Evidence of meeting #84 for Fisheries and Oceans in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was fisheries.
A recording is available from Parliament.
12:30 p.m.
Deputy Minister, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
We certainly have multiple venues for engaging with the U.S. on salmon. We have the Pacific Salmon Commission, which goes through the harvest in various areas extensively.
This is a point that we engage on—the Yukon situation, in particular—extensively with the U.S. We really stress the importance of conversation and the fact that this is a shared resource and we really need to manage it in a very integrated way.
12:30 p.m.
NDP
Lisa Marie Barron NDP Nanaimo—Ladysmith, BC
Thank you.
Will anything happen between now and when the treaty is renewed?
12:30 p.m.
Deputy Minister, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
Absolutely. We're in constant engagement.
12:30 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald
Thank you, Ms. Barron. You're right on the six-minute mark. That's good timing.
12:30 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald
I'll now go to.... Originally, it was Mr. Small. We went to Mr. Perkins and back to Mr. Small.
Now I believe it's up to Mr. Perkins again, so we have to give up dancing.
12:30 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
We're just following the Liberal lead of how you share, and giving all that notice on how you share with everybody.
Thank you.
Deputy, I have some questions around some of the planning on how to fix this issue of enforcement in the elver fishery.
I'll start with how part of the challenge, I think, is traceability. How do you actually trace this? Can you tell us?
Once it's out of the water—for the people watching—how do you know who caught it and where it came from? How does a buyer know, or how does somebody at airport shipping know whether this was legal or illegal?
Can you let us know what DFO is doing to update how we could have better traceability in the elver fishery?
12:30 p.m.
Deputy Minister, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
We're currently engaged in a very extensive review of the elver fishery, including everything from allocation to management. As part of management, we are considering the question of traceability. We're certainly not alone in this. The CBSA has a role. The province has a role.
I can tell you that in September we had a team go to Maine. This is because Maine, given the similar kind of dynamic in that fishery in that state, brought in a regime to try to have better controls from the river to export, including a licence regime and card tracking. People who are selling have to be tracked against the cards they hold. They're scanned and that kind of thing.
It's a very interesting regime that Maine has worked through. It was done in pieces—it didn't achieve it all in one year—but we are certainly taking inspiration from what it has done, and we're really looking at every aspect of how we manage the elver fishery.
12:30 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
That's great.
My understanding, though, was that.... I know DFO did surveillance at the Halifax airport, but that was like whack-a-mole. A lot of them ended up going through live seafood facilities at Toronto airport, where I don't believe—unless I'm wrong—DFO has any enforcement people.
Does DFO have enforcement people at Pearson airport for international live seafood shipping and stuff?
12:30 p.m.
Deputy Minister, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
This would be a CBSA responsibility.
12:30 p.m.
Deputy Minister, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
It is a CBSA response. Yes. CBSA is doing enforcement of this, for sure. We are catching—
12:30 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
Okay. A lot of it was going through Toronto. I never read or heard of any arrests or anything coming out of the export of illegally caught elvers out of the Toronto airport. Maybe you could get back to the committee in writing if there were some instances of that.
12:35 p.m.
Deputy Minister, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
CBSA is very aware of where the activity is. I think that's a point of discussion, for sure.
12:35 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
Whether it's this issue.... We've had some quota cuts whereby DFO has transferred some of the quota from legal, licensed elver fishers to first nations, and we've had some issues around the lobster fishery and issues about willing buyer, willing seller.... My understanding, from something I think I saw in the spring, is that for all fishers, DFO has something like $175 million set aside over a number of years for willing buyer, willing seller.
Are you considering more cuts to the legal, licensed elver fishers in Atlantic Canada as we approach the season next year?
12:35 p.m.
Deputy Minister, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
We are absolutely looking at the allocation of licence and how we meet the interests of indigenous rights holders. On the specifics of elver licences and what will happen there, again, that's not something I'm in a position to give you details on, but we are absolutely looking at allocation.
As you know, willing buyer, willing seller is the predominant approach that we use. We don't always use it, because it's not always applicable, but we really do strive to use it to the extent we can.
12:35 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
Going forward in the management of the elver fishery, we have a number of licensed eel harvesters. Some of them have said to me in meetings that they think it would be better for the entire stock if basically the adult eel fishery ended and those licences were converted to elver fisheries to allow those eels to go back to the Sargasso Sea and reproduce.
Is the department giving any consideration to converting the eel licences to elver licences as part of replenishing or allowing for the growth of the stock?
12:35 p.m.
Deputy Minister, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
I think just generally we look at the conservation objectives for every stock. Certainly, eels are a listed species under the Species at Risk Act. We consider, for situations like that, just a range of different measures to ensure the conservation of the stock.
On the specific transfer of licence, again, that's a very specific question that—
12:35 p.m.
Conservative
Rick Perkins Conservative South Shore—St. Margarets, NS
Could you get back in writing, Annette? I think I'm out of time. If you could get back to the committee in writing, that would be great.
12:35 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Ken McDonald
You were way over time. I had understood from my paper that it was going to be shared with another member. That didn't happen, so that's on you.
We'll now go to Mr. Cormier for five minutes or less, please.
12:35 p.m.
Liberal
Serge Cormier Liberal Acadie—Bathurst, NB
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Ms. Gibbons and Mr. Burns, in New Brunswick there is a regional office in Moncton and another one in Tracadie, in my riding. A lot of officials, scientists and people from your team work in those offices.
Do you have confidence in those people when they send you files for making decisions about opening or closing a fishery?
12:35 p.m.
Deputy Minister, Department of Fisheries and Oceans
At the department, there are people who are very competent in various fields. For example, there are scientists, people who manage resource protection measures, and experts who work on small craft ports. The opinions are forwarded to me or sent to the minister. In either case, I see them pass by. There are always discussions about the files. Most of them are quite complex, and I receive advice. I will certainly have questions for making the—