Health Committee on Nov. 15th, 2007

[Some hon. members]

Agreed.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

(Motion agreed to: yeas 7; nays 3)

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

Motion carried; we'll keep it in as is. Thank you so much, and thank you for the discussion.

Now we'll go to number 7, time limits for witnesses' statements and questioning. I'm going to read it, and then I understand that there's some discussion around this one.

Mr. Brown.

[Patrick Brown, Conservative, Barrie, ON]

Ms. Smith, I have a motion for this one. Would it be appropriate to read it now?

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

I'll read the motion first, Mr. Brown, then you can read your motion. We'll proceed that way.

That all questioning of witnesses be limited to five (5) minutes per member and that the Chair direct the first two (2) questions to members of the Official Opposition, followed by five (5) minutes for the Bloc québécois, five (5) minutes for the Conservative Party, five (5) minutes for the New Democratic Party; and that subsequent questions be alternately shared between government and opposition members at the discretion of the Chair, with the principle of allowing all members who wish to speak that opportunity; That during the appearance of a Minister, the Chair direct the first fifteen (15) minutes to members of the Official Opposition, ten (10) minutes to the Bloc québécois, ten (10) minutes to the New Democratic Party and ten (10) minutes to the Conservative Party during the first round of questioning; and that thereafter five (5) minutes per party be allocated alternating between the opposition and government members, at the discretion of the Chair.

Is there a mover for that?

[Robert Thibault, Liberal, West Nova, NS]

I so move.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

Thank you, Mr. Thibault.

Mr. Brown.

[Patrick Brown, Conservative, Barrie, ON]

I have an amendment regarding the timing and questioning of witnesses in relation to questions during the appearance of a Minister.

Rounds of questioning:That the witnesses from any one organization shall be allowed ten (10) minutes to make their opening statement. During the questioning of witnesses, there should be allocated seven (7) minutes for the first round of questioning, and thereafter five (5) minutes shall be allocated to each questioner in the second and subsequent rounds of questioning.

Speaking order:The order of questions for the first round of questioning shall be as follows: Liberal, Bloc, NDP, Conservative. Questioning during the subsequent rounds shall alternate between the opposition members and government members in the following fashion: Liberal, Conservative, Bloc, Conservative, NDP, Conservative, Liberal, Conservative, Bloc, Conservative, NDP, Conservative, for so long as time allows.

This would allow all members of the committee an opportunity to speak, rather than just one political party.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

Just one moment, Mr. Brown. First of all, we need copies of that motion for everybody, please. Then we'll discuss it.

Can we have a moment to get those copies handed out? We do have it translated, as well.

Mr. Brown, proceed please.

[Patrick Brown, Conservative, Barrie, ON]

Madam Chair, the point of this would be to allow all members of the committee to speak. I know in some set-ups, where the political party is smaller, it might allow a disproportionate number of questions for one member. This would allow members of the official opposition and the government to give all their members an opportunity to ask a question.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

Thank you, Mr. Brown.

Is there further discussion?

Mr. Thibault.

[Robert Thibault, Liberal, West Nova, NS]

I can't support this motion. When we have a minister or the Auditor General it has been the practice that we have longer sessions, that a round goes for fifteen minutes. It gives us a reasonable chance to ask questions. In seven-minute rounds, asking questions to a minister on supplementary estimates or the auditor general on a report is not sufficient. The existing system has worked a lot better with fifteen minutes for the government side and ten minutes for all other parties in the first round.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

Is there further debate, anybody?

Mr. Fletcher.

[Steven Fletcher, Conservative, Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia, MB]

I'll let the Bloc go first.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

Madame Gagnon.

[Christiane Gagnon, Bloc, Québec, QC]

Mr. Thibault is referring to the appearance of a minister. We could make an exception when a minister comes, and we could extend the time allowed for questioning. As for the rest, I think that it is more equitable to give everybody seven minutes. In the past, when they had seven minutes, we had five. We had scarcely enough time to deal with the issue in such a short amount of time. I think that the motion on the table right now is more equitable. Perhaps we could ascertain whether there is some flexibility in the case of a minister, but if these are witnesses... In other committees, ministers' appearances were viewed as specific cases.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

We now have Mr. Fletcher.

[Steven Fletcher, Conservative, Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia, MB]

Mr. Thibault, the motion that Mr. Brown is presenting only deals with the first paragraph of motion number 7. There is a second paragraph that says that “during the appearance of a minister, the chair direct the first fifteen minutes to members of the official opposition, ten minutes to the Bloc Québécois”, and so on. That remains. It's just to the first part that Mr. Brown's motion applies.

[Robert Thibault, Liberal, West Nova, NS]

That's not clear from what he's presenting.

Madam Chair, could I recommend this to the committee—

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

One minute, Monsieur Thibault. Mrs. Wasylycia-Leis had her hand up first.

Madam.

[Judy Wasylycia-Leis, NDP, Winnipeg North, MB]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

It seems to me that Mr. Brown's motion is very reasonable. Further to the explanation given by Mr. Fletcher, who indicated that the rules were very specific for ministers' appearances, I agree with Mr. Brown's motion. In my opinion, this motion will enable this committee to be run very well.

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

Is there further discussion?

Monsieur Thibault.

[Robert Thibault, Liberal, West Nova, NS]

The motion as presented by Mr. Brown and the interpretation by Mr. Fletcher aren't clear. This motion doesn't say “striking this paragraph” and replacing with that paragraph, and that the second paragraph remains.

Could I suggest that rather than dealing with this today, Mr. Brown have the opportunity to put the motion in the proper form so that it would be understandable, that we circulate it as quickly as you have it so that there can be discussions among the parties, and that we bring it back for consideration at that point?

[The Chair, Conservative, Joy Smith]

Mr. Fletcher.

[Steven Fletcher, Conservative, Charleswood—St. James—Assiniboia, MB]

I think we could do it right now. We're all agreeing on the second paragraph of what exists now, and if we just insert what Mr. Brown has for the first paragraph, that's it. I don't think there's any reason that we need to drag this out. We've already heard from the NDP and I believe the Bloc, and I don't see why the Liberals would have any problem with it either.

So we just insert what Mr. Brown has said in the first paragraph and leave the second paragraph on ministerial appearances, because I agree that you guys should have ample opportunity, knowing our democratic nature, to ask the minister a question.

Why can't we just do it right now? I think it's very clear.