Fisheries Committee on April 18th, 2024

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

Yes, we proceed to a vote on the challenge to the chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Okay. We'll proceed to a vote on the challenge to the chair.

Madam Clerk, go ahead.

(Ruling of the chair sustained: yeas 6; nays 5 [See Minutes of Proceedings])

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

We'll resume debate on the amendment.

Go ahead, Mr. Kelloway.

[Mike Kelloway, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

I saw some hands go up, but I think I'm good to speak to the amendment.

The committee had already decided to send a letter to the minister at the conclusion of the study, Mr. Chair. The motion in question goes against what the subcommittee agreed was the direction to take.

There is nothing in this motion that could not be included in the letter to the minister. I think our amendments introduce some important context back into the motion. It absolutely requires an acknowledgement of the interplay of an unauthorized fishery and the exercise of indigenous rights.

I also want to point out that—

[Brendan Hanley, Liberal, Yukon, YT]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Go ahead, Mr. Hanley.

[Brendan Hanley, Liberal, Yukon, YT]

With all due respect to my colleague Mr. Kelloway, I wonder if we could let our poor witness leave.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Mr. Bekar, you're free to leave whenever you like, please. Sign off whenever you like. Thank you for appearing.

[Bryce Bekar]

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Anything that you want to send us in writing in relation to the questions you were asked, please submit it so we can include it in this study.

[Bryce Bekar]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, everybody.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you.

[Mike Kelloway, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

The motion, to a large degree, I believe, ignores what makes the fishery so hard to manage. It's like night-time fishing and the sheer number of rivers in Nova Scotia that have to be patrolled on a daily basis by law enforcement and the danger for law enforcement and what they have to go through on a daily basis.

Regarding the subcommittee's direction, I think we had a pretty good meeting. We have an excellent go-forward in terms of the letter. My understanding is that the letter doesn't have to be your standardized one-page letter. It can be detailed with recommendations, thoughts, observations.

We need to give some thought to the role of the subcommittee, what it puts forward, knowing that we have to pivot sometimes, but this seems to be already covered in the original motion.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

I have a point of order.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Point of order, Mr. Arnold.

[Mel Arnold, Conservative, North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC]

Mr. Kelloway keeps referring to the subcommittee. The subcommittee had no discussions on this motion whatsoever.

[Mike Kelloway, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

I'm talking about our general direction on how we want to handle meetings, MP Arnold, through you, Chair. That's what we discussed, quite a lot in fact. We didn't talk specifically, but we certainly talked about the generalities of how we want to work together to make things happen, like studies, more studies for all folks who have a special stake in things that are important to them—MP Desbiens, MP Barron and you folks on the Conservative side. We certainly talked about the general paths forward, and I think that's important to highlight.

With that in mind, I think again we have the mechanism by which to address what we heard, which was powerful testimony. What we heard was an incredible ordeal that happened last year. We also should acknowledge that this year there have been a considerable number of arrests and a considerable number of vehicles taken away from owners.

I think we need to be very thoughtful here in terms of providing the full picture to get the results that we want. The original path forward is absolutely the way to go. It's the most prudent way to go, and perhaps it is even the most efficient way to go.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Thank you, Mr. Kelloway.

Mr. Small.

[Clifford Small, Conservative, Coast of Bays—Central—Notre Dame, NL]

Mr. Chair, with all due respect to Mr. Kelloway, he spoke about the vast geographies, the number of rivers, the amount of darkness. It's the same as it was 30, 40, 50, 60 years ago, before that fishery even began. Nothing has changed with respect to the number of rivers and the hours of daylight.

I understand Mr. Kelloway's point of view. He's here to protect his minister. On this side, we're here—

[Mike Kelloway, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.

[Clifford Small, Conservative, Coast of Bays—Central—Notre Dame, NL]

—to stand up for the elver harvesters.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

Mr. Kelloway.

[Mike Kelloway, Liberal, Cape Breton—Canso, NS]

It is really interesting how committees like this one, which was to a large degree non-partisan, quickly become partisan when you say that I'm trying to protect the minister. When you defame the person, your argument is toast.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

That's not a point of order. That's debate.

You're supposed to rule things out of order, Mr. Chair, if it's not a point of order.

[The Chair, Liberal, Ken McDonald]

I'll rule them out of order when I think they're out of order, Mr. Perkins.