Evidence of meeting #28 for Fisheries and Oceans in the 41st Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was ice.
A recording is available from Parliament.
3:30 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Rodney Weston
I call this meeting to order.
We're pleased to have Mr. Pinhorn with us here today.
Thank you very much for coming to meet with us. As you're well aware, we're studying Bill C-555. We certainly look forward to your comments on it and our opportunity to question you on the bill.
We generally allow about 10 minutes maximum for comments from our witnesses.
I'll ask if you have any questions before we begin, and, if not, you can proceed with reading your comments.
3:30 p.m.
Frank Pinhorn Executive Director, Canadian Sealers Association
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Members of Parliament, ladies and gentlemen, my name is Frank Pinhorn. I'm the executive director of the Canadian Sealers Association in Newfoundland and Labrador.
The CSA was formed in 1981 as an advocacy group representing the interests of all of our sealers. Our main goal was to try to redevelop an industry that was crippled in the late sixties and early seventies by animal rights groups. It's a big challenge.
When you look at sealing in Newfoundland and Labrador, there are over 10,000 licensed sealers. For most who earn a living from the ocean and are commercial sealers, about a third of their income originates from sealing. It's a third of their income. That's our setting today.
First of all, I would like to thank you for the invitation to be here today. I would rather have had some of our sealers with me, but the spring of 2014 has just concluded and some boats haven't been able to get out there yet because of heavy ice. From the bottom of White Bay right up to around St. Anthony, there's no access to the ocean yet because of ice. They tell me that the ice there this year was up to 10 and 12 feet thick. That's where that is.
Like I said, I would have liked to have brought some sealers with me to relay to you the importance of the industry to Newfoundland and Labrador.
Regarding Bill C-555, an act respecting the Marine Mammal Regulations, it is proposed that the distance to observe the seal hunt be increased from half of a nautical mile to one nautical mile. The Canadian Sealers Association have been requesting for years that federal Fisheries take a more stringent approach in licensing and monitoring the activities of those who observe the seal hunt. All too often they are there for the sole purpose of interfering and disrupting sealers who are trying to make a living in pursuit of a legitimate industry to support their families and their communities.
The Canadian Sealers Association fully supports the bill of MP Greg Kerr, which will increase the distance between seal observers and harvesting crews. It will offer a greater measure of protection and safety for both. However, this bill only applies to non-licensed observers. It needs to be expanded to also include licensed observers, who presently can venture to within 10 metres of a sealing boat—30-odd feet.
The present regulations put sealers and licensed observers in quarters that are too close, considering the environment, high-powered rifles, and powerful vessels. It is not conducive to any measure of safety or security for either the sealer or the observer.
Also, Bill C-555 is only an empty gesture, unless we take a close look at the bigger picture and focus on the status of the sealing industry today in Newfoundland and Labrador and elsewhere. We can say with certainty that it is only a shadow of its former self and that we are bordering on an economic and ecological disaster that could play havoc with our rural population.
Let's look at what has happened over the last 20 years. From 1995 to 2006, Newfoundlanders and Labradorians were taking 100% of the quota. For 11 years, we took 100% of the quota. Prices ranged from $40 to $100. They peaked at $115 in 2006. There was virtually full participation for all commercial sealers who wanted to go sealing. We had up to 2,000 boats out there in a given year. There were five processing establishments in full production, with several hundred employees. A key element to these 11 years was that the sustainable commercial fishing industry kept the seal herd—I'm talking of harp seals when I talk seals—at the 5-million to 5.5-million range. For 11 years they stayed fairly stationary.
Now, what happened after 2006? The world went into an economic recession, and it took two or three years for that to subside. But over the last eight years, we have taken 10% to 15% of available quotas—400,000 seals for the last five years, I believe—and taken, on average, 40,000 to 60,000 seals. One year, which was last year, we got 91,000. That means we have left almost three million seals in the water, unharvested.
Prices have ranged over eight years from $20 to $35. Just look at what happened before that: we were at $40 to $115. Participation levels are at an all-time low. We have one processing plant in partial production.
