservative
Mark Adler Conservative York Centre, ON
Okay. I just want to read you some facts. There's $53 million in private investments at the Quebec port; across Canada 9,800 jobs are tied to the Quebec port; in 2012, $20 billion in goods, which was 33 million tonnes, went through the port. You talk about people: for 9,800 jobs there are 9,800 families behind those jobs.
5:05 p.m.
Spokesperson, Initiative de vigilance du Port de Québec
Actually, the numbers that are given by the port are always very high.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
Mark Adler Conservative York Centre, ON
What do you say to the 9,800 people who are going to be out of work?
5:05 p.m.
Spokesperson, Initiative de vigilance du Port de Québec
Actually, when you look at all the ports, we are mainly focusing on the bulk industries, which are known as being very space-consuming.
That's not really a value-added activity if we compare it to ship building, for instance.
If you look at the jobs at the port of Quebec, most of them come from la construction navale.
If we look at the jobs created in bulk handling, the port is really just a passageway. Very little wealth is created for the community. The number of jobs is about 200. Concerning all the costs to the community, a number of studies indicate much lower economic benefits. In the Port of Quebec, the GDP value in terms of economic benefits of the bulk industry is less than 1% for the community. However, the studies indicate a very high level of inconvenience and problems for the constituents, and that is never taken into account when the port presents its figures. They always talk about jobs and benefits, but they never keep track of social, economic and health costs people have to assume collectively and individually.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
Mark Adler Conservative York Centre, ON
So is it fair to say, then, that your ultimate goal is to shut down the port? Would that be your preference? It would be fine if it is.
5:05 p.m.
Some hon. members
Oh, oh!
5:05 p.m.
Spokesperson, Initiative de vigilance du Port de Québec
No, no. We've said, I would say a million times, that our goal is not to shut down the port. We believe that things like recreation and port operations can all be parts of a community, but we want the port of Quebec to maintain.... Actually, we are the greatest supporters of the Port de Québec mission, which is to...
Again, the port's profitability must be ensured while respecting the environment and communities. If we had a transshipment system in Quebec City for handing all products, I would not be here talking to you. We actually think that those mechanisms would not only preserve jobs, but would also generate innovation that could bring much more....
5:05 p.m.
Spokesperson, Initiative de vigilance du Port de Québec
They could bring a lot more wealth to our community.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
Mark Adler Conservative York Centre, ON
You are aware that there were other amendments to the Marine Act and there are other regulations that the government can apply when developing projects on port lands, essentially ensuring that projects do go through even further environmental scrutiny and assessment processes? You're aware of that?
5:05 p.m.
Spokesperson, Initiative de vigilance du Port de Québec
Yes, but the process—
5:05 p.m.
Spokesperson, Initiative de vigilance du Port de Québec
We think that a process where the industry—which is the promoter—defines rules, handles the process and ultimately gives its approval does not meet the transparency criteria for projects that will have such an impact on the community.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
Mark Adler Conservative York Centre, ON
How do we compare to other jurisdictions around the world when it comes to...?
5:05 p.m.
Spokesperson, Initiative de vigilance du Port de Québec
We have instead documented the impact of port activities. As for jurisdictions, I would like to have much more time and be able to dedicate myself to those issues full time, but I have a job. I am probably the only person here who is not paid to participate in this meeting.
However, ours is one of the only countries with such a gap between federal and provincial jurisdictions. This makes alignment more difficult. Coexistence issues between ports and populations are noted around the world.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Rajotte
Okay, thank you. Merci.
Thank you, Mr. Adler.
I'm going to take the next round as chair. I do want to clarify the position with respect to the chief public health officer.
We had the chief public health officer before our committee. I'm sure the three witnesses who've talked about it today have seen the testimony. I thought Dr. Taylor was very explicit in terms of what he wanted. Obviously, I take him at his word. I think we all do.
Just to follow up on few points, Mr. Culbert, you talked about the U.S. having a different kind of model, whereas the U.K. and Australia have a similar model to what's being proposed here. Am I correct in that?
5:05 p.m.
Excutive Director, Canadian Public Health Association
That's my understanding, yes.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Rajotte
It seems to me it's linked to the difference between a parliamentary-type system, in which you have ministerial responsibility and the executive resides within the legislative branch, and a congressional-type system or a complete separation of power in the U.S. Maybe a better question to ask is this. Is there a parliamentary system that has a different model from what is being used in the U.K. or Australia or being contemplated here in this legislation?
5:05 p.m.
Excutive Director, Canadian Public Health Association
Unfortunately, I can't answer the question.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Rajotte
Okay.
Then I want to follow up on the connection between the chief public health officer and the minister. You say that under the current legislation, the CPHO, as deputy head of the agency, reports directly to the Minister of Health, yet I think at least one of the witnesses said that the chief public health officer will not report directly to the minister. Did I hear any one of you say that?
Mr. Culbert or Mr. Hoffman, go ahead please.
5:10 p.m.
Assistant Professor, Faculty of Law, University of Ottawa, As an Individual
In the proposed bill, there's language saying how the chief public health officer would advise the president and the minister. So, yes, it's clear that there would be advice provided. But of course under the new system there would be an agency president. The CPHO would be reporting directly to the agency president. The CPHO job and performance reviews would be done by the agency president. So even if in the legislation it says that the chief public health officer will provide advice, it would go through the president of the agency, which then restricts that independence. There are problems there.
5:10 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative James Rajotte
Okay.
I don't read this legislation like that at all. It says:
The Chief Public Health Officer shall provide the Minister and the President with public health advice that is developed on a scientific basis.
It seems to state explicitly what you want, which is that the chief public health officer is to provide scientific advice directly to the Minister of Health.
5:10 p.m.
Assistant Professor, Faculty of Law, University of Ottawa, As an Individual
I hope that does happen, but in this case it's not just to the minister that matters. We're in a federal model, in which we need to make sure that the chief public health officer is able to communicate to Canadians, to the rest of the federation, knowing that the advice is based on science rather than based on political imperatives. There's the concern that—