Evidence of meeting #106 for Fisheries and Oceans in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was chair.
A recording is available from Parliament.
4:55 p.m.
Liberal
4:55 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
I'm okay with that before I move the motion.
4:55 p.m.
Liberal
Ken Hardie Liberal Fleetwood—Port Kells, BC
Thank you.
Mr. Bekar, the hydroelectric dam seems to be one pinch point, I suppose, in both the travel and the survival of salmon heading further east. In the absence of better fish ladders and better protection from putting fish through the turbine, we had the Big Bar slide in British Columbia a couple of years ago now, and we used literally a water cannon to get fish past that barrier. Has that sort of thing been discussed?
Second, with respect to the hatcheries, there has been great success in survivability and the size of recruits coming back when the fish are kept in the hatchery for an extra year before they're released.
Have either of those two things been under discussion through your group or through the network that you have?
4:55 p.m.
President, Yukon Fish and Game Association
I'm sorry, but I can't speak to the B.C. situation. However, I have heard of the salmon cannon, and I have done a little research personally on some alternative solutions.
I can't speak to or make recommendations on the hydro dam currently. I think that would be better left to the experts.
I have heard the same, and maybe keeping a fish for an extra year could be very beneficial. I don't believe there are talks about that currently, but it is definitely something that we would be willing to work on with Yukon Energy and all of its partners to try to ensure the fish have the best chance of survival.
We're not professionals in that, so we can't really make a recommendation on how you operate a hydro dam either way.
5 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald
Thank you, Mr. Hardie.
I want to say a big thank you to Mr. Bekar for sharing his knowledge with the committee today as we start this Yukon salmon study.
We're going to suspend for a moment now to go into committee—
5 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
No, I'm not going into committee.
My motion was—
5 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald
You can wait, then, because the last half-hour is dedicated to committee business in camera.
5 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
Let me finish a sentence. Don't be rude, Mr. Chair.
I politely gave Mr. Hardie my slot when I had the floor so that he could ask a question and I could get back to this. I think you owe me the courtesy and respect to allow us to come back to this while the committee is still in public.
5 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
I have three minutes.
As we know, the government closed the elver fishery, claiming that by doing so they could arrest and charge people who were exporting illegally, as well as the buyers. None of that has happened.
There is poaching going on in every river in Nova Scotia every night. There have been some token arrests, but nowhere near enough. The minister owes it to the elver harvesters—the 1,100 people she has deprived while others continue to steal that resource out of the river—to allow them to earn a living.
I'm going to move the following motion, which is on notice:
That, regarding Minister Diane Lebouthillier's decision to close the legal elver harvest of 2024, the committee finds that:
(a) banning legal fishing does not stop poaching;
(b) closing the elver fishery has not decreased criminal activity and violence in Nova Scotia as evidenced by the witnesses who have come forward to the committee to detail continued violence and lawlessness in their communities, including arson, assault, and attempted murder;
(c) closing the elver fishery has resulted in 1,100 job losses, harming rural Nova Scotian communities and the fishing industry as a whole, when Canadians are struggling with a cost of living crisis created by this government;
(d) current DFO and RCMP enforcement efforts allocated by the minister remain insufficient and have not put a halt to the violence or the poaching; and
given these findings, the committee therefore agrees to report these findings to the House, and call on the Minister of Fisheries, Oceans and the Canadian Coast Guard to immediately reopen the elver fishery.
April 18th, 2024 / 5 p.m.
Liberal
Mike Kelloway Liberal Cape Breton—Canso, NS
Thanks, Mr. Chair.
I would like to put forward an amendment, if possible. I'll do something different this time. I will speak to the changes, or relay the changes to everyone here, and then read the motion out with the changes so that it's a bit clearer for everyone.
I'd like to amend the motion in the following way: one, delete (a) and replace it with “That the elver fishery is a unique public safety and law enforcement environment with considerations including Indigenous treaty rights to fish that complicate attempts to stop unauthorized fishing”; two, delete (b); three, delete “created by this government” in paragraph (c); four, delete paragraph (d) and replace it with “the federal Minister of Fisheries and Oceans and the provincial ministers of public safety, justice, and fisheries and aquaculture are working hard and in collaboration across jurisdictions to ensure that public safety is maintained in Nova Scotia and New Brunswick this elver season”; five, delete “and call on the Minister of Fisheries, Oceans and Canadian Coast Guard to immediately reopen the elver fishery” and replace it with “That this committee call on the government to accelerate the adoption of new regulations for the elver fishery so that the 2025 season can open as scheduled.”
I'll read the motion with the changes, and then I'll circulate it in both official languages, if that has not already been done. It reads: “That, regarding Minister Diane Lebouthillier's decision to close the legal elver harvest of 2024, the committee finds that: (a) the elver fishery is a unique public safety and law enforcement environment with considerations including indigenous treaty rights to fish that complicate attempts to stop unauthorized fishing; (b) closing the elver fishery has resulted in 1,100 job losses, harming rural Nova Scotian communities and the fishing industry as a whole, when Canadians are struggling with a cost of living crisis; (d) the federal Minister of Fisheries and Oceans, and the provincial ministers of public safety, justice, and fisheries and aquaculture are working hard and in collaboration across jurisdictions to ensure that public safety is maintained in Nova Scotia and New Brunswick this elver season; given these findings, the committee therefore agrees to report these findings to the House; and that this committee call on the government to accelerate the adoption of new regulations for the elver fishery so that the 2025 season can open as scheduled.”
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
I would ask the chair to rule this out of order because it actually goes diametrically in the opposite direction of the intent of the original motion.
The original motion calls for the season to open, not for the season to remain closed. Those are complete opposites; therefore, it is out of order.
It's also out of order because the motion clearly identifies that the government has done an inadequate job of enforcing the law, and the amendment claims to do the exact opposite.
In both cases, what the government is doing is out of order and is against the spirit and the intent of the original motion. It is a completely opposite motion of this and, therefore, it is out of order.
You need to rule, Mr. Chair.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
No, I think you should discuss it with the clerk before doing that.
5:05 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald
It can be in order.
The other option is that members who don't think it's in order could vote against it and could vote it down.
Mr. Arnold.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
Mel Arnold Conservative North Okanagan—Shuswap, BC
I have a point of order, Mr. Chair.
I challenge the chair's position on this.
The amendment is definitely contrary, in an exact opposite direction, to the original motion. This proposed amendment should not be allowed to proceed. It should be declared out of order.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
To challenge the chair, you have to go to a vote.
5:05 p.m.
Conservative