The harp seal herd now has increased from about 5.5 million to over 8 million. With a winter like we just had...which was probably the worst one we've had, they tell me, in 40, 50, 60 years. Sealers tell me that it's the first time ever in their life they went out to where the seals were and every mature female was carrying a pup; every one. The ice conditions were perfect for the seals. They got out there in the middle of the heavy ice and no one could get at where they were to.
If we total harps and hoods and greys, we have about 10 million seals. The impact on the ecosystem is devastating, and it's in dire need of correction.
For those who commercially harvest seals, about one-third of their income is derived from sealing. The guy in St. Anthony with a 34-11 boat, if he can get sealing in the spring and get anywhere from 900 to 1,200 seals, will gross about $40,000—four men in a boat. That means he can start the season on a positive note as opposed to being, as we say in Newfoundland, “in the hold”. It's so critical that they can pay to get their boat ready to go crabbing and shrimping and different things. They can pay their insurance. They can fuel up. It's a good start to their season.
The other thing that has happened here is that sealers are telling me that the seals they are getting are full of shrimp and full of crab; even young beater seals. We just saw a 10,000-tonne reduction in the shrimp quota, with snow crab quotas over the last five years, especially in parts of 2J and 3K, Labrador and down towards Cape Bonavista. The crab resources there in the last five years have decreased by at least 30% to 40%.
It's so critical to balance that ecosystem and to get the seals landed, get them into the marketplace, so that we can have a sustainable industry, a profitable industry.
We've been sealing in Newfoundland and Labrador for hundreds of years. On June 19, they're going to open the memorial in Elliston. It's about $3 million, and it's in honour of those who died on the SS Newfoundland and the Southern Cross. Sealing is just as important today as it was way back in 1914, and way back in the 1850s. It's a critical part of our livelihoods and our culture, and it needs to be sustained.
3:40 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Rodney Weston
Thank you very much, Mr. Pinhorn.
We're going to start off with a 10-minute round of questions, and we'll start with Mr. Chisholm.
3:40 p.m.
NDP
Robert Chisholm NDP Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, and thank you, Mr. Pinhorn, for coming and presenting to us today.
It was an interesting presentation, and I have some questions that relate to the bill and to some of the things you said during your presentation.
We've indicated our support for Bill C-555. There's a health and safety matter. The principle of that is that we want to ensure that the people who are prosecuting the harvest are not endangered as a result of the way the harvest is managed. We've indicated that.
I've been trying to get an answer from the department about why they've extended the regulations, what's happened that they felt the need now to extend the regulations, the distance from half a nautical mile to a full nautical mile. Have there been any incidents, or whatever? They've suggested there haven't but there might be, which is fine.
But I also understand when we began to make some calls and to talk to some folks, on hearing that this bill was coming, what the perspective was from the people in your industry. One of the things we heard was that there was a problem now with enforcement of the regulations as they exist. I think you mentioned it, that if this is going to mean anything, we're going to have to see regular and full enforcement of the rules. I wonder if you could comment on that for a second.
3:45 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Sealers Association
Getting back to what you said about had there been any incidents, I talked to Ron Burton, the chief enforcement officer with DFO in western Newfoundland and Labrador. You will recall in 2008 that the Farley Mowat did go into the Gulf with the sole purpose of trying to disrupt those who were sealing, and as soon as it went less than half a nautical mile from the sealing boats, they could charge it and get it out of there. In Newfoundland and Labrador in the spring there aren't a lot of unlicensed people out there sailing around. It's not a very good environment out there, no matter what you're doing.
3:45 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative Rodney Weston
I'm sorry, Mr. Pinhorn, but I have to interrupt at this point, as the bells are ringing. Colleagues, could we have in-house consent to extend for another 10 to 15 minutes, because we're in the Centre Block and we could go to the House promptly in 15 minutes?
3:45 p.m.
Some hon. members
Agreed.
3:45 p.m.
Conservative
3:45 p.m.
