Fisheries Committee on May 28th, 2013

[Nathan Millar]

That's correct.

[Robert Chisholm, NDP, Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS]

As you know, the Fisheries Act went through some significant changes last year, particularly in relation to the question of protecting fish habitat. Have you seen a change in the resources and the focus of DFO in the Yukon so as to continue to carry out this work of protecting fish habitat?

[Dan Lindsey]

I think we're in the midst of a change, quite frankly. There has obviously been a change in the number of people devoted to that kind of work. We're probably seeing a shift more to the salmonid rather than the non-anadromous fish.

There are some unique provisions in the Yukon, too. We have a different placer mining regime, which has different standards for habitat risk assessment and management. It is a bit unusual, compared with the rest of the country.

So yes, there have been some changes. We hope those changes don't remove the habitat management provisions related to the freshwater program, but they probably have already. We're in a transition right now and haven't seen the full impact of what the new structure might look like under the legislation.

I don't know whether that helps.

[Robert Chisholm, NDP, Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS]

It does and I appreciate it. We're not here to talk about the legislative changes, but it is important for us to understand, especially in light of the Canada-Yukon agreement, the relationship the Yukon has with the Government of Canada through the Department of Fisheries and Oceans. So thank you for that.

[Dan Lindsey]

Just as a summary comment, I think it's safe to say that we have enjoyed a very good relationship with the northern region over the years. I think it's been a very good partnership. Frankly, I think that partnership was due in part to this being a shared activity and to its being defined, so we worked collectively together on it. I think it was a good model.

Thank you.

[Robert Chisholm, NDP, Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS]

That's good to hear. Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rodney Weston]

Thank you very much.

Mr. Allen.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you, folks, for being here today. We really appreciate it.

I want to ask a few questions with respect to coming in at a high level with respect to the types of fisheries that are in the Yukon. You commented, in your responses to Mr. Sopuck, that you are talking about a $23-million-a-year industry on the recreational side, for direct and indirect value. Also, your report talks about a decline in the number of non-resident anglers, as well as about participation by youth.

Can you tell me what your assessment is of the impact that is going to have upon that perhaps $23 million, going forward? What are some of the strategies you're undertaking to reverse that trend?

[Nathan Millar]

Thanks. That's a good question. Certainly something that came out very strongly in our report was that when we looked at trends in participation and recreational fishing in Yukon, we did begin to see a slight decline in some categories. Overall, I'd categorize it as relatively stable right now, but the indicators are there such that we believe in the next 10 to 20 years, we're going to have a reduction in the number of people who participate in the recreational fishery.

I'm not an economist and I can't speak definitively to those numbers, but my biologist assessment is that we're going to see a reduction in expenditures that will be concomitant with the reduction in angler activity, which is concerning. Also, from a fisheries and management perspective, there's a big concern about reduction in angler participation because of some of the non-economic values that those provide. So what I'm talking about here are people who are out on the land who are engaging with fishing and with those species tend to have a lot of interest in maintaining those populations and in maintaining healthy ecosystems. When you start to see fewer people engaging in that activity, I personally get worried that you're not going to have as much advocacy for those important resources as we did in the past. That's really concerning for me as a fisheries manager.

You know what? I talked to colleagues across the country and these are trends that everyone is seeing. This is not a Yukon phenomenon. This is a national, maybe a worldwide phenomenon, where there's less uptake in angling by youth. The average age of an angler is increasing and increasing at quite a rapid rate in Yukon.

Dealing with this is a lot of programming, a lot of education, a lot of trying to encourage youth to get out and participate in angling. I think we're just scratching the surface now in terms of what those programs will be. But as I say, it's not necessarily just a Yukon phenomenon. I think every jurisdiction across the country is dealing with this same issue.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

So therefore you're seeing some of that on the tourism side as well, with respect to people buying packages and coming there as well?

[Nathan Millar]

I'm not sure if we're able to determine specific trends like that right now. It would need a more in-depth analysis than what we've done. In talking to operators, what they're saying is that the state of the world economy is a much more important driver of their success on a year-to-year basis than those big trends right now.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Okay. Thank you.

I understand you also have a stocking program in the Yukon with respect to maybe helping divert some attention away from the wild stocks. On your comment with respect to the uneven fishing effort, and it's more of an issue of stocks being depleted where it's easy to get to, is that stocking program helping with diverting fishing effort away from the wild stocks?

[Nathan Millar]

Yes. We definitely believe so, and that's what the data suggest. As you said, the impetus behind that is to provide, first of all, very easy, accessible opportunities to people near communities, so that gets people out. So it's a fostering of angling opportunities, but at the same time diverting pressure away from what tend to be more slower-growing, more sensitive wild species.

Typically, the stock lakes—there are 23 of them around the territory—are close to communities and they're really heavily used. It's a very successful program. We just had one of our fry releases last weekend and had 40 young people come out and help put some of the young fry into a lake near Whitehorse. It's an activity that throughout all of its stages has a lot of community involvement.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Okay. Thank you.

I just want to ask you a question with respect to some of the other economic drivers. We know that there's uncertainty as to where the commercial fishery is going to go there, but can I ask you a question about aquaculture and just to the extent of aquaculture in the Yukon?

From what I understand, they are small operations. There's not a lot going on and it has an estimated value. Can you talk a little bit about the nature of the aquaculture industry up in the Yukon, and do you see potential for expansion of that?