NDP
Robert Chisholm NDP Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
So, Mr. Pinhorn, we're going to continue for a few minutes until we have to go to vote, but you were talking about the Farley Mowat, which I understand, but I was getting to the whole question of enforcement. Whether it's half a nautical mile or a full nautical mile or 25 nautical miles, if it's not enforced, it's words on paper.
3:45 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Sealers Association
As I said a few minutes ago, the real issue is the licensed observers. They can go to within 10 metres of a boat, and they're there with their .222s and .223s, they've got powerful boats, they're out on the ice in all kinds of weather, and it's not a place for anyone. So what we're saying is that this bill needs to be expanded, and then it would have a critical impact on what's happening in our sealing industry, because it would keep these people who are 10 metres back, whatever the distance is that we agreed to.
3:45 p.m.
NDP
3:45 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Sealers Association
Absolutely. We know of instances in which sealing crews have been surrounded and couldn't get to their boats.
3:45 p.m.
NDP
Robert Chisholm NDP Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
That's interesting.
Okay. I'll take that up a little bit with DFO officials when they're here.
You talked about the industry and the growth of the herds, which you estimate are now up to 10 million altogether with harp, hood, and grey seals combined. Of course, recently the government's been trying to respond to the WTO decision banning the sale of seal products from Canada in the European market. You talked about the viability and the sustainability of the industry in the future. I wonder if you would like to comment on what you think the government needs to do in order to deal with that circumstance.
3:45 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Sealers Association
For one thing, I think the approach they're taking is wrong. It's an approach that is long and drawn out. By the time it's resolved to any measure of satisfaction for either side, the sealing industry will be dead in rural Newfoundland and Labrador. If we don't soon start getting some of these seals landed—the 400,000 quota—and keep the herd to a sustainable level, which most people agree is in the five million to 5.5 million range—which means we have at least 2.5 million to three million too many out there..... They need to be brought down. Seals consume over 40 times the amount of the commercial catch. The commercial catch in Newfoundland and Labrador, if you add up every pound of fish landed by every fisherman, is about 270,000 tonnes. Seals consume 1.4 tonnes per seal per year. Multiply that by 10 million seals and you have 14 million tonnes of food coming out of the ocean to feed our seal population.
3:50 p.m.
NDP
Robert Chisholm NDP Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
You were saying that what the government is doing is wrong. What can the government do to deal with that WTO ban or the ban by the European Commission?
3:50 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Sealers Association
To deal with it through the WTO will take forever. I met with Ed Fast and I met with Gerald Keddy, who's the parliamentary secretary. When they were talking about the free trade agreement with Europe, I asked him when he's going to deal with the sealing issue, and he said, “We're going to do this later”. I simply said to him, “In our mind, later never comes”.
Government has to sit down government to government. After the fact, it's too late. The Marine Mammal Protection Act in the United States was brought in 1971 and it's been in force for 44 years. Do you want to know what the purpose of it is? It's to protect endangered species. The lowest the harp seal population was ever at was 1.8 million. Right now they're at eight million and growing.
It has to be done government to government. How large do you want the herd to get? The rule of thumb, according to scientists, is that the population will double every seven years.
3:50 p.m.
NDP
Robert Chisholm NDP Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
You indicated that the industry has only been able to harvest 10% to 15% of the quota in the last few years. Is that simply based on the fact that there are no markets?
3:50 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Sealers Association
The price was too low. I said the average price. In eight years, the average price was $20 to $35. You're paying $1.10 or $1.20 a litre to fuel up a sealing boat. Some of these 34-11s take $3,000 to $10,000 worth of fuel.
3:50 p.m.
NDP
Robert Chisholm NDP Dartmouth—Cole Harbour, NS
What work is being done with your association to find new markets?
3:50 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Sealers Association
I was talking to the gentleman over here. These animal rights groups have pocketfuls of money. Every time we get a market, they get inside information and they get in there and they press these governments. We had an agreement in principle with China, but it has never meant that a pound could get in there, because they're getting inside.
3:50 p.m.
NDP
3:50 p.m.
Executive Director, Canadian Sealers Association
Absolutely. Animal rights groups are over there in full bloom.
3:50 p.m.
NDP
3:50 p.m.
NDP