[Nathan Millar]

Sure. I'll just give an overview, and then maybe, Dan, you could talk about the projected future of aquaculture.

I'd say on a year-to-year basis we issue a dozen or so licences. There are two major categories of aquaculture in the Yukon. One is family-run, stocked.... There are also pothole lakes that are seeded with young fry that are left to grow out and then they are harvested. They tend to be in more remote areas. They would be accessed by plane or ATV. Generally the fish from this type of aquaculture is just for local consumption.

Then we have one exporting tank farm, where Arctic char are raised in tanks. This is a facility in Whitehorse, and there's some processing of that product and that's exported certainly within North America, if not around the world. They produce about 30,000 kilograms per year.

On the scale of aquaculture in Canada, we're a very small player. The tank farm, as far as I know, has a relatively steady production. On the more small-scale, local production, it's also relatively steady, but it's quite a low level, I would say. So there are a handful of operators who are actively producing products for the local market.

[Dan Lindsey]

Just to add to that, one of our challenges, obviously, with the, for lack of a better term, pothole lakes aquaculture program is that it's a long way from market. I think those are marginally economic and folks have struggled with just the distance piece. What Nathan mentioned is that when some of those fish are provided locally, that makes sense, but from a distant market it becomes a little bit more challenging.

[Mike Allen, Conservative, Tobique—Mactaquac, NB]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Conservative, Rodney Weston]

Thank you very much.

Mr. MacAulay.

[Lawrence MacAulay, Liberal, Cardigan, PE]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you, guests, for appearing.

Basically, I do not know very much about your fishery. Have you just touched the edge of your expectations? I'd just like you to elaborate a bit on what you see taking place in the commercial fishery and the recreational fishery. Looking at the recreational fishery, just from my mind, I would believe that.... If I understand correctly, your recreational fishery is declining from outside anglers, which is difficult to understand. I would think it would be a major experience for tourists to go north and to have the experience.

If you could, just first of all elaborate in that way. It's difficult for me to understand why people wouldn't want to go there. People have money and they would like to have this great experience to go north and go right out into the wilderness. Is there much of that going on, or what?

[Dan Lindsey]

There is certainly some of it that is specifically for fish. Sometimes you see it connected to other activities. In the hunting and outfitting industry, there is obviously fishing as a sidebar, but a very important piece. There is also a variety of wilderness recreation, whether canoeing down the Yukon River or rafting some of the more challenging areas. Fishing is still a pretty integral part of that program. As to a dedicated, sole, specific fishing experience, there are opportunities. We're not seeing a huge increase in demand for it. It might come, but it's generally wrapped up with other activities.

Just as a point concerning our recreational fishery, we probably have one of the highest or the highest participation rate amongst residents. I think that's a good piece. As Nathan mentioned, there is an age unit that is going through, and younger folks aren't experiencing it as much. We have seen, on the harvesting or hunting side, a bit of a switch going on. We were constantly going down. Now we're coming back up with some of our younger folks. The same experience has been identified in the U.S. recently—over the last couple of years.

It's hard to say what the future holds concerning participation. Downward trends can change. We've seen it on the hunting side recently, whether as a blip or as something new. Much of our effort is still focused on the recreational fishery. The commercial fishery, as far as a contribution to the economy is concerned, doesn't involve nearly the benefits economically that both resident and non-resident recreational fishing do.

[Lawrence MacAulay, Liberal, Cardigan, PE]

Is that because you're too far away from the markets?

[Nathan Millar]

Let me give you a brief overview of what the commercial fishery is like. I think that to understand why that's the case, it will help.

Basically, our commercial fishery takes place on Yukon's large lakes. There are six lakes that have commercial licences. The challenge we face is that these are also lakes on which there is a strong recreational fishery. There's a lot of attention to commercial fishery, which is done through netting. Recreational anglers come out and see that there's a conflict.

The ability of this industry to grow is limited to a large degree by overlap with a recreational fishery. Because the recreational fishery is very large and is a very large part of life for many Yukoners, there's a very high value on it. The ability of the commercial fishery to expand is, on that basis, very limited. Basically, they're sharing space. There are not a lot of large lakes not accessed by people that could sustain the productivity you would need for a commercial fishery.

I hope that gives a bit of the context for some of the constraints we would have in a commercial fishery in Yukon.

[Dan Lindsey]

Largely, it's a productivity issue in many cases on lakes. If you're going to increase the commercial harvest, you're probably going to have to reduce the recreational take.

[Lawrence MacAulay, Liberal, Cardigan, PE]

We're used to that battle.

Is it six bodies of water, six lakes that you fish out of? Why is it only the six, or why has it not expanded beyond these? Or have you answered this in saying that the market is not there, the commercial fishery is not there, or the recreational fishery is not there?

[Nathan Millar]

There was a process undertaken. Dan mentioned the political and regulatory context in which we do fisheries management. Yukon is largely driven by processes from the final agreements. This collaborative management process has involved stakeholders, first nations, renewable resource councils—so they are regional resource councils.

There was an examination of the commercial fishery and which bodies of water would be good choices for that kind of activity. Those six had historic fisheries, but they also were large enough and had enough production that they would be appropriate places to do this kind of activity.

I guess there are a variety of things that are taken into consideration. Part of it is the biological productivity of the system, but there are also the social values and the interaction with the other fisheries that are taken into consideration when making those decisions about where commercial fisheries should take place.